Dartmoor news

Aluminium said:

news.bbc.co.uk3361143.stmOpen ↗

What is it with these people? They buy some land and the next thing you know, they think
they own it!

Paul
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"Aluminium" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
"]news:[email hidden]...
| news.bbc.co.uk3361143.stmOpen ↗

"Mary Alford closed the tor after the insurers said she could be liable if someone injured
themselves in the area. "

Sounds fair to me, it's her land, and why should she pay insurance for other people to walk her
land? If someone hurts themselves, they'll be the first to sue her for having a hole in the ground
or failing to maintain her land or something.

Ste

Paul Saunders wrote:
|| Aluminium wrote:
||
||| news.bbc.co.uk3361143.stmOpen ↗
||
|| What is it with these people? They buy some land and the next thing you know, they think they
|| own it!

She does own it! But she should also know her responsibilities concerning Environment protection of
the moor;-(

Hope she gets a bl**dy heavy fine! Doubt it though.

CB

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ste © wrote:
|| "Aluminium" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
|| "]news:[email hidden]...
||| news.bbc.co.uk3361143.stmOpen ↗
||
||
|| "Mary Alford closed the tor after the insurers said she could be liable if someone injured
|| themselves in the area. "
||
|| Sounds fair to me, it's her land, and why should she pay insurance for other people to walk her
|| land? If someone hurts themselves, they'll be the first to sue her for having a hole in the
|| ground or failing to maintain her land or something.

Wrong especially for just walking on her land, she cannot be sued.! Any building or other structures
are a different matter. Although, all she has to do is put up warning signs and a disclaimer. The
National Trust and other organisations are in the process of doing just that.

Sign of the times, I'm afraid:-(

CB
--
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In message <[email hidden]>

CB said:

Wrong especially for just walking on her land, she cannot be sued.! Any building or other
structures are a different matter. Although, all she has to do is put up warning signs and a
disclaimer. The National Trust and other organisations are in the process of doing just that.

Sign of the times, I'm afraid:-(

Ah, that's the one that gets things demolished to be on the safe side, no matter how safe, or of any
historical interest they may be.

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ste © said:

"Mary Alford closed the tor after the insurers said she could be liable if someone injured
themselves in the area. "

Sounds fair to me, it's her land, and why should she pay insurance for other people to walk
her land?

We're not talking about a field full of potatoes, we're talking about Dartmoor, a wild patch of land
with a Tor. It's like someone buying a mountain and then closing it off to walkers in case someone
falls of a cliff.

There's a new landowner in the Beacons at Penywllt. There's a terrific photo viewpoint there that
I've been visiting since forever. All of a sudden it's surrounded by barbed wire fences with
Private: Keep Out signs preventing me from getting to the spot where I used to park my car.

Now if the area was indundated with walkers and parked cars he might have a reason to get annoyed,
but the daft thing is that no-one ever goes there! Okay, there might be the odd person now and
again, but in all the times I've ever been there I've never seen another car parked there and never
encountered another walker. So why's this new landowner suddenly so keen to surround everything with
barbed wire and keep out signs? He could have left it exactly as it was and would rarely have been
disturbed by anyone. That's pure bloody-minded selfishness! Probably English too I wouldn't be
surprised.

Paul
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ste © said:

"Aluminium" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
"]news:[email hidden]...
| news.bbc.co.uk3361143.stmOpen ↗

"Mary Alford closed the tor after the insurers said she could be liable if someone injured
themselves in the area. "

Sounds fair to me, it's her land, and why should she pay insurance for other people to walk her
land? If someone hurts themselves, they'll be the first to sue her for having a hole in the ground
or failing to maintain her land or something.

Ste

Except .. Do you want to live in that world? Hills are dangerous. Allow this goml to get away with
it, and you will be pounding tarmac for the rest of your life. Resist......

Richard Webb

ste © said:

"Mary Alford closed the tor after the insurers said she could be liable if someone injured
themselves in the area. "

Sounds fair to me

It wouldn't if you'd read the CROW Act: hmso.gov.uk00037 b.htmOpen ↗

"CB" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
"]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Paul Saunders wrote:
|| Aluminium wrote:
||
||| news.bbc.co.uk3361143.stmOpen ↗
||
|| What is it with these people? They buy some land and the next thing you know, they think they
|| own it!

She does own it! But she should also know her responsibilities concerning Environment protection
of the moor;-(

Hope she gets a bl**dy heavy fine! Doubt it though.

CB

A Devon landowner. Probably on the Bench, or on dinner party terms with someone who is.

