Crampons Update

[email hidden] said...

Quoted message said:

Thanks to Graham and Mike for their advice.

Aha! This'll do, since it's about crampons:

Over the weekend I accompanied my teenage daughter on a field
archery shoot. Lots of lovely squelchy slippery slidey MUD. I
found it very hard keeping my footing in places and fell twice
because having lost balance my feet went from under me and the
rest of me followed. Had the ground been horizontal this might
not have been a problem, but the course took us up and down steep
slopes, some of which had steps cut into them - which, after
several pairs of muddy slippery (oh yes, and there was a river at
the bottom of this particular steep-sided valley) feet had
trodden them, were starting to erode and get even more slippery
etc... anyway. The point of all this waffle is that I decided
that what I really need is spikes, boots for the use of. What
sort of crampons (I don't know anything about 'em) does one use
for slidey mud, as opposed to ice, or isn't there any difference?
I've got Meindl boots; my daughter has really expensive top-class
(ha!) cheapies from Lidl. Any reason you lot know of why spikes
shouldn't be used with cheapy Lidl specials? Keeping upright is
a priority with all the weapons around; walking poles aren't all
that much use because one tends to need one's hands free to carry
equipment around the course, which in this particular case was
here:
http://tinyurl.com/689cf (Llwyncelin Farm)
The muddy bit is in the wooded valley immediately to the north of
the farm buildings.
--
I try to be a good example to my children, but they just see me
as a dire warning.

Quoted message said:

etc... anyway. The point of all this waffle is that I decided
that what I really need is spikes, boots for the use of.

Thinking outside the box for a moment, what about football boots? JJB
Sports normally have some in the £12-15 range.

Fine for sprinting around a muddy field for a couple of hours. Dunno if
they'd be good for what you've got in mind tho - can't take the studs off
to turn 'em into normal shoes as you can with spikey-crampon-type-thingies.

Fran wrote on Mon, 25 Oct 2004 23:23:53 +0100....

Quoted message said:

What
sort of crampons (I don't know anything about 'em) does one use
for slidey mud, as opposed to ice, or isn't there any difference?

Maybe instep crampons would do? Presumably they would be cheaper than
the full 10 or 12 point jobs.

--
Tim Jackson
[email hidden]
(Change '.invalid' to '.co.uk' to reply direct)
Absurd patents: visit http://www.patent.freeserve.co.uk

[email hidden] said...

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

etc... anyway. The point of all this waffle is that I decided
that what I really need is spikes, boots for the use of.

Thinking outside the box for a moment, what about football boots?

I wondered about something like that, but...

Quoted message said:

Fine for sprinting around a muddy field for a couple of hours.

Well that's the thing, you see. Football fields tend to be more
or less horizontal. Over the weekend I was trying to cope with
mud up to 4-6" deep, with attendant heavy rain on Saturday and
steep gradients with not a great deal to hold on to for support.
To be honest it was scary, and after my second fall on
Saturday[1] my nerve was sufficiently shaken that I
actually refused to accompany my daughter[2] for the rest of the
time she was in the wooded valley bit of the course, and rejoined
her when she reached targets in the vaguely horizontal and not at
all slippery field later on.

Quoted message said:

Dunno if
they'd be good for what you've got in mind tho - can't take the studs off
to turn 'em into normal shoes as you can with spikey-crampon-type-thingies.

It's not the taking the studs off that's the problem, because
studs could be worn outdoors regardless of terrain and it's easy
enough to remove boots when going inside if there are 'no studs'
rules. I need waterproof boots (lots of archers wear wellies and
I'm seriously thinking of joining them) with industrial
quantities of GRIP. Can you get wellies with Cleopatra-stylee
spikes on 'em?

[1] The first one was totally painless and had onlookers in
stitches, being as it was a sitty-up contoured slide straight
down from the top of the bank to the stream about 30 feet below.
Wheee! "Dig your heels in", they said. So I did. This had the
effect of pushing the debris ahead of my feet making my route
down the slope much smoother. My second fall was whilst going up
a short slope. I missed my footing and fell back, rolling
slightly. This in itself wouldn't have been too bad had there
not been a small but nonetheless very sharp bit of rock
protruding... I'll get a photo of the resulting bruise on a
website near you in the near future. It dunnarf 'urt.

[2] She's 14. Under governing body regulations for archery she
must be accompanied by a responsible[2a] adult until she's 18.
[2a] But most of the time they have to make do with me.
--
I try to be a good example to my children, but they just see me
as a dire warning.

