Do riders Know The Road Ahead

"CEO" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Was watching a dvd of the Tour De France, and wanted to know, how do the
riders know the road ahead.
I mean how do they know if the hairpin up ahead is sharp, and they should
slow down.
Do they know the points of the track that are sharp and slow ?
And which ones they can take flat out ?

Eyes and brakes help. The course is plotted and made public
knowledge well before the race and some will ride sections of
it (I'm thinking Lance and key climbs). Mostly I would think
it's just a case of slowing down for tight corners like anywhere
else. Some might be marked "hairpin" like here but I've not
seen signs like this before.

hippy

"hippy" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

"CEO" <[email hidden]> wrote in message

news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Was watching a dvd of the Tour De France, and wanted to know, how do the
riders know the road ahead.
I mean how do they know if the hairpin up ahead is sharp, and they

should

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

slow down.
Do they know the points of the track that are sharp and slow ?
And which ones they can take flat out ?

Eyes and brakes help. The course is plotted and made public
knowledge well before the race and some will ride sections of
it (I'm thinking Lance and key climbs). Mostly I would think
it's just a case of slowing down for tight corners like anywhere
else. Some might be marked "hairpin" like here but I've not
seen signs like this before.

hippy

They have motor bikes to lead them too. Although the motorbikes have been
known to crash too so they can't assume speeds. Citys and mountain descents
seem to be the most likely places to have problems.

Marty

"Marty Wallace" <[email hidden]> wrote

Quoted message said:

They have motor bikes to lead them too. Although the motorbikes have been
known to crash too so they can't assume speeds. Citys and mountain

descents

Quoted message said:

seem to be the most likely places to have problems.

The motorbikes have to be a distance in front for safety so the riders
wouldn't really be able to use them for anything other than a VERY
rough idea of which way the road was heading..

Okay, dug up some rules:

<quote>
To the fore, these motor-cycles shall keep ahead of the photographers'
"screen" and shall never slip in between the commissaire's car and the
riders.
They may not slip in between two groups of riders unless authorised to
do so by the Race Manager.
To the rear, they shall keep level with the Team Managers' cars in
single-file and shall make way for vehicles that have to attend the bunch
or wish to overtake the riders.
<endquote>
from: http://www.uci.ch/imgArchive/Road/Rules/A_2road.pdf

Couldn't find anything about motorbike-peloton distances though.

Factoid:
"Ardoisier" - The guy who sits on the pinion seat of a motorcycle
with a small chalkboard on which he gives information to the
riders in a breakaway about the time gap to the chasers.
http://www.chass.utoronto.ca/~mirvine/

hippy

CEO said:

Was watching a dvd of the Tour De France, and wanted to know, how do the
riders know the road ahead.
I mean how do they know if the hairpin up ahead is sharp, and they should
slow down.
Do they know the points of the track that are sharp and slow ?

And which ones they can take flat out ?

americansinfrance.netDangerSigns.cfmOpen ↗

they don't seem to have the suggestions we have on every corner.

The downhillers study those sections more than other riders?
Also, they have the advantage of using the full width of the road.

aeek said:

CEO said:

Was watching a dvd of the Tour De France, and wanted to know, how do
the
riders know the road ahead.
I mean how do they know if the hairpin up ahead is sharp, and they
should
slow down.
Do they know the points of the track that are sharp and slow ?

And which ones they can take flat out ?

http://www.americansinfrance.net/Driving/DangerSigns.cfm

they don't seem to have the suggestions we have on every corner.

The downhillers study those sections more than other riders?
Also, they have the advantage of using the full width of the road.

as well as info coming on the radio from the team.

--
Nick

In aus.bicycle on Mon, 06 Dec 2004 11:38:05 +1100

NickZX6R said:

aeek said:

The downhillers study those sections more than other riders?
Also, they have the advantage of using the full width of the road.

as well as info coming on the radio from the team.

"Left! Left!.....Um, no, the *other* left"

Zebee

NickZX6R said:

as well as info coming on the radio from the team.

--
Nick

This seems to be a large reason people argue that radio´s are good for racing. And another reason people argue they make it less interesting. Just out of curiousity, would anyone know if the radio´s are comfortable to ride with? I was at a race here and noticed the ones the Belgian 2nd div team had were rather large and potentially look annoying to ride 100´s of k with.

"oely" <[email hidden]

Quoted message said:

NickZX6R said:

as well as info coming on the radio from the team.

This seems to be a large reason people argue that radio´s are good for
racing. And another reason people argue they make it less interesting.
Just out of curiousity, would anyone know if the radio´s are
comfortable to ride with? I was at a race here and noticed the ones the
Belgian 2nd div team had were rather large and potentially look annoying
to ride 100´s of k with.

I'd prefer the race without radios.. like how we race..

