Denver Marathon....(not)...

Leafing through rec.running, I read Lanceandrew's message of 12 Oct
2004:

Quoted message said:

http://marathonguide.com/features/articles/DenverMarathon041010.cfm

Sad....Denver is a major league city too....supposively this sports
mecca...and heck...just look at the highschool and collegiate running
programs of Colorado...and isn't the Olympic training center there?

Quoted message said:

the race director stood at the site of packet pick-up and told runners
that the race was not going to be held as scheduled.

Now that has got to be a let down. I hope the runners had to go through a
metal detector before hearing that news. I can't imagine.

Phil M.

--
"What counts in battle is what you do once the pain sets in." -John Short,
South African coach.

In article <[email hidden]>,

Phil M. said:

Leafing through rec.running, I read Lanceandrew's message of 12 Oct
2004:

Quoted message said:

http://marathonguide.com/features/articles/DenverMarathon041010.cfm

Sad....Denver is a major league city too....supposively this sports
mecca...and heck...just look at the highschool and collegiate running
programs of Colorado...and isn't the Olympic training center there?

Quoted message said:

the race director stood at the site of packet pick-up and told runners
that the race was not going to be held as scheduled.

Now that has got to be a let down. I hope the runners had to go through a
metal detector before hearing that news. I can't imagine.

I complained to the Denver police at:

http://www.denvergov.org/talktous/default.asp

--Harold Buck

"I used to rock and roll all night,
and party every day.
Then it was every other day. . . ."
-Homer J. Simpson

Phil M. said:

Leafing through rec.running, I read Lanceandrew's message of 12 Oct
2004:

Quoted message said:

http://marathonguide.com/features/articles/DenverMarathon041010.cfm

Sad....Denver is a major league city too....supposively this sports
mecca...and heck...just look at the highschool and collegiate running
programs of Colorado...and isn't the Olympic training center there?

Colorado Springs.

I'm not sure but Boulder Backroads (two weeks earlier) may be
larger. We had ~750 registered marathoners and ~2300 registered
halfers. Isn't Denver ~800 total? I think all of the local
training programs target Boulder instead of Denver.

We definitely have more Olympic athletes in training in Boulder. :-)

Lanceandrew <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

http://marathonguide.com/features/articles/DenverMarathon041010.cfm

Sad....Denver is a major league city too....supposively this sports

mecca...

Do you have Denver confused with Boulder?

Quoted message said:

heck...just look at the highschool and collegiate running programs of
Colorado...and isn't the Olympic training center there?

Or maybe Colorado Springs?

Matthew Venhaus said:

Lanceandrew <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

http://marathonguide.com/features/articles/DenverMarathon041010.cfm

Sad....Denver is a major league city too....supposively this sports

mecca...

Do you have Denver confused with Boulder?

Denver does have the major league sports teams. We're stuck with
the Buffs. (Can you tell the street to my townhouse is blocked
about 6 times each year by rabid Buffs fans on their way to or
from the game?)

But, per capita, I'm sure we have many more active athletes than
Denver. You can get anywhere in town on the extensive bike path
network (the one that is not 20' from my front door) and there's
an extensive trail system in adjacent open space. It's even a
crime for men to have more than 4% body fat within city limits....

Bear G <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:9wYad.248433$3l3.129385@attbi_s03...

Quoted message said:

Phil M. said:

Leafing through rec.running, I read Lanceandrew's message of 12 Oct
2004:

Quoted message said:

http://marathonguide.com/features/articles/DenverMarathon041010.cfm

Sad....Denver is a major league city too....supposively this sports
mecca...and heck...just look at the highschool and collegiate running
programs of Colorado...and isn't the Olympic training center there?

Colorado Springs.

I'm not sure but Boulder Backroads (two weeks earlier) may be
larger. We had ~750 registered marathoners and ~2300 registered
halfers. Isn't Denver ~800 total? I think all of the local
training programs target Boulder instead of Denver.

We definitely have more Olympic athletes in training in Boulder. :-)

My thoughts exactly, just 3 minutes late. Even Durango seems to have a more
developed running community than Denver.

"Phil M." <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Leafing through rec.running, I read Lanceandrew's message of 12 Oct
2004:

Quoted message said:

http://marathonguide.com/features/articles/DenverMarathon041010.cfm

Sad....Denver is a major league city too....supposively this sports
mecca...and heck...just look at the highschool and collegiate running
programs of Colorado...and isn't the Olympic training center there?

It is all that and more, but remember, the Denver Marathon is an independent
event, not one held or sponsored by the city or any other government agency.
It is a shame the city gets tainted when they had nothing to do with the
success or failure of the race.

