Caught in Rain

"Bob Palermo" <[email hidden]> wrote:

[snip]

Quoted message said:

So, how careful do I need to be when riding on the rain? How much can you
lean before sliding out? Any other tips for riding on wet roads?

If you live in an area where it rains frequently, I'd take your bike
out into a parking lot--wearing knee-pads, elbow pads, your gloves,
and your helmet--and start screwing around with turning.
Experimentation will lead you to a better understanding of your
traction limits. Sticking a foot out will nearly always prevent an
actual fall.

Quoted message said:

When I was done, I and my bike were soaked. In fact, when I spin the back
wheel, I can hear water sloshing. Is the water in the rim or in the hub? How
do I get it out? It seems spinning the tire gets some out a little at a
time. There also seems to be a tiny bit of sloshing in the front wheel, but
much less than the back. Any suggestions?

Also, what else do I need to do? What do I need to dry? Should I lube the
chain? What about the brakes and derailleur? Anything else?

I stole this, verbatim, from some other post in the late '70s. I
liked it, so . . . by popular demand . . . :

"POST-RAIN MAINTENANCE:

For my non-winter bikes, that still see some rainy days, I usually do
the above more of a wash with soap, and I'll pop the chain off and
clean it thoroughly in solvent and then lube/install (use a
Wipperman). I will at a minimum pop the bolt out of the cable guide
underneath the BB shell to let water drain, and possibly pull the
seatpost to drain the seat tube. However, I use aluminum posts and I
grease the seat tube liberally so I usually only do this after a few
rainy rides. If I used a carbon post or carbon frame and could not use
grease, I would pull the post every rainy ride. Trek OCLV frames are
notorious for having seat tubes full of water after riding in the
rain.

On your machine, the Bontrager wheels have sealed hubs. Not much to do
but wait until the bearings fail, I mean, they can't be serviced. If
you want to be thorough, clean the cassette by either "flossing it
with a rag" or take it off and scrub it. When washing, don't spray
water directly at the hubs or bottom bracket. Ditto with the King HS,
but that sucker will withstand a lot of wet riding with no
maintenance. I would definitely drain the BB shell as described above,
drain the water from the rims, and also clean off your brake pads when
you have the wheels out of the frame."

Neil Brooks said:

"Bob Palermo" <[email hidden]> wrote:

[snip]

Quoted message said:

So, how careful do I need to be when riding on the rain? How much can
you
lean before sliding out? Any other tips for riding on wet roads?

If you live in an area where it rains frequently, I'd take your bike
out into a parking lot--wearing knee-pads, elbow pads, your gloves,
and your helmet--and start screwing around with turning.
Experimentation will lead you to a better understanding of your
traction limits. Sticking a foot out will nearly always prevent an
actual fall.

You know in a 100k I rode early this year, it was drizzling, and I was
going down a hill. I took one foot out of my pedals and had it out in
case I feel. I guy passed me and said that it wasn't wise to take a foot
out, but I still don't understand why. I'd rather land on my foot than my
butt or worse yet put my arm out.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

When I was done, I and my bike were soaked. In fact, when I spin the
back
wheel, I can hear water sloshing. Is the water in the rim or in the
hub? How
do I get it out? It seems spinning the tire gets some out a little at a
time. There also seems to be a tiny bit of sloshing in the front wheel,
but
much less than the back. Any suggestions?

Also, what else do I need to do? What do I need to dry? Should I lube
the
chain? What about the brakes and derailleur? Anything else?

I stole this, verbatim, from some other post in the late '70s. I
liked it, so . . . by popular demand . . . :

"POST-RAIN MAINTENANCE:

For my non-winter bikes, that still see some rainy days, I usually do
the above more of a wash with soap, and I'll pop the chain off and
clean it thoroughly in solvent and then lube/install (use a
Wipperman). I will at a minimum pop the bolt out of the cable guide
underneath the BB shell to let water drain, and possibly pull the
seatpost to drain the seat tube. However, I use aluminum posts and I
grease the seat tube liberally so I usually only do this after a few
rainy rides. If I used a carbon post or carbon frame and could not use
grease, I would pull the post every rainy ride. Trek OCLV frames are
notorious for having seat tubes full of water after riding in the
rain.

