Cycle Shoes

Velvet said:

Peter Clinch said:

But if you've got SPuD compatible shoes and you want to
go any sort of distance you might as well put the
relevant pedals on IMHO. Pete.

Unless you don't fancy the inevitable falling over during
the learning process...

I've not yet fallen over and I'm well beyond what might be
termed the learning process. I've had spds for 2 years now,
except on the Brommie.

Colin

Simonb said:

Velvet said:

I'm riding in shimano m037w's with fair amounts of tread
(though no grip in the wet it transpires) without any
retaining mechs, yes.

I was thinking of a cycle shoe without tread.

Ah, well there you go :-) Mine have tread on them (meaning
they're fine for walking on stuff, so long as it's dry). I
deliberately chose ones with tread on so I *could* walk off
the bike in them, though I do realise having the cleats in
the bottom will make it a little harder to do, hopefully not
as impossible as some of the smoother-soled ones would be.

--

Velvet

In article <[email hidden]>,

Velvet said:

Unless you don't fancy the inevitable falling over during
the learning process...

I didn't fall off. Getting used to SPD took a morning. I've
not used anything else for the past nine months.

ian

Velvet said:

Unless you don't fancy the inevitable falling over during
the learning process...

You've told yourself it will happen, though that is not
necessarily the case. For example, I never keeled over while
getting used to them (I've gone over a few times /since/,
mainly on the MTB, once in the middle of trying to ford the
South Esk...), though I never got hurt, my first pair were
donated to my cycling flatmate who never keeled over in
them, and Roos learned to use them on Real Roads while also
learning to ride a 'bent /and/ using my SPuD sandals which
were size too big, and she didn't keel over during the
process (or since, I think).

It is not inevitable you will fall over, and the only way to
get used to them is by using them on a real bike on real
roads. So stop imagining obstacles for yourself, and start
using your SPuDs! Otherwise you will never "graduate" to
them, because you've set circular reasoning in place not to
(start using them when experienced, not experienced yet so
don't use them, don't use them so no experience, so don't
start using them yet, etc. etc.). All it takes is a can-do
attitude and getting on with it, and those hills will be
easier too.

Pete.
--
Peter Clinch University of Dundee Tel 44 1382 660111 ext.
33637 Medical Physics, Ninewells Hospital Fax 44 1382 640177
Dundee DD1 9SY Scotland UK net [email hidden]
dundee.ac.uk~pjclinchOpen ↗

"Colin Blackburn" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
"]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Velvet said:

Peter Clinch said:

But if you've got SPuD compatible shoes and you want
to go any sort of distance you might as well put the
relevant pedals on IMHO. Pete.

Unless you don't fancy the inevitable falling over
during the learning process...

I've not yet fallen over and I'm well beyond what might be
termed the learning process. I've had spds for 2 years
now, except on the Brommie.

I have 8 years on SPDs (they are on all my bikes) and I
haven't actually decked it yet. Well, not that i could blame
it on the SPDs.

I have had some *very* near misses. The occupants of the car
I was in front of at the lights when I keeled over to about
45 degrees before hurriedly getting a leg down are probably
still laughing, and I still wake up screaming when I dream
about the gorse bush incident, but <FX: knocks on wood> they
haven't got me yet.

The secrets are really very few:

A. set the release tension loose to start with,
B. practise for a quarter hour or so while leaning against a
wall or something
C. set your seat to its correct height - some people put the
seat lower so they will not fall so hard, but then your
leg has less strenght on the "panic pull" if you do need
to get out in a hurry.
D. practise the little "I'm coming to a halt, I need to
unclip" mantra for the first few days.[1]

Good luck to all who take the plunge, may you not take
the plunge!

[1] Yes, I made myself really unpopular here by suggesting
that it's a good idea to use some mental ability on
being aware of what's going on with your bike. (Velvet
started that thread too :-) But it still helps.
--
Mark South Citizen of the World, Denizen of the Net <<Tiens!
Ce poulet a une grenade!