"CB" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
"]news:[email hidden]...
| ste © wrote:
| || "Aluminium" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
| || "]news:[email hidden]...
| ||| news.bbc.co.uk3361143.stmOpen ↗
| ||
| ||
| || "Mary Alford closed the tor after the insurers said she could be liable if someone injured
| || themselves in the area. "
| ||
| || Sounds fair to me, it's her land, and why should she pay insurance for other people to walk her
| || land? If someone hurts themselves, they'll be the first to sue her for having a hole in the
| || ground or failing to maintain her land or something.
|
| Wrong especially for just walking on her land, she cannot be sued.! Any building or other
| structures are a different matter. Although, all she has to do is put up warning signs and a
| disclaimer. The National Trust and
other
| organisations are in the process of doing just that.
|
| Sign of the times, I'm afraid:-(
|
| CB

If she can't be sued by people just walking on her land, and only has to put up signs, then no
problems then! But why are her insurers giving her problems? I hate insurance companies! :-)

Ste

Paul Saunders wrote:
|| ste © wrote:
||
||| "Mary Alford closed the tor after the insurers said she could be liable if someone injured
||| themselves in the area. "
|||
||| Sounds fair to me, it's her land, and why should she pay insurance for other people to walk
||| her land?
||
|| We're not talking about a field full of potatoes, we're talking about Dartmoor, a wild patch of
|| land with a Tor. It's like someone buying a mountain and then closing it off to walkers in case
|| someone falls of a cliff.
||
|| There's a new landowner in the Beacons at Penywllt. There's a terrific photo viewpoint there that
|| I've been visiting since forever. All of a sudden it's surrounded by barbed wire fences with
|| Private: Keep Out signs preventing me from getting to the spot where I used to park my car.
||
|| Now if the area was indundated with walkers and parked cars he might have a reason to get
|| annoyed, but the daft thing is that no-one ever goes there! Okay, there might be the odd person
|| now and again, but in all the times I've ever been there I've never seen another car parked there
|| and never encountered another walker. So why's this new landowner suddenly so keen to surround
|| everything with barbed wire and keep out signs? He could have left it exactly as it was and would
|| rarely have been disturbed by anyone. That's pure bloody-minded selfishness! Probably English too
|| I wouldn't be surprised.

English! Get away, never ;-) I'm English!

Roll on the freedom to 'roam' act that the Labour parties supposed to be introducing ;-)
Like never!!!!

CB

--
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[email hidden] said...

Quoted message said:

Paul Saunders wrote:
|| Aluminium wrote:
||
||| news.bbc.co.uk3361143.stmOpen ↗
||
|| What is it with these people? They buy some land and the next thing you know, they think they
|| own it!

She does own it! But she should also know her responsibilities concerning Environment protection
of the moor;-(

Hope she gets a bl**dy heavy fine! Doubt it though.

Seems to me she was in a bit of a pickle though, because she'd been told that she'd be liable if
anyone injured himself on her land. What would *you* (generic) do in similar circumstances?
--
Fran If you need my email address please ask.

[email hidden] said...

Quoted message said:

That's pure bloody-minded selfishness! Probably English too I wouldn't be surprised.

OY!

--
Fran If you need my email address please ask.

In message <[email hidden]>

Fran said:

[email hidden] said...

Quoted message said:

Paul Saunders wrote:
|| Aluminium wrote:
||
||| news.bbc.co.uk3361143.stmOpen ↗
||
|| What is it with these people? They buy some land and the next thing you know, they think they
|| own it!

She does own it! But she should also know her responsibilities concerning Environment protection
of the moor;-(

Hope she gets a bl**dy heavy fine! Doubt it though.

Seems to me she was in a bit of a pickle though, because she'd been told that she'd be liable if
anyone injured himself on her land. What would *you* (generic) do in similar circumstances?

I would hope (although I don't know) that anyone who hurts themselves on a natural feature of the
landscape should only have themselves to blame, and not be able to sue. If this is true then someone
ought to make sure it's rammed down the front of insurance companies etc.

Although there definitely does seem to be a trend to start screaming at the slightest bump, and win,
it's caused too big a reaction the other way. Unfortunately I think only some high-level
intereference is required to bring back a bit of common sense to the whole thing, but this won't
happen (voters will sulk when told they are behaving like crying babies).

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"Paul Saunders" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
"]news:[email hidden]...
| ste © wrote:
|
| > "Mary Alford closed the tor after the insurers said she could be liable if someone injured
| > themselves in the area. "
| >
| > Sounds fair to me, it's her land, and why should she pay insurance for other people to walk
| > her land?
|
| We're not talking about a field full of potatoes, we're talking about Dartmoor, a wild patch of
| land with a Tor. It's like someone buying a mountain and then closing it off to walkers in case
| someone falls of a cliff.