[email hidden] said...

Quoted message said:

Fran wrote on Mon, 25 Oct 2004 23:23:53 +0100....

Quoted message said:

What
sort of crampons (I don't know anything about 'em) does one use
for slidey mud, as opposed to ice, or isn't there any difference?

Maybe instep crampons would do? Presumably they would be cheaper than
the full 10 or 12 point jobs.

Instep crampons, eh? I shall investigate. Thanks for the
suggestion.
--
I try to be a good example to my children, but they just see me
as a dire warning.

Fran said:

[email hidden] said...

Quoted message said:

Fran wrote on Mon, 25 Oct 2004 23:23:53 +0100....

Quoted message said:

What
sort of crampons (I don't know anything about 'em) does one use
for slidey mud, as opposed to ice, or isn't there any difference?

Maybe instep crampons would do? Presumably they would be cheaper than
the full 10 or 12 point jobs.

Instep crampons, eh? I shall investigate. Thanks for the
suggestion.

http://www.gearshack.co.uk/crampons.htm#qua

Where it says, "4 point crampons, suitable for trekking on uneven
ground: snow, grass, earth........"
--
Phil Cook looking north over the park to the "Westminster Gasworks"

Mark Thompson said:

Thinking outside the box for a moment, what about football boots? JJB
Sports normally have some in the £12-15 range.

Fine for sprinting around a muddy field for a couple of hours. Dunno if
they'd be good for what you've got in mind tho

As anyone who has ever played football on frozen turf will tell you, the
studs only penetrate mud if it's relatively soft. Crampons require
sharp spikes that will give purchase on hard ice.

If you're thinking out of the box this way you'd be better off with
cross country running spikes, which would probably be okay apart from
your toes falling off from the cold...

Pete.
--
Peter Clinch Medical Physics IT Officer
Tel 44 1382 660111 ext. 33637 Univ. of Dundee, Ninewells Hospital
Fax 44 1382 640177 Dundee DD1 9SY Scotland UK
net [email hidden] http://www.dundee.ac.uk/~pjclinch/

I've never used them, but Nokian do an up market welly with detachable
studs: <URL:http://www.rosker.co.uk/nokian/nokian.htm>

--
Giles Chamberlin

Giles Chamberlin <[email hidden]> wrote

Quoted message said:

I've never used them, but Nokian do an up market welly with detachable
studs: <URL:http://www.rosker.co.uk/nokian/nokian.htm>

Why don't they make tyres like that? [1]

After we enjoyed a walk in the snow I had to devise some under-wheel
matting from waterproof pants, and dig the frozen snow away with an
umbrella. A few studs screwed in on the accessible part of the front
wheels would have made life easier.

[1] Guessing that they perhaps do make very expensive ones.
--
Gordon

Giles Chamberlin said:

I've never used them, but Nokian do an up market welly with detachable
studs: <URL:http://www.rosker.co.uk/nokian/nokian.htm>

Didn't that used to be the Nokia * with no terminal N* Trimmi? I
suspect they have been jumped on by the fobile moan makers :-(
--
Phil Cook looking north over the park to the "Westminster Gasworks"

[email hidden] said...

Quoted message said:

I've never used them, but Nokian do an up market welly with detachable
studs: <URL:http://www.rosker.co.uk/nokian/nokian.htm>

Looks promising...
--
I try to be a good example to my children, but they just see me
as a dire warning.

[email hidden] said...

Quoted message said:

If you're thinking out of the box this way you'd be better off with=20
cross country running spikes, which would probably be okay apart from=20
your toes falling off from the cold...

I'd already thought of that, because I know how wonderful running
spikes can be; however shoots last for most of the day with short
breaks every now and then for food or hot soup, and footwear
needs to be waterproof and protective because brambles and
nettles tend to be much in evidence as well as the ubiquitous
mud.
--
I try to be a good example to my children, but they just see me
as a dire warning.

[email hidden] said...

Quoted message said:

http://www.gearshack.co.uk/crampons.htm#qua

Where it says, "4 point crampons, suitable for trekking on uneven
ground: snow, grass, earth........"

Thanks Phil - nice looking price as well as being a nice looking
design! I shall definitely investigate these further!
--
I try to be a good example to my children, but they just see me
as a dire warning.