Harold Buck <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

In article <[email hidden]>,

Phil M. said:

Leafing through rec.running, I read Lanceandrew's message of 12 Oct
2004:

Quoted message said:

http://marathonguide.com/features/articles/DenverMarathon041010.cfm

Sad....Denver is a major league city too....supposively this sports
mecca...and heck...just look at the highschool and collegiate running
programs of Colorado...and isn't the Olympic training center there?

Quoted message said:

the race director stood at the site of packet pick-up and told runners
that the race was not going to be held as scheduled.

Now that has got to be a let down. I hope the runners had to go through

a

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

metal detector before hearing that news. I can't imagine.

I complained to the Denver police at:

http://www.denvergov.org/talktous/default.asp

Why the police? They would have loved the overtime.

Matthew Venhaus said:

Harold Buck <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

I complained to the Denver police at:

http://www.denvergov.org/talktous/default.asp

Why the police? They would have loved the overtime.

It could be fraud if he collected the money and ran, but I thought
he had refunded race fees.

Of course that doesn't help anyone who dropped hundreds of dollars
on airfare, hotel room, etc.

In article <jqZad.235412$D%.121360@attbi_s51>,

Bear G said:

Matthew Venhaus said:

Harold Buck <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

I complained to the Denver police at:

http://www.denvergov.org/talktous/default.asp

Why the police? They would have loved the overtime.

It could be fraud if he collected the money and ran, but I thought
he had refunded race fees.

Of course that doesn't help anyone who dropped hundreds of dollars
on airfare, hotel room, etc.

From reading the linked article, it sounded like the police refused to
take the 75% of their fees prior to the event, but maybe I misread
things. I was complaining about the race getting canceled, not the RD.

--Harold Buck

"I used to rock and roll all night,
and party every day.
Then it was every other day. . . ."
-Homer J. Simpson

"Lanceandrew" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

http://marathonguide.com/features/articles/DenverMarathon041010.cfm

Sad....Denver is a major league city too....supposively this sports

mecca...and

Quoted message said:

heck...just look at the highschool and collegiate running programs of
Colorado...and isn't the Olympic training center there?

Olympic Training Center is in Colorado Springs, about 70 miles south.
Colorado Springs has a fine marathon. www.adtmarathon.com.

The RD is the sole person to blame here not the City of Denver as
Marathonguide.com tries to make out to be.

"Harold Buck" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

In article <jqZad.235412$D%.121360@attbi_s51>,

Bear G said:

Matthew Venhaus said:

Harold Buck <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...
>
>I complained to the Denver police at:
>
>http://www.denvergov.org/talktous/default.asp

Why the police? They would have loved the overtime.

It could be fraud if he collected the money and ran, but I thought
he had refunded race fees.

Of course that doesn't help anyone who dropped hundreds of dollars
on airfare, hotel room, etc.

From reading the linked article, it sounded like the police refused to
take the 75% of their fees prior to the event, but maybe I misread
things. I was complaining about the race getting canceled, not the RD.

--Harold Buck

"I used to rock and roll all night,
and party every day.
Then it was every other day. . . ."
-Homer J. Simpson

It was the City of Denver, not just the PD. Also the city would have been
on the hook for the money if the RD could not come up with it. I believe
this happened in an earlier incarnation of this race. The City is
responsible for making sure the taxpayers are not stuck with a bill.

"Bear G" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:9wYad.248433$3l3.129385@attbi_s03...

Quoted message said:

Phil M. said:

Leafing through rec.running, I read Lanceandrew's message of 12 Oct
2004:

Quoted message said:

http://marathonguide.com/features/articles/DenverMarathon041010.cfm

Sad....Denver is a major league city too....supposively this sports
mecca...and heck...just look at the highschool and collegiate running
programs of Colorado...and isn't the Olympic training center there?

Colorado Springs.

I'm not sure but Boulder Backroads (two weeks earlier) may be
larger. We had ~750 registered marathoners and ~2300 registered
halfers. Isn't Denver ~800 total? I think all of the local
training programs target Boulder instead of Denver.

We definitely have more Olympic athletes in training in Boulder. :-)

And Colorado Springs has even more than Boulder...

Sam said:

"Bear G" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:9wYad.248433$3l3.129385@attbi_s03...

Quoted message said:

We definitely have more Olympic athletes in training in Boulder. :-)

And Colorado Springs has even more than Boulder...

Overall, sure. But I think runners tend to come here. Alan
Culpepper and his wife live in Louisville (about 10 miles down the
road), the Japanese and I thought at least one other national
teams are based here, etc. There was another runner recently
profiled in the paper who'll pop into the Boulder Running Company
to do things like help them vacuum the place around closing.

About the only former Olympians I'll recognize around town are
Frank Shorter and Lorraine Moller.

