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Cheaper alternative to Ergo computer?

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Cycling Equipment
Published
22 June 2005
Last activity
27 June 2005
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Kovie
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  1. I like the feature on Campy's Ergo computer that tells you which gear combo
    you're in, but don't think it's anywhere near worth the triple-digit price
    tag (for my needs and budget at least). I already have a pretty decent
    computer (CatEye Astrale) that has just about every feature I want and need,
    except for this one. I was wondering if anyone made a cheaper version of the
    Ergo that had this feature?

    Seems to me that if your computer already has a cadence sensor and
    capability (mine does), it would be a relatively simple matter to add to it
    the ability to calculate and display which gears one was in (so long as
    there was a way to input the number of teeth on the front and rear gears,
    the way you currently have to input the wheel circumference).

    The only potential snag I can see would be in determining which gear combo
    was in use if there are duplicates (which in a 30 gear setup is likely), in
    which case it should at least be able to tell you what gear-inch (or
    gear-centimeter) you're currently in. But it would be nice to be able to
    know which gear I was in without having look look down.

    --
    Kovie
    [email hidden]

  2. Kovie said:

    I like the feature on Campy's Ergo computer that tells you which gear combo
    you're in, but don't think it's anywhere near worth the triple-digit price
    tag (for my needs and budget at least). I already have a pretty decent
    computer (CatEye Astrale) that has just about every feature I want and need,
    except for this one. I was wondering if anyone made a cheaper version of the
    Ergo that had this feature?

    Probably not the option you were looking for, but Bar-Cons (Bar-end
    shifters) can do the job: The right markings added to the lever show
    you what you need to know.

    Sample on an ancient SunTour indexing barcon:
    http://home.comcast.net/~mandmlj/BarConIndicator.jpg

    (This could work similarly on modern Shimano barcons)

    Mark Janeba

  3. Kovie,

    You might try a Avocet 50. It has cadence and speed sensors and after
    you've input your wheel circumference it can calculate gear-inches. Worked
    great for me for a couple of years until the silver rubbed off the contacts
    exposing the copper underneath which promptly turn a bright shade of green.

    K.

    "Kovie" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
    news:[email hidden]...

    Quoted message said:

    I like the feature on Campy's Ergo computer that tells you which gear


    combo

    Quoted message said:

    you're in, but don't think it's anywhere near worth the triple-digit price
    tag (for my needs and budget at least). I already have a pretty decent
    computer (CatEye Astrale) that has just about every feature I want and


    need,

    Quoted message said:

    except for this one. I was wondering if anyone made a cheaper version of


    the

    Quoted message said:

    Ergo that had this feature?

    Seems to me that if your computer already has a cadence sensor and
    capability (mine does), it would be a relatively simple matter to add to


    it

    Quoted message said:

    the ability to calculate and display which gears one was in (so long as
    there was a way to input the number of teeth on the front and rear gears,
    the way you currently have to input the wheel circumference).

    The only potential snag I can see would be in determining which gear combo
    was in use if there are duplicates (which in a 30 gear setup is likely),


    in

    Quoted message said:

    which case it should at least be able to tell you what gear-inch (or
    gear-centimeter) you're currently in. But it would be nice to be able to
    know which gear I was in without having look look down.

    --
    Kovie
    [email hidden]

  4. Kovie said:

    I like the feature on Campy's Ergo computer that tells you which gear
    combo you're in, but don't think it's anywhere near worth the
    triple-digit price tag (for my needs and budget at least). I already
    have a pretty decent computer (CatEye Astrale) that has just about
    every feature I want and need, except for this one. I was wondering
    if anyone made a cheaper version of the Ergo that had this feature?

    Yup, it's called "looking down." I still do it, even though I have a Flight
    Deck.

    Matt O.

  5. Shimano make bar-end shifters featuring "Shimano Tactile Shifting" you
    can feel which gear you
    are in. No need to look at a computer or the rear of the bike, also
    includes SSS, Shimano
    Sweep Shifting, you can shift any number of gears at once!, great for
    rolling hills.
    And unlike STI, they're repairable and weigh less.

