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Did Astana pay CSF ?

Started by whiteboytrash · · Last activity · 83 posts · 7,545 views

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Professional Cycling
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2 June 2008
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5 June 2008
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whiteboytrash
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  1. Ricco believes so.... maybe this is the Hog's new method... rather than dope his own team he provides dope to a lowly team so that they will help his ?
    ____

    Asked whether he would repeat yesterday's comments to the effect that Sella and his CSF team-mate Domenico Pozzovivo had conspired with Giro leader Alberto Contador and against him, Riccò didn't hesitate. "[What I'd say now would be] even worse," snapped 'The Cobra" after signing on for the day's stage in Rovetta.

    "Anyone who understands cycling can work out what happened," he'd said earlier. "People who defended Sella are ignorant."

    Riccò's quotes in Saturday morning's Gazzetta dello Sport had already banished any doubts about exactly what the Saunier-Duval rider was insinuating when he criticized Sella last night.

    "Sella tried to be cute," he told La Gazzetta. "I hope that Contador at least paid him for it..."

  2. Poor Sella. He will be crying himself to sleep over those allegations. Fortunately he has three stage wins, the green KOM jersey and last but not least a big fat payment from Astana to console himself with.

  3. classic1 said:

    Poor Sella. He will be crying himself to sleep over those allegations. Fortunately he has three stage wins, the green KOM jersey and last but not least a big fat payment from Astana to console himself with.

    Watt comparisons aside what I thought what was interesting about Sella was his recovery. Di Luca showed that after a one day big effort he paid the price (minus the dope ?).... however Sella had this ability to keep on attacking and although the main guys were not chasing him down he managed to stay away on each attack.... hmmmmm....... I watched every stage and it did look a little strange.... I can understand winning one stage with a lone attack but 3 ? we should also remember he almost won a flat stage in a breakaway bar his crash in the last km..... we'll never know what the story was but from no where cyclist to 3 stage wins & KOM ?

    CSF were certainly on the Astana payroll. Nothing new there but they were riding the entire Giro for Astana not just one assist on a tough stage... thats something new.....

  4. whiteboytrash said:

    Watt comparisons aside what I thought what was interesting about Sella was his recovery. Di Luca showed that after a one day big effort he paid the price (minus the dope ?).... however Sella had this ability to keep on attacking and although the main guys were not chasing him down he managed to stay away on each attack.... hmmmmm....... I watched every stage and it did look a little strange.... I can understand winning one stage with a lone attack but 3 ? we should also remember he almost won a flat stage in a breakaway bar his crash in the last km..... we'll never know what the story was but from no where cyclist to 3 stage wins & KOM ?

    CSF were certainly on the Astana payroll. Nothing new there but they were riding the entire Giro for Astana not just one assist on a tough stage... thats something new.....

    Sella had said himself (I think after the first stage win) that he had no intention of a top ten finish as he didn't see himself as being able to keep with the favourites. Yes gained a lot of time and was initially able to get away because he wasn't a GC contender but on the last few stages he was more than a match (he won another stage, almost won the uphill TT, then kept on climbing with the big boys). Who knows if this is because the others are down a level or because he's gone up a level? The doubt remains.

    The sad thing is that the clean up many of us were hoping for seems to have been brushed under the carpet by RCS. Some riders come down from super human levels and others take their place. The invitation to Astana just cracked a hole into the hull of the anti-doping ship. I look forward the the Tour. At least ASO seem intent on backing up their rhetoric with action.

  5. To the OP: probably. After all, I doubt that CSF has any real interest in races outside of the Giro in terms of, sponsorship visibility, so I doubt that promises were made to exchange victories in other races.

    The big question for me is the reason that RCS decided to invite Astana vis-a-vis the position originally taken in agreement with ASO.

  6. But how much time would Contador have lost if the CSF guys weren't helping him? I don't see Ricco get the pink jersey even if they didn't collude with Contador.

  7. whiteboytrash said:

    CSF were certainly on the Astana payroll. Nothing new there but they were riding the entire Giro for Astana not just one assist on a tough stage... thats something new.....

    It was obvious even from the 10 minutes SBS highlight package Sella worked for Contador. Can't say for the whole Giro as I haven't yet watched any of the DVD's a mate gave me.

  8. classic1 said:

    It was obvious even from the 10 minutes SBS highlight package Sella worked for Contador. Can't say for the whole Giro as I haven't yet watched any of the DVD's a mate gave me.


    you should get the same cable guy o' classic one.

  9. classic1 said:

    It was obvious even from the 10 minutes SBS highlight package Sella worked for Contador. Can't say for the whole Giro as I haven't yet watched any of the DVD's a mate gave me.

    A lot ! It was kind of silly really. The most obvisous work but CSF was not by Sella but by two other CSF guys who broke away with Colulm (spelling?) on Saturday rode him all the way to the final 40km & left him out front to wait for Contador..... that was the worst display. Colulm was even getting water bottles from the CSF team car !!

  10. whiteboytrash said:

    A lot ! It was kind of silly really. The most obvisous work but CSF was not by Sella but by two other CSF guys who broke away with Colulm (spelling?) on Saturday rode him all the way to the final 40km & left him out front to wait for Contador..... that was the worst display. Colulm was even getting water bottles from the CSF team car !!

    These kind of alliances have been around for long enough. What is more surprising is that there was no obvious Italian pact against Astana. DiLuca and Simoni are friendly and Ricco and Simoni are friendly. If those three had worked together...who knows? Maybe too many egos among them for that? Ricco certainly missed having the support of Piepoli.

  11. thunder said:

    you should get the same cable guy o' classic one.

    Costs money.:p 500 channels sounds good in theory, but most of them have [censored] on them, same as the six channels I have now. Then again, free Euro [censored] rules.

