Doping Joke

"Bill C" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport2/hi/athletics/4350810.stm
Riders and other athletes are being stripped of their careers and
taking 2 year hits; marijuana will get you serious jail time, but these
clowns basically walk even though they were creating and distributing
designer drugs.
The whole system is screwed, but we already knew that. As so many have
pointed out, the justice system doesn't have much to do with justice.
Bill C

Rather light sentences for the Balco Boys. At least Ferrari didn't have to
do any of his prison time. :-)

Bill C said:

http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport2/hi/athletics/4350810.stm
Riders and other athletes are being stripped of their careers and
taking 2 year hits; marijuana will get you serious jail time, but these
clowns basically walk even though they were creating and distributing
designer drugs.
The whole system is screwed, but we already knew that. As so many have
pointed out, the justice system doesn't have much to do with justice.
Bill C

Yeah, a joke that is not funny.

JT

****************************
Remove "remove" to reply
Visit http://www.jt10000.com
****************************

Bill C said:

http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport2/hi/athletics/4350810.stm
Riders and other athletes are being stripped of their careers and
taking 2 year hits; marijuana will get you serious jail time, but these
clowns basically walk even though they were creating and distributing
designer drugs.
The whole system is screwed, but we already knew that. As so many have
pointed out, the justice system doesn't have much to do with justice.

dumbass,

what's worse is that the athletes aren't being held accountable.

if they were able to prove those three were guilty for distribution,
they must have the means to prove who the recipients were (ie. BALCO's
celebrity clients). I don't know the law, but I assume receiving
steroids must be a crime if distributing them is, even if the law
doesn't consider it to be as serious.

trainers and suppliers will take the fall while athletes go on with
their careers or maybe serve brief suspensions (10 days for violating
baseball's steroid policy).

romanowski went on TV and SAID that he received drugs from BALCO and
that HGH wasn't as good as THG. Conte and Anderson are going to jail
and he's making a movie with rob schneider and napoleon dynamite

http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0437863/

(and writing a tell all book to make back the $400k he had to pay for
ending a guy's career)

John Forrest Tomlinson said:

Bill C said:

http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport2/hi/athletics/4350810.stm
Riders and other athletes are being stripped of their careers and
taking 2 year hits; marijuana will get you serious jail time, but these
clowns basically walk even though they were creating and distributing
designer drugs.
The whole system is screwed, but we already knew that. As so many have
pointed out, the justice system doesn't have much to do with justice.
Bill C

Yeah, a joke that is not funny.

JT

Your right, I should've said "sick joke". The whole system takes itself
so seriously while failing miserably. If anything makes the
Congressional hearings, and posturing a colossal waste of time, and
possibly another debacle waiting to happen it's this sentencing. They
want to mandate screwing the athlete for years while the producers and
dealers walk. Complete BS, but at least bull [censored] is good for
fertilizer.
Bill C

amit said:

Bill C said:

http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport2/hi/athletics/4350810.stm
Riders and other athletes are being stripped of their careers and
taking 2 year hits; marijuana will get you serious jail time, but these
clowns basically walk even though they were creating and distributing
designer drugs.
The whole system is screwed, but we already knew that. As so many have
pointed out, the justice system doesn't have much to do with justice.

dumbass,

what's worse is that the athletes aren't being held accountable.

if they were able to prove those three were guilty for distribution,
they must have the means to prove who the recipients were (ie. BALCO's
celebrity clients). I don't know the law, but I assume receiving
steroids must be a crime if distributing them is, even if the law
doesn't consider it to be as serious.

trainers and suppliers will take the fall while athletes go on with
their careers or maybe serve brief suspensions (10 days for violating
baseball's steroid policy).

romanowski went on TV and SAID that he received drugs from BALCO and
that HGH wasn't as good as THG. Conte and Anderson are going to jail
and he's making a movie with rob schneider and napoleon dynamite

http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0437863/

(and writing a tell all book to make back the $400k he had to pay for
ending a guy's career)

Thank the players unions.
Bill C

Bill C said:

Thank the players unions.

dumbass,

if the justice system finds it worthwhile to go after the supplier
(arguable, but they did), they can find it worthwhile to criminally
charge the buyers as well.

the sporting authority can't protect them if they break a law.

amit said:

Bill C said:

Thank the players unions.

dumbass,

if the justice system finds it worthwhile to go after the supplier
(arguable, but they did), they can find it worthwhile to criminally
charge the buyers as well.

the sporting authority can't protect them if they break a law.