    Scott G.
    Next week Shimano introduces one handed shifting, using the amazing
    down tube shifter!

  6. "Matt O'Toole" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
    news:[email hidden]...

    Quoted message said:
    Kovie said:

    I like the feature on Campy's Ergo computer that tells you which gear
    combo you're in, but don't think it's anywhere near worth the
    triple-digit price tag (for my needs and budget at least). I already
    have a pretty decent computer (CatEye Astrale) that has just about
    every feature I want and need, except for this one. I was wondering
    if anyone made a cheaper version of the Ergo that had this feature?

    Yup, it's called "looking down." I still do it, even though I have a
    Flight
    Deck.

    Matt O.

    Hah. Too low-tech for me! ;-)

    --
    Kovie
    [email hidden]

  7. On Thu, 23 Jun 2005 02:04:01 GMT, "Kovie" <[email hidden]>

    Quoted message said:

    "Matt O'Toole" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
    news:[email hidden]...

    Quoted message said:
    Kovie said:

    I like the feature on Campy's Ergo computer that tells you which gear
    combo you're in, but don't think it's anywhere near worth the
    triple-digit price tag (for my needs and budget at least). I already
    have a pretty decent computer (CatEye Astrale) that has just about
    every feature I want and need, except for this one. I was wondering
    if anyone made a cheaper version of the Ergo that had this feature?

    Yup, it's called "looking down." I still do it, even though I have a
    Flight
    Deck.

    Matt O.

    Hah. Too low-tech for me! ;-)

    Hi, maybe you could adapt a Shimano optical indicator to your needs. I
    use the 9-speed version with my DA shifters.
    Here is what I am thinking. If they make a 10-speed version, all the
    better, but either way, overall travel should be the same, so the
    9-speed would work. You would have to redo your handlebar tape, to
    expose part of the cable, where you would insert the indicator. There
    you have it.

    I don't like looking down to the rear. I don't mind glancing at the
    chainrings. And with 9-10 rear cogs, it is hard to tell what gear you
    are in anyway. Looking down isn't very safe and often when you would
    like to know what gear you are in, is at times, when safety is an
    issue.

    Life is Good!
    Jeff

  8. "Jeff Starr" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
    news:[email hidden]...

    Quoted message said:

    On Thu, 23 Jun 2005 02:04:01 GMT, "Kovie" <[email hidden]>

    Quoted message said:

    "Matt O'Toole" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
    news:[email hidden]...

    Quoted message said:

    Kovie wrote:

    > I like the feature on Campy's Ergo computer that tells you which gear
    > combo you're in, but don't think it's anywhere near worth the
    > triple-digit price tag (for my needs and budget at least). I already
    > have a pretty decent computer (CatEye Astrale) that has just about
    > every feature I want and need, except for this one. I was wondering
    > if anyone made a cheaper version of the Ergo that had this feature?

    Yup, it's called "looking down." I still do it, even though I have a
    Flight
    Deck.

    Matt O.

    Hah. Too low-tech for me! ;-)

    Hi, maybe you could adapt a Shimano optical indicator to your needs. I
    use the 9-speed version with my DA shifters.
    Here is what I am thinking. If they make a 10-speed version, all the
    better, but either way, overall travel should be the same, so the
    9-speed would work. You would have to redo your handlebar tape, to
    expose part of the cable, where you would insert the indicator. There
    you have it.

    I don't like looking down to the rear. I don't mind glancing at the
    chainrings. And with 9-10 rear cogs, it is hard to tell what gear you
    are in anyway. Looking down isn't very safe and often when you would
    like to know what gear you are in, is at times, when safety is an
    issue.

    Life is Good!
    Jeff

    There seems to be a certain anti-tech "old school" purist ethos going on in
    this ng. Take a look at some of the responses I've gotten to my request for
    recommendations on hydration packs in a recent thread I started. I try to
    ignore it. My take is if it helps you do what you like to do, increases
    safety, and solves a problem or two, I'm all for it, even if they never had
    'em in the good 'ole days.

