definitely not cyclists

brucef said:

Graeme Dods said:

There's a steep hill in Perth! Where?

I grew up in Lesmurdie. I'lll see your Edinburgh hill and raise you
a Darling scarp.

Or even Flinders St in Yokine/Nollamara. If you're really seriously looking
for a walk-up hill in Perth, right in the city, you could try Spring St, or
Mount St.

Theo

Resound said:

If you're selling
these online, offer a certain amount of modularity with regards to bits
(would madame like north bend, flat, bullhorn or moustache bars with that?).

That's where it gets difficult.

If I get my suppliers to do the mixing and matching, I have to carry
stock of a wider range of bikes.

Any time I spend mixing, matching and assembling costs money. I'm
often told I'm cheap, but my hourly rate has to be higher than a
Chinese bike factory worker.

Every time an importer touches the product, the cost goes up. To keep
the costs down as low as possible, I can't afford to touch the product
any more than is strictly necessary. I'll be unloading, storing, then
distributing the bikes in their boxes.

Quoted message said:

Centrestands are a thing that I can see being a distinct advantage
(especially for the bakfiet while trying to load and unload it).

The bakfiets will have a big double-sided stand under the box. The
single bikes will most likely have a rear axle mounted double-sided
stand.

tim

brucef said:

Graeme Dods said:

There's a steep hill in Perth! Where?

I grew up in Lesmurdie. I'lll see your Edinburgh hill and raise you
a Darling scarp.

Hey, no fair! Theo was (I think) referring to trips *within* Perth. If
you're going to be sneaky and start introducing stuff from the suburbs
then I could introduce the Pentland Hills -
http://www.st-andrews.ac.uk/institutes/sassi/spns/News19_0011.jpg I
admit that there's no road over the top, but the last bit of road on
the way up is a struggle even with a low gear. It's a hoot on the way
down too!

Graeme

Theo Bekkers said:

brucef said:

Graeme Dods said:

There's a steep hill in Perth! Where?

Quoted message said:

I grew up in Lesmurdie. I'lll see your Edinburgh hill and raise you
a Darling scarp.

Or even Flinders St in Yokine/Nollamara. If you're really seriously looking
for a walk-up hill in Perth, right in the city, you could try Spring St, or
Mount St.

Spring Street's not bad and I'm not familiar with Mount Street, but
Malcolm Street running parallel to it is getting to "stand up on the
pedals and strain" steepness. In fact Malcolm Street is what made me
realise how unfit I'd got a couple of years ago. I was walking up it
at my typical high speed whilst talking on the phone to someone and
had to stop as I didn't have the breath to do both :-( Still, I'm
slowly getting back to my old fitness levels...

Graeme

Graeme Dods said:

Theo Bekkers wrote:

Quoted message said:

Spring Street's not bad and I'm not familiar with Mount Street, but
Malcolm Street running parallel to it is getting to "stand up on the
pedals and strain" steepness.

Mount St used to be an extension of St Georges Terrace before the Freeway
cut it in half. Mount St is where a lot of cars would be changing down to
first gear in the sixties.

Theo

brucef said:

Quoted message said:

tim said:

Single-speed is as simple as it gets. But there's the hill issue. Cost
permitting, my preference would be hub gears.

Me too, but single speed works in a lot of places.

My thinking is to have two models. A basic model, single-speed, with
back-pedal rear brake and front rim brake; and a deluxe model with 8-
speed internal gears, and drum brakes at both ends.

The basic version is a standard production model from my supplier.
It's easy to do.

I'm negotiating the upgrades I want on the deluxe. Not surprisingly,
adding a brand-name (small S) 8-speed hub does awful things to the
cost, and I'm still working on the drum brakes. Even so, it will make
one hell of a wet weather commuting bike, at a reasonable price for
what it is.

They'll be available in your choice of black.

Quoted message said:

I saw a single
speed Giant with wide slick tyres at my lbs a couple of months
ago. It was on special for $150. No gears, no gear lever or cable,
1 front brake and cable, 1 pedal brake. Can't get much simpler
than that. I was tempted.

That's in the ballpark of where I'm aiming the basic model. Freight to
send them out will be the killer. That's where K-mart has the upper
hand, not having to send low-cost bikes out individually.

Quoted message said:

My wife and 16yo daughter won't ride a diamond frame bike. They
don't wear skirts, it is a security thing - they like to feel that
they
can easily jump off the seat and stand without falling over. For
some reason swinging their leg backwards frightens them.

I'll have to think about adding a drop-bar / step-through frame to the
line-up. Probably only in the basic model.

Quoted message said:

I like the dutch-style swept back handlebars.

So do I :-)

tim

In aus.bicycle on Tue, 27 Nov 2007 20:19:27 -0800 (PST)

tim said:

I'll have to think about adding a drop-bar / step-through frame to the
line-up. Probably only in the basic model.

