Do you count calories or fast?

On 11/10/05 8:12 PM, in article
[email hidden],

Quoted post said:

I am having a discussion(cough-fight)with some peeps on another board.
WTH would anyone low carb and then do crazy stuff like count cals or
fast?
Just wondering.
Lynn

Maybe they want to lose weight? Eating low carb alone won't do it, you still
have to limit calories.

SS

Quoted message said:

I am having a discussion(cough-fight)with some peeps on another board.
WTH would anyone low carb and then do crazy stuff like count cals or
fast?
Just wondering.
Lynn

Because they haven't figured out that the low-carb method shows that
calories mean squat. People are so fixated on calories that they cannot
concieve that you could possibly lose weight without calories being the
center piece of the weight loss.

Counting calories fails to achieve weight loss in better than 95% of
cases. Statistically, that means that restricting calories does exactly
the opposite of what is expected, and that even a random diet will work
better.

But so far no one can explain exactly how calories are monitored by the
body. How does the body know that there is an excess of calories or a
deficiency of calories? And how does it then trigger fat storage or fat
usage based on the caloric status. There is no known bio-chemical or
hormonal mechanism that detects the caloric status of the body. There
is no known mechanism that triggers fat storage or weight usage based
on caloric status. There is no known cascade of biological events that
is triggered by caloric status and ends up is fat storage or fat usage.

For those wedded to the caloric theory of weight management, the body
is one big black box that just does what they say it does, except that
the reality isn't co-operating. If it was just a matter of the caloric
balance, anyone who put even a moderate amount of effort to restrict
the amounts of foods eaten, and increase their daily exercise slightly,
would easily take the pounds off. It is not hard to eat slightly less
food over a period of time and walk a bit every day (many, many people
do just that, every day, religiously). But we know that that has failed
to work for most people.

TC

: > I am having a discussion(cough-fight)with some peeps on another board.
: > WTH would anyone low carb and then do crazy stuff like count cals or
: > fast?
: > Just wondering.
: > Lynn
: >
:
: Maybe they want to lose weight? Eating low carb alone won't do it, you
still
: have to limit calories.
:
: SS

Funny, it worked for me. I lost 44 pounds without even being aware of
calories. I practically live on cheese!

Pat in TX
:

In article <[email hidden]>,

Quoted message said:

I am having a discussion(cough-fight)with some peeps on another board.
WTH would anyone low carb and then do crazy stuff like count cals or
fast?
Just wondering.
Lynn

Because even with low carbing, calories still count...

and fasting is good for reasons too numerous to take the time to list.
--
Om.

"My mother never saw the irony in calling me a son-of-a-[censored]." -Jack Nicholson

In article <[email hidden]>,

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

I am having a discussion(cough-fight)with some peeps on another board.
WTH would anyone low carb and then do crazy stuff like count cals or
fast?
Just wondering.
Lynn

Because they haven't figured out that the low-carb method shows that
calories mean squat. People are so fixated on calories that they cannot
concieve that you could possibly lose weight without calories being the
center piece of the weight loss.

<snipped rest of Deja-moo>

Quoted message said:

TC

Have you managed to lose weight by pigging out on all the fat and
protein that you want?

Well, congratulations.

You are genetically gifted...
--
Om.

"My mother never saw the irony in calling me a son-of-a-[censored]." -Jack Nicholson

In article <[email hidden]>, "Pat" <[email hidden]>

Quoted message said:

: > I am having a discussion(cough-fight)with some peeps on another board.
: > WTH would anyone low carb and then do crazy stuff like count cals or
: > fast?
: > Just wondering.
: > Lynn
: >
:
: Maybe they want to lose weight? Eating low carb alone won't do it, you
still
: have to limit calories.
:
: SS

Funny, it worked for me. I lost 44 pounds without even being aware of
calories. I practically live on cheese!

Pat in TX
:

That does not work for me.
Too many sugar carbs in cheese (lactose).

