Customer had a problem with our service

Mike Jacoubowsky said:

Just heard about this one from my wife. We had a customer come in for
a flat tire, which she had someone take care of. He was then telling
her he's had some problems with our shop, specifically that we had
previously recommended his chain be replaced because it was worn. She
explained to him that we recommend replacing chains when worn because
if you let them go on too long, they wear out your cassette.

He replied that wasn't a problem because he doesn't use cassettes
anymore, just CDs. And he was serious. He went on to say that he
planned to ride the same chain until it broke.

(This particular customer is playing with less than a full deck, so
we try to be nice, but it was very difficult to keep from cracking up
in this case)

One cog short of a cluster? :-P

"Mike Jacoubowsky" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Just heard about this one from my wife. We had a customer come in for a
flat tire, which she had someone take care of. He was then telling her
he's had some problems with our shop, specifically that we had previously
recommended his chain be replaced because it was worn. She explained to
him that we recommend replacing chains when worn because if you let them
go on too long, they wear out your cassette.

He replied that wasn't a problem because he doesn't use cassettes anymore,
just CDs. And he was serious. He went on to say that he planned to ride
the same chain until it broke.

(This particular customer is playing with less than a full deck, so we try
to be nice, but it was very difficult to keep from cracking up in this
case)

--Mike-- Chain Reaction Bicycles
www.ChainReactionBicycles.com

At least he won't be RWI (riding while iPod'ing).

Mike Jacoubowsky said:

Just heard about this one from my wife. We had a customer come in
for a flat tire, which she had someone take care of. He was then
telling her he's had some problems with our shop, specifically that
we had previously recommended his chain be replaced because it was
worn. She explained to him that we recommend replacing chains when
worn because if you let them go on too long, they wear out your
cassette.

Quoted message said:

He replied that wasn't a problem because he doesn't use cassettes
anymore, just CDs. And he was serious. He went on to say that he
planned to ride the same chain until it broke.

Quoted message said:

(This particular customer is playing with less than a full deck, so
we try to be nice, but it was very difficult to keep from cracking
up in this case)

I see the same problem here in this forum. When discussing mechanical
items on bicycles, especially with someone like the customer in
question, not using jargon is the best policy. I find using cassette
awkward because whether they are individual sprockets of a cassette is
immaterial. The sprockets wear to a point where they must all be
replaced when the chain is replaced. That's the problem.

The customer may discover his faux pas later and feel embarrassed,
choosing not to come back to this shop where he made these blunders.
Many people revel in assimilating as much bike-jargon as possible to
show they are part of the in group. I notice it while riding, where a
newbie seems to say to himself, now's my chance and shouts "on your
left", as if it made any difference on an empty road.

Jobst Brandt

Mike Jacoubowsky said:

Just heard about this one from my wife. We had a customer come in for a flat
tire, which she had someone take care of. He was then telling her he's had
some problems with our shop, specifically that we had previously recommended
his chain be replaced because it was worn. She explained to him that we
recommend replacing chains when worn because if you let them go on too long,
they wear out your cassette.

He replied that wasn't a problem because he doesn't use cassettes anymore,
just CDs. And he was serious. He went on to say that he planned to ride the
same chain until it broke.

(This particular customer is playing with less than a full deck, so we try
to be nice, but it was very difficult to keep from cracking up in this case)

--Mike-- Chain Reaction Bicycleswww.ChainReactionBicycles.com

Hanging out at the LBS the other day I think this guy's missing twin
was in to complain. He had purchased a $300 MTB a month earlier, and
complained that it was dangerous and had caused him to crash, ruining
his vacation, and that it didn't shift right. He also claimed he rode
about 1000 km per week as he used his bike for transport for his job
which was to "collect information about compaines that need to be
investigated." His belly seemed to suggest that this 1000km claim was
a bit exagerated. The guy at the store took one look at the bike which
was completly trashed, and just to get rid of the guy, tried to offer
fixing everything for free. The rear hanger was bent among other
things so he figured it would be an easy fix. The guy wasn't
interested. He wanted a list over all the other customers that had
bought the same bike because he was going to bring a class action suit
against the shop on their behalf. And he wanted his money back. He
then stated saying the frame was an amazingly good quality frame, but
the bike was terrible, and he knows about frames. He then started
rummaging through his bag which was overflowing with folders and files
of an illegible nature for at least 20 minutes looking for something.
Then he just left. The kid at the store joked to me that maybe the
should give the boss' cell-phone number to the guy as punishment for
not giving his a raise.

