Do aluminum frames wear out?

Quoted post said:

Originally posted by Chris Hansen
Hello,

I've talked to two people who have said aluminum frames
wear out. One said that after about 8 years they kind of go
"dead" and lose the feel they once had. Another talked
about how he broke the bottom bracket out of an old
aluminum frame.

Does anyone know anything about this? If you plan to
keep a bike for longer than 10 years is it better not to
get aluminum?

Don't know about 'wearing out' but I owned one that had the seat tube lug crack. (I was out of the saddle climbing at the time). I'd owned the bike for about 7 yrs. at the time this had happened.

Here's something to read on the subject:

http://www.ihpva.org/com/PracticalInnovations/materials.html

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In article
<[email hidden]>, Chris

Hansen said:

Hello,

I've talked to two people who have said aluminum frames
wear out. One said that after about 8 years they kind of go
"dead" and lose the feel they once had. Another talked
about how he broke the bottom bracket out of an old
aluminum frame.

Does anyone know anything about this? If you plan to keep a
bike for longer than 10 years is it better not to get
aluminum?

_ Aluminum alloys will eventually fatigue, whether
you'll use the bike enough for this ever to happen is an
open question.

_ A high quality steel bike will easily last 30 years.
I ride a 30+ year old steel frame and it's a good as
it ever was.

_ Booker C. Bense

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On 24 Mar 2004 10:42:25 -0800, [email hidden] (Chris
Hansen) wrote in message
<[email hidden]>:

Quoted message said:

I've talked to two people who have said aluminum frames
wear out. One said that after about 8 years they kind of go
"dead" and lose the feel they once had. Another talked
about how he broke the bottom bracket out of an old
aluminum frame.

The first person may well have been talking bollocks, the
second was not. I've broken two aluminium frames (replaced
under warranty). It won't stop me buying aluminium bikes. I
ride about 5k miles per year and a bike is my primary mode
of transport; if a bike only lasts 3 years I've still saved
money over the cost of running a car.

If you are really concerned buy titanium or steel, I guess.

--
Guy
===
May contain traces of irony. Contents liable to settle after
posting. chapmancentral.co.ukchapmancentral.co.ukOpen ↗

88% of helmet statistics are made up, 65% of them at
Washington University

<[email hidden].-
edu> wrote

Quoted message said:

_ Aluminum alloys will eventually fatigue, whether you'll
use the bike enough for this ever to happen is an open
question.

A steel frame will also fatigue if it is loaded over its
fatigue limit. As to whether it will ever be, or how often
it will be, depends on the design, the rider, the quality
control, and how it's ridden. Steel frames fail all the
time. It's a mistake to think material has anything to do
with longevity.

Peter Cole said:

It's a mistake to think material has anything to do with
longevity.

^^^^^^^^ I think you
mean "everything".

--
Benjamin Lewis

Clothes make the man. Naked people have little or no
influence on society.
- Mark Twain

Cipher said:

Here's something to read on the subject:

ihpva.orgmaterials.htOpen ↗
ml

Good site. He neglects titanium, though. The homebuilder
committed to welding aluminum already has a MIG or TIG
setup, and in my experience, 6Al-4V Titanium is easier to
weld than aluminum, and stiffness-to-weight, there is no
contest. A vast difference between steel and aluminum was
explained to me by an ME friend thusly: After a million
flexural cycles on a steel structure, it can be
considered to have unlimited life; After a million
flexural cycles on an aluminum structure, it can be
considered to have Zero remaining flexural life. (I do
not know the rationale for this, nor the mechanisms, etc.
BUT: Do airframe components "time out"? There are plenty
of commercial aircraft flying after decades of use. But
they are not 6061-T6, I do not think.)

Quoted message said:

I've talked to two people who have said aluminum frames
wear out. One said that after about 8 years they kind of
go "dead" and lose the feel they once had. Another talked
about how he broke the bottom bracket out of an old
aluminum frame.

Back in the day, we were told that European racers replaced
their steel frames every year because they "went soft." And
those of us who thought we were of even moderate strength
would insist that our steel frames became "mushy" after a
couple of years.

It's funny how the more things change, the more they stay
the same...