Cottage cheese especially stops my ketosis and weight loss dead in it's
tracks. :-(

It really does vary from person to person. Tolerances vary.
--
Om.

"My mother never saw the irony in calling me a son-of-a-[censored]." -Jack Nicholson

[email hidden] wrote:
|| I am having a discussion(cough-fight)with some peeps on
|| another board. WTH would anyone low carb and then do crazy
|| stuff like count cals or fast?
|| Just wondering.
|| Lynn

Low carb does not emphasis the number of calories, but one must
be aware that calories still count. This is mentioned in the
Atkin's
book and likely in other low carb books. Exercise is also
mentioned
as a component of the WOL.

--
"When you're arguing with a fool, make sure he isn't doing the
same thing." -- Unknown

OmManiPadmeOmelet said:

In article <[email hidden]>,

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

I am having a discussion(cough-fight)with some peeps on another board.
WTH would anyone low carb and then do crazy stuff like count cals or
fast?
Just wondering.
Lynn

Because they haven't figured out that the low-carb method shows that
calories mean squat. People are so fixated on calories that they cannot
concieve that you could possibly lose weight without calories being the
center piece of the weight loss.

<snipped rest of Deja-moo>

Quoted message said:

TC

Have you managed to lose weight by pigging out on all the fat and
protein that you want?

Well, congratulations.

You are genetically gifted...
--
Om.

I have managed to lose weight by pigging out on all the fat and protein
that I want. I am always satiated at the end of a meal, and I always
eat when I get hungry. I add loads of butter (real butter) to my food.
I splash on liberal amounts of EVOO (extra virgin olive oil) on my
food. An eight ounce steak with a nice half-inch ring of fat around the
outside, is not out of bounds for me. A double burger with cheese and
bacon finds its way onto my plate every once in a while. I eat eggs,
yolk and all, fried in butter, often. My salads are copiously bathed in
homemade oil and vinegar dressings. If I have ice cream, which I never
crave, but indulge in once in a while, it is high-fat whole-cream ice
cream and nothing but. My favorite breakfast is three eggs over-easy,
sausages and bacon. Rye toast with lots of butter and only a little bit
of hash browns. I often make soup from bones, with all the fat that
oozes from them. I insist on my chicken to have the bone in and the
skin on. I love fatty pork chops. Pork Ribs, slow grilled on the BBQ,
slathered with my own BBQ sauce, yummmmmmm.

I eat as much as I want and my weight stays at 184, +-2 or 3 lbs. Been
like that for over 5 years.

I don't eat added-sugar [censored], cereals, pasta, white bread, soda, potato
chips, or any other refined and high GI carbs in any appreciable
amounts. I do enjoy the odd sweet snack (a chocolate bar), and since I
don't eat it every single day, it is truly a snack and I enjoy it that
much more.

And since my weight is steady where I want it to be, I have no fear of
food, no sense of lack of control over my health whatsoever. I am in
100% control of my weight and my health.

My bg levels are spot on normal, my cholesterol perfectly normal, my
blood pressure a titch low from the normal, no signs of syndrome X or
pre-diabetes. No prescriptions in over 5 years. No colds in 5 years.
Not a single sick day off work in over 5 years. No infections. No mood
swings, no anxiety, no depression, plenty of energy, low back condition
virtually pain free. I heal quickly for an old man of 40-something.
Life is great.

I wonder when the fat I am eating in copious amounts is going to kick
in and make me fat and sick with cholesterol and heart problems. My
guess is.... NEVER.

TC

In article <[email hidden]>,

Quoted message said:

OmManiPadmeOmelet said:

In article <[email hidden]>,

Quoted message said:

[email hidden] wrote:
> I am having a discussion(cough-fight)with some peeps on another board.
> WTH would anyone low carb and then do crazy stuff like count cals or
> fast?
> Just wondering.
> Lynn

Because they haven't figured out that the low-carb method shows that
calories mean squat. People are so fixated on calories that they cannot
concieve that you could possibly lose weight without calories being the
center piece of the weight loss.

