Decathlon vs Trek vs ???

Tom Anderson said:

So, any thoughts would be most welcome.

Edinburgh Bicycle Co-op do some nice mountain/hybrid crossover bikes
under the Revolution brand.

For example:

http://www.edinburgh-bicycle.co.uk/catalogue/

http://www.edinburgh-bicycle.co.uk/catalogue/detail.cfm?ID=22637

(because of their brain-dead website you'll have to visit the first URL
before the second will work)

Anthony

Tom Anderson said:

Afternoon all,

I'd like to buy a new bike. I want to spend 200-300 UKP on a mountain
bike, which i'll mostly use for commuting to work, on the road, but
which'll (hopefully) see plenty more varied use over the summer. I know a
hybrid would be logical here, but i've really not been impressed with the
ones i've looked at - plus, London roads really need something tougher!
I'd prefer rigid forks, since i'm mostly going to be on the road or
halfway decent trails, and the kind of boingy fork you get on a 200-300
UKP bike is just going to sit there soaking up power and control while i'm
doing that.

If i go to my local bike shop, they'll sell me a Trek 4300 for 270 UKP. I
know this, because that's what they sold me when i was in the same
position last year. It was a generally decent bike, and served me well
until it got pinched. The chainset somehow felt a bit flimsy, but it never
broke or anything, so it was probably all in my mind.

However, a friend suggested i try Decathlon, since apparently they're very
good value. I've had a look at their website, but the descriptions of the
bikes are pretty vague, and they don't give prices. They also don't seem
to do much in the way of rigid forks. Moreover, i've never ridden one of
their bikes, and have no sense of how good they are. Can anyone enlighten
me? Are they good value? What's the build quality like? How's the
after-sales service?

There is a third option - a slightly-less-local bike shop (a Cycle
Surgery) down the road. I have no idea what they've got; their website
claims they don't have anything rigid, but amongst the front-sus bikes,
it's Marins and Specializeds in my price range - i believe those are good
quality, but perhaps not such good value, since you're paying extra for
the name. Although they do have a sale on at the moment!

So, any thoughts would be most welcome.

Ta buckets,
tom

--
Many of us adopted the File's slang as our own, feeling that we'd found a
tangible sign of the community of minds we'd half-guessed to be out there.

Decathlon do offer very good value, and actually have ome staff who know what they are talking about (Surrey Quays used to be my LBS when Ilived there). I'd go down there and give the bikes test out, they normally let you have quite a bit of free reign on riding. I've never bought a biek from them, but a friend has and liked it very much until it got nicked.

Cyclesurgery are also good, I've never bought a bike them and can;t say Iv;e seen too many low proced machines there (Liverpool St branch anyway) ut then again I get drawn to teh more expensive ones, so cheaper ones may be there:-)

Don;t worry too much about getting a mtb instead of a hybrid, I used to cycle right across London 4 times a week (24 mile each way commute) on my touring bike with 700x28 tyres, and never had a comfort problem.

Simple answer is go to teh shops, and ssee if any of the bikes on offer are better than the Trek, after all you know what that's like. Another place to condsider is Condor cycles, a friend when there after getting bad service form other shops, and was amazed at the service he got, and walked out with a Marin, ideal for what he wanted.

Bryan

in message <[email hidden]>, Tom

Anderson (') said:

Afternoon all,

I'd like to buy a new bike. I want to spend 200-300 UKP on a mountain
bike, which i'll mostly use for commuting to work, on the road, but
which'll (hopefully) see plenty more varied use over the summer. I know
a hybrid would be logical here, but i've really not been impressed with
the ones i've looked at - plus, London roads really need something
tougher!

Oh, help, this is the second one in a week.

Mountain bikes are NOT 'tougher' than other bikes. Downhill and freeride
bikes /are/ tougher, but are even more unsuitable for riding on the
road. Mountain bikes generally have different geometry - higher bottom
bracket and different head angles - which is designed to cope with very
uneven terrain. They are not designed for use on the road and may be
significantly less suitable for use on the road. Furthermore, the sort
of 'mountain bike' you can buy for £300 isn't much good off-road either.