I looked at the bike and my theory is that someone at the group home
where this guy must live probably has the same bike albeit a few years
older, and somehow they got mixed up and this nut didn't notice.

It sure brightened up the day.

Then a guy came in with a grungy wheel with a flat. He wanted a refund
because he had gotten a flat fixed there "only a few weeks ago". He
put the wheel on the counter and the LBS guy looked at it for about 2
seconds and then pointed to a HUGE nail that was sticking into the
tire. "Oh, I didn't see that." the customer said.

I feel for you guys!

Joseph

In article <[email hidden]>,

Mike Jacoubowsky said:

Just heard about this one from my wife. We had a customer come in for a flat
tire, which she had someone take care of. He was then telling her he's had
some problems with our shop, specifically that we had previously recommended
his chain be replaced because it was worn. She explained to him that we
recommend replacing chains when worn because if you let them go on too long,
they wear out your cassette.

He replied that wasn't a problem because he doesn't use cassettes anymore,
just CDs. And he was serious.

Uh, why wouldn't he be? More to the point, why would you assume that
everyone who rides a bike also knows all the mechanical terminology?
While it might be common knowledge to you and most people here that a
(type of) rear cluster is also known as a cassette, we're probably also
more comfortable changing our own flats than this guy clearly was.

Quoted message said:

(This particular customer is playing with less than a full deck, so we try
to be nice, but it was very difficult to keep from cracking up in this case)

So you tend to laugh at people who actually need your services? That is
the oddest customer service I have ever heard of. It is even more
strange that you'd post your poor attitude, seemingly *bragging*, to
Usenet.

--
My personal UDP list: 127.0.0.1, 4ax.com, buzzardnews.com, googlegroups.com,
heapnode.com, localhost, x-privat.org

Dear Mike:
SNIP

Quoted message said:

He replied that wasn't a problem because he doesn't use cassettes anymore,
just CDs. And he was serious. He went on to say that he planned to ride the
same chain until it broke.

SNIP
Ouch. Did you/your staff let the guy know when you or your local
bike advocacy group give basic bike repair lessons? As in, "You put
enough miles on that bike -- what if you get a flat far from a bike
shop?" I've seen Information technology people laugh the same way when
the jargon isn't understood by those not in the know.
By the way, did you see the latest "Bicycling" magazine? The one
with the articles on the best hill climbs around the United States? We
you their sole consultant on California hilly roads? Their picks were
all Old La Honda, Mt. Hamilton, Sierra Road -- it was like reading
your ride diary!
Robert Leone

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

He replied that wasn't a problem because he doesn't use cassettes
anymore,
just CDs. And he was serious.

Uh, why wouldn't he be? More to the point, why would you assume that
everyone who rides a bike also knows all the mechanical terminology?
While it might be common knowledge to you and most people here that a
(type of) rear cluster is also known as a cassette, we're probably also
more comfortable changing our own flats than this guy clearly was.

Now, think about what you just wrote for a second. Why would the guy think
his CD player would have anything to do with his bicycle chain? If she was
talking about the chain wearing out something---anything---it would have to
be something the chain touches!

You are bending over backward to be contentious. Get a grip, man!

<snip>

Quoted message said:

Many people revel in assimilating as much bike-jargon as possible to
show they are part of the in group. I notice it while riding, where a
newbie seems to say to himself, now's my chance and shouts "on your
left", as if it made any difference on an empty road.

