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Diagnosing a Knee Problem

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General fitness, health and nutrition
Published
17 May 2005
Last activity
19 May 2005
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Jeff
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10
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  1. I've recently come back to training after a very long layoff. Before
    the layoff of a couple years, I trained an average of four days a week
    for almost five years. Over the five years I started mostly with
    powerlifting and then went more into bodybuilding; squatting was
    always a major component of my leg routine. As I'm coming back now
    I'm getting pain and clicking in both knees, but more so in my right
    knee. As I descend into a squat I get two nasty clicks in my right
    knee: one just before hitting parallel, and one once I have descended
    just below parallel. This isn't just a sound but the joint actually
    clicks. I feel the pain mostly below the kneecap and it is pretty
    localized, and I only feel it during that moment of motion (there is
    not ache in the knee that lasts after exercising).

    I realize nobody here is qualified to actually diagnosis a knee
    problem, but some general comments would help me a lot so I can start
    dealing with this both physically and psychologically. Any
    suggestions about where to go first would be good, as I'm not sure if
    I should go to an orthopedist or a sports medicine doctor. The
    thought of weight training but not being able to squat just feels like
    a joke to me. However, I also don't want to continue grinding on my
    knee if I am going to exacerbate whatever the existing problem might
    be. Again, any helpful comments would be appreciated, as this really
    sucks.

    Thanks

    Jeff

  2. "Jeff" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
    news:[email hidden]...

    Quoted message said:

    I've recently come back to training after a very long layoff. Before
    the layoff of a couple years, I trained an average of four days a week
    for almost five years. Over the five years I started mostly with
    powerlifting and then went more into bodybuilding; squatting was
    always a major component of my leg routine. As I'm coming back now
    I'm getting pain and clicking in both knees, but more so in my right
    knee. As I descend into a squat I get two nasty clicks in my right
    knee: one just before hitting parallel, and one once I have descended
    just below parallel. This isn't just a sound but the joint actually
    clicks. I feel the pain mostly below the kneecap and it is pretty
    localized, and I only feel it during that moment of motion (there is
    not ache in the knee that lasts after exercising).

    I realize nobody here is qualified to actually diagnosis a knee
    problem, but some general comments would help me a lot so I can start
    dealing with this both physically and psychologically. Any
    suggestions about where to go first would be good, as I'm not sure if
    I should go to an orthopedist or a sports medicine doctor. The
    thought of weight training but not being able to squat just feels like
    a joke to me. However, I also don't want to continue grinding on my
    knee if I am going to exacerbate whatever the existing problem might
    be. Again, any helpful comments would be appreciated, as this really
    sucks.

    Go and get it scoped. Sounds like you need the joint cleaning out.
    Glucosamine will help joint problems but you have to take it for a while
    before it kicks in.

    Fraser

  3. "Jeff" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
    news:[email hidden]...

    Quoted message said:

    I've recently come back to training after a very long layoff. Before
    the layoff of a couple years, I trained an average of four days a week
    for almost five years. Over the five years I started mostly with
    powerlifting and then went more into bodybuilding; squatting was
    always a major component of my leg routine. As I'm coming back now
    I'm getting pain and clicking in both knees, but more so in my right
    knee. As I descend into a squat I get two nasty clicks in my right
    knee: one just before hitting parallel, and one once I have descended
    just below parallel. This isn't just a sound but the joint actually
    clicks. I feel the pain mostly below the kneecap and it is pretty
    localized, and I only feel it during that moment of motion (there is
    not ache in the knee that lasts after exercising).

    I realize nobody here is qualified to actually diagnosis a knee
    problem, but some general comments would help me a lot so I can start
    dealing with this both physically and psychologically. Any
    suggestions about where to go first would be good, as I'm not sure if
    I should go to an orthopedist or a sports medicine doctor. The
    thought of weight training but not being able to squat just feels like
    a joke to me. However, I also don't want to continue grinding on my
    knee if I am going to exacerbate whatever the existing problem might
    be. Again, any helpful comments would be appreciated, as this really
    sucks.

    No diagnosis but a suggestion: put your knees through an easy but full
    range of motion repetitively, something like laying on your back on the
    floor and pretend bicycling where you bring the knee towards the chest
    then extend it fully. Some but not all joint dysfunction can be
    improved by simply using the joint more, just take your time and work
    into it. I'd start with a full range of motion - that means getting the
    knee fully straightened, too - and a single set of 10 reps or so if you
    can manage it, and work on adding reps and/or sets from there. Pavel's
    "Super Joints" talks about this sort of thing, including why repetitive
    motion of the right kind is good for your joints, and I recommend it
    highly, see http://www.kbnj.com/sj.htm

    Of course, if you suspect you're suffering from something other than
    just plain lack of use, you should consult a doctor before you try this.

    For me, riding a bicycle regularly at a relaxed, high cadence helps my
    knees stay healthy. I do the above-mentioned exercise when I can't get
    on a bike.

    Another other thing you can try is changing or at least examining your
    squatting form - make sure you knees track your feet, and also make sure
    you're actively sitting *back*, not just lowering yourself. Sitting
    back can help stabilize the knee joint.

    Yet another thing you can try is one-legged work to improve stability
    around the knee - one-legged squats and/or deadlifts are great.

    -S-
    http://www.kbnj.com

  4. On Wed, 18 May 2005 08:37:19 -0400, "Steve Freides"
    <[email hidden]> wrote:

    <snip>

    Thanks for the great post, Steve, I appreciate it. I probably could
    be doing more preworkout to warm my knees up, so I am going to try
    some more warm-up exercises for my knees before squatting including
    what you mentioned. As far as my form goes, I am pretty good at
    keeping my knees and toes pointing in the same direction and
    initiating the descent with my hips. However, I noticed more clicking
    and irritation in my knees recently after widening the stance in my
    squat. I almost think some inflexibility in my hamstrings and groin
    are perhaps causing my knees to move inward more than they should and
    could be irritating things more. After a few workouts of pulling my
    stance in and warming up more thoroughly I'll let you know how I feel.
    Again, thanks.