You /don't/ want a mountain bike. You /do/ want a hybrid or an 'urban'
bike or a 'road' bike. If in the summer you want to ride Coed y Brenin
or the 7stanes or somewhere, hire a mountain bike for that.

--
[email hidden] (Simon Brooke) http://www.jasmine.org.uk/~simon/
,/| _.--''^``-...___.._.,;
/, \'. _-' ,--,,,--'''
{ \ `_-'' ' /
`;;' ; ; ;
._..--'' ._,,, _..' .;.'
(,_....----''' (,..--''

"Simon Brooke" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Oh, help, this is the second one in a week.

Mountain bikes are NOT 'tougher' than other bikes.

But 26" wheels are tougher than 700s - MTBs tend to get the former,
hybrid/urban/road bikes tend to get the latter.

Not that I'm entirely disagreeing with you - I wouldn't use an MTB even with
slicks for road riding.

cheers,
clive

Quoted message said:

So, any thoughts would be most welcome.

As Simon says, any bike will be able to cope with London roads - wheels are
very strong, and I haven't damaged my road bike's wheels yet - so that
frees you up to look at a wider range of bikes.

Sounds like a hybrid would be perfect - can do all the off road stuff and
is a _lot_ more suited to the on road stuff.

Obvious I know but don't forget the mudguards.

in message <[email hidden]>, Clive

George (') said:

"Simon Brooke" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Oh, help, this is the second one in a week.

Mountain bikes are NOT 'tougher' than other bikes.

But 26" wheels are tougher than 700s - MTBs tend to get the former,
hybrid/urban/road bikes tend to get the latter.

I really don't believe there's a measurable difference. The wheel I
crashed into a boulder at 46 miles per hour last October was 700c. The
rim's a bit battered, but the wheel is still perfectly true, and still
ridable. The difference in dimension between a 26" and a 700c is very
small. Furthermore, of course, at any rim braked wheel of any size will
be stronger than any disk braked wheel of similar construction, simply
because the spokes are at a less acute angle.

--
[email hidden] (Simon Brooke) http://www.jasmine.org.uk/~simon/

Morning had broken, and there was nothing left for us to do
but pick up the pieces.

Simon Brooke said:

.... freeride
bikes /are/ tougher, but are even more unsuitable for riding on the
road.

Why do you say that ?

After reading the enthusiastic comments about the Specialized Tricross here,
I'm considering buying one as a sort of faster hybrid. The Trek hybrid I
tried seemed disappointingly slow and heavy even compared with my ancient,
cheap, Raleigh.

I'm actually after a light day tourer, and a Dawes Audax seemed a good
choice - but while I think it would be good on tarmac, I'm unsure how well
it would cope with gravelly NCN paths etc.

The Tricross might be a bit limited in gearing range, but that strikes
me as being easier to fix (at some later stage) than a lack of wheel
clearance.

-adrian

Take a look at the Specialized Hardrock - Very well reviewed and within
your budget.

R

Tom

Have a look at the Triban

They do a model with an 8 speed hub gear for about £300. It got a good
review in Cycling Plus. Very much a fast urban bike.
Generally Decathlon offers very good value for money.

Best regards

Rod King

"Tom Anderson" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Afternoon all,

I'd like to buy a new bike. I want to spend 200-300 UKP on a mountain
bike, which i'll mostly use for commuting to work, on the road, but
which'll (hopefully) see plenty more varied use over the summer. I know a
hybrid would be logical here, but i've really not been impressed with the
ones i've looked at - plus, London roads really need something tougher!
I'd prefer rigid forks, since i'm mostly going to be on the road or
halfway decent trails, and the kind of boingy fork you get on a 200-300
UKP bike is just going to sit there soaking up power and control while i'm
doing that.

If i go to my local bike shop, they'll sell me a Trek 4300 for 270 UKP. I
know this, because that's what they sold me when i was in the same
position last year. It was a generally decent bike, and served me well
until it got pinched. The chainset somehow felt a bit flimsy, but it never
broke or anything, so it was probably all in my mind.