Jobst Brandt

I take your point, but please don't discourage newbies from alerting people
to their presence. Many times, I have been near one while riding and they
tend to---well, let's just say they don't keep a straight line while riding.
If a newbie comes up beside me and yells "on your left", it tells me he is
trying to be conscientious and not bang into anybody.

Pat in TX

Mike, Mike, Mike you've really stepped in it now.
Now everyone knows the dirty little secret of how "Elitist shop owners'" laugh
at their customers behind their backs... shame on you.

What are you a Republican?

Mike Jacoubowsky said:

Just heard about this one from my wife. We had a customer come in for a flat
tire, which she had someone take care of. He was then telling her he's had
some problems with our shop, specifically that we had previously recommended
his chain be replaced because it was worn. She explained to him that we
recommend replacing chains when worn because if you let them go on too long,
they wear out your cassette.

He replied that wasn't a problem because he doesn't use cassettes anymore,
just CDs. And he was serious. He went on to say that he planned to ride the
same chain until it broke.

(This particular customer is playing with less than a full deck, so we try
to be nice, but it was very difficult to keep from cracking up in this case)

--Mike-- Chain Reaction Bicycles
www.ChainReactionBicycles.com

--
Tp,

-------- __o
----- -\<. -------- __o
--- ( )/ ( ) ---- -\<.
-------------------- ( )/ ( )
-----------------------------------------

No Lawsuit Ever Fixed A Moron...

Doc O'Leary said:

So you tend to laugh at people who actually need your services? That is
the oddest customer service I have ever heard of. It is even more
strange that you'd post your poor attitude, seemingly *bragging*, to
Usenet.

I've seen the proverbial Clueless Newbie many a time. During my
planetarium years we sometimes had people ask us if we closed during
cloudy weather. At Bryce Canyon NP we had people ask us (a) who carved
all those sculptures and (b) was the canyon lighted at night. At Grand
Canyon a guy I know tried and failed to convince one tourist (we called
them "dudes," with the old meaning, not the current one) that the canyon
does not fill with snow up to the rim in winter. Give me a little time,
and I'm sure I can think of more like these.
And yes, I'm sure I've asked dumb questions myself in computer shops,
at airline ticket counters, or somewhere.
To the inititated, things like this will always be funny. The only
thing you can do is keep a straight face and answer the newby's question
in terms s/he can understand. But if you don't laugh about it later, you
ain't human.

Bill

__________________________________________________________________
| Only two things are infinite, the universe and human stupidity, |
| and I'm not sure about the former. |
| -Albert Einstein |
------------------------------------------------------------------

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Just heard about this one from my wife. We had a customer come in
for a flat tire, which she had someone take care of. He was then
telling her he's had some problems with our shop, specifically that
we had previously recommended his chain be replaced because it was
worn. She explained to him that we recommend replacing chains when
worn because if you let them go on too long, they wear out your
cassette.

Quoted message said:

He replied that wasn't a problem because he doesn't use cassettes
anymore, just CDs. And he was serious. He went on to say that he
planned to ride the same chain until it broke.

Quoted message said:

(This particular customer is playing with less than a full deck, so
we try to be nice, but it was very difficult to keep from cracking
up in this case)

I see the same problem here in this forum. When discussing mechanical
items on bicycles, especially with someone like the customer in
question, not using jargon is the best policy. I find using cassette
awkward because whether they are individual sprockets of a cassette is
immaterial. The sprockets wear to a point where they must all be
replaced when the chain is replaced. That's the problem.

No Jobst, that's not the problem. The customer honestly thought there was a
connection between his bike and a cassette player. The point of my
illustration, which you seem to want to avoid by pretending it's something
else that you're on a personal crusade about, is that this customer is not
to be taken literally about anything. The mis-communication doesn't occur
because we, as a shop, are using jargon. The mis-communication comes because
we, as a shop, hear a comment and think oh my, what did we do, when the
reality is that this particular customer is not to be taken literally for
just about anything.

Quoted message said:

The customer may discover his faux pas later and feel embarrassed,
choosing not to come back to this shop where he made these blunders.
Many people revel in assimilating as much bike-jargon as possible to
show they are part of the in group. I notice it while riding, where a
newbie seems to say to himself, now's my chance and shouts "on your
left", as if it made any difference on an empty road.

