Do good value for performance bikes have to be American?

Jo Stoller said:

Many thanks

Orange: http://www.orangebikes.co.uk/main/main.php
Dawes: http://www.dawescycles.com/
Orbit: http://www.orbit-cycles.co.uk/
Edinburgh Co-op: http://www.edinburgh-bicycle.co.uk/

YMMV WRT price.

If you want a good value bike - try

http://www.edinburgh-bicycle.co.uk/

Their own brand bikes get consistently good reviews as being exceptionally good
value for money.

Also consider Dawes bikes. The Discovery range is good value.

Cheers, helen s

--This is an invalid email address to avoid spam--
to get correct one remove fame & fortune
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--Due to financial crisis the light at the end of the tunnel is switched off--

Simonb said:

Jo Stoller said:

Many thanks

Orange: http://www.orangebikes.co.uk/main/main.php
Dawes: http://www.dawescycles.com/
Orbit: http://www.orbit-cycles.co.uk/
Edinburgh Co-op: http://www.edinburgh-bicycle.co.uk/

The Orion City 2x9 looks good at £495:

http://www.orbit-cycles.co.uk/orion3.shtml

On 14 Jun 2004 13:25:30 -0700, [email hidden] (Jo Stoller)

Quoted message said:

Are they really
the best value, or is there another make (model suggestion would help
too) from another country that I should consider?

My bikes (ie last bike(crashed) and last bike but one(stolen)) usually
come from Ridgeback who can be found at
http://www.ridgebackbikes.co.uk/.

They don't actually build frames in the UK but I don't think many
people do these days, with the exception of custom builds. They are,
however, refreshingly not Merkin.

I was happy with both Ridgebacks that I owned.

dirtylitterboxofferingstospammers said:

If you want a good value bike - try

http://www.edinburgh-bicycle.co.uk/

Their own brand bikes get consistently good reviews as being exceptionally
good value for money.

Also consider Dawes bikes. The Discovery range is good value.

Seconded. Just got a Discovery 201. Very happy with it compared to my
old Carrera Crossfire.

I'm not sure just how British their bikes are anymore, though.

Frink

--
Doctor J. Frink : 'Rampant Ribald Ringtail'
See his mind here : http://www.cmp.liv.ac.uk/frink/
Annoy his mind here : pjf at cmp dot liv dot ack dot ook
"No sir, I didn't like it!" - Mr Horse

Doctor J. Frink said:

I'm not sure just how British their bikes are anymore, though.

Confirmed by my LBS -- Fort (Czech Republic) makes the Dawes Audax frame.

But most US frames are made in TW anyway.

In article <[email hidden]>,=20
[email hidden] says...

Quoted message said:

The bike shops are now dominated by bikes from American companies. In
addition to the Trek, I was also offered Cannondale and Specialized
but they were even worse from my point of view because they had big
markings boasting about the fact that they were American and/or made
there. I would like to be able to consider a non-US bike if possible
without compromising value for money.
=20
=20

cannondale do good frames, and both mine have been made in the usa, but=20
at your price point, you wont get good good componets on a 'dale frame.=20
Excelent basis for upgrades though. Most frames these days are however=20
manufacured in tiwan irrespective of the country of assembly and=20
trademark, the exception being custom frames, but again, not at your=20
price point. Oh and components wise, you'll probably end up with shimano=20
(the miccrosoft of the cycling world) and I *think* these are made in=20
japan. It's dificult to be patriotic, and almost imposible at around=20
=A3500.
--=20
..paul

If at first you don't succeed...
Skydiving is probably not the sport for you.

paul said:

price point. Oh and components wise, you'll probably end up with shimano
(the miccrosoft of the cycling world)

Is that comparison made on their market share, or the quality of their
products (or both)?

There's certainly nothing wrong with dominating a market if you're
producing good stuff, but not if you abuse the position to keep down
those that would.

Frink

--
Doctor J. Frink : 'Rampant Ribald Ringtail'
See his mind here : http://www.cmp.liv.ac.uk/frink/
Annoy his mind here : pjf at cmp dot liv dot ack dot ook
"No sir, I didn't like it!" - Mr Horse

in message <[email hidden]>, Jo Stoller

(') said:

After not having a bike for many many years, I am about to buy a new
one. It is for general riding in London, commuting and some long rides
e.g. in the Cotswolds. Almost all on road but perhaps some off road on
reasonable tracks. I am not bothered about suspension but would like
to have SPD type pedals with an option for normal shoes.

The bike shops are now dominated by bikes from American companies. In
addition to the Trek, I was also offered Cannondale and Specialized
but they were even worse from my point of view because they had big
markings boasting about the fact that they were American and/or made
there. I would like to be able to consider a non-US bike if possible
without compromising value for money.

There are actually plenty of good non-US manufacturers, but, unless
you're prejudiced (and I know people who are) many of the big American
brands do offer good value for money. Of UK-built bikes in the sort of
robust hybrid category you're thinking of Dawes and Orange are names to
consider (but beware that the low-end models in each range have frames
made in Taiwan). If you're prepared to consider European as well,
Nicolai make bikes at least as good as the best of the big American
brands. And there are many others.

Quoted message said:

What do you guys think of what I have been offered? Are they really
the best value, or is there another make (model suggestion would help
too) from another country that I should consider?

Best value for a robust but performant hybrid is probably the Edinburgh
Bicycle Co-op's Revolution Courier (frame made in Taiwan, I believe,
but to EBC's design).

--
[email hidden] (Simon Brooke) http://www.jasmine.org.uk/~simon/
;; "If I were a Microsoft Public Relations person, I would probably
;; be sobbing on a desk right now" -- Rob Miller, editor, /.

in message <[email hidden]>, Doctor J. Frink

(') said:

paul said:

price point. Oh and components wise, you'll probably end up with
shimano (the miccrosoft of the cycling world)

Is that comparison made on their market share, or the quality of their
products (or both)?

