DT Swiss Aerolite Spokes

With those rims and enough spoke tension, your wheels should be good, reliable wheels, like Rolf
Vector Comps (18 and 20 spokes in similar rims). And the wide flange spacing of the track hub should
help even more.

But the Aerolights are very, very thin spokes.

You are in danger of twisting them into barber poles unless you hold them very near the round
section close to the nipple.

It would be worth getting a spoke key that doesn't obstruct the part you're holding. Something like
the one on Cane Creek's page, but to fit your DT nipples, of course. See
canecreek.comindex.htmlOpen ↗

Uniseriate said:

I am looking to build up a low spoke count aero wheel using ovaled spokes. DT Aerolite is one of
the spoke options I am considering. Does anyone have any information concerning these spokes? A
usenet search on google groups only yielded a press release for the Aerolites.

Furthermore, I would like to hear your opinions on the following set up:

18 / 24 spoke count front /rear Velocity Deep V rims Phil Wood high flange track hubs DT Swiss
black brass nipples DT Swiss Aerolite spokes ( uncertain )

Thank you for any help that you may provide.

dianne_1234 said:

With those rims and enough spoke tension, your wheels should be good, reliable wheels, like Rolf
Vector Comps (18 and 20 spokes in similar rims). And the wide flange spacing of the track hub
should help even more.

But the Aerolights are very, very thin spokes.

You are in danger of twisting them into barber poles unless you hold them very near the round
section close to the nipple.

It would be worth getting a spoke key that doesn't obstruct the part you're holding. Something
like the one on Cane Creek's page, but to fit your DT nipples, of course. See
canecreek.comindex.htmlOpen ↗

Another tip: If you can come up with a way to apply pressure to the rim from the outside, that makes
the spoke much easier to tighten while minimizing twist. I successfully did that by leaning my chest
against a board on top of a wheel standing on a hard surface. Of course, it is slow going as you
have to repeatedly take the wheel in and out of the truing stand.

Wheel manufacturers do the same thing for low spoke-count wheels, but have better equipment. If
Jobst is reading he may be able to provide a good description.

--
Ted Bennett Portland OR

In article <[email hidden]>, [email hidden] says...

Quoted message said:

I am looking to build up a low spoke count aero wheel using ovaled spokes. DT Aerolite is one of
the spoke options I am considering. Does anyone have any information concerning these spokes? A
usenet search on google groups only yielded a press release for the Aerolites.

Furthermore, I would like to hear your opinions on the following set up:

18 / 24 spoke count front /rear Velocity Deep V rims Phil Wood high flange track hubs DT Swiss
black brass nipples DT Swiss Aerolite spokes ( uncertain )

I would use plain round spokes. With aero spokes if they twist just a wee bit, they end up hurting,
not helping.
-----------------
Alex

In article <[email hidden]>,
[email hidden] says...

Quoted message said:

Another tip: If you can come up with a way to apply pressure to the rim from

the outside, that makes

Quoted message said:

the spoke much easier to tighten while minimizing twist. I successfully did

that by leaning my

Quoted message said:

chest against a board on top of a wheel standing on a hard surface. Of

course, it is slow going as

Quoted message said:

you have to repeatedly take the wheel in and out of the truing stand.

Wheel manufacturers do the same thing for low spoke-count wheels, but have

better equipment. If

Quoted message said:

Jobst is reading he may be able to provide a good description.

Pulling the rim at the spoke hole toward the side that the spoke is coming from also helps.
--------------
Alex

Uni-<< I am looking to build up a low spoke count aero wheel using ovaled spokes. DT Aerolite is one
of the spoke options I am considering >><BR><BR>

They start life as pretty thin spokes, basically 15g spokes, then made oval so you don't have to
slot the hubs. So with such thin spokes, i would choose the rim and spoke number/lacing carefully to
not intentionally build an unreliable wheel.

Peter Chisholm Vecchio's Bicicletteria 1833 Pearl St. Boulder, CO, 80302
(303)440-3535 vecchios.comvecchios.comOpen ↗ "Ruote convenzionali costruite eccezionalmente bene"

Dianne-<< With those rims and enough spoke tension, your wheels should be good, reliable wheels,
like Rolf Vector Comps >><BR><BR>

Those are much beefier spokes tho-

Peter Chisholm Vecchio's Bicicletteria 1833 Pearl St. Boulder, CO, 80302
(303)440-3535 vecchios.comvecchios.comOpen ↗ "Ruote convenzionali costruite eccezionalmente bene"

Tip:

When the spokes are loose, mark one side of each with a sharpie so that windup is easily detectable.
With straight ga and 14/15 spokes I use these marks and a process of turning the nipple such that
the actual threading of the nipple minus the windup results in a non-twisted spoke. The amount of
windup is equal to the amount the mark on the spoke has rotated. So, if when you remove the windup
the spoke key has only turned 1/8 turn, and you needed 1/4 turn, you repeat the prior amount of
turning. After a while, you will get to know how much extra you need to wind up the spoke so that
when you return the mark to the neutral point, the nipple will be threaded further on the spoke the
amount you desired without having to repeat.