On your machine, the Bontrager wheels have sealed hubs. Not much to do
but wait until the bearings fail, I mean, they can't be serviced. If
you want to be thorough, clean the cassette by either "flossing it
with a rag" or take it off and scrub it. When washing, don't spray
water directly at the hubs or bottom bracket. Ditto with the King HS,
but that sucker will withstand a lot of wet riding with no
maintenance. I would definitely drain the BB shell as described above,
drain the water from the rims, and also clean off your brake pads when
you have the wheels out of the frame."

--
Bob in CT

Quoted message said:

Hi,

Today while riding, I got caught in a rainstorm. It was a hard rain, though
not torrential, that lasted about 20 minutes. It wasn't real pleasant.

Me too. 24 mile ride home in floods and torrential rain! What a
bummer.

Quoted message said:

I was very concerned about
traction and was worried about sliding out.

And rightly so.

Quoted message said:

I took almost every curve and
turn gingerly, slowing considerably before reaching them and then coasting
through them. I tried to keep the bike as upright as possible,

Good move, pretty much text book stuff.

Quoted message said:

So, how careful do I need to be when riding on the rain?

Basically, VERY! Do you drive a car? IF so, bet you slow down more on
country lane corners when it's been, or has been raining.

Quoted message said:

How much can you
lean before sliding out?

About that much. Impossible to say. Depends on amount of rain, road
surface, road condition, mud, gravel, tyre condition, tyre pressure,
rider weight etc. The only real answer is "not as much as you can when
in the dry on a good surface. I stacked it last December on a wet road
and slid for many metres before coming to a stop when hitting the kerb.
I consider myself a good rider, obviously I lent too much!

Quoted message said:

Any other tips for riding on wet roads?

I tend to ride lower tyre pressures when it's wet, as I do when it's
icy. I run 700c x 23's at about 100, as opposed to 130 in good
conditions.

Get some mudguards? Won't stop you crashing, but will make the ride
more enjoyable...no wet ass!

--
Mark
______________________________________
Nerves of Steel, Heart of Gold, Knob of Butter

There have been a number of threads about how to handle your bike
post-rain ride.

For your wheels - find the small hole on in the rim and put both of
them in direct contact with a towel on the ground. Lean the bike on a
low chair with the hole side down in contact with the towel and it will
drain as gravity and capilary action (wicking properties of the towel)
work for you. It will never get completely dry in there without
removing the tire, but this will get them mostly dry.

For the bike, I usually take out the seatpost and try to slosh out as
much as possible. With the post out, I put the bike back on it's
wheels with the rear wheel elevated so all water runs to the BB. Tape
the cable guide under the BB in place, and remove the small torx bolt
that holds it in place. Again, adding a dry towel will help, but leave
it overnight and you'll get your frame plenty dry.

"Neil Brooks" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

"Bob Palermo" <[email hidden]> wrote:

[snip]

Quoted message said:

So, how careful do I need to be when riding on the rain? How

much can you

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

lean before sliding out? Any other tips for riding on wet

roads?

Quoted message said:

If you live in an area where it rains frequently, I'd take your

bike

Quoted message said:

out into a parking lot--wearing knee-pads, elbow pads, your

gloves,

Quoted message said:

and your helmet--and start screwing around with turning.
Experimentation will lead you to a better understanding of your
traction limits. Sticking a foot out will nearly always

prevent an

Quoted message said:

actual fall.

Quoted message said:

When I was done, I and my bike were soaked. In fact, when I

spin the back

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

wheel, I can hear water sloshing. Is the water in the rim or

in the hub? How

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

do I get it out? It seems spinning the tire gets some out a

little at a

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

time. There also seems to be a tiny bit of sloshing in the

front wheel, but

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

much less than the back. Any suggestions?

