cycling in spain

<[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

I am in Barcelona next week for work and was thinking of hiring a bike
to get around (hotel 5 miles from conference centre). I had a feeling
that Spain's MHL doesn't apply in urban areas. Can anyone confirm
this. Any other tips for commuting in Barcelona?

My journey is from close to the university to the coast end of
Avinguda Diagonal. Anyone know what the drop is (ok for single speed
folder) or how the road is for cycling?

tia
james

Whats MHL ?
I cycled from St Malo to Barcelona and my advce is use the UG (Underground)
..
The traffic is horrendus, stop go with lots of traffic lights, large open
junctions and nippy motorbikes flying around.

PK

PK

Quoted message said:

I am in Barcelona next week for work and was thinking of hiring a bike
to get around (hotel 5 miles from conference centre). I had a feeling
that Spain's MHL doesn't apply in urban areas. Can anyone confirm
this. Any other tips for commuting in Barcelona?

My journey is from close to the university to the coast end of
Avinguda Diagonal. Anyone know what the drop is (ok for single speed
folder) or how the road is for cycling?

tia
james

If you are going to Barcelona for work on a long term basis, this may be of
interest to you
www.bicing.com

Jan

Jan said:

Quoted message said:

I am in Barcelona next week for work and was thinking of hiring a
bike to get around (hotel 5 miles from conference centre). I had a
feeling that Spain's MHL doesn't apply in urban areas. Can anyone
confirm this. Any other tips for commuting in Barcelona?

My journey is from close to the university to the coast end of
Avinguda Diagonal. Anyone know what the drop is (ok for single speed
folder) or how the road is for cycling?

tia
james

If you are going to Barcelona for work on a long term basis, this may
be of interest to you
www.bicing.com

Jan

Sorry meant to say there's no English, however Google Translation will give
you a pretty good idea of what its about.
Jan

P K said the following on 08/11/2007 13:35:

Quoted message said:

Whats MHL ?

Mandatory Helmet Law

--
Paul Boyd
http://www.paul-boyd.co.uk/

<[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

I am in Barcelona next week for work and was thinking of hiring a bike
to get around (hotel 5 miles from conference centre). I had a feeling
that Spain's MHL doesn't apply in urban areas. Can anyone confirm
this. Any other tips for commuting in Barcelona?

My journey is from close to the university to the coast end of
Avinguda Diagonal. Anyone know what the drop is (ok for single speed
folder) or how the road is for cycling?

tia
james

Helmet is mandatory outside towns
After darkness you have to wear reflective clothing
Right before left does not apply to cyclists
Children are not permitted in trailors
Some through roads are closed to cyclists

Last info I had!

Fred

fred2 said:

Helmet is mandatory outside towns
After darkness you have to wear reflective clothing
Right before left does not apply to cyclists
Children are not permitted in trailors
Some through roads are closed to cyclists

It makes Britain sound like some sort of cycling utopia. Remind me not
to visit Spain.

Cheers,
Luke

--
Red Rose Ramblings, the diary of an Essex boy in
exile in Lancashire <http://www.shrimper.org.uk>

"Ekul Namsob" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

fred2 said:

Helmet is mandatory outside towns
After darkness you have to wear reflective clothing
Right before left does not apply to cyclists
Children are not permitted in trailors
Some through roads are closed to cyclists

It makes Britain sound like some sort of cycling utopia. Remind me not
to visit Spain.

Well, points 2 to 5 are common sense - believe me you would not WANT to ride
on the roads on which cycling is not allowed (Fancy the M25 on your bike -
with no hard shoulder?) and no 1 is almost NEVER imposed. Even on motorbikes
and scooters little notice is paid to those who opt out of this particular
law......

Rob

Quoted message said:

Cheers,
Luke

--
Red Rose Ramblings, the diary of an Essex boy in
exile in Lancashire <http://www.shrimper.org.uk>

RobDee said:

"Ekul Namsob" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

fred2 said:

Helmet is mandatory outside towns
After darkness you have to wear reflective clothing
Right before left does not apply to cyclists
Children are not permitted in trailors
Some through roads are closed to cyclists

It makes Britain sound like some sort of cycling utopia. Remind me not
to visit Spain.

