CX/Commuter questions

Chris said:

I've been thinking about building a CX bike that'd mostly see commuting duty (5 days a week, less
than 10 miles, to and on campus). I am planning on a Surly CrossCheck frame, but since I'm a MTB
guy, I have a few roadie-related questions:

1 - Shifters...I know not all Campy stuff works with Shimano, and vice versa. I prefer Campy
levers (feel and name) but can get Shimano a bit cheaper

Really? Can you find a new Ultrgra nine lever set with cables for $148, an average Campagnolo Ergo
prioe? Shimano is usually higher by a lot.

If dollars count, maybe look at a complete bike such as Redline's Conquest at $895 and swap parts
with your dealer. Can be cheaper than building from scratch
--
Andrew Muzi www.yellowjersey.org Open every day since 1 April, 1971

"Chris" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
"]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

I've been thinking about building a CX bike that'd mostly see commuting

duty

Quoted message said:

(5 days a week, less than 10 miles, to and on campus). I am planning on a Surly CrossCheck frame,
but since I'm a MTB guy, I have a few

roadie-related

Quoted message said:

questions:

1 - Shifters...I know not all Campy stuff works with Shimano, and vice versa. I prefer Campy
levers (feel and name) but can get Shimano a bit cheaper, and am planning on running an XT
rear mech I already have. Which Campy levers, if any, will pose a problem with Shimano
drivetrain parts?

I

Quoted message said:

have a bunch of Shimano stuff around (ders, cassettes), and would like to use all that, but would
also like some Campy shifters.

Campy shifters means you have to run Campy rear derailleurs. (Now there's

Quoted message said:

2 - Is there any reliable way to run v-brakes (Avid Single Digit series,

or

Quoted message said:

Ultimates) with a "brifter"? I'd much rather have Avid V's on the bike

than

Quoted message said:

some roadie-scum stuff 🙂

Travel agents. Having said that, cantilevers are better for your application. Less on/off, more
modulation.

Quoted message said:

3 - Wheelsets. I gather Open Pros are a good rim that can take

abuse...know

Quoted message said:

anything cheaper? I'm 5'11", with my bag for school I'm probably just

under

Quoted message said:

200 (180-185 naked). I'm looking for a rim that can take a couple of

curbs,

Quoted message said:

the occasional accidental pothole, hopefully some CX races, etc. It's

going

Quoted message said:

to get rode rough. As far as hubs, I'm more comfortable with mountain stuff, and am working under
the assumption that they can take more abuse than roadie stuff. Is this unfounded? I'm looking for

toughness/longevity

Quoted message said:

here in rough, bad weather conditions. Should I go LX, XT, Ultegra, something else? Cheap is good,
but how are the LX seals in water? If you guys were building a wheelset (sub $150 preferred) for
commuting/CX, how would you do it? Remember spacing is not an issue, Surly bikes fit road

and

Quoted message said:

mtn.

OPs are good, as are Velocity Aeroheads. Hubs are hubs. Take care of them and they'll all last.

Quoted message said:

4 - What are the chainring size limits to an '02 LX front mech? I have

one

Quoted message said:

extra, and would rather use it than, again, roadie scum parts, but will probably have a big roadie
ring on the bike.

Problem with your characterizations is that you're about to be a roadie after all, roadies INVENTED
cross! Better learn to like it! I'm running a 50t ring in the front with an XTR, before that I had
LX. Most of the time, guys run 38/48 up front. I've seen 34/44 and 34/46 too.

Quoted message said:

All (actual) advice is good, and appreciated. If you want to respond, you have my thanks. If you
want to respond just to tell me not to get some heavy steel frame, not to go
Shimano/Campy/whatever, etc., well, stuff it.

Remember cheap is good, I'm just a college puke (who will probably sell

his

Quoted message said:

Fisher X-Caliber to finance this ride).

Go Terps.

Chris

You can make a passable cross bike out of a mtn bike if you really want to. Skinny tires and a rigid
fork will get you most of the way. A real short stem and road bars/shifters gets you the rest.

If you're running this as a winter/beater bike you may also want to think about bar-end shifters.
Much less likely to freeze solid in the middle of winter while riding in the snow/mud/ice at Gambril
State Park.