However, a friend suggested i try Decathlon, since apparently they're very
good value. I've had a look at their website, but the descriptions of the
bikes are pretty vague, and they don't give prices. They also don't seem
to do much in the way of rigid forks. Moreover, i've never ridden one of
their bikes, and have no sense of how good they are. Can anyone enlighten
me? Are they good value? What's the build quality like? How's the
after-sales service?

There is a third option - a slightly-less-local bike shop (a Cycle
Surgery) down the road. I have no idea what they've got; their website
claims they don't have anything rigid, but amongst the front-sus bikes,
it's Marins and Specializeds in my price range - i believe those are good
quality, but perhaps not such good value, since you're paying extra for
the name. Although they do have a sale on at the moment!

So, any thoughts would be most welcome.

Ta buckets,
tom

--
Many of us adopted the File's slang as our own, feeling that we'd found a
tangible sign of the community of minds we'd half-guessed to be out there.

"Simon Brooke" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

But 26" wheels are tougher than 700s - MTBs tend to get the former,
hybrid/urban/road bikes tend to get the latter.

I really don't believe there's a measurable difference. The wheel I
crashed into a boulder at 46 miles per hour last October was 700c. The
rim's a bit battered, but the wheel is still perfectly true, and still
ridable. The difference in dimension between a 26" and a 700c is very
small. Furthermore, of course, at any rim braked wheel of any size will
be stronger than any disk braked wheel of similar construction, simply
because the spokes are at a less acute angle.

Unfortunately I don't have experience of 700 vs 26" with similar rims on the
tandem - I think the 26" rims have always been stronger than the 700 ones we
had (40H mavic mod 4 - but the original ceramics on the MTB were a similar
profile to that). I've broken two of the 700c rims on remarkably small
bumps, and none of the 36H 26" ones.

And your evidence is just as flawed :-)

What are the numbers - who's got a copy of the bicycle wheel to hand? I
thought it was something like a squared relationship.

cheers,
clive

Simon Brooke said:

Furthermore, of course, at any rim braked wheel of any size will
be stronger than any disk braked wheel of similar construction, simply
because the spokes are at a less acute angle.

Shirley they are not of a similar construction if the spokes are at a
less acute angle? e.g. any wheel with a disk hub and braking surfaced
rim (of which I have a several). There's plenty of space on the lhs of
rear hubs to fit the rotor mounts without having to move the spoke holes
at all. There may be a small difference between the lhs position of the
spoke holes on a front wheel when comparing a disk to a non-disk hub,
and I take it that this is what you are referring to. This however would
lead to the front wheel's spokes being very slightly dished, unless you
happen to have a front rim with offset spoke holes (I do). So, you may
lose a small amount of side-to-side strength, but nowhere near as much
as you've already given up on the rear wheel with 9 speed dishing. I CBA
to go out to the shed at this time in the evening to check the offset
spoke front rim to see if the front hub also has compensation for the
movement of the lhs spoke holes by moving the rhs ones to the right, but
if you're interested, I might tomorrow.

JimP

Mark Thompson said:

Quoted message said:

So, any thoughts would be most welcome.

As Simon says, any bike will be able to cope with London roads - wheels are
very strong, and I haven't damaged my road bike's wheels yet - so that
frees you up to look at a wider range of bikes.

Sounds like a hybrid would be perfect - can do all the off road stuff and
is a _lot_ more suited to the on road stuff.

Obvious I know but don't forget the mudguards.

I rode my road bike round London for many years as a daily commuting
vehicle. 20mm tyres on wheels I built myself. After 10k miles they were
less than 1mm out (and I am no lightweight )

I wouldn't worry about th esize of the wheels - it's how well they are
built. I prefer a sit up position in cities so would go for a hybrid
for speed. Having said that, I am splitting the difference with my
current project. Upgrading my Norwegian single speed bike grandma bike
to a dynamo hub and epicyclic gears. It has wheels half way between MTB
and road (584 - or 650C)

...d

in message <[email hidden]>, Adrian Godwin

(') said:

Simon Brooke said:

.... freeride
bikes /are/ tougher, but are even more unsuitable for riding on the
road.