Well, points 2 to 5 are common sense - believe me you would not WANT to ride
on the roads on which cycling is not allowed (Fancy the M25 on your bike -
with no hard shoulder?) and no 1 is almost NEVER imposed. Even on motorbikes
and scooters little notice is paid to those who opt out of this particular
law......

Wearing a helmet is common sense. Until this year, I didn't own any
reflective clothing. I owned lights.

My daughter has travelled with pleasure on a trailer bike. I don't see
that it's common sense to ban parents from travelling with their
children by bike.

Common sense is frequently wrong, hence the Monty Hall problem.

Cheers,
Luke

--
Red Rose Ramblings, the diary of an Essex boy in
exile in Lancashire <http://www.shrimper.org.uk>

Quoted message said:

I am in Barcelona next week for work and was thinking of hiring a bike
to get around (hotel 5 miles from conference centre). I had a feeling
that Spain's MHL doesn't apply in urban areas. Can anyone confirm
this.

I cycled right across Spain during the summer through urban and rural
areas without wearing a helmet, encountering polis of various flavours
including traffic polis, but none paid me any attention.

in message <[email hidden]>, RobDee ([email hidden]'😉

Quoted message said:

"Ekul Namsob" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

fred2 said:

Helmet is mandatory outside towns
After darkness you have to wear reflective clothing
Right before left does not apply to cyclists
Children are not permitted in trailors
Some through roads are closed to cyclists

It makes Britain sound like some sort of cycling utopia. Remind me not
to visit Spain.

Well, points 2 to 5 are common sense - believe me you would not WANT to
ride on the roads on which cycling is not allowed (Fancy the M25 on your
bike - with no hard shoulder?) and no 1 is almost NEVER imposed. Even on
motorbikes and scooters little notice is paid to those who opt out of
this particular law......

So it's 'common sense' that you can't take children in trailers, or that
you /must/ wear reflectives after dark?

--
[email hidden] (Simon Brooke) http://www.jasmine.org.uk/~simon/

;; If you're doing this for fun, do what seems fun. If you're
;; doing it for money, stop now.
;; Rainer Deyke

"Simon Brooke" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

in message <[email hidden]>, RobDee ([email hidden]'😉

Quoted message said:

"Ekul Namsob" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

fred2 <[email hidden]> wrote:

> Helmet is mandatory outside towns
> After darkness you have to wear reflective clothing
> Right before left does not apply to cyclists
> Children are not permitted in trailors
> Some through roads are closed to cyclists

It makes Britain sound like some sort of cycling utopia. Remind me not
to visit Spain.

Well, points 2 to 5 are common sense - believe me you would not WANT to
ride on the roads on which cycling is not allowed (Fancy the M25 on your
bike - with no hard shoulder?) and no 1 is almost NEVER imposed. Even on
motorbikes and scooters little notice is paid to those who opt out of
this particular law......

So it's 'common sense' that you can't take children in trailers, or that
you /must/ wear reflectives after dark?

Sorry, Simon, sent this to your email in error.....

Well , I reckon so. Unless of course you don't value your children's lives -
or your own.

I could quote some of the road death stats - they're posted on signs all
over the motorway bridges - they read like war casualty figures. I wouldn't
dream of having a child of mine on a bike with me, in a trailer or in any
other shape or form on most of the roads around here. I think the law
pertains specifically to children because the Spanish hold children's lives
with higher regard than those of adults. Amongst my friends and colleagues
there have been a number of deaths on the roads - quite recently a colleague
was hit from the side as he cycled past a junction in the dark (yes he had
lights). As I have said in previous posts, I take massive detours to avoid
travelling on some of the roads where cyclists *are* allowed. In my honest
opinion, anyone who would voluntarily cycle on the roads where cycling is
banned deserves their inevitable fate.

HTH

Rob

Quoted message said:

--
[email hidden] (Simon Brooke) http://www.jasmine.org.uk/~simon/

;; If you're doing this for fun, do what seems fun. If you're
;; doing it for money, stop now.
;; Rainer Deyke

"Ekul Namsob" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

RobDee said:

"Ekul Namsob" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

fred2 <[email hidden]> wrote:

> Helmet is mandatory outside towns
> After darkness you have to wear reflective clothing
> Right before left does not apply to cyclists
> Children are not permitted in trailors
> Some through roads are closed to cyclists

It makes Britain sound like some sort of cycling utopia. Remind me not
to visit Spain.