You mean it's not a field of potatoes? Well dammit, I retract my original post then! :-)

| There's a new landowner in the Beacons at Penywllt. There's a terrific photo viewpoint there that
| I've been visiting since forever. All of a sudden it's surrounded by barbed wire fences with
| Private: Keep Out signs preventing me from getting to the spot where I used to park my car.

How dare he stop people from entering his own land! ;-)

| Now if the area was indundated with walkers and parked cars he might have a reason to get annoyed,
| but the daft thing is that no-one ever goes there! Okay, there might be the odd person now and
| again, but in all the times I've ever been there I've never seen another car parked there and
| never encountered another walker. So why's this new landowner suddenly so keen to surround
| everything with barbed wire and keep out signs? He could have left it exactly as it was and would
| rarely have been disturbed by anyone. That's pure bloody-minded selfishness!

Yes, it's terrible, but it's his land so he can do whatever he wants with it. If he's breaking any
laws, then he'll be dealt with, surely? If you care strongly about this, why don't you form an
action group? Lobby the council? Or contact the Ramblers Association for assistance? You never know,
you might get it opened again if there's a case to be answered.

| Probably English too I wouldn't be surprised.

English?!?! A shocking statement, I hope you forgot to put the smilies in there! ;-) I'll respond by
saying that the only reason the guy is probably closing his land for is to protect his sheep! ;-)

| Paul

Ste

"RJ Webb" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
"]news:[email hidden]...
| On Thu, 01 Jan 2004 21:44:43 GMT, "ste ©" <[email hidden]> wrote:
|
| >"Aluminium" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
| >"]news:[email hidden]...
| >| news.bbc.co.uk3361143.stmOpen ↗
| >
| >
| >"Mary Alford closed the tor after the insurers said she could be liable
if
| >someone injured themselves in the area. "
| >
| >Sounds fair to me, it's her land, and why should she pay insurance for
other
| >people to walk her land? If someone hurts themselves, they'll be the
first
| >to sue her for having a hole in the ground or failing to maintain her
land
| >or something.
| >
| >Ste
|
|
| Except .. Do you want to live in that world? Hills are dangerous. Allow this goml to get away with
| it, and you will be pounding tarmac for the rest of your life. Resist......
|
| Richard Webb

No of course not. But I hate the compensation culture too, and it does happen. If someone trips over
a hole, I'd say 'watch where you're going and be more careful in future!' :-) But people claim for
anything and everything these days, so if I could get some peace of mind (and save money by not
having to make payouts!) by closing my land, then it'd be an easy decision to make.

Of course, if the 'insurance company' story is just an excuse, then open the land again! ;-)

Ste

"Simon Caldwell" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
"]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

ste © said:

"Mary Alford closed the tor after the insurers said she could be liable

if

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

someone injured themselves in the area. "

Sounds fair to me

It wouldn't if you'd read the CROW Act: hmso.gov.uk00037 b.htmOpen ↗

Thanks for that informative, but dry read. She should show it to her insurers I think! ;-)

Ste

"Paul Saunders" <[email hidden]> wrote

Quoted message said:

There's a new landowner in the Beacons at Penywllt. There's a terrific photo viewpoint there that
I've been visiting since forever. All of a sudden it's surrounded by barbed wire fences with
Private: Keep Out signs preventing me from getting to the spot where I used to park my car.

Maybe they've had problems with travellers setting up camp wherever they came from before buying
the bit of land you're talking about? Just a thought, it's quite a common problem in some areas
these days.

In message <[email hidden]>

Paul Saunders said:

ste © wrote:

Quoted message said:

Starting to see a pattern here? Beacons, Mid-Wales, Snowdonia - wild camping okay. New Forest,
Peak District - wild camping not tolerated. I don't know about other parts of England, I assume
it's okay in the Lake District and it seems to be okay in Dartmoor, but my experiences so far
indicate that the English are far less tolerant of wild camping than the Welsh. And I'm not just
talking about specific landowners, but whole areas where the activity is a no-no.

I believe it generally seems to be tolerated as long as you're out of sight from the valleys, or
perhaps the roads in the case of passes, with a few fairly obvious exceptions (forestry land,
for example).

Quoted message said:

Yes, some Welsh landowners are tossers, but in England whole areas seem to be off-limits.

I've never had a problem, although off wild land I've rarely been off RoWs (I used to run around the
fields near our house when I was a kid). There might be problems when a farmer doesn't even know
there's a RoW there, although the worst I've had was a "Is there? I guess it'll be going over there,
then". I've even been trudging through fields with the son of the guy who owned them, trying to work
out where the path was supposed to go 🙂

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