    I hate having to look back at my gears to tell which one I'm in, and I agree
    that it's often unsafe, and in any case hard to do with a 10-cog cassette.
    This isn't one of those devices that creates as many problems as it solves,
    or is just plain silly and unnecessary. I think it serves a perfectly valid,
    and possibly safety-enhancing, purpose, while not requiring any
    modifications or additions to one's setup.

    As for your suggestion, I have a Campy setup, so I'm not sure this would
    work. But I still think that adapting a computer to do this makes the most
    sense. With cadence it would have all the information it needs to calculate
    this, and display either gear-units or actual gears.

    --
    Kovie
    [email hidden]

  9. Kovie said:
    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:

    > Kovie wrote:
    >
    >> I like the feature on Campy's Ergo computer that tells you which gear
    >> combo you're in, but don't think it's anywhere near worth the
    >> triple-digit price tag (for my needs and budget at least). I already
    >> have a pretty decent computer (CatEye Astrale) that has just about
    >> every feature I want and need, except for this one. I was wondering
    >> if anyone made a cheaper version of the Ergo that had this feature?
    >

    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:

    There seems to be a certain anti-tech "old school" purist ethos going on in
    this ng. Take a look at some of the responses I've gotten to my request for
    recommendations on hydration packs in a recent thread I started. I try to
    ignore it. My take is if it helps you do what you like to do, increases
    safety, and solves a problem or two, I'm all for it, even if they never had
    'em in the good 'ole days.

    Don't discount some of these completely. There is a certain
    gadget-mindedness in today's cycling gear and a lot of the stuff that
    is around now is just plain silly. A lot of people here have a lot of
    miles on a bici, and some of thier suggestions, altho low tech, may be
    worthwhile.

    Quoted message said:


    I hate having to look back at my gears to tell which one I'm in, and I agree
    that it's often unsafe, and in any case hard to do with a 10-cog cassette.
    This isn't one of those devices that creates as many problems as it solves,
    or is just plain silly and unnecessary. I think it serves a perfectly valid,
    and possibly safety-enhancing, purpose, while not requiring any
    modifications or additions to one's setup.

    As for your suggestion, I have a Campy setup, so I'm not sure this would
    work. But I still think that adapting a computer to do this makes the most
    sense. With cadence it would have all the information it needs to calculate
    this, and display either gear-units or actual gears.

    As for your answer-since ERGO brsin uses a mechanical attachment inside
    the lever, I don't see how another computer could be adapted. If you
    want a visual dfisp[lay of gear selection, it's ERGO brain for Campag,
    Flightdeck for shimano.

    Quoted message said:


    --
    Kovie
    [email hidden]

  10. Quoting Kovie <[email hidden]>:

    Quoted message said:

    I hate having to look back at my gears to tell which one I'm in, and I agree
    that it's often unsafe, and in any case hard to do with a 10-cog cassette.

    I don't look back at mine [1], and I know what gear I'm in both because I
    count them and because I know what speed I'm making and if the cadence is
    comfortable. This does sound a bit like a solution looking for a problem...

    [1] I know this I'm not even glancing because on the tandem you can't
    look back at the gears because the stoker's legs are in the way.
    --
    David Damerell <[email hidden]> Distortion Field!
    Today is Aponoia, Presuary.

  11. Kovie said:

    Seems to me that if your computer already has a cadence sensor and
    capability (mine does), it would be a relatively simple matter to add to it
    the ability to calculate and display which gears one was in (so long as
    there was a way to input the number of teeth on the front and rear gears,
    the way you currently have to input the wheel circumference).

    Well, there was a computer that did this in reverse. Some Shimano Flight
    deck (I think that was the name) computers would tie into the STI
    shifters, so they knew what gear you were in, would then take the gear and
    speed and give you a "virtual" cadence. It didn't know when you were
    coasting, though, so required some interpretation.