Peter Clinch said:

Velvet said:

Unless you don't fancy the inevitable falling over during
the learning process...

You've told yourself it will happen, though that is not
necessarily the case. For example, I never keeled over
while getting used to them (I've gone over a few times
/since/, mainly on the MTB, once in the middle of trying
to ford the South Esk...), though I never got hurt, my
first pair were donated to my cycling flatmate who never
keeled over in them, and Roos learned to use them on Real
Roads while also learning to ride a 'bent /and/ using my
SPuD sandals which were size too big, and she didn't keel
over during the process (or since, I think).

It is not inevitable you will fall over, and the only way
to get used to them is by using them on a real bike on
real roads. So stop imagining obstacles for yourself, and
start using your SPuDs! Otherwise you will never
"graduate" to them, because you've set circular reasoning
in place not to (start using them when experienced, not
experienced yet so don't use them, don't use them so no
experience, so don't start using them yet, etc. etc.). All
it takes is a can-do attitude and getting on with it, and
those hills will be easier too.

Pete.

I'll use them when I'm ready for them, ta :-) I *want* to,
but I don't want to set myself more hurdles than I can
jump over.

I can see no good reason why I should add spd's into the
equation of cycling in traffic when I'm still not able
to signal in traffic. Signalling, to me, is something I
need to get under my belt before I start having to think
about unclipping, and I can do without being nervous
about unclipping/falling off whilst in traffic while I
master that :-)

--

Velvet

Velvet said:

I can see no good reason why I should add spd's into the
equation of cycling in traffic when I'm still not able to
signal in traffic. Signalling, to me, is something I need
to get under my belt before I start having to think about
unclipping

This is fair reasoning, though to be brutally honest and to
shift the topic a little I'd say it's a pretty questionable
idea being in traffic /at all/ if you feel you can't signal
safely yet. I'd be inclined to take a day, weekend,
whatever going up and down a quiet, flat road practicing
until you've got it, and not really worry about much else
until you have. It'll be boring, you'll feel daft, but
you'll get a lot safer as a result. There is no substitute
for practice, and a lot is better than a little, even if it
means you miss a few 50 mile tours just to go round in
circles in residential streets.

Pete (who spent lots of time doing the rounds of the
neighbourhood on recumbent and unicycle making a fool of
himself to get up to speed).
--
Peter Clinch University of Dundee Tel 44 1382 660111 ext.
33637 Medical Physics, Ninewells Hospital Fax 44 1382 640177
Dundee DD1 9SY Scotland UK net [email hidden]
dundee.ac.uk~pjclinchOpen ↗

Peter Clinch said:

This is fair reasoning, though to be brutally honest and
to shift the topic a little I'd say it's a pretty
questionable idea being in traffic /at all/ if you feel
you can't signal safely yet. I'd be inclined to take a
day, weekend, whatever going up and down a quiet, flat
road practicing until you've got it, and not really worry
about much else until you have. It'll be boring, you'll
feel daft, but you'll get a lot safer as a result. There
is no substitute for practice, and a lot is better than a
little, even if it means you miss a few 50 mile tours just
to go round in circles in residential streets.

Pete (who spent lots of time doing the rounds of the
neighbourhood on recumbent and unicycle making a fool of
himself to get up to speed).

True - but round here roads aren't quiet, or flat. I'm
getting closer to being able to manage it (little steps at a
time), and I rarely tangle with traffic if I'm on my own to
any degree - or if I do, then I either try and get my
intentions over by clearly looking where I'm going and
positioning myself in the road as if I were a car in terms
of lane-hogging, or if it's the sort of junction that's not
feasible or I don't feel the traffic permits me, I'll just
get off, walk across, get back on. I'm well prepared for the
car not realising what I'm up to, but have to say most of
them have either waited for me to make my move simply
*because* they're not sure what I'm doing, or the situation
has by then changed (I've slowed down, lights have changed,
whatever) and it's then a case that I'm making that move
without requiring what traffic might be around to actually
alter what they're doing to accommodate me.

