crampon use

aj said:

the lakes forcast tomorrow says frozen paths,would a winter walker even use
crampons on a steep grass bank that is frozen but not covered in snow ?

I hope not. It would be incredibly destructive, tearing the grass and
ground to shreds when it is at its most vulnerable. I can't think of a
grass bank that is so smooth that spikes would be needed. In any case,
are there any routes left in the Lake District that have grass banks on
them? They are all walked-out ruts or paved now, aren't they?

I was up there on Xmas Day and the ground was frozen with some ice on the
paths. Off path, the boggy bits were frosty and crusted over. Underfoot grip
was fine as long as you watched where you put your feet.

"aj" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

the lakes forcast tomorrow says frozen paths,would a winter walker even

use

Quoted message said:

crampons on a steep grass bank that is frozen but not covered in snow ?

"Alan Dicey" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

aj said:

the lakes forcast tomorrow says frozen paths,would a winter walker even
use
crampons on a steep grass bank that is frozen but not covered in snow ?

I hope not. It would be incredibly destructive, tearing the grass and
ground to shreds when it is at its most vulnerable. I can't think of a
grass bank that is so smooth that spikes would be needed. In any case,
are there any routes left in the Lake District that have grass banks on
them? They are all walked-out ruts or paved now, aren't they?

you should try the Helvellyn face above Red Tarn when the snow is sparse.
The scrambling can be quite exciting, with crampons providing much
assistance on the mixed ground.
Mike Mason

Personally, I do everything I can to avoid walking on frozen steep grass
banks. The grass gives the impression of there being nothing more than a
bit of frost, but can mask a layer of smooth hard frozen soil beneath it and
when you slip its a bit like being on a glacier thats only got 2cm of soft
snow on it.

"aj" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

the lakes forcast tomorrow says frozen paths,would a winter walker even
use
crampons on a steep grass bank that is frozen but not covered in snow ?

"Alan Dicey" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

aj said:

the lakes forcast tomorrow says frozen paths,would a winter walker even

use

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

crampons on a steep grass bank that is frozen but not covered in snow ?

I hope not. It would be incredibly destructive, tearing the grass and
ground to shreds when it is at its most vulnerable. I can't think of a
grass bank that is so smooth that spikes would be needed. In any case,
are there any routes left in the Lake District that have grass banks on
them? They are all walked-out ruts or paved now, aren't they?

i was coming down off barrow to braithwaite on boxing day,the path was steep
smooth grass & partly frozen,thats what made me think about crampon use
after i nearly went head over heels.

Mike Mason said:

"Alan Dicey" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

aj said:

the lakes forcast tomorrow says frozen paths,would a winter walker even
use
crampons on a steep grass bank that is frozen but not covered in snow ?

I hope not. It would be incredibly destructive, tearing the grass and
ground to shreds when it is at its most vulnerable. I can't think of a
grass bank that is so smooth that spikes would be needed. In any case,
are there any routes left in the Lake District that have grass banks on
them? They are all walked-out ruts or paved now, aren't they?

you should try the Helvellyn face above Red Tarn when the snow is sparse.
The scrambling can be quite exciting, with crampons providing much
assistance on the mixed ground.
Mike Mason

Not really a grass bank though, is it.

http://www.diceyhome.free-online.co.uk/Walking/Not_Striding_Edge/Catstycam%20summit-half.jpg

Alan Dicey said:

In any case,
are there any routes left in the Lake District that have grass banks on
them?

Lots of them (routes, that is, not paths). And some are as scary as
anything in the district - much more so than exposed rocky scrambles.
--

Paul Rooney

aj said:

"Alan Dicey" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

aj said:

the lakes forcast tomorrow says frozen paths,would a winter walker even

use

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

crampons on a steep grass bank that is frozen but not covered in snow ?

I hope not. It would be incredibly destructive, tearing the grass and
ground to shreds when it is at its most vulnerable. I can't think of a
grass bank that is so smooth that spikes would be needed. In any case,
are there any routes left in the Lake District that have grass banks on
them? They are all walked-out ruts or paved now, aren't they?

i was coming down off barrow to braithwaite on boxing day,the path was steep
smooth grass & partly frozen,thats what made me think about crampon use
after i nearly went head over heels.

I was there last week, in cold rain, pondering the possibilities of
sliding all the way down if it had been a few degrees colder. It's not
as though you could fall off, is it?

--

Paul Rooney

"Alan Dicey" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Mike Mason said:

"Alan Dicey" <[email hidden]> wrote in
message news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

aj wrote:
> the lakes forcast tomorrow says frozen paths,would a winter walker even
> use
> crampons on a steep grass bank that is frozen but not covered in snow ?
>
>
I hope not. It would be incredibly destructive, tearing the grass and
ground to shreds when it is at its most vulnerable. I can't think of a
grass bank that is so smooth that spikes would be needed. In any case,
are there any routes left in the Lake District that have grass banks on
them? They are all walked-out ruts or paved now, aren't they?

you should try the Helvellyn face above Red Tarn when the snow is sparse.
The scrambling can be quite exciting, with crampons providing much
assistance on the mixed ground.
Mike Mason

Not really a grass bank though, is it.

http://www.diceyhome.free-online.co.uk/Walking/Not_Striding_Edge/Catstycam%20summit-half.jpg

Right hand side towards Swirral is mixed ground, mixture of grass and rock.
Good for beginners to have a go on when the snow is in good condition. In
the event of only a light covering of snow then there is quite a lot of
grass about.

Mike

Alan Dicey said:

aj said:

the lakes forcast tomorrow says frozen paths,would a winter walker even use
crampons on a steep grass bank that is frozen but not covered in snow ?

I hope not. It would be incredibly destructive, tearing the grass and
ground to shreds when it is at its most vulnerable. I can't think of a
grass bank that is so smooth that spikes would be needed. In any case,
are there any routes left in the Lake District that have grass banks on
them? They are all walked-out ruts or paved now, aren't they?

If the turf is well frozen crampons won't cause much damage.

You should have tried the open plain of Beinn a Chuirn (Beinn Mhanach,
head of Loch Lyon) in February last year. Melt water had flowed out
over a wide area of grass and refrozen the result was like a convex
ice rink.

Of course I had left the points in the car not having not used them
whilst carrying them on snowier and higher hills all week. /Lesson
learned/.
--
Phil Cook looking north over the park to the "Westminster Gasworks"

Phil Cook said:

Alan Dicey said:

aj said:

the lakes forcast tomorrow says frozen paths,would a winter walker even use
crampons on a steep grass bank that is frozen but not covered in snow ?

I hope not. It would be incredibly destructive, tearing the grass and

<snip>

Quoted message said:

If the turf is well frozen crampons won't cause much damage.

But as you descend the hardness of the frost lessens and you start
chewing up [fragile] gound.

Re.: Beinn a Chuirn (Beinn Mhanach, head of Loch Lyon)

Quoted message said:

Melt water had flowed out over a wide area of grass and refrozen the
result was like a convex ice rink.

As in all things safety... its a judgement call. What are crampons
for? Are there alternate routes to avoid the /tricky bits/ altogether?
In some conditions certain actions are the only real options, in
others there's latitude.

Quoted message said:

Of course I had left the points in the car not having not used them
whilst carrying them on snowier and higher hills all week. /Lesson
learned/.

Assuming you've kept your options open ;-)