  5. Fraser Johnston said:

    Go and get it scoped. Sounds like you need the joint cleaning out.
    Glucosamine will help joint problems but you have to take it for a while
    before it kicks in.

    About how long does it take for glucosamine supplementation to start
    kicking in? I noticed a few different formulations at my local
    Costco. Some are just glucosamine, and some have other ingredients
    like MSM and chondriate. Not sure which, if any, I should bother
    trying.

  6. "Jeff" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
    news:[email hidden]...

    Quoted message said:

    On Wed, 18 May 2005 08:37:19 -0400, "Steve Freides"
    <[email hidden]> wrote:

    <snip>

    Thanks for the great post, Steve, I appreciate it. I probably could
    be doing more preworkout to warm my knees up, so I am going to try
    some more warm-up exercises for my knees before squatting including
    what you mentioned. As far as my form goes, I am pretty good at
    keeping my knees and toes pointing in the same direction and
    initiating the descent with my hips. However, I noticed more clicking
    and irritation in my knees recently after widening the stance in my
    squat. I almost think some inflexibility in my hamstrings and groin
    are perhaps causing my knees to move inward more than they should and
    could be irritating things more. After a few workouts of pulling my
    stance in and warming up more thoroughly I'll let you know how I feel.

    Warming up with joint mobility exercises is a great idea for just about
    everyone, IMHO.

    As to knees tracking feet, I find it's pretty hard to tell what you're
    doing by yourself, so I'd either videotape yourself or have someone who
    knows what the issue is watch you.

    And the pushing back business, that should be throughout the squat until
    you're parallel at the very least, not just at the start of the
    movement - don't know exactly what you meant by "initiating" in this
    context but the pushing back of the butt becomes, if anything, more
    important the closer to parallel you get, IMHO, at least in terms of the
    health of your knees.

    Quoted message said:

    Again, thanks.

    No problemo, and best of luck to you.

    -S-
    http://www.kbnj.com

  7. Jeff said:

    About how long does it take for glucosamine supplementation to start
    kicking in? I noticed a few different formulations at my local
    Costco. Some are just glucosamine, and some have other ingredients
    like MSM and chondriate. Not sure which, if any, I should bother
    trying.

    I don't know if this will help you any but I bought Triflex from GNC
    and it contains a mixture of the 3 above ingredients you mention.
    I noticed a BIG difference in my arthritis stiffness/pain about a week
    into taking it. I still had some pain but it was not as bad as it was
    and a lot of my stiffness had almost disappeared. My walk today was
    75% better then what thay have pain because I felt like I could move
    in a way I did when I was younger and my knees did not hurt. They
    still are not hurting which is a wonderful because by this time in the
    evening they would be *screaming* at me and I would be taking aspirin
    to ease the pain. I didn't have to do that tonight and I have been
    taking it since May 1. :-)

    ****************************************
    ~Jaime~
    "You don't have to like it, you just have to do it."
    ****************************************

  8. "Jeff" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
    news:[email hidden]...

    Quoted message said:
    Fraser Johnston said:

    Go and get it scoped. Sounds like you need the joint cleaning out.
    Glucosamine will help joint problems but you have to take it for a while
    before it kicks in.

    About how long does it take for glucosamine supplementation to start
    kicking in? I noticed a few different formulations at my local
    Costco. Some are just glucosamine, and some have other ingredients
    like MSM and chondriate. Not sure which, if any, I should bother
    trying.

    I guess about 6 weeks based on myself and most of the people I know who take
    it say. I take straight glucosamine. I hear good things about flax seed
    oil but have never taken it.

    Fraser

  9. me said:
    Jeff said:

    About how long does it take for glucosamine supplementation to start
    kicking in? I noticed a few different formulations at my local
    Costco. Some are just glucosamine, and some have other ingredients
    like MSM and chondriate. Not sure which, if any, I should bother
    trying.

    I don't know if this will help you any but I bought Triflex from GNC
    and it contains a mixture of the 3 above ingredients you mention.
    I noticed a BIG difference in my arthritis stiffness/pain about a week
    into taking it. I still had some pain but it was not as bad as it was
    and a lot of my stiffness had almost disappeared. My walk today was
    75% better then what thay have pain because I felt like I could move
    in a way I did when I was younger and my knees did not hurt. They
    still are not hurting which is a wonderful because by this time in the
    evening they would be *screaming* at me and I would be taking aspirin
    to ease the pain. I didn't have to do that tonight and I have been
    taking it since May 1. :-)

    ****************************************
    ~Jaime~
    "You don't have to like it, you just have to do it."
    ****************************************

    Remember what I said about protecting your knees?

    http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/7900422/

    Just be careful until you drop a bit. You get signed up at that pool yet?
    --
    -Larry

  10. Larry Hodges said:

    Remember what I said about protecting your knees?

    Yes. I still have that post saved. :-)

    Quoted message said:

    Just be careful until you drop a bit.

    I am always careful.

    Quoted message said:

    You get signed up at that pool yet?

    The use of the pool goes with my gym membership which starts on June
    1.
    In the meantime I am going swimming a few times a week but I had to
    pay $2.00 per swim so I purchased one of thier punchcards. 10 swims
    for $20. The card gets punched once per swim everytime I use it and it
    will suffice until my membership is activated. I go swimming 3 times
    a week now.

    ****************************************
    ~Jaime~
    "You don't have to like it, you just have to do it."
    ****************************************

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