<snipped rest of Deja-moo>

Quoted message said:

TC

Have you managed to lose weight by pigging out on all the fat and
protein that you want?

Well, congratulations.

You are genetically gifted...
--
Om.

I have managed to lose weight by pigging out on all the fat and protein
that I want. I am always satiated at the end of a meal, and I always
eat when I get hungry. I add loads of butter (real butter) to my food.
I splash on liberal amounts of EVOO (extra virgin olive oil) on my
food. An eight ounce steak with a nice half-inch ring of fat around the
outside, is not out of bounds for me. A double burger with cheese and
bacon finds its way onto my plate every once in a while. I eat eggs,
yolk and all, fried in butter, often. My salads are copiously bathed in
homemade oil and vinegar dressings. If I have ice cream, which I never
crave, but indulge in once in a while, it is high-fat whole-cream ice
cream and nothing but. My favorite breakfast is three eggs over-easy,
sausages and bacon. Rye toast with lots of butter and only a little bit
of hash browns. I often make soup from bones, with all the fat that
oozes from them. I insist on my chicken to have the bone in and the
skin on. I love fatty pork chops. Pork Ribs, slow grilled on the BBQ,
slathered with my own BBQ sauce, yummmmmmm.

I must confess... that worked for me too, but only for the first 50 lbs.
:-(

I've been stalled for phreaking EVER it seems! <sigh>

But, on my lab work, my frickin' T-4 (thyroxine) level has dropped below
normal damned range again. My Endocrinologist and I are working on that.
I imagine that is the problem...

<sigh>

I still have 70 lbs. to lose.
I've got Lyle's book still on the way. The first one got lost. :-(
Just got the re-order confirmation today.

Quoted message said:

I eat as much as I want and my weight stays at 184, +-2 or 3 lbs. Been
like that for over 5 years.

I hate you. :-(

Quoted message said:

I don't eat added-sugar [censored], cereals, pasta, white bread, soda, potato
chips, or any other refined and high GI carbs in any appreciable
amounts.

Neither do I.

Quoted message said:

I do enjoy the odd sweet snack (a chocolate bar), and since I
don't eat it every single day, it is truly a snack and I enjoy it that
much more.

I don't dare.

Quoted message said:

And since my weight is steady where I want it to be, I have no fear of
food, no sense of lack of control over my health whatsoever. I am in
100% control of my weight and my health.

You are lucky.
Bet your thyroid is normal.

<snipped rest of disgustingly healthy report>

Cheers!

Quoted message said:

TC

--
Om.

"My mother never saw the irony in calling me a son-of-a-[censored]." -Jack Nicholson

Quoted message said:

I still have 70 lbs. to lose.
I've got Lyle's book still on the way. The first one got lost. :-(
Just got the re-order confirmation today.

Shoot me an e-mail at the obvious fix for this address with a returnable
address.

Ryan

--
295/278/225 monthly-goal: 10 month-start: 285 since: 19/9/05

OmManiPadmeOmelet said:

In article <[email hidden]>,

Quoted message said:

OmManiPadmeOmelet said:

In article <[email hidden]>,
[email hidden] wrote:

> [email hidden] wrote:
> > I am having a discussion(cough-fight)with some peeps on another board.
> > WTH would anyone low carb and then do crazy stuff like count cals or
> > fast?
> > Just wondering.
> > Lynn
>
> Because they haven't figured out that the low-carb method shows that
> calories mean squat. People are so fixated on calories that they cannot
> concieve that you could possibly lose weight without calories being the
> center piece of the weight loss.
>
<snipped rest of Deja-moo>
>
> TC
>

Have you managed to lose weight by pigging out on all the fat and
protein that you want?

Well, congratulations.

You are genetically gifted...
--
Om.