Well....

I suppose it depends how much of your target market needs gears. I
tend to think the target is as many women as men, and quite possibly
older women too. You maybe need to find more non-riders to ask if
they want gears and a stepthrough.

At first blush I'd say there would be quite a few who do.

Zebee

tim said:

If I get my suppliers to do the mixing and matching, I have to carry
stock of a wider range of bikes.

Any time I spend mixing, matching and assembling costs money. I'm
often told I'm cheap, but my hourly rate has to be higher than a
Chinese bike factory worker.

You are right, keep it simple. The wishlist process is a useful
exercise, but in the end you want to strip it down to maybe
two basic models max, plus easily user-installable addons
like lights and baskets etc.

If you can come up with a simple bike like this, with maybe
3 or 5 hub gears for under $200 I will buy three.

In aus.bicycle on Tue, 27 Nov 2007 21:12:38 -0800 (PST)

brucef said:

If you can come up with a simple bike like this, with maybe
3 or 5 hub gears for under $200 I will buy three.

heh, even a bent freak like me might buy 1 as a station bike - single
speed or 3 gears, full chaincase, stand, basket and rack as extras.

I'd still use the bent for the normal shopping, but that would be a
bike to use to avoid walking to the station...

Hell, even a 3 speed would work - keep it at work for lending out for
going to the shops on 🙂

<has sudden weird idea about stepthrough frame and modified cruzbike
kit....>

Zebee

tim said:

I'm negotiating the upgrades I want on the deluxe. Not surprisingly,
adding a brand-name (small S) 8-speed hub does awful things to the
cost, and I'm still working on the drum brakes.

The 7 speed hub is a fair bit less expensive than the 8 speed hub and
the ratios are actually more even (assuming it's the brand of hub gears
I'm thinking of).

G-S

Theo Bekkers said:

Quoted message said:

Theo Bekkers wrote:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

I only rode single-speeds as a kid and rode from Mt Lawley to Perth
after I started work on the same bike I had in High school. When I
got back into cycling at age 40, I rode a fixie for a while from
Balga to the City. No big deal. You just need to have a manageble
gear, which means you're limiting your top speed a little.

Quoted message said:

Geoff pretty much hit the nail on the head. Most of the hills where I
live are such that a single speed would mean walking up them.

I did have a steep hill which was on my route in, but I detoured around it
on the way home. So steep became long.

Castlemaine is built in a valley and along the edges of a couple of
ridge lines.

It's a bit hard to detour around the foothills of the Great Dividing
Range ;-)

G-S

brucef said:

tim said:

If I get my suppliers to do the mixing and matching, I have to carry
stock of a wider range of bikes.

Any time I spend mixing, matching and assembling costs money. I'm
often told I'm cheap, but my hourly rate has to be higher than a
Chinese bike factory worker.

You are right, keep it simple. The wishlist process is a useful
exercise, but in the end you want to strip it down to maybe
two basic models max, plus easily user-installable addons
like lights and baskets etc.

If you can come up with a simple bike like this, with maybe
3 or 5 hub gears for under $200 I will buy three.

So would I 🙂

If you can only keep it to around $400 I'd have to keep it to 1 though.

G-S

Quoted message said:

G-S said:

Resound said:

Centrestands are a thing that I can see being a distinct advantage
(especially for the bakfiet while trying to load and unload it).

You're right... I hate the sidestand on my cypress city with a passion.

It is easily the least practical bit of the bike, when I have weight in
the panniers the bike is very unstable.

G-S

I'll third that.

No, these rear-stay-mounted stands
http://aebike.com/page.cfm?PageID=30&action=details&sku=KI1002

are excellent for securely supporting a fully loaded touring bike, and cope
easily with typical shopping loads.
http://sports.webshots.com/photo/2186762450074746151wuCHNq (my bike standing
with kickstand in front - blue panniers)