In article <[email hidden]>,

Sam said:

"Lanceandrew" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

http://marathonguide.com/features/articles/DenverMarathon041010.cfm

Sad....Denver is a major league city too....supposively this sports

mecca...and

Quoted message said:

heck...just look at the highschool and collegiate running programs of
Colorado...and isn't the Olympic training center there?

Olympic Training Center is in Colorado Springs, about 70 miles south.
Colorado Springs has a fine marathon. www.adtmarathon.com.

The RD is the sole person to blame here not the City of Denver as
Marathonguide.com tries to make out to be.

If the city accepted partial payment in previous years and then suddenly
and without warning changed that policy, don't you think the city is at
least partly to blame for the cancellation?

And doesn't the city profit by having a marathon and having people come
to town for it? Well, not anymore.

--Harold Buck

"I used to rock and roll all night,
and party every day.
Then it was every other day. . . ."
-Homer J. Simpson

"Harold Buck" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

In article <[email hidden]>,

Sam said:

"Lanceandrew" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

http://marathonguide.com/features/articles/DenverMarathon041010.cfm

Sad....Denver is a major league city too....supposively this sports

mecca...and

Quoted message said:

heck...just look at the highschool and collegiate running programs of
Colorado...and isn't the Olympic training center there?

Olympic Training Center is in Colorado Springs, about 70 miles south.
Colorado Springs has a fine marathon. www.adtmarathon.com.

The RD is the sole person to blame here not the City of Denver as
Marathonguide.com tries to make out to be.

If the city accepted partial payment in previous years and then suddenly
and without warning changed that policy, don't you think the city is at
least partly to blame for the cancellation?

And doesn't the city profit by having a marathon and having people come
to town for it? Well, not anymore.

I preface my comments acknowledging the fact I know nothing about directing
a race. It seems like it was a bad assumption on the part of the RD that the
permit would be honored with only partial funds. It's also odd that he
couldn't find a loan from someone for the additional amount necessary if, as
marathonguide says, the check was in the mail. The biggest suprise to me was
no one in the running or cycling community are listed as sponsors on the
marathon web page. Has Trujillo burned a lot of bridges, doesn't have the
time to get sponsors, or do shoe stores and bike shops not have the
publicity budget for this sort of thing?

And doesn't the city profit by having a marathon and having people come
to town for it? Well, not anymore.
_

Last year SLC had their first marathon...$100K+ in prize money, major
sponsorship..etc...3000+ runners, etc.
http://www.saltlakecitymarathon.com/

Major cities can turn marathons into vehicles to showcase, promote, and market
every aspect/offering of their entire region. Denver's civic leaders simply
are failing to recognize a window of opportunity and showcase vehicle.

Cities routinely learn how to "do things right" from other cities. SLC had a
plan and they promoted/marketed their event at other US and Intl. marathons (at
booths) even before their first event. I've seen Denver officials in an
effort to market their city proudly claim Denver has more sunny days than San
Diego and Miami. This is supposively a fact. I won't dispute that, been there,
down to Springs, and up to Ft. Collins many times. I can recall a wonderful
run I had at the end of Garden of the Gods Road in Springs...at twighlight
(until the bats came out).

The RD should have marketed/sold the event to the City..(he probably tried
to)....and Denver city officials should have learned of the joint cooperation
between RDs and municipalities in Chicago, NYC, Boston, Honolulu, etc...to
learn how this stuff is done successfully for for the betterment of both,
creating a win win.

Having a Marathon in Denver fits right into Denver's already in place efforts
to market the region, it would have been ideal synergy.....and all you have to
do is examine side by side SLC and Devner and ask basic questions. Just look
at how well coordinated/organized, sponsored, and promoted SLC's very firt
marathon was earlier this year. Why would the city of SLC participate in such
a thing?

IMO SLC is doing something very right and showing Denver to be asleep & a
cowtown with big buildings.

Blame should be placed everywhere....but I place more blame on the City than
the RD. The City should have appreciated having a "warm body", a person
wanting to stage a Marathon in their City....then the city should have said,
"OK...let's create a long term plan and do this right...like Honolulu
does....like that smaller city to North, SLC....has clearly done. Give me a
break...the way these things are done is City Officials should have been in
Salt Lake last Spring to watch and observe SLC's first marathon.

SLC laid the template...Denver simply had to copy the model....

-Remember...cities' bend over backwords to bring in conventions, collegiate
sports events, etc..all sorts of stuff. Here was a perfect marketing vehicle
for the region...and they still can't see it.

Solutions? Email the SLC link to every Denver City official and ask them "Why
Can't Denver measure up to SLC"?