Just as someone in a newsgroup might feel when an experienced old hand comes
down on them with sarcastic remarks that could have been couched more
politely. One wonders if the desire of the experienced old hand is not to
help the person understand the err of his or her ways, but rather to rid
them from the newsgroup through such embarrassment. For good or bad, it
seems to be a tactic that rarely works in a newsgroup.

--Mike-- Chain Reaction Bicycles
www.ChainReactionBicycles.com

"Mike Jacoubowsky" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Just heard about this one from my wife. We had a customer come in
for a flat tire, which she had someone take care of. He was then
telling her he's had some problems with our shop, specifically that
we had previously recommended his chain be replaced because it was
worn. She explained to him that we recommend replacing chains when
worn because if you let them go on too long, they wear out your
cassette.

Quoted message said:

He replied that wasn't a problem because he doesn't use cassettes
anymore, just CDs. And he was serious. He went on to say that he
planned to ride the same chain until it broke.

Quoted message said:

(This particular customer is playing with less than a full deck, so
we try to be nice, but it was very difficult to keep from cracking
up in this case)

I see the same problem here in this forum. When discussing mechanical
items on bicycles, especially with someone like the customer in
question, not using jargon is the best policy. I find using cassette
awkward because whether they are individual sprockets of a cassette is
immaterial. The sprockets wear to a point where they must all be
replaced when the chain is replaced. That's the problem.

No Jobst, that's not the problem. The customer honestly thought there was
a connection between his bike and a cassette player. The point of my
illustration, which you seem to want to avoid by pretending it's something
else that you're on a personal crusade about, is that this customer is not
to be taken literally about anything. The mis-communication doesn't occur
because we, as a shop, are using jargon. The mis-communication comes
because we, as a shop, hear a comment and think oh my, what did we do,
when the reality is that this particular customer is not to be taken
literally for just about anything.

Quoted message said:

The customer may discover his faux pas later and feel embarrassed,
choosing not to come back to this shop where he made these blunders.
Many people revel in assimilating as much bike-jargon as possible to
show they are part of the in group. I notice it while riding, where a
newbie seems to say to himself, now's my chance and shouts "on your
left", as if it made any difference on an empty road.

Just as someone in a newsgroup might feel when an experienced old hand
comes down on them with sarcastic remarks that could have been couched
more politely. One wonders if the desire of the experienced old hand is
not to help the person understand the err of his or her ways, but rather
to rid them from the newsgroup through such embarrassment. For good or
bad, it seems to be a tactic that rarely works in a newsgroup.

I've been biking a few years now. I'm the type of customer that if my
husband wasn't around I'd bring my bike in to get flats fixed. I spend a
ton of money on bikes, having one for my weekly short mountain climb with
the moms, a tandem for my weekly long mountain climb with my husband, one
with fenders and baskets for shopping and other errands, and an old hybrid I
should get rid of but only use for those too wet for skinny tire days when I
want to go climb hills anyway. My husband and daughter also have bikes,
plural. I do all my bike shopping at local bike shops, and have even been
into your store a few times. I wouldn't have known what a cassette is. I
believe that is the jargon the other posters are alluding to. (And by the
way, lately, as the bike business has slowed, I seldom run into a jargon
spewing sales guy anymore.)

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Just as someone in a newsgroup might feel when an experienced old hand
comes down on them with sarcastic remarks that could have been couched
more politely. One wonders if the desire of the experienced old hand is
not to help the person understand the err of his or her ways, but rather
to rid them from the newsgroup through such embarrassment. For good or
bad, it seems to be a tactic that rarely works in a newsgroup.