Mike

"A Muzi" <[email hidden]> wrote in message "]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Chris said:

I've been thinking about building a CX bike that'd mostly see commuting

duty

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

(5 days a week, less than 10 miles, to and on campus). I am planning on

a

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Surly CrossCheck frame, but since I'm a MTB guy, I have a few

roadie-related

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

questions:

1 - Shifters...I know not all Campy stuff works with Shimano, and vice versa. I prefer Campy
levers (feel and name) but can get Shimano a bit cheaper

Really? Can you find a new Ultrgra nine lever set with cables for $148, an average Campagnolo Ergo
prioe? Shimano is usually higher by a lot.

I see Ultegra nines on the web for around 150-160, but I'd be getting them from my LBS...which would
give me a few bucks off. FTR, I used "cheaper" in the sense that I get Shimano stuff below average
cost, not in relation to Campy.

Quoted message said:

If dollars count, maybe look at a complete bike such as Redline's Conquest at $895 and swap parts
with your dealer. Can be cheaper than building from scratch
--

I understand that rationale, and usually recommend it to new mtb buyers, but I want control over
individual components, already have a bunch of spare parts, and really want a Surly CrossCheck (and
don't like the way they spec the complete bike).

Chris

If you get 10sp. camp. shifters, with a slight cable clamp trick, 9sp shim. shifting will result
with your shim. RD. The trick involves bypassing the normal clamp region and clamping at 90 deg.
This has the effect of shortening the throw of each click. My use of this cabling goes back to
8sp. days.

--
Bruni Bicycles "Where art meets science" brunibicycles.com
410.426.3420 Mike S. <mikeshaw2@coxDOTnet> wrote in message news:yNhwb.6934$9O5.3336@fed1read06...

Quoted message said:

"Chris" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
"]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

I've been thinking about building a CX bike that'd mostly see commuting

duty

Quoted message said:

(5 days a week, less than 10 miles, to and on campus). I am planning on

a

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Surly CrossCheck frame, but since I'm a MTB guy, I have a few

roadie-related

Quoted message said:

questions:

1 - Shifters...I know not all Campy stuff works with Shimano, and vice versa. I prefer Campy
levers (feel and name) but can get Shimano a bit cheaper, and am planning on running an XT rear
mech I already have.

Which

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Campy levers, if any, will pose a problem with Shimano drivetrain parts?

I

Quoted message said:

have a bunch of Shimano stuff around (ders, cassettes), and would like

to

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

use all that, but would also like some Campy shifters.

Campy shifters means you have to run Campy rear derailleurs. (Now

there's

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

2 - Is there any reliable way to run v-brakes (Avid Single Digit series,

or

Quoted message said:

Ultimates) with a "brifter"? I'd much rather have Avid V's on the bike

than

Quoted message said:

some roadie-scum stuff 🙂

Travel agents. Having said that, cantilevers are better for your application. Less on/off, more
modulation.

Quoted message said:

3 - Wheelsets. I gather Open Pros are a good rim that can take

abuse...know

Quoted message said:

anything cheaper? I'm 5'11", with my bag for school I'm probably just

under

Quoted message said:

200 (180-185 naked). I'm looking for a rim that can take a couple of

curbs,

Quoted message said:

the occasional accidental pothole, hopefully some CX races, etc. It's

going

Quoted message said:

to get rode rough. As far as hubs, I'm more comfortable with mountain stuff, and am working
under the assumption that they can take more abuse than roadie stuff. Is this unfounded? I'm
looking for

toughness/longevity

Quoted message said:

here in rough, bad weather conditions. Should I go LX, XT, Ultegra, something else? Cheap is
good, but how are the LX seals in water? If

you

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

guys were building a wheelset (sub $150 preferred) for commuting/CX, how would you do it?
Remember spacing is not an issue, Surly bikes fit road

and

Quoted message said:

mtn.

OPs are good, as are Velocity Aeroheads. Hubs are hubs. Take care of

them

Quoted message said:

and they'll all last.

Quoted message said:

4 - What are the chainring size limits to an '02 LX front mech? I have

one

Quoted message said:

extra, and would rather use it than, again, roadie scum parts, but will probably have a big
roadie ring on the bike.