--Mike-- Chain Reaction Bicycles www.ChainReaction.com

"Chris Hansen" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
"]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Hello,

I've talked to two people who have said aluminum frames
wear out. One said that after about 8 years they kind of
go "dead" and lose the feel they once had. Another talked
about how he broke the bottom bracket out of an old
aluminum frame.

Does anyone know anything about this? If you plan to keep
a bike for longer than 10 years is it better not to get
aluminum?

Cipher said:

Chris Hansen wrote:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Does anyone know anything about this? If you plan to
keep a bike for longer than 10 years is it better not
to get aluminum?

Quoted message said:

Don't know about 'wearing out' but I owned one that had
the seat tube lug crack. (I was out of the saddle climbing
at the time). I'd owned the bike for about 7 yrs. at the
time this had happened.

My aluminum frame is no more due to unplanned automotive
percussive testing downgrading the functionality of my
bicycle. i.e. Cars Suck

As to the frame material, as long as you don't buy something
stupid-light, it shouldn't be a problem. But don't go out
and buy a 2.5 lb aluminum & faery dust frame with
drillium/unobtainium components and then complain that it
breaks in two years.

--
Dane Jackson - z u v e m b i @ u n i x b i g o t s . o r g
Congratulations are in order for Tom Reid.

He says he just found out he is the winner of the 2021
Psychic of the Year award.

"Benjamin Lewis" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
"]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Peter Cole said:

It's a mistake to think material has anything to do with
longevity.

^^^^^^^^ I think
you mean
"everything".

No, I meant anything.

Everything wears out, eventually. My Schwinn Sierra steel
ATB, which was used primarily for commuting, recently
parted ways at the rear dropout. Actually, the dropout
itself broke.

The frame was bought in 1989, making it 14 years old. It
had 43,500 miles on it. And "Schwinn" doesn't honor
_Schwinn's_ lifetime warranty (The bike outlasted the
company that made it).

Aluminum frames usually don't come with lifetime warrantees,
period. 5-6 years is the norm. Aluminum, for all it's good
points, doesn't handle torsional stresses as well as steel.
It slowly develops micro-fractures in it's structure
eventually leading to fatigue and failure. This is just a
characteristic of the metal.

How long this takes depends on the alloy, the quality of
iot, and of course the severity of the stresses it is being
called upon to withstand.

- - "May you have the wind at your back. And a really low
gear for the hills!"

Chris Zacho ~ "Your Friendly Neighborhood Wheelman"

Chris'Z Corner geocities.comczcornerOpen ↗

"TopCounsel" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
"]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

It's a mistake to think material has anything to do
with longevity.

^^^^^^^^ I think
you mean
"everything".

Obviously the material has "a lot" to do with longevity.
I'ts just not

the

Quoted message said:

be-all and end-all of longevity. Try building an origami
bike frame and

see

Quoted message said:

what happens. After all, there's a reason nearly all cars
are made of

steel,

Quoted message said:

whereas fiberglass and other metals are somewhat rare.

Easier to mass produce. Cheaper. Doesn't "dent".

If you live in a damp climate and don't crash,
fiberglass wins.

Peter Cole said:

"Benjamin Lewis" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
"]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Peter Cole said:

It's a mistake to think material has anything to do with
longevity.

^^^^^^^^ I think you mean "everything".

No, I meant anything.

You're seriously claiming that the material has *nothing* to
do with longevity? So a bicycle made of pasta would last
just as long as a bicycle made of steel, all other things
being equal?

--
Benjamin Lewis

Clothes make the man. Naked people have little or no
influence on society.
- Mark Twain

"Dane Jackson" <[email hidden]> wrote in message ...

Quoted message said:

As to the frame material, as long as you don't buy
something stupid-light, it shouldn't be a problem. But
don't go out and buy a 2.5 lb aluminum & faery dust frame
with drillium/unobtainium components and then complain
that it breaks in two years.

Don't worry about that.

Today top-end AL frames are all way overbuilt.

Take De Rosa's Merak frame, it's built with Dedacciai V107
hydroformed aluminum tubing but weighs in at 1.25kg. That's
giving up to much on today's top carb frames. This thing
will still be around next season, which by then the frame
design will be out of date.