I guess you missed when Heather posted this in the Page thread:
you might like the following (very similar to what you just said 🙂

~More than one in ten of all arrests-1.5m in 1999-is for drug
offences.
Some 40% of those drug arrests were for possessing marijuana. Fewer
than
20% were for the sale or manufacture of drugs, whether heroin, cocaine
or anything else. [...]

Many of those arrested receive mandatory minimum sentences of five or
ten years for possession of a few grams of drugs, a dire punishment
rushed through Congress in 1986 amid hysteria about crack cocaine. Eric

Sterling, now head of the Criminal Justice Policy Foundation, a
campaigning group, worked in Congress on drugs policy at the time. He
recalls that Congress set small quantities for no better reason than
ignorance, politicking and "a lack of fluency in the metric
system".

Because congressmen did not know their grams from their kilos back in
1986, America's prisons are crammed with drug offenders, who now
account
for roughly one in four of those in custody, and more than half of all
federal prisoners. ~ (economist, july 26, 2001

I really didn't think you'd be one of those advocating for locking up
users since that definitely not the Canadian way.
Bill C

Michael Press said:

Oh, and who manufactures and sells for profit various
substances designed to alter human biochemistry?

A lot of people and organizations. Some get awards for it. We get a
morality buzz when its by someone that looks a touch slimy and does it
clearly for personal profit and nothing else, but that's like claiming
your toke is moral because you bought it from someone that looked like
Carly Simon (in the 60s) instead of a biker.

I get my biochemistry altered daily. Starts with a cup of coffee and
ends with prescribed medication at the end of the day. I all for
altering your biochemistry, as long as you can safely drive in the
lane next to my on U.S.50. Perhaps we should castigate VeloNews more
often - I'm guessing every issue they publish has at least one
advertisement for a patented drug that is guaranteed to enhance
performance and/or endurance (on the bike).

I have to admit that what keeps me from being as involved emotionally
about this drug thing is that every one seems to want to make their
villains unique, except Henry. Hell, when I was racing (to use the
term loosely), we had people into macrobiotics to get an upper edge.
It did manage to get them way down in racing weight, when they could
make the rides.

It isn't that these things are illegal - most can be taken with a
prescription and some don't require that. It boils down that now,
today, we know that they can give a measurable performance boost over
not taking them. That appears to make the unknown ones completely
legal, ethical and above board, except that you don't want your
competitors to know.

Yet how many people aren't doing something to get a boost? How many
people are normalizing their diet to be completely average? Anyone
want to do the Sean Kelly thing where you give up sex practically the
entire season? That ain't normal, except for slow college freshmen. No
vitamins? Don't buy the guaranteed stuff from VeloNews? How about the
stuff the pusher at General Nutrition pushes? How about really good,
deep rich ale with the really dark foamy head, say about 45 degrees F?

I know, I know - its on the list, so using it breaks the rules. I
guess the drug rules are all in caps, so they carry more weight than
the ones about taking pace off of a vehicle, jumping the yellow line,
and where the front end of the saddle has to be to avoid being
performance enhancing. I know no one here would knowingly break any of
the rules in the manual(s). It must be about the rules, all this
emotional involvement...

Curtis L. Russell
Odenton, MD (USA)
Just someone on two wheels...

You do realize that most of the drug pushers aren't rich Balco
executives making millions don't you? Most are street corner thugs who
find drug pushing as the only way they can make money.

Not to put too fine a point on it but as long as they're MFer's that
are willing to cheat, they will be a ready market for whatever drug
that they can find to cheat with.

The problem ISN'T the makers -it's the less than ethical user who is
willing to mess up his body in order to beat some clean guy.

Please don't tell me that Balco executives didn't get enough punishment
to suit you. As far as I'm concerned they were only filling a market.