I've been biking a few years now. I'm the type of customer that if my
husband wasn't around I'd bring my bike in to get flats fixed. I spend a
ton of money on bikes, having one for my weekly short mountain climb with
the moms, a tandem for my weekly long mountain climb with my husband, one
with fenders and baskets for shopping and other errands, and an old hybrid
I should get rid of but only use for those too wet for skinny tire days
when I want to go climb hills anyway. My husband and daughter also have
bikes, plural. I do all my bike shopping at local bike shops, and have
even been into your store a few times. I wouldn't have known what a
cassette is. I believe that is the jargon the other posters are alluding
to. (And by the way, lately, as the bike business has slowed, I seldom
run into a jargon spewing sales guy anymore.)

Kathy: Had you had even the slightest quizzical look on your face when
somebody said "cassette", any of us in the shop would have deftly switched
gears, so to speak, and explained that we're talking about the cogs in the
rear. There would have been no assumption whatsoever that somebody is a
lesser person because they don't know we call the rear gears a "cassette"
(when that's what they actually are). Most of us probably call them the
"rear cogs" anyway. My wife calls it the "cassette" because she knows that's
what it's called when we sell one, to differentiate it from a freewheel.

But no matter how confused someone might have been over the jargon involved,
that was never the unintentionally funny part. That came from the customer
believing we were talking about something entirely unrelated. As I explained
in a different reply, it would be like you taking your car in for a repair,
and they told you that you needed a new antenna, and your reply was that you
don't use an antenna anymore, you had cable installed years ago.

--Mike-- Chain Reaction Bicycles
www.ChainReactionBicycles.com

Pat said:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

He replied that wasn't a problem because he doesn't use cassettes
anymore,
just CDs. And he was serious.

Uh, why wouldn't he be? More to the point, why would you assume that
everyone who rides a bike also knows all the mechanical terminology?
While it might be common knowledge to you and most people here that a
(type of) rear cluster is also known as a cassette, we're probably also
more comfortable changing our own flats than this guy clearly was.

Now, think about what you just wrote for a second. Why would the guy think
his CD player would have anything to do with his bicycle chain? If she was
talking about the chain wearing out something---anything---it would have to
be something the chain touches!

You are bending over backward to be contentious. Get a grip, man!

Too funny. I only wish there was a video. Laughing mode.
Bill Baka

Quoted message said:

Dear Mike:
SNIP

Quoted message said:

He replied that wasn't a problem because he doesn't use cassettes anymore,
just CDs. And he was serious. He went on to say that he planned to ride the
same chain until it broke.

SNIP
Ouch. Did you/your staff let the guy know when you or your local
bike advocacy group give basic bike repair lessons? As in, "You put
enough miles on that bike -- what if you get a flat far from a bike
shop?" I've seen Information technology people laugh the same way when
the jargon isn't understood by those not in the know.
By the way, did you see the latest "Bicycling" magazine? The one
with the articles on the best hill climbs around the United States? We
you their sole consultant on California hilly roads? Their picks were
all Old La Honda, Mt. Hamilton, Sierra Road -- it was like reading
your ride diary!
Robert Leone

Mt. Hamilton is a real ride if the path taken is the one over Mt. Day.
Climb 2,500' steep way up, then descent about 2,000' of that then climb
the 3,500' to the observatory and enjoy the view. Coming home you have a
2,500' descent and then oops, forgot about the final 2,000' climb to get
back over Mt. Day. It is a hot, hard ride, and you might just get
jealous of the hawk spiraling upwards on a thermal while you sweat your
butt off.
At the end of the day, and about 100 miles later you can feel like you
have done something. I did it twice as a teen and both times it was a
life lesson, like not being as fit as you think you are.
A definite 'yes' on the ride list.
Also anything at all in the area of the Big Basin, Big Bear, La Honda is
like cycling in a dream world where the trees are the rulers of the
land. You can ride in some places and never get hit by the sun, while it
may be in the 90's in San Jose. There are spots that never seem to get
over 65F, and you can actually be shivering while Silicon valley is cooking.
Bill Baka

"Bill Baka" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Dear Mike:
SNIP

Quoted message said:

He replied that wasn't a problem because he doesn't use cassettes
anymore,
just CDs. And he was serious. He went on to say that he planned to ride
the
same chain until it broke.