I've asked Cristiano DeRosa several times to shave the mass
of that frame down to a more reasonable 968 grams.

Start the season with a new training frame and one or two
race frames, that's how many of the pro teams work it.

Why wish your AL frame to last for three years? You're going
to have to rent a storage unit in that case.

"Methuselah" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
"]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Cipher usenet- said:

Here's something to read on the subject:

ihpva.orgmateriaOpen ↗
ls.html

Good site. He neglects titanium, though. The homebuilder
committed to welding aluminum already has a MIG or TIG
setup, and in my experience, 6Al-4V Titanium is easier to
weld than aluminum, and stiffness-to-weight, there is no
contest. A vast difference between steel and aluminum was
explained to me by an ME friend thusly: After a million
flexural cycles on a steel structure, it can be considered
to have unlimited life; After a million flexural cycles on
an aluminum structure, it can be considered to have Zero
remaining flexural life.

Gee, with those numbers, my frame shouldn't last the summer,
or my rims, or my cranks, or my seatpost!

Quoted message said:

(I do not know the rationale for this, nor the mechanisms,
etc. BUT: Do airframe components "time out"? There are
plenty of commercial aircraft flying after decades of use.
But they are not 6061-T6, I do not think.)

I wouldn't take any chances, refuse to fly anything but
steel planes!

Buy a titanium frame. Doesn't corrode, not brittle
like alumnium.

There is a good article on the advantages/disadvantages of
frame materials at:

exploratorium.eduframes1.htmlOpen ↗

"Chris Hansen" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
"]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Hello,

I've talked to two people who have said aluminum frames
wear out. One said that after about 8 years they kind of
go "dead" and lose the feel they once had. Another talked
about how he broke the bottom bracket out of an old
aluminum frame.

Does anyone know anything about this? If you plan to keep
a bike for longer than 10 years is it better not to get
aluminum?

In article <[email hidden]>,
[email hidden] says...

Quoted message said:

Cipher usenet- said:

Here's something to read on the subject:

ihpva.orgmateriaOpen ↗
ls.html

Good site. He neglects titanium, though. The homebuilder
committed to welding aluminum already has a MIG or TIG
setup, and in my experience, 6Al-4V Titanium is easier to
weld than aluminum, and stiffness-to-weight, there is no
contest. A vast difference between steel and aluminum was
explained to me by an ME friend thusly: After a million
flexural cycles on a steel structure, it can be
considered to have unlimited life; After a million
flexural cycles on an aluminum structure, it can be
considered to have Zero remaining flexural life. (I do
not know the rationale for this, nor the mechanisms, etc.
BUT: Do airframe components "time out"? There are plenty
of commercial aircraft flying after decades of use. But
they are not 6061-T6, I do not think.)

They are also routinely inspected for cracks every so many
cycles (one takeoff and one landing being a cycle).
Remember the Hawaiian 737 a few years ago where the top
half of the fuselage ripped off, and then inspection found
fatigue cracks?

--
Dave Kerber Fight spam: remove the ns_ from the return
address before replying!

REAL programmers write self-modifying code.

Since aluminum is not as good as steel, riding an aluminum
bike is dangerous, therefore one should wear a helmet to
save one's life!

Woohoooo!

--
[email hidden]
A very small object - Its center.
25

Quoted message said:

Obviously the material has "a lot" to do with longevity.
I'ts just not the be-all and end-all of longevity.

An old engineering saying goes: "There are not bad
materials, only bad applications"

Quoted message said:

Try building an origami bike frame and see what happens.

I see no reason why you couldn't build a bike out of
properly engineered cardboard tubes which would at least be
marginally functional.

Quoted message said:

After all, there's a reason nearly all cars are made
of steel, whereas fiberglass and other metals are
somewhat rare.

Yes, cost. A typical automobile manufacturer can price their
vehicles by the pound and get a pretty close estimate to
their actual production costs.

High-end vehicles are often carbon fiber these days.

Chris Neary [email hidden]

"Science, freedom, beauty, adventure: what more could you
ask of life? Bicycling combined all the elements I loved" -
Adapted from a quotation by Charles Lindbergh