Also, what else do I need to do? What do I need to dry? Should

I lube the

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

chain? What about the brakes and derailleur? Anything else?

I stole this, verbatim, from some other post in the late '70s.

I

Quoted message said:

liked it, so . . . by popular demand . . . :

"POST-RAIN MAINTENANCE:

For my non-winter bikes, that still see some rainy days, I

usually do

Quoted message said:

the above more of a wash with soap, and I'll pop the chain off

and

Quoted message said:

clean it thoroughly in solvent and then lube/install (use a
Wipperman). I will at a minimum pop the bolt out of the cable

guide

Quoted message said:

underneath the BB shell to let water drain, and possibly pull

the

Quoted message said:

seatpost to drain the seat tube. However, I use aluminum posts

and I

Quoted message said:

grease the seat tube liberally so I usually only do this after

a few

Quoted message said:

rainy rides. If I used a carbon post or carbon frame and could

not use

Quoted message said:

grease, I would pull the post every rainy ride. Trek OCLV

frames are

Quoted message said:

notorious for having seat tubes full of water after riding in

the

Quoted message said:

rain.

On your machine, the Bontrager wheels have sealed hubs. Not

much to do

Quoted message said:

but wait until the bearings fail, I mean, they can't be

serviced. If

Quoted message said:

you want to be thorough, clean the cassette by either "flossing

it

Quoted message said:

with a rag" or take it off and scrub it. When washing, don't

spray

Quoted message said:

water directly at the hubs or bottom bracket. Ditto with the

King HS,

Quoted message said:

but that sucker will withstand a lot of wet riding with no
maintenance. I would definitely drain the BB shell as described

above,

Quoted message said:

drain the water from the rims, and also clean off your brake

pads when

Quoted message said:

you have the wheels out of the frame."

Or, if you are like me and commute in the rain for about half the
year, you bounce the bike up and down to get the big drops off,
and then you lean it against the wall in the garage, go inside
and put your cleats on the shoe dryer and get into dry clothes.
Squirt the chain with 30 weight every so often and then throw it
away when it wears out. Blast the derailleur pivots and pulleys
with some light oil now and then to supress squeaking. As the
rainy season nears an end, clean the bike off so you can see what
color it is and check for cracks, etc. Put on new Salmon Kool
Stop brake pads (I change mine at least twice a year).
Thoroughly clean and lube everything in July while watching
coverage of the Tour de France.

As far as traction goes, get a good carbon black tire -- or one
of the newer Michelins with carbon and silica in a soft compound.
I have ridden on some colored silica based tires that were pretty
bad. The early clay based colored tires were suicide in the rain.
Resign yourself to the fact that you will have to slow down when
descending twisting roads. Crashing in the rain is usually not
too bad because you slide, but on the other hand, it usually
means you destroy an expensive rain jacket or jersey or both. --
Jay Beattie.

Hi,

To get the water out of the rear wheel, I let out most of the air and hand
cranked the pedals. A lot of the water seemed to come out. I'll try your
idea of finding the wheel holes and leaning the bike

Also, In the course of moving the bike around, I lifted the front wheel
high, with the rear wheel on the ground. About 2 ounces of water drained out
of some holes at the end of the chain stays. I was surprised to see so much
water come out. Did it get in through the bottom bracket? I'm hoping that
the holes in the chain stays were for the purpose of draining the bottom
bracket and I don't need to take out the screw at the bottom of the bottom
bracket.

Bob Palermo

"Andrew F Martin" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

There have been a number of threads about how to handle your bike
post-rain ride.

For your wheels - find the small hole on in the rim and put both of
them in direct contact with a towel on the ground. Lean the bike on a
low chair with the hole side down in contact with the towel and it will
drain as gravity and capilary action (wicking properties of the towel)
work for you. It will never get completely dry in there without
removing the tire, but this will get them mostly dry.