Why do you say that ?

6 inches or more of suspension travel at each end does not a good road
bike make, and that's before you start thinking about weight.

Quoted message said:

After reading the enthusiastic comments about the Specialized Tricross
here, I'm considering buying one as a sort of faster hybrid. The Trek
hybrid I tried seemed disappointingly slow and heavy even compared with
my ancient, cheap, Raleigh.

Tricross is a really nice bike, recommended. Good for roads, and good for
the sort of off-road most people actually do. There are other
mass-produced crossers as well - Giant do one and so do Cannondale. Much
better as general purpose commute-plus-a-bit-of-off-road bikes than
mountain bikes are.

Quoted message said:

I'm actually after a light day tourer, and a Dawes Audax seemed a good
choice - but while I think it would be good on tarmac, I'm unsure how
well it would cope with gravelly NCN paths etc.

Lighter and probably faster than a Tricross, should be OK on gravel
provided it's not too loose.

Quoted message said:

The Tricross might be a bit limited in gearing range, but that strikes
me as being easier to fix (at some later stage) than a lack of wheel
clearance.

Limited for /what/? You can get up any road hill with Tricross gearing,
and off-road you'd probably run out of traction or the ability to keep
the front wheel down before you ran out of gears.

--
[email hidden] (Simon Brooke) http://www.jasmine.org.uk/~simon/

;; MS Windows: A thirty-two bit extension ... to a sixteen bit
;; patch to an eight bit operating system originally coded for a
;; four bit microprocessor and sold by a two-bit company that
;; can't stand one bit of competition -- anonymous

Simon Brooke said:

Quoted message said:

Why do you say that ?

6 inches or more of suspension travel at each end does not a good road
bike make, and that's before you start thinking about weight.

Ah, that's what I expected you to say about mountain bikes, but you
also mentioned 'freeride'. Specialized call the Tricross 'freeroad',
hence my confusion. But it has no suspension, so I guess you weren't
referring to it there, after all.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

I'm actually after a light day tourer, and a Dawes Audax seemed a good
choice - but while I think it would be good on tarmac, I'm unsure how
well it would cope with gravelly NCN paths etc.

Lighter and probably faster than a Tricross, should be OK on gravel
provided it's not too loose.

Tricross is 10.9kg (ali), 48/34 chainset, 8 speed 12-25 cassette
Audax is 11.7 kg (steel), 52/42/30, 9 speed 12-25 cassette.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

The Tricross might be a bit limited in gearing range, but that strikes
me as being easier to fix (at some later stage) than a lack of wheel
clearance.

Limited for /what/? You can get up any road hill with Tricross gearing,
and off-road you'd probably run out of traction or the ability to keep
the front wheel down before you ran out of gears.

My old 10-speed (and my older legs) doesn't have low enough gearing to
let me spin up a steep hill, but I lack the experience to translate
the numbers above into real life. So I'm looking for lower ratios but
don't really know how low. From the above, the Audax appears to have
about 20% wider gearing range, some at each end (though a Galaxy has
considerably more) - this makes me think I'm less likely to find it a
problem. However, the old bike is 25kg, 52/42, 14-26 so either is
going to be an improvement.

-adrian

in message <[email hidden]>, Adrian Godwin

(') said:

Tricross is 10.9kg (ali), 48/34 chainset, 8 speed 12-25 cassette
Audax is 11.7 kg (steel), 52/42/30, 9 speed 12-25 cassette.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

The Tricross might be a bit limited in gearing range, but that
strikes me as being easier to fix (at some later stage) than a lack
of wheel clearance.

Limited for /what/? You can get up any road hill with Tricross
gearing, and off-road you'd probably run out of traction or the
ability to keep the front wheel down before you ran out of gears.