Problem with your characterizations is that you're about to be a roadie after all, roadies
INVENTED cross! Better learn to like it! I'm running a 50t ring in the front with an XTR, before
that I had LX.

Most

Quoted message said:

of the time, guys run 38/48 up front. I've seen 34/44 and 34/46 too.

Quoted message said:

All (actual) advice is good, and appreciated. If you want to respond,

you

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

have my thanks. If you want to respond just to tell me not to get some heavy steel frame, not to
go Shimano/Campy/whatever, etc., well, stuff

it.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Remember cheap is good, I'm just a college puke (who will probably sell

his

Quoted message said:

Fisher X-Caliber to finance this ride).

Go Terps.

Chris

You can make a passable cross bike out of a mtn bike if you really want

to.

Quoted message said:

Skinny tires and a rigid fork will get you most of the way. A real short stem and road
bars/shifters gets you the rest.

If you're running this as a winter/beater bike you may also want to think about bar-end shifters.
Much less likely to freeze solid in the middle of winter while riding in the snow/mud/ice at
Gambril State Park.

Mike

"Bruni" <[email hidden]> wrote in message "]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

If you get 10sp. camp. shifters, with a slight cable clamp trick, 9sp

shim.

Quoted message said:

shifting will result with your shim. RD. The trick involves bypassing the normal clamp region and
clamping at 90

deg.

Quoted message said:

This has the effect of shortening the throw of each click. My use of this cabling goes back to
8sp. days.

See what did I tell ya!

Mike

Quoted message said:

--
Bruni Bicycles "Where art meets science" brunibicycles.com
410.426.3420 Mike S. <mikeshaw2@coxDOTnet> wrote in message news:yNhwb.6934$9O5.3336@fed1read06...

Quoted message said:

"Chris" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
"]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

I've been thinking about building a CX bike that'd mostly see

commuting

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

duty

Quoted message said:

(5 days a week, less than 10 miles, to and on campus). I am planning

on

Quoted message said:

a

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Surly CrossCheck frame, but since I'm a MTB guy, I have a few

roadie-related

Quoted message said:

questions:

1 - Shifters...I know not all Campy stuff works with Shimano, and vice versa. I prefer Campy
levers (feel and name) but can get Shimano a

bit

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

cheaper, and am planning on running an XT rear mech I already have.

Which

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Campy levers, if any, will pose a problem with Shimano drivetrain

parts?

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

I

Quoted message said:

have a bunch of Shimano stuff around (ders, cassettes), and would like

to

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

use all that, but would also like some Campy shifters.

Campy shifters means you have to run Campy rear derailleurs. (Now

there's

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

2 - Is there any reliable way to run v-brakes (Avid Single Digit

series,

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

or

Quoted message said:

Ultimates) with a "brifter"? I'd much rather have Avid V's on the

bike

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

than

Quoted message said:

some roadie-scum stuff 🙂

Travel agents. Having said that, cantilevers are better for your application. Less on/off, more
modulation.

Quoted message said:

3 - Wheelsets. I gather Open Pros are a good rim that can take

abuse...know

Quoted message said:

anything cheaper? I'm 5'11", with my bag for school I'm probably just

under

Quoted message said:

200 (180-185 naked). I'm looking for a rim that can take a couple of

curbs,

Quoted message said:

the occasional accidental pothole, hopefully some CX races, etc. It's

going

Quoted message said:

to get rode rough. As far as hubs, I'm more comfortable with mountain stuff, and am working
under the assumption that they can take more

abuse

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

than roadie stuff. Is this unfounded? I'm looking for

toughness/longevity

Quoted message said:

here in rough, bad weather conditions. Should I go LX, XT, Ultegra, something else? Cheap is
good, but how are the LX seals in water? If

you

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

guys were building a wheelset (sub $150 preferred) for commuting/CX,

how

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

would you do it? Remember spacing is not an issue, Surly bikes fit

road

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

and

Quoted message said:

mtn.

OPs are good, as are Velocity Aeroheads. Hubs are hubs. Take care of

them

Quoted message said:

and they'll all last.

Quoted message said:

4 - What are the chainring size limits to an '02 LX front mech? I

have

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

one

Quoted message said:

extra, and would rather use it than, again, roadie scum parts, but

will

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

probably have a big roadie ring on the bike.