I have managed to lose weight by pigging out on all the fat and protein
that I want. I am always satiated at the end of a meal, and I always
eat when I get hungry. I add loads of butter (real butter) to my food.
I splash on liberal amounts of EVOO (extra virgin olive oil) on my
food. An eight ounce steak with a nice half-inch ring of fat around the
outside, is not out of bounds for me. A double burger with cheese and
bacon finds its way onto my plate every once in a while. I eat eggs,
yolk and all, fried in butter, often. My salads are copiously bathed in
homemade oil and vinegar dressings. If I have ice cream, which I never
crave, but indulge in once in a while, it is high-fat whole-cream ice
cream and nothing but. My favorite breakfast is three eggs over-easy,
sausages and bacon. Rye toast with lots of butter and only a little bit
of hash browns. I often make soup from bones, with all the fat that
oozes from them. I insist on my chicken to have the bone in and the
skin on. I love fatty pork chops. Pork Ribs, slow grilled on the BBQ,
slathered with my own BBQ sauce, yummmmmmm.

I must confess... that worked for me too, but only for the first 50 lbs.
:-(

I've been stalled for phreaking EVER it seems! <sigh>

But, on my lab work, my frickin' T-4 (thyroxine) level has dropped below
normal damned range again. My Endocrinologist and I are working on that.
I imagine that is the problem...

<sigh>

I still have 70 lbs. to lose.
I've got Lyle's book still on the way. The first one got lost. :-(
Just got the re-order confirmation today.

Quoted message said:

I eat as much as I want and my weight stays at 184, +-2 or 3 lbs. Been
like that for over 5 years.

I hate you. :-(

Quoted message said:

I don't eat added-sugar [censored], cereals, pasta, white bread, soda, potato
chips, or any other refined and high GI carbs in any appreciable
amounts.

Neither do I.

Quoted message said:

I do enjoy the odd sweet snack (a chocolate bar), and since I
don't eat it every single day, it is truly a snack and I enjoy it that
much more.

I don't dare.

Quoted message said:

And since my weight is steady where I want it to be, I have no fear of
food, no sense of lack of control over my health whatsoever. I am in
100% control of my weight and my health.

You are lucky.
Bet your thyroid is normal.

<snipped rest of disgustingly healthy report>

Cheers!

Quoted message said:

TC

--
Om.

Do you watch the amounts of flouride you get? And do you eat a lot of
soy products? Both of these can mess with your thyroid function. Teas,
especially iced teas, can have ridiculously high amounts of fluoride.

TC

In article <[email hidden]>,

Ryan Case said:

Quoted message said:

I still have 70 lbs. to lose.
I've got Lyle's book still on the way. The first one got lost. :-(
Just got the re-order confirmation today.

Shoot me an e-mail at the obvious fix for this address with a returnable
address.

Ryan

Ok, thanks!
--
Om.

"My mother never saw the irony in calling me a son-of-a-[censored]." -Jack Nicholson

In article <[email hidden]>,

Quoted message said:

Do you watch the amounts of flouride you get? And do you eat a lot of
soy products? Both of these can mess with your thyroid function. Teas,
especially iced teas, can have ridiculously high amounts of fluoride.

TC

I don't eat a lot of soy products, no.
Tofu is a rare treat. Just every few months in soups.

I was using Green Tea extract which is supposed to be high in fluoride,
but the problem occured PRIOR to that... and I stopped using it after I
was warned.

And no, I don't drink tea either.

City water maybe? Yeah. Just called them. :-( They add 0.8 parts per
million of fluoride to our water, and I drink about 1 gallon of tap
water per day!

I'm dumping my bottles now and will switch back to the water from the
vending machines. It's purified of that [censored].

Thanks!

It will be interesting to see if my T-4 levels come back up.

Quoted message said:

--
Om.

"My mother never saw the irony in calling me a son-of-a-[censored]." -Jack Nicholson

BJ in Texas said:

[email hidden] wrote:

|| I am having a discussion(cough-fight)with some peeps on
|| another board. WTH would anyone low carb and then do crazy
|| stuff like count cals or fast?
|| Just wondering.