I don't see how they're a safety item - surely the team
manager can't navigate for his riders, at least not in real
time. I think it spoils a lot of the tactical racing and
removes some of the potential mistakes riders can
make.

hippy

"hippy" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

"oely" <[email hidden]

Quoted message said:

NickZX6R said:

as well as info coming on the radio from the team.

This seems to be a large reason people argue that radio´s are good for
racing. And another reason people argue they make it less interesting.
Just out of curiousity, would anyone know if the radio´s are
comfortable to ride with? I was at a race here and noticed the ones the
Belgian 2nd div team had were rather large and potentially look annoying
to ride 100´s of k with.

I'd prefer the race without radios.. like how we race..

I don't see how they're a safety item - surely the team
manager can't navigate for his riders, at least not in real
time. I think it spoils a lot of the tactical racing and
removes some of the potential mistakes riders can
make.

hippy

Add to that the fact that the team manager can view real time heartrate data
and knows how hard you're working it must take a lot of the decision making
out of the minds of the cyclist.

Marty

hippy said:

I'd prefer the race without radios.. like how we race..

I don't see how they're a safety item - surely the team
manager can't navigate for his riders, at least not in real
time. I think it spoils a lot of the tactical racing and
removes some of the potential mistakes riders can
make.

hippy

I agree really but i have heard a few pro´s mention the safer rider thing when asked in interviews (cant remember when or who etc..). Team managers have always dictated strategy and made decisions, albiet by driving more dangerously to reach riders or domestiques dropping back to pick up the orders. The argument has been made that there is alot more $ at stake now, with riders wanting to ensure they are healthy/make a good living, having to keep sponsors happy and anything that can be done to ensure the riders are safe, fit and firing in the big race they have to try and seek out. With the $ comes stakes that are high, trying to limit factors that could ruin a rider by making a silly mistake is like ensuring the sponsor is getting the best possible return on the investment.

But i do agree, they are professional racers, they should be able to deal with round abouts, traffic islands etc.... Part of the reason why i like watching cycling is that a rider who may not be in the best form or have the most talent can win through his tactics and his own race "smarts". Taking advantage of spur of the moment situations etc... anything that can be done to get riders to ride on their instincts more could only be a good thing in my eyes.

"oely" <[email hidden]

Quoted message said:

hippy said:

I'd prefer the race without radios.. like how we race..
I don't see how they're a safety item - surely the team
manager can't navigate for his riders, at least not in real
time. I think it spoils a lot of the tactical racing and
removes some of the potential mistakes riders can
make.

I agree really but i have heard a few pro´s mention the safer rider
thing when asked in interviews (cant remember when or who etc..). Team
managers have always dictated strategy and made decisions, albiet by
driving more dangerously to reach riders or domestiques dropping back
to pick up the orders. The argument has been made that there is alot

That's probably why the view is held that 'with radios' is safer. If
they raced without radios and cars weren't permitted to drive to
riders I don't see how it would differ from riding normally. Someone
slowing to get to the team car shouldn't tax the peloton's skills 'that'
much, surely?

Quoted message said:

more $ at stake now, with riders wanting to ensure they are
healthy/make a good living, having to keep sponsors happy and anything
that can be done to ensure the riders are safe, fit and firing in the
big race they have to try and seek out. With the $ comes stakes that
are high, trying to limit factors that could ruin a rider by making a
silly mistake is like ensuring the sponsor is getting the best possible
return on the investment.

True, but lets say radios were banned and cars were not allowed to
drive through the peloton. Wouldn't this allow for some shuffling of
the ranks - riders with speed AND better tactical ability would be at
the top of the heap. I guess when money is involved, nothing will change
but personally I would like to see riders forced to make decisions, keep
an eye on who's in their bunch and who is in front and behind, that sort
of thing.

Quoted message said:

But i do agree, they are professional racers, they should be able to
deal with round abouts, traffic islands etc.... Part of the reason why
i like watching cycling is that a rider who may not be in the best form
or have the most talent can win through his tactics and his own race
"smarts". Taking advantage of spur of the moment situations etc...
anything that can be done to get riders to ride on their instincts more
could only be a good thing in my eyes.

Yeah. :-)

hippy

hippy said:

"oely" <[email hidden]

Quoted message said:

NickZX6R said:

as well as info coming on the radio from the team.

This seems to be a large reason people argue that radio´s are good for
racing. And another reason people argue they make it less interesting.
Just out of curiousity, would anyone know if the radio´s are
comfortable to ride with? I was at a race here and noticed the ones the
Belgian 2nd div team had were rather large and potentially look annoying
to ride 100´s of k with.

I'd prefer the race without radios.. like how we race..

I don't see how they're a safety item - surely the team
manager can't navigate for his riders, at least not in real
time. I think it spoils a lot of the tactical racing and
removes some of the potential mistakes riders can
make.

hippy

I agree. Let the riders do the riding.

--
Nick