DIY base for Minoura Workman Pro

"Ozark Bicycle" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

I was in need of a foldable, portable truing stand. After looking at
the field, I settled on a Minoura Workman Pro, mostly due to the fact
that it was closest in use to the (heavy, non-foldable, non-portable)
Park TS-2 I have used for nearly 20 years.

The drawback to the Minoura is that it is too lightweight and unstable
as it comes in the box. To address this, I fashioned a base from a 19"
x 15" piece of 3/4" MDF and various pieces of wood and hardware I had
in the shop. The base makes the Minoura pretty stable and also serves
as a storage/transport station when the stand is folded down. I
wouldn't want to build wheels on it on a regular basis, but it should
be fine for occasional use by a home builder, and it works just dandy
as a truing stand 'in the field' (which was my goal/intended use).

Pictures are worth a kiloword, so here they are, first the base
itself, then with the stand in the folded/stored mode, and last, three
pics of the stand in the "deployed" mode on the base:

http://ozarkbicycleservice.com/minoura1

http://ozarkbicycleservice.com/minoura2

http://ozarkbicycleservice.com/minoura3

http://ozarkbicycleservice.com/minoura4

http://ozarkbicycleservice.com/minoura5

Last time I looked, Nashbar had the Minoura for $45 (and there's
usually a 10% off coupon floating around somewhere), and the base
should cost less than $10 to build up, so this is a pretty affordable
project.

Nice execution. I bought one of these last spring. I screwed mine to my
workbench but I'm going to check out your strap setup.

I built 1 set of wheels on it and decided that it was too hard on the old
hands so I found a good local wheel builder. ;-)

My main complaint with the Minoura is the rigidity or lack of it in the
uprights. The way they are held is very flimsy. I can do just as good a
job with the wheels in the bike.

I've used lots of Park Pro stands and I had an old Var wheel stand that I
could use to build truck wheels and so maybe I was expecting more from
what looked like a good design.

The problem is that the uprights don't center the hub. I use a very old
1st generation Park dish tool to make sure the hub is centered. With just
a little more effort, Minoura could have fixed this design problem.

Chas.

* * Chas said:

"Ozark Bicycle" <[email hidden]> wrote in message

news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

I was in need of a foldable, portable truing stand. After looking at
the field, I settled on a Minoura Workman Pro, mostly due to the fact
that it was closest in use to the (heavy, non-foldable, non-portable)
Park TS-2 I have used for nearly 20 years.

Quoted message said:

The drawback to the Minoura is that it is too lightweight and unstable
as it comes in the box. To address this, I fashioned a base from a 19"
x 15" piece of 3/4" MDF and various pieces of wood and hardware I had
in the shop. The base makes the Minoura pretty stable and also serves
as a storage/transport station when the stand is folded down. I
wouldn't want to build wheels on it on a regular basis, but it should
be fine for occasional use by a home builder, and it works just dandy
as a truing stand 'in the field' (which was my goal/intended use).

Quoted message said:

Pictures are worth a kiloword, so here they are, first the base
itself, then with the stand in the folded/stored mode, and last, three
pics of the stand in the "deployed" mode on the base:

Quoted message said:

http://ozarkbicycleservice.com/minoura1

Quoted message said:

http://ozarkbicycleservice.com/minoura2

Quoted message said:

http://ozarkbicycleservice.com/minoura3

Quoted message said:

http://ozarkbicycleservice.com/minoura4

Quoted message said:

http://ozarkbicycleservice.com/minoura5

Quoted message said:

Last time I looked, Nashbar had the Minoura for $45 (and there's
usually a 10% off coupon floating around somewhere), and the base
should cost less than $10 to build up, so this is a pretty affordable
project.

Nice execution. I bought one of these last spring. I screwed mine to my
workbench but I'm going to check out your strap setup.

The straps are only used in the folded/stored/transit mode The two
metal tabs are movable and swing out and back over the Minoura's
'mounting tabs' (the ones you used to screw it to the workbench).
Together with the front facing "dock" for the forward brace and those
two small blocks near the tabs, they make the stand pretty stable.

Quoted message said:

I built 1 set of wheels on it and decided that it was too hard on the old
hands so I found a good local wheel builder. ;-)

My main complaint with the Minoura is the rigidity or lack of it in the
uprights. The way they are held is very flimsy. I can do just as good a
job with the wheels in the bike.

Properly anchoring the Minoura makes a big difference. Just using
their mounting holes does not make the stand suffeciently rigid, IMO.

Quoted message said:

I've used lots of Park Pro stands and I had an old Var wheel stand that I
could use to build truck wheels and so maybe I was expecting more from
what looked like a good design.

The problem is that the uprights don't center the hub. I use a very old
1st generation Park dish tool to make sure the hub is centered. With just
a little more effort, Minoura could have fixed this design problem.