    But modern bikes have so many crossover gears that it could never really
    tell you what gears you were in from the cadence and the speed. It could
    tell you the gear size easily enough, but would have to guess what
    chainring you were in.

    Quoted message said:


    But it would be nice
    to be able to know which gear I was in without having look look down.

    I hasten to point out that, in order to read the computer you have to look
    down, as well.

    --

    David L. Johnson

    __o | "A foolish consistency is the hobgoblin of little minds, adored
    _`\(,_ | by little statesmen and philosophers and divines." --Ralph Waldo
    (_)/ (_) | Emerson

  12. "Kovie" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:MYtue.8153>

    Quoted message said:

    There seems to be a certain anti-tech "old school" purist ethos going on
    in this ng. Take a look at some of the responses I've gotten to my request
    for recommendations on hydration packs in a recent thread I started. I try
    to ignore it. My take is if it helps you do what you like to do, increases
    safety, and solves a problem or two, I'm all for it, even if they never
    had 'em in the good 'ole days.


    I totally agree with you. To me it seemed that you asked a simple and
    reasonable question and many of the responses are saying that you are wrong
    and should be doing things their way. I don't get it but it seems to happen
    very frequently.

    I am sorry that I don't have an answer to your question and hope that
    someone has a useful idea.

  13. Frank Drackman said:

    "Kovie" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:MYtue.8153>

    Quoted message said:

    There seems to be a certain anti-tech "old school" purist ethos going on
    in this ng. Take a look at some of the responses I've gotten to my request
    for recommendations on hydration packs in a recent thread I started. I try
    to ignore it. My take is if it helps you do what you like to do, increases
    safety, and solves a problem or two, I'm all for it, even if they never
    had 'em in the good 'ole days.


    I totally agree with you. To me it seemed that you asked a simple and
    reasonable question and many of the responses are saying that you are wrong
    and should be doing things their way. I don't get it but it seems to happen
    very frequently.

    I am sorry that I don't have an answer to your question and hope that
    someone has a useful idea.

    I hate to point out the obvious, but the only direct and correct answer
    to his question is "NO".

  14. <[email hidden]> wrote in message
    news:[email hidden]...

    Quoted message said:
    Frank Drackman said:

    "Kovie" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:MYtue.8153>

    Quoted message said:

    There seems to be a certain anti-tech "old school" purist ethos going
    on
    in this ng. Take a look at some of the responses I've gotten to my
    request
    for recommendations on hydration packs in a recent thread I started. I
    try
    to ignore it. My take is if it helps you do what you like to do,
    increases
    safety, and solves a problem or two, I'm all for it, even if they never
    had 'em in the good 'ole days.


    I totally agree with you. To me it seemed that you asked a simple and
    reasonable question and many of the responses are saying that you are
    wrong
    and should be doing things their way. I don't get it but it seems to
    happen
    very frequently.

    I am sorry that I don't have an answer to your question and hope that
    someone has a useful idea.

    I hate to point out the obvious, but the only direct and correct answer
    to his question is "NO".

    Are you sure that the only correct answer was "NO", could it have been, "I
    have not seen the solution that you are looking for", or "I am not aware of
    any company that makes a product with the exact features that you wan?"

  15. <[email hidden]> wrote in message
    news:[email hidden]...

    Quoted message said:
    Frank Drackman said:

    "Kovie" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:MYtue.8153>

    Quoted message said:

    There seems to be a certain anti-tech "old school" purist ethos going
    on
    in this ng. Take a look at some of the responses I've gotten to my
    request
    for recommendations on hydration packs in a recent thread I started. I
    try
    to ignore it. My take is if it helps you do what you like to do,
    increases
    safety, and solves a problem or two, I'm all for it, even if they never
    had 'em in the good 'ole days.


    I totally agree with you. To me it seemed that you asked a simple and
    reasonable question and many of the responses are saying that you are
    wrong
    and should be doing things their way. I don't get it but it seems to
    happen
    very frequently.

    I am sorry that I don't have an answer to your question and hope that
    someone has a useful idea.

    I hate to point out the obvious, but the only direct and correct answer
    to his question is "NO".