--
Cheers
Peter

~~~ ~ _@
~~ ~ _- \,
~~ (*)/ (*)

G-S said:

I wheeled my Giant Cypress City (with rack, panniers, lights, kick-stand
etc etc) commuter bike out the door of work today into a sea of lycra.
The local cycling club meet and leave from the lights near work.

I was in a work T-Shirt and black jeans (it was cold today... normally
that'd be shorts).

(not personal but) commuting home in full lycra down to my shimano
sandals
I was moments away from being maimed by Mr T-shirt and baggy shorts.
A shared path is NOT single track. A downhill run does not justify
drifting wide out of shape into a blind corner underpass.
Railing to my left and concrete wall to the right so nowhere to go.
Under Cotter Rd by Curtin ACT.
Apologies G-S, I really needed to vent.

Quoted message said:

Many many 'looks' (presumably because I didn't fit the lycra
demographic) LOL

or not. Some may have been checking out your bike.
You've obviously put some thought into it.
--
Andre ==================== Speed Thrills!

G-S said:

brucef said:

If you can come up with a simple bike like this, with maybe
3 or 5 hub gears for under $200 I will buy three.

So would I 🙂

If you can only keep it to around $400 I'd have to keep it to 1 though.

The price point is tricky. It falls somewhere between a kmart special
at about $150 and a low-end name brand bike with reasonable quality
parts, like a giant elwood or upland, which starts at about $400.

I reckon they would sell like crazy at $200, above $300 it gets a bit
dicey.

brucef said:

G-S said:

brucef said:

If you can come up with a simple bike like this, with maybe
3 or 5 hub gears for under $200 I will buy three.

So would I 🙂

If you can only keep it to around $400 I'd have to keep it to 1 though.

The price point is tricky. It falls somewhere between a kmart special
at about $150 and a low-end name brand bike with reasonable quality
parts, like a giant elwood or upland, which starts at about $400.

True, and whilst the Elwood isn't exciting or note worthy it actually
works pretty well for general pootling around, and can be adapted for
short/medium distance commuting pretty easily.

Quoted message said:

I reckon they would sell like crazy at $200, above $300 it gets a bit
dicey.

I have to agree...

G-S

Graeme Dods said:

Theo Bekkers said:

I did have a steep hill which was on my route in, but I detoured around it
on the way home. So steep became long.

There's a steep hill in Perth! Where? Admittedly there are probably
huge bits of Perth I've not seen, but I've not come across anything
which I'd go out of my way to avoid on a single speed. My single speed
days were when I was younger and fitter but Edinburgh is rather well
known for being built on a bunch of hills.

Try Toowoomba. I've got a single speed, which used to be great for
commuting the 20 kms to work on the flatlands of Inglewood, but killed
me when I tried even a sedate cycle around the 'burbs here. Long live
multi-geared bikes.

Liz said:

I want one of these bikes when you get them! I'm currently riding my mum's
1950s(?) Malvern Star, and the brakes terrify me. I don't trust them to stop
at the bottom of a hill, so I find myself braking the whole way down the
hill. I'm sure there must be a better way. I'd also like a side stand (I
know, I could easily get one). I ride to the shops (about 1km) or short
rides with my toddler in a front-mounted child seat. It doesn't seem worth
spending $900 (what my previous bike cost) for that. Maybe when my
daughter's a bit older and can ride her own bike.

You'd be surprised what you can do with a $12 recycle-centre bike, with
proper brakes and spend $40 on hi pressure slicks. Been happily
commuting on that for a year or so now.

lemmiwinks said:

G-S said:

Resound wrote:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Centrestands are a thing that I can see being a distinct advantage
(especially for the bakfiet while trying to load and unload it).

Quoted message said:

You're right... I hate the sidestand on my cypress city with a passion.

Quoted message said:

It is easily the least practical bit of the bike, when I have weight in
the panniers the bike is very unstable.

I'll third that. My only caveat would be not to get those horrible
centrestands that swing from the rear axle like are common on Dutch
bikes, but rather the neat two legged type that attach just behind the
bottom bracket like a sidestand and the legs tuck up underneath the
chainstays.http://ebent.files.wordpress.com/2007/05/slipstreamtriangles.jpg

Is it a midships-mounted sidestand by any chance? Aaargh has one of
those, and by the timewe got to Foster I went shopping for a rear
mounted one[1] because they work much better with panniers. $5 later
and I now have dual sidestands, which gives it a very secure 4-point-
of-contact stance. ;-)

BTH
[1] They either bolt to the rear of the left chainstay, or are held in
place by the left rear axle nut.

BT Humble said:

lemmiwinks said:

G-S said:

Resound wrote:
> Centrestands are a thing that I can see being a distinct advantage
> (especially for the bakfiet while trying to load and unload it).
You're right... I hate the sidestand on my cypress city with a passion.
It is easily the least practical bit of the bike, when I have weight in
the panniers the bike is very unstable.

I'll third that. My only caveat would be not to get those horrible
centrestands that swing from the rear axle like are common on Dutch
bikes, but rather the neat two legged type that attach just behind the
bottom bracket like a sidestand and the legs tuck up underneath the
chainstays.http://ebent.files.wordpress.com/2007/05/slipstreamtriangles.jpg

Is it a midships-mounted sidestand by any chance? Aaargh has one of
those, and by the timewe got to Foster I went shopping for a rear
mounted one[1] because they work much better with panniers. $5 later
and I now have dual sidestands, which gives it a very secure 4-point-
of-contact stance. ;-)

Yes it is a midships-mounted sidestand (and the bike fell off it today
for the 3rd time). Bit of a gust and *fall*.

Quoted message said:

BTH
[1] They either bolt to the rear of the left chainstay, or are held in
place by the left rear axle nut.

Might have to look into one ta BT.

G-S