The "self centering" feature is kinda useless, but no more so than the
same feature on the TS-2. An alignment guage ("dishing tool"😉 is a
must for precision work.

Quoted message said:

Ozark Bicycle said:

The "self centering" feature is kinda useless, but no more so than the
same feature on the TS-2. An alignment guage ("dishing tool"😉 is a
must for precision work.

This is the thing that makes me think that your frame is a fine truing
jig unless you are making wheels for someone else. Eyeball the center
(dish) and it is good enough. All you need is a decent spoke wrench.

It is a nice stand you made, BTW.

Ron Ruff said:

On Feb 12, 11:49 am, "Ozark Bicycle"

Quoted message said:

The "self centering" feature is kinda useless, but no more so than the
same feature on the TS-2. An alignment guage ("dishing tool"😉 is a
must for precision work.

This is the thing that makes me think that your frame is a fine truing
jig unless you are making wheels for someone else.

I guess "fine" is in the eye of the beholder; yes, you can true a
wheel in your frame, if you don't mind the PIA factor. Having done
this sort of thing in the distant past, I would never want to do it
again (the pronouncements of certain self-appointed internet bicycle
gurus not withstanding). If you do this sort of thing regularly, even
a modest truing stand makes life far more pleasant. At least that was
my experience when I obtained a used (old, original model) Minoura
truing stand way back ~25 years ago.

Quoted message said:

Eyeball the center
(dish) and it is good enough. All you need is a decent spoke wrench.

When I said the self-centering feature is "kinda useless", I meant
that in a relative way: even the Minoura makes centering the wheel
easier than does a bike frame, especially for a rear wheel. My comment
re: an alignment guage was aimed at the goal of getting the wheel
centered to within ~1mm and doing so in a reasonable time frame.

Quoted message said:

It is a nice stand you made, BTW.

Thank you!

"Ozark Bicycle" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Ron Ruff said:

On Feb 12, 11:49 am, "Ozark Bicycle"

Quoted message said:

The "self centering" feature is kinda useless, but no more so than

the

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

same feature on the TS-2. An alignment guage ("dishing tool"😉 is a
must for precision work.

This is the thing that makes me think that your frame is a fine truing
jig unless you are making wheels for someone else.

I guess "fine" is in the eye of the beholder; yes, you can true a
wheel in your frame, if you don't mind the PIA factor. Having done
this sort of thing in the distant past, I would never want to do it
again (the pronouncements of certain self-appointed internet bicycle
gurus not withstanding). If you do this sort of thing regularly, even
a modest truing stand makes life far more pleasant. At least that was
my experience when I obtained a used (old, original model) Minoura
truing stand way back ~25 years ago.

Quoted message said:

Eyeball the center
(dish) and it is good enough. All you need is a decent spoke wrench.

When I said the self-centering feature is "kinda useless", I meant
that in a relative way: even the Minoura makes centering the wheel
easier than does a bike frame, especially for a rear wheel. My comment
re: an alignment guage was aimed at the goal of getting the wheel
centered to within ~1mm and doing so in a reasonable time frame.

Quoted message said:

It is a nice stand you made, BTW.

Thank you!

You made a portable "truing" stand which is what you set out to
accomplish. I use mine to get wheels to within .010 (.25mm).

If I were going to be building wheels on a regular basis I'd get a Var or
Park stand.

Chas.

* * Chas said:

"Ozark Bicycle" <[email hidden]> wrote in message

news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Ron Ruff said:

On Feb 12, 11:49 am, "Ozark Bicycle"

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

<[email hidden]> wrote:
> The "self centering" feature is kinda useless, but no more so than

the

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

> same feature on the TS-2. An alignment guage ("dishing tool"😉 is a
> must for precision work.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

This is the thing that makes me think that your frame is a fine truing
jig unless you are making wheels for someone else.

Quoted message said:

I guess "fine" is in the eye of the beholder; yes, you can true a
wheel in your frame, if you don't mind the PIA factor. Having done
this sort of thing in the distant past, I would never want to do it
again (the pronouncements of certain self-appointed internet bicycle
gurus not withstanding). If you do this sort of thing regularly, even
a modest truing stand makes life far more pleasant. At least that was
my experience when I obtained a used (old, original model) Minoura
truing stand way back ~25 years ago.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Eyeball the center
(dish) and it is good enough. All you need is a decent spoke wrench.

Quoted message said:

When I said the self-centering feature is "kinda useless", I meant
that in a relative way: even the Minoura makes centering the wheel
easier than does a bike frame, especially for a rear wheel. My comment
re: an alignment guage was aimed at the goal of getting the wheel
centered to within ~1mm and doing so in a reasonable time frame.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

It is a nice stand you made, BTW.

Quoted message said:

Thank you!