    The ONLY direct and correct answer? Can you prove this? If not, then your
    assertion lacks credibility. Show me how the reasoning I provided (as
    opposed to lack of any you provided) could not work. It's pretty simple
    math. If you know your wheel's circumference--which of course you need to
    for a computer to display meaningful mileage-related numbers--and have a
    cadence sensor, then a simple equation will tell you what gear-inch you're
    in. Adding the number of teeth in the front and rear gears enables you to
    make an educated guess as to which combination you're in. And for
    combinations that have no gear-inch duplicate, the "guess" would be nearly
    100% accurate. None of this requires any additional mechanical parts, just
    some extra memory and a fairly simple software enhancement on the computer.
    Of course, since these things aren't programmable by users (wouldn't it be
    nice if they were, though, especially for the ones that can hook up to
    PCs?), it would have to be programmed at the factory, but still entirely
    doable.

    Show me the flaw in this reasoning. And prove to me why "NO" is the only
    direct and correct answer. Back up your assertion, or just back off.

    --
    Kovie
    [email hidden]

  16. Read my other recent reply. I agree that it would be hard to guess gear
    combinations that have gear-inch duplicates. But even in such cases, an
    educated guess could be made as not all duplicates are precise numerical
    duplicates. For example, I have a 12-25 10-cog cassette matched to a
    30-42-53 triple chainring. Both 42x 15 and 53x19 result in a 74 g-i ratio,
    rounded. But the first one is actually 73.97, while the second is 73.69, so
    a smart computer could make a pretty good guess as to which combo was in
    use. Even if errors are introduced by innacurate circumference measurement,
    or expansion/contraction due to weather or wear, etc., could be compensated
    for because the relation between these two ratios remains steady. None of
    this would require ANY additional mechanical parts or modifications. So
    unless I'm missing something, I don't see why this wouldn't be possible from
    a technical pov. In terms of whether this would make business sense, that's
    a whole different issue. I'd buy one, if it was not much more expensive than
    standard computers. And it certainly shouldn't cost much for manufacturers,
    who are constantly upgrading their products to stay competitive.

    And I'd say there's a wee bit of a difference between looking down AND back,
    away from the direction of travel (and oncoming bikes, cars, trucks,
    potholes, etc.), and looking down and slightly forward, where peripheral
    vision keeps you relatively safe.

    --
    Kovie
    [email hidden]

    "David L. Johnson" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
    news:[email hidden]...

    Quoted message said:
    Kovie said:

    Seems to me that if your computer already has a cadence sensor and
    capability (mine does), it would be a relatively simple matter to add to
    it
    the ability to calculate and display which gears one was in (so long as
    there was a way to input the number of teeth on the front and rear gears,
    the way you currently have to input the wheel circumference).

    Well, there was a computer that did this in reverse. Some Shimano Flight
    deck (I think that was the name) computers would tie into the STI
    shifters, so they knew what gear you were in, would then take the gear and
    speed and give you a "virtual" cadence. It didn't know when you were
    coasting, though, so required some interpretation.

    But modern bikes have so many crossover gears that it could never really
    tell you what gears you were in from the cadence and the speed. It could
    tell you the gear size easily enough, but would have to guess what
    chainring you were in.

    Quoted message said:


    But it would be nice
    to be able to know which gear I was in without having look look down.

    I hasten to point out that, in order to read the computer you have to look
    down, as well.

    --

    David L. Johnson

    __o | "A foolish consistency is the hobgoblin of little minds, adored
    _`\(,_ | by little statesmen and philosophers and divines." --Ralph Waldo
    (_)/ (_) | Emerson

  17. "Qui si parla Campagnolo" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
    news:[email hidden]...