In article <[email hidden]>, Fran
<[email hidden]> writes

Quoted message said:

[2] She's 14. Under governing body regulations for archery she
must be accompanied by a responsible[2a] adult until she's 18.
[2a] But most of the time they have to make do with me.

He! He! He!.
--
Bill Grey
http://www.billboy.co.uk

In article <[email hidden]>, Phil Cook <u-r-
[email hidden]> writes

Quoted message said:

Giles Chamberlin said:

I've never used them, but Nokian do an up market welly with detachable
studs: <URL:http://www.rosker.co.uk/nokian/nokian.htm>

Didn't that used to be the Nokia * with no terminal N* Trimmi? I
suspect they have been jumped on by the fobile moan makers :-(

CMIIW, but my understanding is that Nokia (electronics) and Nokia
(rubber) used to be a single, Finnish company. Nokia started as a
rubber business (cue jokes from resident wits🙂), especially tyres,
before diversifying with electronics. The rubber interest was
eventually established as a separate company (Nokian) in which Nokia
retained a substantial share.

I had a pair of these green, sawn off wellies when they were known as
Nokia bog trotters. They had the holes in the soles for metal studs,
but the hardware was not available when I bought them nor have I seen
the inserts on offer since. I imagine it would be a bit of a faff
putting them in and removing them as conditions dictate, especially with
our climate. Perhaps ideal for Finland - put them in when it drops
below zero, then remove several months later.

Nonetheless, they were a great piece of kit, especially for winter bog
trots in the Dark Peak, and for soft snow plods. By way of experiment,
I also tried them with crampons, and managed a modest gully in Glen Doll
(Clova) without mishap.

I threw them away after several years good use when rubber fatigue led
to leaks - I really must buy another pair.

--
Russ Clare

[email hidden] said...

Quoted message said:

In article <[email hidden]>, Fran
<[email hidden]> writes

Quoted message said:

[2] She's 14. Under governing body regulations for archery she
must be accompanied by a responsible[2a] adult until she's 18.
[2a] But most of the time they have to make do with me.

He! He! He!.

<G> I thought I'd get it in before anyone else got the chance :-
)
--
I try to be a good example to my children, but they just see me
as a dire warning.

Gordon said:

Why don't they make tyres like that? [1]

After we enjoyed a walk in the snow I had to devise some under-wheel
matting from waterproof pants, and dig the frozen snow away with an
umbrella. A few studs screwed in on the accessible part of the front
wheels would have made life easier.

Quoted message said:

[1] Guessing that they perhaps do make very expensive ones.

Get some snow chains, they're available from Halfords.

As with snow chains, studded tyres (also available for bikes, btw,
though not generally in the UK as there's not enough snow and ice to
justify them) tend to bugger the roads up, as well as do horrors to your
mileage, if used off of the white stuff.

Pete.
--
Peter Clinch Medical Physics IT Officer
Tel 44 1382 660111 ext. 33637 Univ. of Dundee, Ninewells Hospital
Fax 44 1382 640177 Dundee DD1 9SY Scotland UK
net [email hidden] http://www.dundee.ac.uk/~pjclinch/

Peter Clinch <[email hidden]> wrote

Quoted message said:

Gordon said:

Why don't they make tyres like that? [1]

After we enjoyed a walk in the snow I had to devise some under-wheel
matting from waterproof pants, and dig the frozen snow away with an
umbrella. A few studs screwed in on the accessible part of the front
wheels would have made life easier.

Quoted message said:

[1] Guessing that they perhaps do make very expensive ones.

Get some snow chains, they're available from Halfords.

As with snow chains, studded tyres (also available for bikes, btw,
though not generally in the UK as there's not enough snow and ice to
justify them) tend to bugger the roads up, as well as do horrors to your
mileage, if used off of the white stuff.

Pete.

I don't really do enough essential mileage to justify snow chains, but
it's a nasty feeling when your transport becomes immobilised...

My daughter has them in Sunny California, in order to get to Lake Tahoe
in winter, for which they are essential.
--
Gordon

Gordon said:

I don't really do enough essential mileage to justify snow chains, but
it's a nasty feeling when your transport becomes immobilised...

Nor do I, though same argument would apply to studded snow tyres, of course!

Pete.
--
Peter Clinch Medical Physics IT Officer
Tel 44 1382 660111 ext. 33637 Univ. of Dundee, Ninewells Hospital
Fax 44 1382 640177 Dundee DD1 9SY Scotland UK
net [email hidden] http://www.dundee.ac.uk/~pjclinch/