Well, points 2 to 5 are common sense - believe me you would not WANT to
ride
on the roads on which cycling is not allowed (Fancy the M25 on your
bike -
with no hard shoulder?) and no 1 is almost NEVER imposed. Even on
motorbikes
and scooters little notice is paid to those who opt out of this
particular
law......

Wearing a helmet is common sense. Until this year, I didn't own any
reflective clothing. I owned lights.

My daughter has travelled with pleasure on a trailer bike. I don't see
that it's common sense to ban parents from travelling with their
children by bike.

I take your point Luke that we ought to be able to do these things - but see
my response to Simon's post for reasons why I said what I did.

Quoted message said:

Common sense is frequently wrong, hence the Monty Hall problem.

Monty Hall?

Quoted message said:

Cheers,
Luke

Cheers,
Rob

Quoted message said:

--
Red Rose Ramblings, the diary of an Essex boy in
exile in Lancashire <http://www.shrimper.org.uk>

In article <[email hidden]>, RobDee
[email hidden] says...

Quoted message said:

Monty Hall?

Google.
Wkipedia.

RobDee said:

"Simon Brooke" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

in message <[email hidden]>, RobDee ([email hidden]'😉
wrote:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Well, points 2 to 5 are common sense - believe me you would not WANT to
ride on the roads on which cycling is not allowed (Fancy the M25 on your
bike - with no hard shoulder?) and no 1 is almost NEVER imposed. Even on
motorbikes and scooters little notice is paid to those who opt out of
this particular law......

So it's 'common sense' that you can't take children in trailers, or that
you /must/ wear reflectives after dark?

Sorry, Simon, sent this to your email in error.....

Well , I reckon so. Unless of course you don't value your children's lives -
or your own.

I could quote some of the road death stats - they're posted on signs all
over the motorway bridges - they read like war casualty figures. I wouldn't
dream of having a child of mine on a bike with me, in a trailer or in any
other shape or form on most of the roads around here.

Please cite the stats for children in trailers. They would be useful.

cheers,
Luke

--
Red Rose Ramblings, the diary of an Essex boy in
exile in Lancashire <http://www.shrimper.org.uk>

"Ekul Namsob" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

RobDee said:

"Simon Brooke" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

in message <[email hidden]>, RobDee
([email hidden]'😉
wrote:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

> Well, points 2 to 5 are common sense - believe me you would not WANT
> to
> ride on the roads on which cycling is not allowed (Fancy the M25 on
> your
> bike - with no hard shoulder?) and no 1 is almost NEVER imposed. Even
> on
> motorbikes and scooters little notice is paid to those who opt out of
> this particular law......

So it's 'common sense' that you can't take children in trailers, or
that
you /must/ wear reflectives after dark?

Sorry, Simon, sent this to your email in error.....

Well , I reckon so. Unless of course you don't value your children's
lives -
or your own.

I could quote some of the road death stats - they're posted on signs all
over the motorway bridges - they read like war casualty figures. I
wouldn't
dream of having a child of mine on a bike with me, in a trailer or in any
other shape or form on most of the roads around here.

Please cite the stats for children in trailers. They would be useful.

The stats I mentioned on the motorway bridges are simple figures - "149
killed on the roads this same weekend last year" is one I saw recently.

Stats for kids in bike trailers would be difficult to track down - would
probably be lumped in with the rest of the 900 killed and 567,000
hospitalised from cycling accidents - but probably extremely low due to the
fact that it is not the done thing. I've *never* seen a child in a bike
trailer in 17 years of living in Spain.

This site is from an organisation who seem to think that the figures would
drop dramatically if everyone wore helmets - little use when the majority of
deaths are caused when the riders are hit from behind by motorists at speed.

http://www.cea-online.es/joven/conductor/pie.asp

Rob

Quoted message said:

cheers,
Luke

--
Red Rose Ramblings, the diary of an Essex boy in
exile in Lancashire <http://www.shrimper.org.uk>

RobDee said:

Stats for kids in bike trailers would be difficult to track down - would
probably be lumped in with the rest of the 900 killed and 567,000
hospitalised from cycling accidents - but probably extremely low due to the
fact that it is not the done thing. I've *never* seen a child in a bike
trailer in 17 years of living in Spain.