You made a portable "truing" stand which is what you set out to
accomplish.

Yes, that was the goal: a truing stand for use "in the field". That is
why I removed the vertical guage from my Minoura: it's presence made
it impossible for the stand to accept wheels mounted with anything
other than the narrowest of tires (a necessity for "quicky" truing
during a simple tune up, etc.). I found that a simple piece of tubing
mounted between the lateral truing indicators works well as a vertical
indicator when necessary and is quicker than replacing the Minoura
supplied vertical guage.

Quoted message said:

I use mine to get wheels to within .010 (.25mm).

You mean in lateral runout?

Quoted message said:

If I were going to be building wheels on a regular basis I'd get a Var or
Park stand.

I've never used the VAR; I can recommend the Park TS-2, but with the
reservation that an alignment guage is needed for precision work,
despite the "automatic centering" feature.

"Ozark Bicycle" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...
<snip>

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

You made a portable "truing" stand which is what you set out to
accomplish.

Yes, that was the goal: a truing stand for use "in the field". That is
why I removed the vertical guage from my Minoura: it's presence made
it impossible for the stand to accept wheels mounted with anything
other than the narrowest of tires (a necessity for "quicky" truing
during a simple tune up, etc.). I found that a simple piece of tubing
mounted between the lateral truing indicators works well as a vertical
indicator when necessary and is quicker than replacing the Minoura
supplied vertical guage.

Quoted message said:

I use mine to get wheels to within .010 (.25mm).

You mean in lateral runout?

Yes.... If the wheel was well built to begin with and not too trashed,
it's not too hard to get it that close. The idea being that the wheel will
stay within tolerable runout longer if it's trued better. i.e. I don't
have to mess with it again for a while. Pay me now or pay me later.

I'm not obsessive enough to try to correct ovoid rims.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

If I were going to be building wheels on a regular basis I'd get a Var

or

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Park stand.

I've never used the VAR; I can recommend the Park TS-2, but with the
reservation that an alignment guage is needed for precision work,
despite the "automatic centering" feature.

The lower priced VAR #74 weighed 22 Lbs. (10 Kg) and was sturdy enough to
be used with motorcycle wheels.

http://www.sheldonbrown.com/var/pages/var0035.html

A better stand that I forgot about was the Hozan wheel truing stand. We
had one or two at our shop that were beefier than the model they sell
today. It weighed about 30 Lbs.

http://www.hozan.co.jp/cycle_e/catalog/wheel_stand/C-330.htm

They have a lot of interesting tools on their web site:

http://www.hozan.co.jp/cycle_e/

Chas.

* * Chas said:

"Ozark Bicycle" <[email hidden]> wrote in message

news:[email hidden]...
<snip>

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

You made a portable "truing" stand which is what you set out to
accomplish.

Quoted message said:

Yes, that was the goal: a truing stand for use "in the field". That is
why I removed the vertical guage from my Minoura: it's presence made
it impossible for the stand to accept wheels mounted with anything
other than the narrowest of tires (a necessity for "quicky" truing
during a simple tune up, etc.). I found that a simple piece of tubing
mounted between the lateral truing indicators works well as a vertical
indicator when necessary and is quicker than replacing the Minoura
supplied vertical guage.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

I use mine to get wheels to within .010 (.25mm).

Quoted message said:

You mean in lateral runout?

Yes.... If the wheel was well built to begin with and not too trashed,
it's not too hard to get it that close. The idea being that the wheel will
stay within tolerable runout longer if it's trued better.

Yes, but, IME, there is an optimum combination of lateral true,
vertical true and balanced spoke tension. IOW, I wouldn't attempt to
achieve 0.25mm of lateral runout at the expense of the other two
parameters.

Quoted message said:

i.e. I don't
have to mess with it again for a while. Pay me now or pay me later.

I'm not obsessive enough to try to correct ovoid rims.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

If I were going to be building wheels on a regular basis I'd get a Var

or

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Park stand.

Quoted message said:

I've never used the VAR; I can recommend the Park TS-2, but with the
reservation that an alignment guage is needed for precision work,
despite the "automatic centering" feature.

The lower priced VAR #74 weighed 22 Lbs. (10 Kg) and was sturdy enough to
be used with motorcycle wheels.

http://www.sheldonbrown.com/var/pages/var0035.html

A better stand that I forgot about was the Hozan wheel truing stand. We
had one or two at our shop that were beefier than the model they sell
today. It weighed about 30 Lbs.

Yes, the Hozan is sort of the classic old image of the truing stand
seen in shops way back 'in the day'.

Quoted message said:

http://www.hozan.co.jp/cycle_e/catalog/wheel_stand/C-330.htm

They have a lot of interesting tools on their web site:

http://www.hozan.co.jp/cycle_e/

Chas.- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -