Concrete ridge thingies on cycle paths

squeaker said:

Sorry if this has been discussed before, but does anyone else have
problems with these longitudinal concrete ridge blocks on cycle paths -
see http://myweb.tiscali.co.uk/crokeracousticsltd/Mistral/Worthing
concrete.jpg
They are OK to ride over on something with fat, eg MTB, tyres, but on
my 'bent (1.3" wide tyres) they are plain scary in the wet, as there is
a high probability that the front wheel will slip sideways off a ridge,
resulting in an 'interesting' moment - especially the one shown which
is just before a bend 🙁
As they seem to be used to indicate a pedestrian crossing point, maybe
they could just be turned thro' 90 degrees and act as a rumble strip?
My policy now is 'IF WET THEN DIVERT TO FOOTPATH WHEN CONCRETE STRIPS
APPEAR', which kind of defeats the object of a cycle path.....
And what are the damned things called so I can [censored] them off properly?

Just another example of why not to use cycle farcilities. You're
better off in the road, safer too, IMO.

squeaker said:

Sorry if this has been discussed before, but does anyone else have
problems with these longitudinal concrete ridge blocks on cycle paths -
see http://myweb.tiscali.co.uk/crokeracousticsltd/Mistral/Worthing
concrete.jpg
They are OK to ride over on something with fat, eg MTB, tyres, but on
my 'bent (1.3" wide tyres) they are plain scary in the wet, as there is
a high probability that the front wheel will slip sideways off a ridge,
resulting in an 'interesting' moment - especially the one shown which
is just before a bend 🙁
As they seem to be used to indicate a pedestrian crossing point, maybe
they could just be turned thro' 90 degrees and act as a rumble strip?
My policy now is 'IF WET THEN DIVERT TO FOOTPATH WHEN CONCRETE STRIPS
APPEAR', which kind of defeats the object of a cycle path.....
And what are the damned things called so I can [censored] them off properly?

They seem to be designed so they "rumble" if you're on the ped's side.
IME the main problems is the other way around, i.e. peds on the cycle side.

On 26/02/2006 13:14, squeaker said,

Quoted message said:

Sorry if this has been discussed before, but does anyone else have
problems with these longitudinal concrete ridge blocks on cycle paths -
see http://myweb.tiscali.co.uk/crokeracousticsltd/Mistral/Worthing
concrete.jpg
They are OK to ride over on something with fat, eg MTB, tyres, but on
my 'bent (1.3" wide tyres) they are plain scary in the wet, as there is
a high probability that the front wheel will slip sideways off a ridge,
resulting in an 'interesting' moment - especially the one shown which
is just before a bend 🙁
As they seem to be used to indicate a pedestrian crossing point, maybe
they could just be turned thro' 90 degrees and act as a rumble strip?
My policy now is 'IF WET THEN DIVERT TO FOOTPATH WHEN CONCRETE STRIPS
APPEAR', which kind of defeats the object of a cycle path.....
And what are the damned things called so I can [censored] them off properly?

I've got some of these on my commuting route, and to be honest I don't
find them a problem. I have 700Cx37 tyres. Around here, they have the
longitudinal ones on one half of the path, and the same turned through
90 degrees on the other half. There is no consistency though on which
direction ridges the cycle half will get!

--
Paul Boyd
http://www.paul-boyd.co.uk/

squeaker said:

Sorry if this has been discussed before, but does anyone else have
problems with these longitudinal concrete ridge blocks on cycle paths -
see http://myweb.tiscali.co.uk/crokeracousticsltd/Mistral/Worthing
concrete.jpg...
As they seem to be used to indicate a pedestrian crossing point, maybe
they could just be turned thro' 90 degrees and act as a rumble strip?
My policy now is 'IF WET THEN DIVERT TO FOOTPATH WHEN CONCRETE STRIPS
APPEAR', which kind of defeats the object of a cycle path.....
And what are the damned things called so I can [censored] them off properly?

The person who thought of these things really wasn't (thinking, that
is). It appears that pushchair users prefer the longitudinal bars on
the cycle side.

Some versions have separate bars around a foot long instead of one
continuous one. These are a bit safer. Your ones look particularly high.

I think there is a strong case for reversing the usage of longitudinal
and transverse bars, and putting strict limits on length and height.
Surely a phased programme could be devised?!

Colin McKenzie

squeaker said:

Sorry if this has been discussed before, but does anyone else have
problems with these longitudinal concrete ridge blocks on cycle paths -
see
http://myweb.tiscali.co.uk/crokeracousticsltd/Mistral/Worthing20%concrete.jpg

Quoted message said:

As they seem to be used to indicate a pedestrian crossing point, maybe
they could just be turned thro' 90 degrees and act as a rumble strip? My
policy now is 'IF WET THEN DIVERT TO FOOTPATH WHEN CONCRETE STRIPS
APPEAR', which kind of defeats the object of a cycle path..... And what
are the damned things called so I can [censored] them off properly?

Tactile paving surface. "The purpose of the tactile surface used in
conjunction with a segregated shared cycle track/footway is to advise
visually impaired people of the correct side to enter."

http://www.dft.gov.uk/stellent/groups/dft_mobility/documents/page/dft_mobility_503283-10.hcsp#P445_60833

Just one among the many reasons to stay off most farcilities.

Like the bike BTW. Streetmachine?

Mike

Mike Causer said:

Tactile paving surface. "The purpose of the tactile surface used in
conjunction with a segregated shared cycle track/footway is to advise
visually impaired people of the correct side to enter."

As if dogs can read *or* understand the significance of the ridges.

Zog The Undeniable said:

Mike Causer said:

Tactile paving surface. "The purpose of the tactile surface used in
conjunction with a segregated shared cycle track/footway is to advise
visually impaired people of the correct side to enter."

As if dogs can read *or* understand the significance of the ridges.

I'm sure they could be trained to, but in this case the ridges have to be
sufficiently high that they can be felt through someone's shoes.

Mike

"Zog The Undeniable" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:4401c531.0@entanet...

Quoted message said:

Mike Causer said:

Tactile paving surface. "The purpose of the tactile surface used in
conjunction with a segregated shared cycle track/footway is to advise
visually impaired people of the correct side to enter."

As if dogs can read *or* understand the significance of the ridges.

No, but the person can 'feel' the surface they are walking on

Mike Causer twisted the electrons to say:

Quoted message said:

Like the bike BTW. Streetmachine?

It's not a Streetmachine AFAICS - the rear shock is vertical, when it
should be horizontal on a HPVelotechnik product. I think it's maybe a
product of Challenge?
--
These opinions might not even be mine ...
Let alone connected with my employer ...

squeaker said:

Sorry if this has been discussed before, but does anyone else have
problems with these longitudinal concrete ridge blocks on cycle paths -
see http://myweb.tiscali.co.uk/crokeracousticsltd/Mistral/Worthing
concrete.jpg
They are OK to ride over on something with fat, eg MTB, tyres, but on
my 'bent (1.3" wide tyres) they are plain scary in the wet, as there is
a high probability that the front wheel will slip sideways off a ridge,
resulting in an 'interesting' moment - especially the one shown which
is just before a bend 🙁
As they seem to be used to indicate a pedestrian crossing point, maybe
they could just be turned thro' 90 degrees and act as a rumble strip?
My policy now is 'IF WET THEN DIVERT TO FOOTPATH WHEN CONCRETE STRIPS
APPEAR', which kind of defeats the object of a cycle path.....
And what are the damned things called so I can [censored] them off properly?

I loath these things. In the damp or wet if you hit them not
completely lined up your front wheel can get a nasty slide on. There
are several places in Brighton where these are placed just where the
cycle path turns sharply. OK I do have a 20 mm front tyre on until
some new winter tyres arrive this week but still.

Stan Cox

Mike Causer said:

Like the bike BTW. Streetmachine?

Challenge Mistral judging by the colour, shape and most importantly...
URL. ;-)

Jon

in message <[email hidden]>,

squeaker (') said:

Sorry if this has been discussed before, but does anyone else have
problems with these longitudinal concrete ridge blocks on cycle paths -
see http://myweb.tiscali.co.uk/crokeracousticsltd/Mistral/Worthing
concrete.jpg
They are OK to ride over on something with fat, eg MTB, tyres, but on
my 'bent (1.3" wide tyres) they are plain scary in the wet, as there is
a high probability that the front wheel will slip sideways off a ridge,
resulting in an 'interesting' moment - especially the one shown which
is just before a bend 🙁
As they seem to be used to indicate a pedestrian crossing point, maybe
they could just be turned thro' 90 degrees and act as a rumble strip?
My policy now is 'IF WET THEN DIVERT TO FOOTPATH WHEN CONCRETE STRIPS
APPEAR', which kind of defeats the object of a cycle path.....
And what are the damned things called so I can [censored] them off properly?

Those look murderously dangerous!

--
[email hidden] (Simon Brooke) http://www.jasmine.org.uk/~simon/
Wannabe a Web designer?
<URL:http://userfriendly.org/cartoons/archives/97dec/19971206.html>

in message
<[email hidden]>, Mike

Causer (') said:

Zog The Undeniable said:

Mike Causer said:

Tactile paving surface. "The purpose of the tactile surface used in
conjunction with a segregated shared cycle track/footway is to advise
visually impaired people of the correct side to enter."

As if dogs can read *or* understand the significance of the ridges.

I'm sure they could be trained to, but in this case the ridges have to
be sufficiently high that they can be felt through someone's shoes.

Which means, of course, sufficiently high to catch and turn a front
wheel, leading to the rider being ejected from the bike and killed on
the adjacent roadway. It's a safety feature...

--
[email hidden] (Simon Brooke) http://www.jasmine.org.uk/~simon/

;; this is not a .sig

Mike Causer said:

Zog The Undeniable said:

Mike Causer said:

Tactile paving surface. "The purpose of the tactile surface used in
conjunction with a segregated shared cycle track/footway is to advise
visually impaired people of the correct side to enter."

As if dogs can read *or* understand the significance of the ridges.