A lot of the time I spend in traffic is with t'other half,
an accomplished cyclist of quite a few years experience, so
have become adept at hanging onto his back wheel and he does
the signalling for the both of us - I try not to let the gap
get great enough that other vehicles will start to think
we're not going the same way, but if it happens, then I'll
revert to my method of finding a way to do it where I don't
have to rely on cars getting out of my way (to his
frustration some times, since it means he waits for me to
catch back up!)

Then again, he did demonstrate that even cyclists used to
spds fall off with them the other weekend... ;-) So it's
not just you lot scaremongering about them that puts me
off trying them at this point in my learning-how-to-cycle-
again curve :-)

--

Velvet

Simon Brooke said:

in message <[email hidden]>, Mark South

(') said:

A. set the release tension loose to start with,
B. practise for a quarter hour or so while leaning against
a wall or something
C. set your seat to its correct height - some people put
the seat lower so they will not fall so hard, but then
your leg has less strenght on the "panic pull" if you
do need to get out in a hurry.
D. practise the little "I'm coming to a halt, I need to
unclip" mantra for the first few days.[1]

E. MAKE SURE THE BOLTS IN YOUR SHOES ARE REALLY TIGHT!

If the bolts come loose and the cleat starts slipping
about there's /no/ /way/ you can unclip.

How do I know this? I recently got a pair of new shoes and
put the cleats on losely 'while I find the right position
for them'. Mistake!

Yeah, I did that too. I'm now an expert at removing
cleats (without shoes) from spds pedals. Brute force took
care of removing the shoes from the cleats... luckily the
shoes survived.

Also luckily, this was all with the bike firmly on the
turbo!!

--

Velvet

In "]news:[email hidden],
Velvet <[email hidden]> typed:

Quoted message said:

Yeah, I did that too. I'm now an expert at removing cleats
(without shoes) from spds pedals. Brute force took care of
removing the shoes from the cleats... luckily the shoes
survived.

Also luckily, this was all with the bike firmly on
the turbo!!

I found it was OK to do get them off once you'd removed your
feet, as you could now twist the shoes enough to unclip
them. Of course, the truly flexible could turn their legs
more than 90 degrees and not need to take their shoes off.

A

Ambrose Nankivell said:

In "]news:[email hidden],
Velvet <[email hidden]> typed:

Quoted message said:

Yeah, I did that too. I'm now an expert at removing cleats
(without shoes) from spds pedals. Brute force took care of
removing the shoes from the cleats... luckily the shoes
survived.

Also luckily, this was all with the bike firmly on
the turbo!!

I found it was OK to do get them off once you'd removed
your feet, as you could now twist the shoes enough to
unclip them. Of course, the truly flexible could turn
their legs more than 90 degrees and not need to take their
shoes off.

A

Mine wouldn't unclip even with my feet out of the shoes -
they (despite having been loosed off on the pedals) were
incredibly stiff. The cleats were turning in the shoes
along those two slots, rather than the cleat twisting out
of the pedal.

I probably burned more calories in the hour it took to
finally free all the bits (from *both* sides) than I would
have being on the bike and actually cycling.

--

Velvet

"Simonb" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
"]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Velvet said:

Unless you don't fancy the inevitable falling over
during the learning process...

I have never fallen as a result of using clipless pedals,
falling is not inevitable.

Seconded. Paul.

"Simon Brooke" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
"]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

in message <[email hidden]>, Mark South

(') said:

A. set the release tension loose to start with,
B. practise for a quarter hour or so while leaning
against a wall or something
C. set your seat to its correct height - some people put
the seat lower so they will not fall so hard, but
then your leg has less strenght on the "panic pull"
if you do need to get out in a hurry.
D. practise the little "I'm coming to a halt, I need to
unclip" mantra for the first few days.[1]

E. MAKE SURE THE BOLTS IN YOUR SHOES ARE REALLY TIGHT!

Actually, I typed that one in and then deleted it on the
gorunds that it was too obvious....