"Harold Buck" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

In article <[email hidden]>,

Sam said:

"Lanceandrew" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

http://marathonguide.com/features/articles/DenverMarathon041010.cfm

Sad....Denver is a major league city too....supposively this sports

mecca...and

Quoted message said:

heck...just look at the highschool and collegiate running programs of
Colorado...and isn't the Olympic training center there?

Olympic Training Center is in Colorado Springs, about 70 miles south.
Colorado Springs has a fine marathon. www.adtmarathon.com.

The RD is the sole person to blame here not the City of Denver as
Marathonguide.com tries to make out to be.

If the city accepted partial payment in previous years and then suddenly
and without warning changed that policy, don't you think the city is at
least partly to blame for the cancellation?

And doesn't the city profit by having a marathon and having people come
to town for it? Well, not anymore.

--Harold Buck

"I used to rock and roll all night,
and party every day.
Then it was every other day. . . ."
-Homer J. Simpson

There is a new mayor in Denver for one thing. Also, the city is having
financial troubles so getting stuck is not in its best interest. Did the
city accept partial payment the day before? I do not know and cannot
remember from the articles.

The profit the city gets from this small marathon is probably next to
nothing. It is not like 40K people were descending. Also, you have to
consider the negative impact street closings have on businesses.

Denver has never drawn well for a marathon from what I can remember. Also
with marathons in Boulder, Fort Collins, Steamboat Springs, Colorado Springs
and Durango, the area might be saturated for marathons. Denver also goes
head to head with Chicago and Durango. Not sure how many Coloradoans went
to Chicago, but the listing went on for pages.

Durango, from the accounts I have seen and heard, is well organized.
Well-sponsored and being a smaller town, probably much easier to get things
done.

I would say Trujillo is the blame here. No excuse for showing up the Friday
before the race to get the permits.

It looks like the RD in SLC got with the city and county. I wonder if he
approached them or someone in the city approached him? I am betting the
former. So once again, why has Trujillo not done this?

"Lanceandrew" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

And doesn't the city profit by having a marathon and having people come
to town for it? Well, not anymore.
_

Last year SLC had their first marathon...$100K+ in prize money, major
sponsorship..etc...3000+ runners, etc.
http://www.saltlakecitymarathon.com/

Major cities can turn marathons into vehicles to showcase, promote, and

market

Quoted message said:

every aspect/offering of their entire region. Denver's civic leaders

simply

Quoted message said:

are failing to recognize a window of opportunity and showcase vehicle.

Cities routinely learn how to "do things right" from other cities. SLC

had a

Quoted message said:

plan and they promoted/marketed their event at other US and Intl.

marathons (at

Quoted message said:

booths) even before their first event. I've seen Denver officials in an
effort to market their city proudly claim Denver has more sunny days than

San

Quoted message said:

Diego and Miami. This is supposively a fact. I won't dispute that, been

there,

Quoted message said:

down to Springs, and up to Ft. Collins many times. I can recall a

wonderful

Quoted message said:

run I had at the end of Garden of the Gods Road in Springs...at twighlight
(until the bats came out).

The RD should have marketed/sold the event to the City..(he probably tried
to)....and Denver city officials should have learned of the joint

cooperation

Quoted message said:

between RDs and municipalities in Chicago, NYC, Boston, Honolulu,

etc...to

Quoted message said:

learn how this stuff is done successfully for for the betterment of both,
creating a win win.

Having a Marathon in Denver fits right into Denver's already in place

efforts

Quoted message said:

to market the region, it would have been ideal synergy.....and all you

have to

Quoted message said:

do is examine side by side SLC and Devner and ask basic questions. Just

look

Quoted message said:

at how well coordinated/organized, sponsored, and promoted SLC's very firt
marathon was earlier this year. Why would the city of SLC participate in

such

Quoted message said:

a thing?

IMO SLC is doing something very right and showing Denver to be asleep & a
cowtown with big buildings.

Blame should be placed everywhere....but I place more blame on the City

than

Quoted message said:

the RD. The City should have appreciated having a "warm body", a person
wanting to stage a Marathon in their City....then the city should have

said,

Quoted message said:

"OK...let's create a long term plan and do this right...like Honolulu
does....like that smaller city to North, SLC....has clearly done. Give

me a

Quoted message said:

break...the way these things are done is City Officials should have been

in

Quoted message said:

Salt Lake last Spring to watch and observe SLC's first marathon.

SLC laid the template...Denver simply had to copy the model....

-Remember...cities' bend over backwords to bring in conventions,

collegiate

Quoted message said:

sports events, etc..all sorts of stuff. Here was a perfect marketing

vehicle

Quoted message said:

for the region...and they still can't see it.

Solutions? Email the SLC link to every Denver City official and ask them

"Why

Quoted message said:

Can't Denver measure up to SLC"?