I'm sure they could be trained to, but in this case the ridges have to be
sufficiently high that they can be felt through someone's shoes.

IIRC theer are two types. One used to indicate crossing points on
pavements which have a higher and more rounded profile (specs are
online but I'm damned if I can recall where). These are indeed intended
to be felt through shoes and could cause problems to a cyclist (who
shouldn't be where they are intended to be used). The other type is
the one in your picture which are intended to encourage cyclists onto
the right side (where the ridges are longitudinal rather than
transverse). Personally I prefer the longitudinal side and have never
felt insecure on 23mm tyres at 9-10 Bar (I have a short path section on
my daily commute so experience them in all (SE England) weathers.

I believe it is not uncommon for the orientation to be the wrong way
around and not unknown for the trickier footway type to be used on
cycle facilities in error although I have not expeienced either

best wishes
james

Simon Brooke said:

in message
<[email hidden]>, Mike

Causer (') said:

Zog The Undeniable said:

Mike Causer wrote:

> Tactile paving surface. ...to advise visually impaired people

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

As if dogs can read *or* understand the significance of the ridges.

I'm sure they could be trained to, but in this case the ridges have to
be sufficiently high that they can be felt through someone's shoes.

Which means, of course, sufficiently high to catch and turn a front
wheel, leading to the rider being ejected from the bike and killed on
the adjacent roadway. It's a safety feature...

exactly. Put em back into the road where they are safer 🙂

best wishes
james

Challenge Mistral it is! (Must use shorter URL's that fit on one
line...)
Thanks for the tactile paving link, Mike.
Just to discourage cyclist more, the whole of the cycle lane is covered
in a (rather roughly laid) green non-slip surface, while the peds get
the super smooth tarmac. Back to the road, then..... A good example
of why the proposed Highway Code changes need stopping!
Interesting how your perception changes with time / type of riding. 18
months ago I appreciated this new path, as I spent as much time as
possible off-road riding, and it seemed a least-worst option to riding
on a rather narrow (in places) road or illegally riding on the footpath
(which I usually did). And on my MTB the surface seemed smooth
compared to the rest of my routes. However now, doing more road
cycling, my views are changing. I'll still probably use this
particular path (and the adjacent pavement as appropriate) especially
when the road is jammed with slow moving cars, but it's no longer an
automatic choice.

Mike Causer said:

Zog The Undeniable said:

Mike Causer said:

Tactile paving surface. "The purpose of the tactile surface used in
conjunction with a segregated shared cycle track/footway is to advise
visually impaired people of the correct side to enter."

As if dogs can read *or* understand the significance of the ridges.

I'm sure they could be trained to, but in this case the ridges have to be
sufficiently high that they can be felt through someone's shoes.

As a friend of mine put it: "Ah! Braille for the feet."

Tim

squeaker said:

Sorry if this has been discussed before, but does anyone else have
problems with these longitudinal concrete ridge blocks on cycle paths -

I've moaned about these wretched things in here a couple of times at
least. Apparently they are put there so that the visually impaired can
tell which is the pedestrian side. When the standard was set it was
felt that the transverse tiles on the pedestrian side would discourage
cyclists, which shows just how much testing they did.

The tramline effect on the cyclist side can be absolutely deadly,
especially with narrow road tyres, and especially when it's slippery.
The cattle grid effect on the pedestrian side is no problem at all for
cyclists. There's just a slight vibration as you ride over them. The
standard is simply the wrong way round. It's just another example of
how nearly all so-called cycling facilities are actually
thinly-disguised anti-cycling measures.

--
Dave...

Quoted message said:

Mike Causer said:

Zog The Undeniable said:

Mike Causer wrote:

>Tactile paving surface. "The purpose of the tactile surface used in
>conjunction with a segregated shared cycle track/footway is to advise
>visually impaired people of the correct side to enter."

As if dogs can read *or* understand the significance of the ridges.

I'm sure they could be trained to, but in this case the ridges have to be
sufficiently high that they can be felt through someone's shoes.

IIRC theer are two types. One used to indicate crossing points on
pavements which have a higher and more rounded profile (specs are
online but I'm damned if I can recall where). These are indeed intended
to be felt through shoes and could cause problems to a cyclist (who
shouldn't be where they are intended to be used). The other type is
the one in your picture which are intended to encourage cyclists onto
the right side (where the ridges are longitudinal rather than
transverse). Personally I prefer the longitudinal side and have never
felt insecure on 23mm tyres at 9-10 Bar (I have a short path section on
my daily commute so experience them in all (SE England) weathers.

I believe it is not uncommon for the orientation to be the wrong way
around and not unknown for the trickier footway type to be used on
cycle facilities in error although I have not expeienced either

best wishes
james

there are the spotted versions for all users, to indicate the edge of a
path/track to the road, then there are ones which we all appear to hate.
It's far worse when they get put on the corner of a cycle route as the
slightest bit of dampness causes them to [censored] the tyre and slide
around at the wrong angle.

--
"You can't see paradise if you don't pedal" (Fowler, Chicken Run)