    Quoted message said:
    Kovie said:
    Quoted message said:

    >> Kovie wrote:
    >>
    >>> I like the feature on Campy's Ergo computer that tells you which
    >>> gear
    >>> combo you're in, but don't think it's anywhere near worth the
    >>> triple-digit price tag (for my needs and budget at least). I already
    >>> have a pretty decent computer (CatEye Astrale) that has just about
    >>> every feature I want and need, except for this one. I was wondering
    >>> if anyone made a cheaper version of the Ergo that had this feature?
    >>

    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:

    There seems to be a certain anti-tech "old school" purist ethos going on
    in
    this ng. Take a look at some of the responses I've gotten to my request
    for
    recommendations on hydration packs in a recent thread I started. I try to
    ignore it. My take is if it helps you do what you like to do, increases
    safety, and solves a problem or two, I'm all for it, even if they never
    had
    'em in the good 'ole days.

    Don't discount some of these completely. There is a certain
    gadget-mindedness in today's cycling gear and a lot of the stuff that
    is around now is just plain silly. A lot of people here have a lot of
    miles on a bici, and some of thier suggestions, altho low tech, may be
    worthwhile.

    No argument on the "some". Although I appreciate and welcome innovations
    that serve a real and worthwhile purpose, I'm no fan of gadgets that add
    weight and complexity with little to no real added value. Sometimes the old
    and tested way works, and sometimes new's better. How many high-mileage
    cyclists still use down-tube shifters, excepting vintage bikes of course?
    Some, but not that many, I'd say (you own a bike shop so you'd know better
    than me, of course). How many still use heavy leather saddles? Again, except
    for vintage bikes, not many, I'd guess. Same goes for toe clips, freewheels,
    clamp-on bottle cages, etc. But how many have automatic shifting? Not many,
    either, because it's an "innovation" that generally doesn't make sense for
    road bikes, as it adds weight and complexity without much value. Depends on
    the device, how useful it is, and how well-made it is. I was just making a
    point that "old for old's sake" doesn't make sense to me.

    --
    Kovie
    [email hidden]

    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:

    I hate having to look back at my gears to tell which one I'm in, and I
    agree
    that it's often unsafe, and in any case hard to do with a 10-cog
    cassette.
    This isn't one of those devices that creates as many problems as it
    solves,
    or is just plain silly and unnecessary. I think it serves a perfectly
    valid,
    and possibly safety-enhancing, purpose, while not requiring any
    modifications or additions to one's setup.

    As for your suggestion, I have a Campy setup, so I'm not sure this would
    work. But I still think that adapting a computer to do this makes the
    most
    sense. With cadence it would have all the information it needs to
    calculate
    this, and display either gear-units or actual gears.

    As for your answer-since ERGO brsin uses a mechanical attachment inside
    the lever, I don't see how another computer could be adapted. If you
    want a visual dfisp[lay of gear selection, it's ERGO brain for Campag,
    Flightdeck for shimano.

    See my posts about how this shouldn't really require any mechanical parts or
    modifications. It's all in the math. I could probably write a program to do
    this in an hour, provided the necessary numbers (wheel circumference & rpm,
    cadence & gear teeth).

    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:

    --
    Kovie
    [email hidden]


  18. On Thu, 23 Jun 2005 07:58:36 GMT, "Kovie" <[email hidden]>

    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:


    Hi, maybe you could adapt a Shimano optical indicator to your needs. I
    use the 9-speed version with my DA shifters.
    Here is what I am thinking. If they make a 10-speed version, all the
    better, but either way, overall travel should be the same, so the
    9-speed would work. You would have to redo your handlebar tape, to
    expose part of the cable, where you would insert the indicator. There
    you have it.

    I don't like looking down to the rear. I don't mind glancing at the
    chainrings. And with 9-10 rear cogs, it is hard to tell what gear you
    are in anyway. Looking down isn't very safe and often when you would
    like to know what gear you are in, is at times, when safety is an
    issue.

    Life is Good!
    Jeff

    As for your suggestion, I have a Campy setup, so I'm not sure this would
    work. But I still think that adapting a computer to do this makes the most
    sense. With cadence it would have all the information it needs to calculate
    this, and display either gear-units or actual gears.

    Hi, I just checked Shimano's technical website. They do make a
    10-speed optical indicator. Are you familiar with them?
    Like I said, you would have to expose a section of your shift cable,
    along the handlebar. I would bet that it would work.