Quoted message said:

If the bolts come loose and the cleat starts slipping
about there's /no/ /way/ you can unclip.

How do I know this? I recently got a pair of new shoes and
put the cleats on losely 'while I find the right position
for them'. Mistake!

LOL!

I also thought that I might have added

F. If you want to get out more easily, use a pair of
old cleats that are nicely worn in. They have more
float too.
--
Mark South Citizen of the World, Denizen of the Net <<Tiens!
Ce poulet a une grenade!

Velvet [email hidden] opined the following...

Quoted message said:

Unless you don't fancy the inevitable falling over during
the learning process...

Falling over does not come as part of the learning process.
You will be happily clipping in and out for weeks before
coming to an embarrassing halt at a junction.

Jon

Jon Senior said:

Falling over does not come as part of the learning
process. You will be happily clipping in and out for weeks
before coming to an embarrassing halt at a junction.

Jon

Yebbut I don't fancy that either ;-)

--

Velvet

Velvet said:

Jon Senior said:

Falling over does not come as part of the learning
process. You will be happily clipping in and out for
weeks before coming to an embarrassing halt at a
junction.

Jon

Yebbut I don't fancy that either ;-)

But it gives so much enjoyment to the assembled crowds [1]
Spoilsport ;-)

[1] Rule 452 says you will only fall off when people
are looking.

John B

Velvet said:

Quoted message said:

Velvet said:

Unless you don't fancy the inevitable falling over
during the learning process...

Quoted message said:

I'll use them when I'm ready for them, ta :-) I *want* to,
but I don't want to set myself more hurdles than I can
jump over.

Yes, and in the meantime you're suggesting to other people
that clipless pedals are a bigger problem than they really
are (for most people). There's nothing inevitable about it.

--
Michael MacClancy Random putdown - "He had delusions of
adequacy." - Walter Kerr www.macclancy.demon.co.uk
www.macclancy.co.uk

Velvet [email hidden] opined the following...

Quoted message said:

Yebbut I don't fancy that either ;-)

In around 7 years of riding clipless, I've only done it
twice. The only other time I nearly came off was when taking
a bike out for a test ride. My co-rider was just getting
used to clipless when he discovered that 1 of the 4 tension
adjusters had been left at "normal". He nearly wiped me out
while desperately trying to unclip.

While I couldn't really recommend falling off it is such a
rarity that it's not worth worrying about. I'm sure that
this wont convince you anymore than all the others have
but really...

You use them on a turbo trainer? Loose bolts aside, how
often are you unable to unclip?

Jon

JohnB said:

Velvet said:

Jon Senior said:

Falling over does not come as part of the learning
process. You will be happily clipping in and out for
weeks before coming to an embarrassing halt at a
junction.

Jon

Yebbut I don't fancy that either ;-)

But it gives so much enjoyment to the assembled crowds [1]
Spoilsport ;-)

[1] Rule 452 says you will only fall off when people are
looking.

John B

But no one sees cyclists so it won't happen. ;-)
--
Michael MacClancy Random putdown - "I've just learned about
his illness. Let's hope it's nothing trivial." - Irvin S.
Cobb www.macclancy.demon.co.uk www.macclancy.co.uk

Ian G Batten said:

In article <Kzqoc.1555$Cj7.12001470@news-
text.cableinet.net>, Velvet

Quoted message said:

Unless you don't fancy the inevitable falling over during
the learning process...

I didn't fall off. Getting used to SPD took a morning.
I've not used anything else for the past nine months.

I fell off twice in the early process of getting used to
them, the fell off the other day after not having fallen off
for 6 years.

I think on balance, and given that most people I know reckon
they've fallen off when getting used to 'em, assuming you'll
have a couple of mishaps when getting used is far more
likely to be accurate than assuming it will all go
swimmingly.