Would you count portion control as counting calories?
Atkins forbids both overeating and undereating after
Induction, though Dr A never defined either objectively.
So Atkins is about right-sizing through portion control.

Do you log your food on fitday? Lots do. Fitday does
the counting for you.

Quoted message said:

Low carb does not emphasis the number of calories, but one must
be aware that calories still count. This is mentioned in the
Atkin's
book and likely in other low carb books. Exercise is also
mentioned
as a component of the WOL.

The appetite suppression of ketosis is larger the more
you have to lose and smaller the less you have to lose.
So is the metabolic edge of ketosis. Folks with 100+
to lose tend to drop weight quick and easy without ever
being hungry. Look around sometime for folks with 10-
to lose who report that same thing. Sure enough, the
book suggests cutting portions for the last few pounds.

<[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...
....

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Have you managed to lose weight by pigging out on all the fat and
protein that you want?

Well, congratulations.

You are genetically gifted...

....

Quoted message said:

I have managed to lose weight by pigging out on all the fat and protein
that I want. I am always satiated at the end of a meal, and I always

....

Quoted message said:

I eat as much as I want and my weight stays at 184, +-2 or 3 lbs. Been
like that for over 5 years.

But for the sig & eMail addy, that could have been my reply. You're both
correct and absolutely spot-on, "tunderbar".

DustyB
San Jose

Dusty Bleher wrote:
:: <[email hidden]> wrote in message
:: news:[email hidden]...
:: ...
:::: Have you managed to lose weight by pigging out on all the fat and
:::: protein that you want?
::::
:::: Well, congratulations.
::::
:::: You are genetically gifted...
:: ...
::: I have managed to lose weight by pigging out on all the fat and
::: protein that I want. I am always satiated at the end of a meal, and
::: I always ... I eat as much as I want and my weight stays at 184,
::: +-2 or 3 lbs. Been like that for over 5 years.
:: But for the sig & eMail addy, that could have been my reply. You're
:: both correct and absolutely spot-on, "tunderbar".

Spot-on about what? That he only "wants" enough food to not make him fat?
Big deal. He's a normal guy and not a fat person. IIRC, he only had 20 lbs
to lose. Switching to LC and staying there probaby got him half of that due
to water loss.

[email hidden] wrote:
|| OmManiPadmeOmelet wrote:
||| In article <[email hidden]>,
||| [email hidden] wrote:
|||
|||| [email hidden] wrote:
||||| I am having a discussion(cough-fight)with some peeps on another
||||| board. WTH would anyone low carb and then do crazy stuff like
||||| count cals or fast?
||||| Just wondering.
||||| Lynn
||||
|||| Because they haven't figured out that the low-carb method shows
|||| that calories mean squat. People are so fixated on calories that
|||| they cannot concieve that you could possibly lose weight without
|||| calories being the center piece of the weight loss.
||||
||| <snipped rest of Deja-moo>
||||
|||| TC
||||
|||
||| Have you managed to lose weight by pigging out on all the fat and
||| protein that you want?
|||
||| Well, congratulations.
|||
||| You are genetically gifted...
||| --
||| Om.
||
|| I have managed to lose weight by pigging out on all the fat and
|| protein that I want. I am always satiated at the end of a meal, and
|| I always eat when I get hungry. I add loads of butter (real butter)
|| to my food. I splash on liberal amounts of EVOO (extra virgin olive
|| oil) on my food. An eight ounce steak with a nice half-inch ring of
|| fat around the outside, is not out of bounds for me. A double burger
|| with cheese and bacon finds its way onto my plate every once in a
|| while. I eat eggs, yolk and all, fried in butter, often. My salads
|| are copiously bathed in homemade oil and vinegar dressings. If I
|| have ice cream, which I never crave, but indulge in once in a while,
|| it is high-fat whole-cream ice cream and nothing but. My favorite
|| breakfast is three eggs over-easy, sausages and bacon. Rye toast
|| with lots of butter and only a little bit of hash browns. I often
|| make soup from bones, with all the fat that oozes from them. I
|| insist on my chicken to have the bone in and the skin on. I love
|| fatty pork chops. Pork Ribs, slow grilled on the BBQ, slathered with
|| my own BBQ sauce, yummmmmmm.
||
|| I eat as much as I want and my weight stays at 184, +-2 or 3 lbs.
|| Been like that for over 5 years.
||
|| I don't eat added-sugar [censored], cereals, pasta, white bread, soda,
|| potato chips, or any other refined and high GI carbs in any
|| appreciable amounts. I do enjoy the odd sweet snack (a chocolate
|| bar), and since I don't eat it every single day, it is truly a snack
|| and I enjoy it that much more.