    Now, from reading your other posts, it seems to me that you want a
    computer solution. Well, then the obvious solution is to pay the bucks
    and get the Ergo brain. I have a Cateye Astrale which is a nice
    computer, but you probably aren't going to adapt anything to it, for
    less money than the Campy Ergo.

    So, I guess it boils down to, do you want a solution, or do you just
    want to speculate?

    Life is Good!
    Jeff

  19. "Jeff Starr" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
    news:[email hidden]...

    Quoted message said:

    On Thu, 23 Jun 2005 07:58:36 GMT, "Kovie" <[email hidden]>

    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:


    Hi, maybe you could adapt a Shimano optical indicator to your needs. I
    use the 9-speed version with my DA shifters.
    Here is what I am thinking. If they make a 10-speed version, all the
    better, but either way, overall travel should be the same, so the
    9-speed would work. You would have to redo your handlebar tape, to
    expose part of the cable, where you would insert the indicator. There
    you have it.

    I don't like looking down to the rear. I don't mind glancing at the
    chainrings. And with 9-10 rear cogs, it is hard to tell what gear you
    are in anyway. Looking down isn't very safe and often when you would
    like to know what gear you are in, is at times, when safety is an
    issue.

    Life is Good!
    Jeff

    As for your suggestion, I have a Campy setup, so I'm not sure this would
    work. But I still think that adapting a computer to do this makes the most
    sense. With cadence it would have all the information it needs to
    calculate
    this, and display either gear-units or actual gears.

    Hi, I just checked Shimano's technical website. They do make a
    10-speed optical indicator. Are you familiar with them?

    As I've explained several times, I have a Campy setup so I don't think this
    would be compatible. And even if it were, as you correctly surmise below,
    and I thought I made pretty clear, I do want a purely computer solution,
    without any mechanical modifications or additions, and which I think is
    completely feasible. And so far no one's explained why it isn't.

    Quoted message said:

    Like I said, you would have to expose a section of your shift cable,
    along the handlebar. I would bet that it would work.

    Quoted message said:

    Now, from reading your other posts, it seems to me that you want a
    computer solution. Well, then the obvious solution is to pay the bucks
    and get the Ergo brain. I have a Cateye Astrale which is a nice
    computer, but you probably aren't going to adapt anything to it, for
    less money than the Campy Ergo.

    So, I guess it boils down to, do you want a solution, or do you just
    want to speculate?

    Life is Good!
    Jeff

    Sometimes it feels like I'm talking to myself. There's no way that the Ergo
    is worth $150 for what it does. It doesn't have heart rate, power or any
    other fancy features. Campy's charging a premium for it because there's no
    competition and there are people rich or foolish enough to pay this much for
    it. I see no reason at all for why a competitor couldn't come out with a
    similar computer for half the price or less, with the same features. If you
    or others don't agree, tell me why, specifically, this can't or won't be
    done, instead of telling me to put up or shut up (in so many words). Where
    the tendency to knock down others' ideas without explaining why they're
    unworkable comes from eludes me.

    --
    Kovie
    [email hidden]

  20. Quoting Kovie <[email hidden]>:

    Quoted message said:

    weight and complexity with little to no real added value. Sometimes the old
    and tested way works, and sometimes new's better. How many high-mileage
    cyclists still use down-tube shifters, excepting vintage bikes of course?

    A lot of them use bar-end shifters which are pretty old and tested.

    Quoted message said:

    than me, of course). How many still use heavy leather saddles? Again, except
    for vintage bikes, not many, I'd guess.

    I estimate at least 1/3 of British touring cyclists use Brookses. They may
    be heavy (except when compared to the weight of the rider) but they're
    comfortable. I did the End to End on a Brooks B-17 Narrow - am I going to
    save 300 grams to change it for some unknown lump of plastic? I think not.
    --
    David Damerell <[email hidden]> flcl?
    Today is Epithumia, Presuary - a weekend.

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