Nothing specially wrong with Shimano's products. On the whole they're
workmanlike, reliable, quite well made, and good value for money. So
wholly unlike Microsoft on those counts.

--
[email hidden] (Simon Brooke) http://www.jasmine.org.uk/~simon/

'You cannot put "The Internet" into the Recycle Bin.'

Simon Brooke said:

(but beware that the low-end models in each range have
frames made in Taiwan)

Why 'beware' of TW frames? They were pretty good quality last time I looked.

"paul" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Oh and components wise, you'll probably end up with shimano
(the miccrosoft of the cycling world) and I *think* these are
made in japan.

Ony their higher end stuff is made in Japan, the bulk of the range comes from
Taiwan and the mainland.
--
"Mango sorbet is clearcut proof that we have progressed beyond the
bare needs of survival and have progressed to the transcendant."
- Marc Goodman in talk.bizarre

Mark South said:

"paul" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Oh and components wise, you'll probably end up with shimano
(the miccrosoft of the cycling world) and I *think* these are
made in japan.

Ony their higher end stuff is made in Japan, the bulk of the range comes from
Taiwan and the mainland.

.... the mainland of what?
--
Michael MacClancy
Random putdown - "A modest little person, with much to be modest about."-
Winston Churchill
www.macclancy.demon.co.uk
www.macclancy.co.uk

Simonb said:

Simon Brooke said:

(but beware that the low-end models in each range have
frames made in Taiwan)

Why 'beware' of TW frames? They were pretty good quality last time I looked.

I find it very confusing to judge quality by nationality. Taiwan makes
both excellent and poor products. Many Taiwanese firms have opened
factories in china producing good quality products too but generally
mainland chinese companies produce poor quality cycle products.Taiwan
is distinct and seperate from mainland china in not only the fact its
an island but it has a japanese designed infrastructure, major
european influence and is a democracy. Malay-Polynesian people were
the main settlers on the island originally and add to this people of
chinese, japanese and european descent creates a unique type of people
and race completely different in culture to china.

The main concern of the taiwan industry seems to be competition from
even cheaper but lower quality mainland chinese products.

I doubt there can be any true british products anywhere near the
bottom end of pricing without sacrificing quality as Britain is so
expensive to manufacture in. I work for a swiss company (Baumanns)
manufacturing springs and pressings in the uk and the company also
owns chinese factories.UK labour costs are at least 4x more expensive
and Baumanns pay very well in china compared to native chinese
companies. Other costs compare even better in china's favour.

Its far cheaper to manufacture in the states and many american firms
actually manufacture in Mexico but still end up with 'Made in USA'
stickers on. I believe a 'Made in USA" should represent 75% usa made
content but in fact can be as low as 30%.

the best Britain can achieve really is design and development of bikes
that are manufactured elsewhere with top end models hand built in
Britain to exacting specifications. I suspect thats pretty much where
we are at.

Doctor J. Frink wrote:

[shimano]

Quoted message said:

Is that comparison made on their market share, or the quality of their
products (or both)?

Market Share. Some of their very low range stuff is made of cheese, but
costs less than cheese so that's forgivable. The high end stuff is very
good. Maybe not the best, but even if that is the case it's generally
not too far off.

Pete.
--
Peter Clinch Medical Physics IT Officer
Tel 44 1382 660111 ext. 33637 Univ. of Dundee, Ninewells Hospital
Fax 44 1382 640177 Dundee DD1 9SY Scotland UK
net [email hidden] http://www.dundee.ac.uk/~pjclinch/

in message <[email hidden]>, Simonb

(') said:

Simon Brooke said:

(but beware that the low-end models in each range have
frames made in Taiwan)

Why 'beware' of TW frames? They were pretty good quality last time I
looked.

Oh, sure, but the OP seemed to have a fetish about where things were
made.

--
[email hidden] (Simon Brooke) http://www.jasmine.org.uk/~simon/
Ring of great evil
Small one casts it into flame
Bringing rise of Men ;; gonzoron

In news:[email hidden],
Michael MacClancy <[email hidden]> typed:

Quoted message said:

Mark South said:

"paul" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Oh and components wise, you'll probably end up with shimano
(the miccrosoft of the cycling world) and I *think* these are
made in japan.

Ony their higher end stuff is made in Japan, the bulk of the range
comes from Taiwan and the mainland.

... the mainland of what?

Orkney, obviously. That's the only place I know called Mainland.

A

"Michael MacClancy" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Mark South said:

"paul" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Oh and components wise, you'll probably end up with shimano
(the miccrosoft of the cycling world) and I *think* these are
made in japan.

Ony their higher end stuff is made in Japan, the bulk of the range comes

from

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Taiwan and the mainland.

... the mainland of what?

Mainland China. It would have sounded dumb to write "from Taiwan and China."
since Taiwan is China.
--
"Do stairs, stairs, and more stairs,
wherever you can find them."
- Jim Roberts in rec.backcountry

In news:[email hidden],
Mark South <[email hidden]> typed:

Quoted message said:

"Michael MacClancy" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Mark South said:

"paul" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...
> Oh and components wise, you'll probably end up with shimano
> (the miccrosoft of the cycling world) and I *think* these are
> made in japan.

Ony their higher end stuff is made in Japan, the bulk of the range
comes from Taiwan and the mainland.

... the mainland of what?

Mainland China. It would have sounded dumb to write "from Taiwan and
China." since Taiwan is China.

Well, you don't have to take that line, as you're not trying to keep up good
diplomatic relations with Beijing.

A