I don't know how well this works with really thin spokes like Revos or the spokes you are using, but
it kicks butt with the straight and
14/15 ga.

App

"Uniseriate" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
"]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

18 / 24 spoke count front /rear Velocity Deep V rims Phil Wood high flange track hubs DT Swiss
black brass nipples DT Swiss Aerolite spokes ( uncertain )

I trained and raced extensively in 2001-2002 on a set of wheels similar to what you describe w/o any
problems (once I built them right, that is). The rims are stiff enough that 18/24 spokes should be
sufficient for all but the heaviest/most abusive rider. However, you'll need to be careful when you
build up the wheels to chamfer the spokes holes to allow the nipples to rotate toward the
appropriate flange - otherwise, the combination of a deep rim, a high flange hub, and a rim that
lacks eyelets may result in too extreme of an angle between the nipple and the flange, contributing
to premature spoke failure at the end of the nipple.

Andy Coggan

On 20 Jan 2004 14:01:01 GMT, [email hidden] (Qui si parla

Campagnolo) said:

They start life as pretty thin spokes, basically 15g spokes, then made oval so you don't have to
slot the hubs. So with such thin spokes, i would choose the rim and spoke number/lacing carefully
to not intentionally build an unreliable wheel.

I'm more of a lightweight at around ~145 pounds. I'm still debating about bladed or standard spokes.
In the case of ovaled spokes, would Saphim CX rays be a better spoke choice than DT Aerolites?

Thanks for your input.

On 20 Jan 2004 14:01:42 GMT, [email hidden] (Qui si parla

Campagnolo) said:

Dianne-<< With those rims and enough spoke tension, your wheels should be good, reliable wheels,
like Rolf Vector Comps >><BR><BR>

Those are much beefier spokes tho-

Peter Chisholm Vecchio's Bicicletteria 1833 Pearl St. Boulder, CO, 80302
(303)440-3535 vecchios.comvecchios.comOpen ↗ "Ruote convenzionali costruite eccezionalmente bene"

Yep, the Vector Comps use 14g spokes, flattened to make them aero.

The OP, however, has two factors making his wheels more robust:
1. More spokes (2 more in front, 4 more in back)
2. The track rear hub (wider flanges = less dish).

I also said "enough spoke tension", which not all Vector Comps have, though most of them remain
reliable in spite of that.

So I have three reasons Aerolights could be okay.

On Tue, 20 Jan 2004 19:49:22 GMT, Uniseriate <[email hidden]>

Quoted message said:

(Qui si parla Campagnolo) said:

They start life as pretty thin spokes, basically 15g spokes, then made oval so you don't have to
slot the hubs. So with such thin spokes, i would choose the rim and spoke number/lacing carefully
to not intentionally build an unreliable wheel.

I'm more of a lightweight at around ~145 pounds. I'm still debating about bladed or standard
spokes. In the case of ovaled spokes, would Saphim CX rays be a better spoke choice than DT
Aerolites?

Thanks for your input.

I believe both the CX Ray and Aerolight both start out as 2.0 - 1.5 -
2. mm butted, then flattened to make blades.

So in my understanding they should be about the same thing.

my vote goes with sapim - they have the courage to publish fatigue data.

jb

dianne_1234 said:

Uniseriate said:

(Qui si parla Campagnolo) said:

They start life as pretty thin spokes, basically 15g spokes, then made oval so you don't have to
slot the hubs. So with such thin spokes, i would choose the rim and spoke number/lacing carefully
to not intentionally build an unreliable wheel.

I'm more of a lightweight at around ~145 pounds. I'm still debating about bladed or standard
spokes. In the case of ovaled spokes, would Saphim CX rays be a better spoke choice than DT
Aerolites?

Thanks for your input.

I believe both the CX Ray and Aerolight both start out as 2.0 - 1.5 -
2. mm butted, then flattened to make blades.

So in my understanding they should be about the same thing.

Sheldon Brown wrote: <snip>

Quoted message said:

Actually, 1 mm is 2 threads (56 tpi.)

yes! ~0.45mm so i guess just the "4" stuck in my early morning fog.

Quoted message said:

It is true that you can often get by with slighly short spokes, but a wheelbuilder with pride of
workmanship would rather get them right.

agreed - i'm not saying a good artisan shouldn't care, i'm saying that from a mechanical viewpoint,
it doesn't make much difference.

Quoted message said:

Also, in the case of aluminum nipples, if the spoke doesn't extend into the head area, it is not
unheard-of for the head of the nipple to snap off.

that's a good point, but i think more related to the material than the spoke length. softer aluminum
nipples tend to scar more than brass as they turn in the spoke hole under tension. this scarring
puts them into fatigue nucleation territory and if they fatigue, the heads will pop, regardless.

sapim have an interesting "polyax" design on their higher end spoke nipples. basically, they have a
hemisheric seat, not conical so in theory sit better in the rim eyelet. this may reduce the extent
to which a nip may scar under tension if more of the seat is in contact spreading the load. but i
can't say for sure because i've not had reason to disassemble any wheel i've built with those nips
yet, but that's the theory. it will be interesting to see how they work out over time.

jb