cofidiis

pierre said:

the Cofidis guy that put all this team out this year and shame was'nt french
att all, he is italian. they even"t benn excluded, they just decided to go
out when one of their 10 guy was showed doped. he was'nt french.
Except Virenque, that was a real junky, mayby, sure, in the last 25 years,
it not's here the manner we like racing

Slowly?

R

Are Datakoll, Test and Pierre one and the same? Perhaps Hiawatha too?

--Mike-- Chain Reaction Bicycles
www.ChainReactionBicycles.com

pierre said:

the Cofidis guy that put all this team out this year and shame was'nt french
att all, he is italian. they even"t benn excluded, they just decided to go
out when one of their 10 guy was showed doped. he was'nt french.
Except Virenque, that was a real junky, mayby, sure, in the last 25 years,
it not's here the manner we like racing

Casino (now AGR2) and Cofedis had their share of doping cases durring
the late 90'es.

--
Morten Reippuert Knudsen :-) <http://blog.reippuert.dk>

Merlin Works CR-3/2.5 & Campagnolo Chorus 2007.

well,for one time maybe a guy was loaded, like a horse,and catched, but the
other 9 guy from his team ended the tour and go home in a team spirit way.
so you shouldn't joke about french team that would be fulll doped, it was
just one guy and he was italian.

"Mike Jacoubowsky" <[email hidden]> a écrit dans le message de news:
[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Are Datakoll, Test and Pierre one and the same? Perhaps Hiawatha too?

--Mike-- Chain Reaction Bicycles
www.ChainReactionBicycles.com

pierre said:

the Cofidis guy that put all this team out this year and shame was'nt french
att all, he is italian. they even"t benn excluded, they just decided to go
out when one of their 10 guy was showed doped. he was'nt french.
Except Virenque, that was a real junky, mayby, sure, in the last 25 years,
it not's here the manner we like racing

There's that "we" thing again.

And the really objectionable "junky".

When I stood at/near the start house of the '01 Tour (in Luxembourg,
granted), two riders' applause levels, when announced over the PA,
stood above all others-- Virenque, and Armstrong. Vienque's was at yet
another level from Armstrong's, for both volume and enthusiasm. None
of the others' receptions were close, from what I heard. Even in
Luxembourg, IOW, there were many French (and others) who apparently
are not totally a part of your "we".

Are you claiming the French don't win the Tour because they don't
"dope"?

"Doping", "junky", etc. etc. might be indicators of a certain
"morality" when applied to criticism of taking performance enhancing
substances, but EPO to the best of my knowledge is not directly
psychoactive-- not like, say, airplane fabric wing covering finish
(containing tolulene, other) or heroin. Let's control the hysteria a
little, OK?

Even carrying through career-ending sanctions (including via leaks,
for those keeping tabs on all sin on the Morality Scoreboard) hasn't
STOPPED DOPING or CLEANED UP THE SPORT!!!

Goodness. What's wrong here? --D-y

Mike Jacoubowsky said:

Are Datakoll, Test and Pierre one and the same? Perhaps Hiawatha too?

I'm starting to wonder if our French friends Test and Pierre aren't
from Philly.

Bob Schwartz

Bob Schwartz said:

I'm starting to wonder if our French friends Test and Pierre aren't
from Philly.

Philly French must be what the $10 Philly hookers talk.

Quoted post said:

"Doping", "junky", etc. etc. might be indicators of a certain
"morality" when applied to criticism of taking performance enhancing
substances, but EPO to the best of my knowledge is not directly
psychoactive-- not like, say, airplane fabric wing covering finish
(containing tolulene, other) or heroin. Let's control the hysteria a
little, OK?

Not to mention that synthetic EPO pretty much does the same thing
(albeit chemically) that elevation training or elevation tents do.
I've been home from Qinghai for nearly three weeks and I'm still
breathing through my nose (instead of panting through my mouth) when I
sprint or do big climbs.

My hemacrit is certainly dropping by now and the boost will be gone
completely in another few weeks but if I win this weekend's mountain
climb should I be disqualified for unfair advantage over the
competitors because I was the only girl with the ability and
opportunity (read money and influence) to do elevation training[1]?

Or maybe the genetic advantage of my extra 3-5 inches of height and
big legs[2] should disqualify me from racing against Asians on flat
courses? And my training schedule as a student (now computer
programmer) is unfair to my competitors who have full time with
overtime at jobs with non-lenient bosses.

The thing about modern performance enhancing drugs (instead of the
amphetamines used in decades past) is that they make the body do what
the body does only they make it do it better. If and when it gets to
gene doping (and isn't picking the people with bigger lungs and longer
legs really just a primitive form of gene doping?) it'll be the same
story. Better, faster, stronger ... and somewhat less likely to make
you accidentally ride the wrong way down the course, or end up in the
ambulance with your legs still pedaling phantom circles while you
climb a col that does not exist and a lot less likely to make your
heart explode.

What the racers are doing isn't any less real because they might be
taking drugs. Obviously some of them are taking drugs. You wouldn't
necessarily know it from the drug tests in France since they're being
done by labs with poor chain of control and a habit of leaking results
to the media but riders are admitting to having doped in the past so
it must be going on.

Pro-racers want to win. It's how they managed to become professionals
in the first place and if a pill or a patch is going to give them that
magic 1% extra and they think they can take it without getting in
trouble they WILL take it. The placebo effect alone can explain why
maybe smearing some goo on your balls[3] the night before might make
you feel just that little tiniest bit more recovered. And if you do
well the next day, even if the goo had NOTHING to do with it then,
just like lucky red socks, you'll do it again and again and again and
find excuses to explain why it didn't quite help this time.

-M

[1] I'm not entirely sure the word 'training' applies when the
elevation sickness is that bad but I've definitely got a happy happy
blood boost thing going on right now.
[2] My calves are as big around as the thighs of most non-biking local
women
[3] For guys that is