My old 10-speed (and my older legs) doesn't have low enough gearing to
let me spin up a steep hill, but I lack the experience to translate
the numbers above into real life. So I'm looking for lower ratios but
don't really know how low. From the above, the Audax appears to have
about 20% wider gearing range, some at each end (though a Galaxy has
considerably more) - this makes me think I'm less likely to find it a
problem. However, the old bike is 25kg, 52/42, 14-26 so either is
going to be an improvement.

OK:
Lowest Highest
Old bike: (42/26)x27 = 43.605 (52/14)x27 = 100.285
Tricross: (34/25)x27 = 36.72 (48/12)x27 = 108
Audax: (30/25)x27 = 32.4 (52/12)x27 = 117

These numbers are 'gear inches', the diameter (in inches) of a penny
farthing wheel which would travel the same distance for one rotation of
the pedals. Yes, I know that's arcane, but it's TRADITION and you can't
change it; it also helps to make gears comparable over widely different
bikes. The '27' is the diameter in inches of the wheel /with/ /tyre/;
700c with a 28mm tyre is as near as dammit 27 inches (so is a mountain
bike wheel with a 2" tyre).

From this you can clearly see that the bottom gear on the audax is only
three quarters of the bottom gear on the old bike. But getting 15 Kg off
the weight of the bike (is your old one /really/ that heavy?) will make
more difference than you expect!

--
[email hidden] (Simon Brooke) http://www.jasmine.org.uk/~simon/

;; single speed mountain bikes: for people who cycle on flat mountains.

Anthony Jones said:

Tom Anderson said:

So, any thoughts would be most welcome.

Edinburgh Bicycle Co-op do some nice mountain/hybrid crossover bikes
under the Revolution brand.

Those do look good.

I don't live anywhere near any of their shops, though, which means i'd
have to mail order one. Do they ship it in a fully set up condition, or
would i have to do it myself (or rather, get my LBS to do it, given that
my mechanical skills are pathetic)?

tom

--
Cthulu saves! (so he can eat you later)

Simon Brooke said:

in message <[email hidden]>, Tom

Anderson (') said:

I know a hybrid would be logical here, but i've really not been
impressed with the ones i've looked at - plus, London roads really need
something tougher!

Oh, help, this is the second one in a week.

Mountain bikes are NOT 'tougher' than other bikes.

But ... but ... they've got stickers and really aggressive names. Surely
that counts for something?

Point taken. Isn't there a difference in the design of the freewheel,
though? I was told at some point that the hubs typically used with hybrids
are of a lighter but less resilient design.

tom

--
Cthulu saves! (so he can eat you later)

Clive George said:

"Simon Brooke" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Oh, help, this is the second one in a week.

Mountain bikes are NOT 'tougher' than other bikes.

But 26" wheels are tougher than 700s - MTBs tend to get the former,
hybrid/urban/road bikes tend to get the latter.

There are some nice hybrid bikes out there with 26" wheels, tend to be
called 'Urban' or 'City', Marin spring to mind. Would give you a more
MTB look on a road bike.

Simon Brooke said:

OK:
Lowest Highest
Old bike: (42/26)x27 = 43.605 (52/14)x27 = 100.285
Tricross: (34/25)x27 = 36.72 (48/12)x27 = 108
Audax: (30/25)x27 = 32.4 (52/12)x27 = 117
...
From this you can clearly see that the bottom gear on the audax is only
three quarters of the bottom gear on the old bike. But getting 15 Kg off
the weight of the bike (is your old one /really/ that heavy?) will make
more difference than you expect!

Hijacking thread slightly. I would love to replace my 20 year-old road
bike with a Cyclo-cross for all round versatility. But all the
cyclocross bikes have front doubles so you don't get the gear range of a
straight bar hybrid.

I have read that the Sora gears on the Tricross are double specific, so
not easilly upgraded. What about the Tiagra/105/Ultima shifters on the
Cannondale/Trek/Focus cross machines?

Or should I just admit I can't get 1 bike, and buy 2...

Ib.