Great. Please post your before and after pictures.

--
Peter
Website: http://users.thelink.net/marengo

"Roger Zoul" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...
....

Quoted message said:

::: I have managed to lose weight by pigging out on all the fat and
::: protein that I want. I am always satiated at the end of a meal, and
::: I always ... I eat as much as I want and my weight stays at 184,
::: +-2 or 3 lbs. Been like that for over 5 years.
:: But for the sig & eMail addy, that could have been my reply. You're
:: both correct and absolutely spot-on, "tunderbar".

Spot-on about what? That he only "wants" enough food to not make him fat?
Big deal. He's a normal guy and not a fat person. IIRC, he only had 20
lbs to lose. Switching to LC and staying there probaby got him half of
that due to water loss.

Yeah? So? He made his goal...water loss or no. You got a problem with
that?
Like me, he eats all of the fats & oils he wants.
Like me, he's always satiated with his meals.
Like me, he can and does eat those things he likes--esp. with lots of fatty
meat
Like me, he enjoys a double-burger with cheese!
Like me, he likes his eggs fried in butter.
....and so on...
Sounds like he has things figured out. I, and others posting here do as
well. Do you?

But hey! If it's not in your cards to follow suit (pardon the pun), that's
fine with me. But I don't think that empowers you to denigrate his RESULTS!
No matter what the imputed reason (or lack thereof...).

My hat's off to him...

Regards t'all,
DustyB
San Jose

Quoted message said:

Dusty Bleher <[email hidden]> wrote:
:> "Roger Zoul" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
:> news:[email hidden]...
:> ...
:>> ::: I have managed to lose weight by pigging out on all the fat and
:>> ::: protein that I want. I am always satiated at the end of a meal,
:>> ::: and
:>> ::: I always ... I eat as much as I want and my weight stays at 184,
:>> ::: +-2 or 3 lbs. Been like that for over 5 years.
:>> :: But for the sig & eMail addy, that could have been my reply.
:>> :: You're both correct and absolutely spot-on, "tunderbar".
:>>
:>> Spot-on about what? That he only "wants" enough food to not make
:>> him fat? Big deal. He's a normal guy and not a fat person. IIRC,
:>> he only had 20 lbs to lose. Switching to LC and staying there
:>> probaby got him half of that due to water loss.
:> Yeah? So? He made his goal...water loss or no. You got a problem
:> with that?
:> Like me, he eats all of the fats & oils he wants.
:> Like me, he's always satiated with his meals.
:> Like me, he can and does eat those things he likes--esp. with lots
:> of fatty meat
:> Like me, he enjoys a double-burger with cheese!
:> Like me, he likes his eggs fried in butter.
:> ...and so on...
:> Sounds like he has things figured out. I, and others posting here
:> do as well. Do you?
:>
:> But hey! If it's not in your cards to follow suit (pardon the pun),
:> that's fine with me. But I don't think that empowers you to
:> denigrate his RESULTS! No matter what the imputed reason (or lack
:> thereof...).
:>
:> My hat's off to him...

Are you stupid or what? None of what he claims means that calories don't
count.

And I didn't denigrate his results, I just refute his claim about calories.