This site is from an organisation who seem to think that the figures would
drop dramatically if everyone wore helmets - little use when the majority of
deaths are caused when the riders are hit from behind by motorists at speed.

That suggests to me that cycling in Spain is best avoided and not that
cycling with kids is best avoided.

Cheers,
Luke

--
Red Rose Ramblings, the diary of an Essex boy in
exile in Lancashire <http://www.shrimper.org.uk>

in message <[email hidden]>, RobDee ([email hidden]'😉

Quoted message said:

"Ekul Namsob" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

RobDee said:

"Simon Brooke" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...
> in message <[email hidden]>, RobDee
> ([email hidden]'😉
> wrote:

Quoted message said:

>> Well, points 2 to 5 are common sense - believe me you would not WANT
>> to
>> ride on the roads on which cycling is not allowed (Fancy the M25 on
>> your
>> bike - with no hard shoulder?) and no 1 is almost NEVER imposed.
>> Even on
>> motorbikes and scooters little notice is paid to those who opt out
>> of this particular law......
>
> So it's 'common sense' that you can't take children in trailers, or
> that
> you /must/ wear reflectives after dark?

Sorry, Simon, sent this to your email in error.....

Well , I reckon so. Unless of course you don't value your children's
lives -
or your own.

I could quote some of the road death stats - they're posted on signs
all over the motorway bridges - they read like war casualty figures. I
wouldn't
dream of having a child of mine on a bike with me, in a trailer or in
any other shape or form on most of the roads around here.

Please cite the stats for children in trailers. They would be useful.

The stats I mentioned on the motorway bridges are simple figures - "149
killed on the roads this same weekend last year" is one I saw recently.

How many of those were pedestrians? How many were motorcyclists? How many
were in motor cars?

The raw number tells you precisely nothing about how safe a child in a
trailer on that road would be.

--
[email hidden] (Simon Brooke) http://www.jasmine.org.uk/~simon/

Morning had broken, and we had run out of gas for the welding torch.

RobDee said:

Quoted message said:

Common sense is frequently wrong, hence the Monty Hall problem.

Monty Hall?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Monty_hall_problem

"Simon Brooke" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

in message <[email hidden]>, RobDee ([email hidden]'😉

Quoted message said:

"Ekul Namsob" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

RobDee <[email hidden]> wrote:

> "Simon Brooke" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
> news:[email hidden]...
> > in message <[email hidden]>, RobDee
> > ([email hidden]'😉
> > wrote:

> >> Well, points 2 to 5 are common sense - believe me you would not WANT
> >> to
> >> ride on the roads on which cycling is not allowed (Fancy the M25 on
> >> your
> >> bike - with no hard shoulder?) and no 1 is almost NEVER imposed.
> >> Even on
> >> motorbikes and scooters little notice is paid to those who opt out
> >> of this particular law......
> >
> > So it's 'common sense' that you can't take children in trailers, or
> > that
> > you /must/ wear reflectives after dark?
>
> Sorry, Simon, sent this to your email in error.....
>
> Well , I reckon so. Unless of course you don't value your children's
> lives -
> or your own.
>
> I could quote some of the road death stats - they're posted on signs
> all over the motorway bridges - they read like war casualty figures. I
> wouldn't
> dream of having a child of mine on a bike with me, in a trailer or in
> any other shape or form on most of the roads around here.

Please cite the stats for children in trailers. They would be useful.

The stats I mentioned on the motorway bridges are simple figures - "149
killed on the roads this same weekend last year" is one I saw recently.

How many of those were pedestrians? How many were motorcyclists? How many
were in motor cars?

The raw number tells you precisely nothing about how safe a child in a
trailer on that road would be.

--
[email hidden] (Simon Brooke) http://www.jasmine.org.uk/~simon/

Morning had broken, and we had run out of gas for the welding
torch.

If you are interested in European statistics, have a look here:
http://www.ecf.com/376_1
published by the ECF ( European Cyclists Federation)
All sorts of info here.

Especially this PDF Article: Cycling, safety and health By Thomas Krag.

Fred