  12. classic1 said:

    Costs money.:p 500 channels sounds good in theory, but most of them have [censored] on them, same as the six channels I have now. Then again, free Euro [censored] rules.


    I thought the guy got it hooked up by the fridge repairman 😉

  13. At least Ricco can take comfort in the fact that it took CSF, Liquigas and Lotto to keep him out of the MR - the sight of all 3 teams nursing Contador to the finish line to keep him in the jersey by 4" was one of the most pitiful sights I've seen in a GT in a long time - right up there with the CSC/brown enevelope episode.

  14. Even though Sella initially didn't have high GC hopes, as time wore on and things went better for him GC-wise, he wanted to jump up the GC as much as practicable. Hence, actions that happened to help AC were as much for Sella's own gain in terms of GC ascension (even though Sella probably couldn't have won the maglia rosa).

    Second, everybody knows that Sella's team is very focused on TV coverage and publicity during the Giro. So what better way to get TV coverage than to be in the group containing the maglia rosa, when the maglia rosa group was chasing an opponent on an important stage? What better way to show that Sella's team was important to the race and to get more publicity for its sponsors? :p

    Third, in later stages, after Ricco had accused Sella of deliberately helping AC, Ricco and Sella had already themselves some animosity. So why shouldn't Sella go out on Stage 20 and take the stage win and deprive Ricco of bonus seconds, if Sella was capable of doing that and if another stage win was wonderful for Sella?

  15. whiteboytrash said:

    Watt comparisons aside what I thought what was interesting about Sella was his recovery. Di Luca showed that after a one day big effort he paid the price (minus the dope ?).... however Sella had this ability to keep on attacking and although the main guys were not chasing him down he managed to stay away on each attack.... hmmmmm....... I watched every stage and it did look a little strange.... I can understand winning one stage with a lone attack but 3 ? we should also remember he almost won a flat stage in a breakaway bar his crash in the last km..... we'll never know what the story was but from no where cyclist to 3 stage wins & KOM ?

    CSF were certainly on the Astana payroll. Nothing new there but they were riding the entire Giro for Astana not just one assist on a tough stage... thats something new.....

    I do not believe for even a second that CSF was bought. Sella naturally did not have as much to give that stage, since he gave it all the day before. He pushed at the end to try for best overall classification possible, and Contador used him to some advantage. But Sella knew Contador and Riccó were out of reach for him on GC. This is just racing as it is supposed to be. Where riders push to the finish line. Now if Sella ,Pozzovivo, and others instead just sat back of Contador to the finish line, the critics would say "Look how the Italians work together against the foreigner!"

    Perhaps a critic must find a way to be a critic in every scenario.

    Sella's performance during the giro was the most exciting part of it. It is not true that he has come from no where. He has won a mountain stage at a previous giro, and has been involved in many breakaways over the last few years. Has suffered his share of falls.

    On another note: The win of Contador, and the invitation itself to Astana, was a great thing for the giro. It lifts it up as a grand tour by having some of the best riders in the world. Different than recent years, where the giro has been called by some, as the tour of the seven dwarfs.

  16. The controversies in the Giro are what the Giro has historically has been about.The race itself in certain years have been the sideshow.

  17. The thought that Liquigas was deliberately helping AC is even more ridiculous. Obviously Pellizotti was trying to keep up with Bruseghin and Menchov, and vice versa, and to contest the third podium spot. Also, obviously, all of those three were trying to get as high up on GC for themselves as possible or at a minimum, not to lose time relative to key GC rivals (excluding Ricco and AC).

    Stage 20 Results

    1 Emanuele Sella (Ita) CSF Group Navigare 6.52.45 (33.725 km/h)
    2 Gilberto Simoni (other times)
    3 Joaquin Rodriguez
    4 Riccardo Riccò (Ita) Saunier Duval - Scott 1.30
    5 Alberto Contador Velasco (Sp) Astana
    6 Antonio Colom Mas (Spa) Astana
    7 Fortunato Baliani (Ita) CSF GroupNavigare
    8 Marzio Bruseghin (Ita) Lampre
    9 Tadej Valjavec (Slo) AG2R La Mondiale
    10 Franco Pellizotti (Ita) Liquigas
    11 Denis Menchov (Rus) Rabobank
    12 Domenico Pozzovivo (Ita) CSF Group Navigare
    13 Jurgen Van Den Broeck (Bel) Silence - Lotto

    And, frankly, Astana is about to establish AC as the next "boss" of the peloton, just like LA in a year or two. So it would not be surprising if some other teams (even those that did not ride the Tour regularly) may want to lend a helping hand where possible, as a gesture of goodwill in hopes of future assistance on unspecified races.

  18. musette said:

    And, frankly, Astana is about to establish AC as the next "boss" of the peloton, just like LA in a year or two. So it would not be surprising if some other teams (even those that did not ride the Tour regularly) may want to lend a helping hand where possible, as a gesture of goodwill in hopes of future assistance on unspecified races.


    Umm....you Astanaphiles forget that your first second comming Basso will be back, and he will want his crown back.

  19. Upon any Basso return, that would make things more interesting, but that would also test Bruyneel and Astana in a way that would be wonderful if they continued their Tour dominance. :p

  20. musette said:

    Upon any Basso return, that would make things more interesting, but that would also test Bruyneel and Astana in a way that would be wonderful if they continued their Tour dominance. :p


    I don't think CSF was bought either, however I do remember contador asking a favor or rodrigas to keep ricco from getting the time bonuses. When you're a loud mouth you make some enemies.

    And I don't think colom getting bottles from the CSF car is a big deal. They were up the road and I'm sure thats a professional courtesy.

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