The riders shouldn't be getting fined and suspended from competition,
they ought to be spending hard time behind bars. They're the one's
cheating and often for a damned Cat 4 win!

Yeah, EPO has saved literally millions of lives but we ought to jail
those company executives because some immoral and unethical athletes
use EPO to cheat.

Here's the ticket - if you can prove that an athlete used drugs
purposely to cheat that's the end of his career. No more Mr. Niceguy.
How many clean riders from the early 90's quit racing rather than try
to compete against Mr. 60%?

Tom Kunich said:

You do realize that most of the drug pushers aren't rich Balco
executives making millions don't you? Most are street corner thugs who
find drug pushing as the only way they can make money.

Not true. It's the way they have _chosen_ to make money.

In article <[email hidden]>,

Tom Kunich said:

You do realize that most of the drug pushers aren't rich Balco
executives making millions don't you? Most are street corner thugs who
find drug pushing as the only way they can make money.

Quoted message said:

The riders shouldn't be getting fined and suspended from competition,
they ought to be spending hard time behind bars. They're the one's
cheating and often for a damned Cat 4 win!

Hey, I don't know what more I can do to prove my innocence. I have
_never_ failed a drug test. If you're going to be one of the trolls who
makes such accusations, I'm going to add you to the enemies list on my
Blackberry.

RjC, close personal friend of a guy who raced against a guy who raced
against Lance,

--
Ryan Cousineau [email hidden] http://www.wiredcola.com/
"I don't want kids who are thinking about going into mathematics
to think that they have to take drugs to succeed." -Paul Erdos

Tom Kunich said:

Not to put too fine a point on it but as long as they're MFer's that
are willing to cheat, they will be a ready market for whatever drug
that they can find to cheat with.

The problem ISN'T the makers -it's the less than ethical user who is
willing to mess up his body in order to beat some clean guy.

yes, i agree.

as long as there are athletes willing to cheat, they will find a source
for the drugs. companies like BALCO and guys like Dr. Mabuse are just
addressing that demand (and profiting from it).

Quoted message said:

Please don't tell me that Balco executives didn't get enough punishment
to suit you. As far as I'm concerned they were only filling a market.

i don't really care if they get jail time or not, the issue is that the
system is willing to criminally charge the suppliers, but not the
users, who are the ones who gain the most financially, so they are an
important part of driving the trade.

bill: a two year suspension by the sport might kill an athlete's
career, but it's not the same as a criminal conviction, even if there
is no jail time.

there is a big difference between a sporting sanction and a criminal
record.

i don't even think supplying steroids gets someone jail time. valente
is not going to jail, only conte and andrerson are, they were also
convited of money laundering (something which can put you in jail).

Quoted message said:

The riders shouldn't be getting fined and suspended from competition,
they ought to be spending hard time behind bars.

i don't think anyone should be JAILED for using performance enhancing
drugs, but if big time athletes are participating in the illegal drug
trade they should be charged seeing as how they are already willing to
charge the suppliers.

-Amit

amit said:

Tom Kunich said:

Not to put too fine a point on it but as long as they're MFer's that
are willing to cheat, they will be a ready market for whatever drug
that they can find to cheat with.

The problem ISN'T the makers -it's the less than ethical user who is
willing to mess up his body in order to beat some clean guy.

yes, i agree.

as long as there are athletes willing to cheat, they will find a source
for the drugs. companies like BALCO and guys like Dr. Mabuse are just
addressing that demand (and profiting from it).

Quoted message said:

Please don't tell me that Balco executives didn't get enough punishment
to suit you. As far as I'm concerned they were only filling a market.

i don't really care if they get jail time or not, the issue is that the
system is willing to criminally charge the suppliers, but not the
users, who are the ones who gain the most financially, so they are an
important part of driving the trade.

bill: a two year suspension by the sport might kill an athlete's
career, but it's not the same as a criminal conviction, even if there
is no jail time.

there is a big difference between a sporting sanction and a criminal
record.

i don't even think supplying steroids gets someone jail time. valente
is not going to jail, only conte and andrerson are, they were also
convited of money laundering (something which can put you in jail).

Quoted message said:

The riders shouldn't be getting fined and suspended from competition,
they ought to be spending hard time behind bars.

i don't think anyone should be JAILED for using performance enhancing
drugs, but if big time athletes are participating in the illegal drug
trade they should be charged seeing as how they are already willing to
charge the suppliers.

-Amit

Unbelievably I think we're almost in complete agreement, except that
since they do occasionally criminally charge people for things like
"prescription shopping" and abuse of prescription drugs like oxycontin,
oxycodone, and opiates they could do it for performance enhancing
stuff.
Jim Rome was just doing a good take on the Balco guys and their house
arrest time, about how topugh it is to be confined to the mansion and
have to hang out at home around the pool for a sentence.
I just don't see any reason to excuse them when a couple ounces of
weed will get you 5 years mandatory and everything I've seen says that
weed is a whole hell of a lot safer for teens than black market
steroids and [censored]. One of the muscle magazines went to Mexico and
bought a bunch of [censored] at one of the big pharmacies that were supplying
athletes. It was amazing what was actually in those vials. A bunch were
just harmless stuff, a lot was vetrinary steroids, and a lot of the
little that actually was semi real was either contaminated or
incredibly cut down. I'd be willing to bet that a lot of the stuff
category and masters racers are getting is pretty similar in quality.
As far as I'm concerned that's a perfectly valid reason to go after fly
by night suppliers and the doctors and other pushers of this [censored].
Tom just because there is a market for a product or service doesn't
make it right to fill it. I knew a couple of guys who used to go around
with a notebook taking orders for stolen [censored]. Within a week or so
they'd steal what you wanted and deliver it. Is that a good thing?
Bill C

In article
<[email hidden]>,

Tom Kunich said:

You do realize that most of the drug pushers aren't rich Balco
executives making millions don't you? Most are street corner thugs who
find drug pushing as the only way they can make money.

Not to put too fine a point on it but as long as they're MFer's that
are willing to cheat, they will be a ready market for whatever drug
that they can find to cheat with.

The problem ISN'T the makers -it's the less than ethical user who is
willing to mess up his body in order to beat some clean guy.

Please don't tell me that Balco executives didn't get enough punishment
to suit you. As far as I'm concerned they were only filling a market.

The riders shouldn't be getting fined and suspended from competition,
they ought to be spending hard time behind bars. They're the one's
cheating and often for a damned Cat 4 win!

I strongly disagree. Who cares what drugs somebody takes?
I do not; nor do I want to hear his reasons. Taking drugs
is bad enough; no reason to prosecute someone for it.
Folks need to wise up and stop ingesting [censored].

If someone signs a contract promising that he will not
take drugs, then he can be sanctioned under the contract.

I have not had so much as an aspirin in ten years. Some
whisky, some wine, and some beer. I still would not sign a
contract promising not to take drugs.

--
Michael Press

In article <[email hidden]>,

Tom Kunich said:

Please don't tell me that Balco executives didn't get enough punishment
to suit you. As far as I'm concerned they were only filling a market.

Hmm, couldn't you say that about *any* person selling drugs of any sort?
Pablo Escobar was only filling a market, wasn't he?

--
tanx,
Howard

The sheriff is near...

remove YOUR SHOES to reply, ok?

Tom Kunich said:

Quoted message said:

The riders shouldn't be getting fined and suspended from competition,
they ought to be spending hard time behind bars. They're the one's
cheating and often for a damned Cat 4 win!

Ryan Cousineau said:

Hey, I don't know what more I can do to prove my innocence. I have
_never_ failed a drug test.

Well you must be a supplier then. What, other than an illegal dose of
cheap gin, could cause a team mate to ride into a hay bale ?

"Pablo Escobar was only filling a market, wasn't he?"

Yeah, Bill Clinton had a nose like a vacuum cleaner.

Well, you're correct in that assessment Carl, but you could have used
drugs as well and yet did you?

The guys selling the stuff are only selling to a ready market. The
pretense that they are somehow more to blame has to do with the theory
that there are fewer pushers than users and hence it's easier to stop
doping at that point. The FACT is that is a stupid misconseption. If
you put one pusher away another 20 will spring up in his place because
there's money to be made selling drugs.

You NEED to punish the user and NOT focus on the pusher.