SNIP
Ouch. Did you/your staff let the guy know when you or your local
bike advocacy group give basic bike repair lessons? As in, "You put
enough miles on that bike -- what if you get a flat far from a bike
shop?" I've seen Information technology people laugh the same way when
the jargon isn't understood by those not in the know.
By the way, did you see the latest "Bicycling" magazine? The one
with the articles on the best hill climbs around the United States? We
you their sole consultant on California hilly roads? Their picks were
all Old La Honda, Mt. Hamilton, Sierra Road -- it was like reading
your ride diary!
Robert Leone

Mt. Hamilton is a real ride if the path taken is the one over Mt. Day.
Climb 2,500' steep way up, then descent about 2,000' of that then climb
the 3,500' to the observatory and enjoy the view. Coming home you have a
2,500' descent and then oops, forgot about the final 2,000' climb to get
back over Mt. Day. It is a hot, hard ride, and you might just get jealous
of the hawk spiraling upwards on a thermal while you sweat your butt off.
At the end of the day, and about 100 miles later you can feel like you
have done something. I did it twice as a teen and both times it was a life
lesson, like not being as fit as you think you are.
A definite 'yes' on the ride list.
Also anything at all in the area of the Big Basin, Big Bear, La Honda is
like cycling in a dream world where the trees are the rulers of the land.
You can ride in some places and never get hit by the sun, while it may be
in the 90's in San Jose. There are spots that never seem to get over 65F,
and you can actually be shivering while Silicon valley is cooking.
Bill Baka

Do you notice less oxygen too in the trees. They are suppose to hold in the
CO2 which they produce during the day making breathing or being in the sun
your choices.

Mike

The guy was talking about his financial situation; he uses
certificates of deposit now, replacement of components is no object.
Therefore, stop trying preventive maintenance and just upsell him all
the time.
Ted

I've been in my local shop when a customer, after spending some great
length of time looking at bikes ended up spending around 5000rmb on a
Giant not because it was more within their price range but because the
more expensive bikes (Trek and Bianchi) were no name brands that
they'd never heard of before and clearly couldn't be anywhere near as
good as something as famous as a Giant. Not to mention the snob
appeal that a famous name brand like Giant has which these would never
have. Can't impress the neighbors with your ability to spend lots of
money if you get something no one has ever heard of.

Or, my newest favorite ... the sign over the fax machine instructing
my coworkers to please refrain from sending faxes until _after_ the
white-out is dry.

-M

nash said:

"Bill Baka" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

[email hidden] wrote:
Mt. Hamilton is a real ride if the path taken is the one over Mt. Day.
Climb 2,500' steep way up, then descent about 2,000' of that then climb
the 3,500' to the observatory and enjoy the view. Coming home you have a

*********************************************************

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

3,500' descent and then oops, forgot about the final 2,000' climb to get

**********Correction******3,500' not 2,500***********BB*******

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

back over Mt. Day. It is a hot, hard ride, and you might just get jealous
of the hawk spiraling upwards on a thermal while you sweat your butt off.
At the end of the day, and about 100 miles later you can feel like you
have done something. I did it twice as a teen and both times it was a life
lesson, like not being as fit as you think you are.
A definite 'yes' on the ride list.
Also anything at all in the area of the Big Basin, Big Bear, La Honda is
like cycling in a dream world where the trees are the rulers of the land.
You can ride in some places and never get hit by the sun, while it may be
in the 90's in San Jose. There are spots that never seem to get over 65F,
and you can actually be shivering while Silicon valley is cooking.
Bill Baka

Do you notice less oxygen too in the trees. They are suppose to hold in the
CO2 which they produce during the day making breathing or being in the sun
your choices.

Do the ride. After you have done that one I may answer you. Very little
in the way of trees on that ride. The CO2 gets taken care of on the
other side of Silicon valley by the Big Basin trees.
One thing that did get me on the Hamilton ride was getting chased by
angry bees while riding UPhill. I got away but nearly died after that
climb with bees on my tail.
Bill Baka