Problem with your characterizations is that you're about to be a roadie after all, roadies
INVENTED cross! Better learn to like it! I'm running a 50t ring in the front with an XTR, before
that I had LX.

Most

Quoted message said:

of the time, guys run 38/48 up front. I've seen 34/44 and 34/46 too.

Quoted message said:

All (actual) advice is good, and appreciated. If you want to respond,

you

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

have my thanks. If you want to respond just to tell me not to get

some

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

heavy steel frame, not to go Shimano/Campy/whatever, etc., well, stuff

it.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Remember cheap is good, I'm just a college puke (who will probably

sell

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

his

Quoted message said:

Fisher X-Caliber to finance this ride).

Go Terps.

Chris

You can make a passable cross bike out of a mtn bike if you really want

to.

Quoted message said:

Skinny tires and a rigid fork will get you most of the way. A real

short

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

stem and road bars/shifters gets you the rest.

If you're running this as a winter/beater bike you may also want to

think

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

about bar-end shifters. Much less likely to freeze solid in the middle

of

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

winter while riding in the snow/mud/ice at Gambril State Park.

Mike

On Mon, 24 Nov 2003 02:20:07 GMT, Chris =

Quoted message said:

I've been thinking about building a CX bike that'd mostly see commutin=

g =

Quoted message said:

duty (5 days a week, less than 10 miles, to and on campus). I am planning =

on =

Quoted message said:

a Surly CrossCheck frame, but since I'm a MTB guy, I have a few =

Quoted message said:

roadie-related questions:

I have a CrossCheck that is mostly used for commuting. It has the Surly=
=

component spec and a few modifications. The brakes, the saddle, and the=
=

cable adjusters (or lack thereof) are the parts that I like the least. =

The wheels were apparently built poorly or the spokes were junk. 4 of t= he =

32 spokes in the rear wheel broke within one year (maybe 2000 miles on =

that bike, head popped off each spoke). If designing a bike for =

commuting, I would not pick 9-speed. The shifting seems to be constantl= y =

in need of tweaking. Then again, I ride it in all conditions, and =

sometimes it doesn't get maintained for a while after fairly harsh rides=
. =

But in my opinion, that's part of commuting.

Quoted message said:

1 - Shifters...

Might I suggest the Shimano bar-end shifters? Allows you to switch =

between various wheel types (I use 8 and 9 speed), and allows friction =

mode for those times when the snow/ice/rain/grit takes its toll on the =

drivetrain.

Quoted message said:

2 - Is there any reliable way to run v-brakes (Avid Single Digit serie=

s, =

Quoted message said:

or Ultimates) with a "brifter"?

I've used the travel agent things with success in the past. If I had a =

choice, I'd use the bar-end shifters and the brake levers designed for =

v-brakes. But one advantage of the travel agent is the built-in cable =

adjuster that newer models have.

Quoted message said:

3 - Wheelsets.

I think you can get away with any reasonable hub/spoke/rim combo if it's=
=

well-built. My complete CrossCheck came with Alex DV15 rims and LX hubs= , =

which is a decent combo in my opinion. The build and/or the spokes were=
=

junk, but the other stuff is working just fine. But I must admit that m= y =

rear rim is a little tough to build around because it really wants to ha= ve =

a flat spot, and I *hate* flat spots.

As you mentioned, the frame has 132.5 mm dropouts. I find it a minor pa= in =

in the butt to mount an MTB hub in there. I switch wheels frequently (o= ne =

set w/road hubs and slicks, one set w/MTB hubs and knobbies). I hesitat= e =

to remove a spacer and recenter the MTB wheel because of the foremention= ed =

flat spot in the rim. Flat spot leads to uneven spoke tension (or that =

yucky thump-thump-thump). Uneven spoke tension plus increased dish equa= ls =

a problem waiting to happen. If you get a rim that's round, you shouldn= 't =

have that problem and you should probably remove the spacer(s) and redis=
h.

Quoted message said:

4 - What are the chainring size limits to an '02 LX front mech?

I don't know.

Quoted message said:

Go Terps.

Go Lions.

-- =

Dave dvt at psu dot edu