For the bike, I usually take out the seatpost and try to slosh out as
much as possible. With the post out, I put the bike back on it's
wheels with the rear wheel elevated so all water runs to the BB. Tape
the cable guide under the BB in place, and remove the small torx bolt
that holds it in place. Again, adding a dry towel will help, but leave
it overnight and you'll get your frame plenty dry.

Bob Palermo said:

So, how careful do I need to be when riding on the rain? How much can you
lean before sliding out? Any other tips for riding on wet roads?

It depends on the pavement, and whether or not oil is present. If it
hasn't rained in awhile, there may be a lot of oil coming up from the
pavement (dripped from cars) that can make it slick. Also, the paint
lines can be very smooth and therefore slick when they are wet.

But most pavement is rough enough that a bicycle wheel with it's
pointed contact patch will not lose much traction. I ride in the rain a
lot and don't slow down except for a little on turns, unless I'm
crossing a paint line or see an oily spot. So far, so good...

Quoted message said:

Also, what else do I need to do? What do I need to dry? Should I lube the
chain? What about the brakes and derailleur? Anything else?

I'll tell you what works for me. I take a bucket of soapy water and a
rag and clean off the bike, and rinse with an open hose (low pressure).
Then I take it in the house and put a fan on it to dry it off. This is
an important step (especially in a humid climate) because you really
can't lube it until it is dry. After the bike is dry (couple hours), I
lube everything external (brakes, levers, derailleurs, QRs, etc) with
Gunk Silicone spray with a rag handy to catch drips and wipe, and lube
the chain. Then if I'm feeling ambitious, I'll wipe all the external
parts with Pledge. The whole bit takes around 20 minutes of work.

BTW, I just drill a hole in the bottom of the bottom bracket shell on
the frame to let the water out... I don't want my bearings sitting in a
puddle even during the ride.

Bob Palermo said:

Hi,

Today while riding, I got caught in a rainstorm. It was a hard rain, though
not torrential, that lasted about 20 minutes. It wasn't real pleasant.

But it's normal. If someone doesn't get caught in the rain once in a
while, they live in an unusual climate, or they don't bike enough!

Quoted message said:

So, how careful do I need to be when riding on the rain? How much can you
lean before sliding out? Any other tips for riding on wet roads?

Well, there are things to watch for. Your braking distance will be
greater, and you probably want to be more careful braking anyway.
Obvious, I suppose.

I'm very conservative on curves in the rain. As someone else said,
roads are especially slippery during the first, oh, fifteen minutes of
rain after a dry spell, because of accumulated oil that hasn't yet
washed off. But hard rains can also wash sand or gravel onto the
roadway.

Be wary of puddles. Some puddles are actually potholes in disguise.
Hitting one can ruin your day, if not your tire and rim.

I tend to ride further into the traffic lane in the rain. There are
several reasons: The potholes are usually more to the right. Same for
the sand and gravel. Same for the glass, and wet glass goes through
wet rubber in a flash - and patching tires in the rain is the pits.
Also, road spray from cars is the pits, and riding further out usually
means they'll pass you with a wider margin.

About the bike: I really like fenders. If there's a decent chance of
rain, I'll put mine on. It takes only a few minutes, and it makes
things much more tolerable. Not pleasant, usually, but tolerable.
Don't mess with little clip-on things. Get real, full-coverage
fenders.

- Frank Krygowski

"Bob Palermo" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Hi,

Today while riding, I got caught in a rainstorm. > When I was done, I and
my bike were soaked. In fact, when I spin the back wheel, I can hear water
sloshing. Is the water in the rim or in the hub? How do I get it out? It
seems spinning the tire gets some out a little at a time. There also seems
to be a tiny bit of sloshing in the front wheel, but much less than the
back. Any suggestions?

Also, what else do I need to do? What do I need to dry? Should I lube the
chain? What about the brakes and derailleur? Anything else?

Thanks for any advice you can give me

Bob Palermo

I live on the wet coast, and get soaked several times a year. If you are
riding a lot in the rain, especially commuting, I recommend the following
bike components:

- Old-style road hubs with lubrication ports in the middle (such as Campy
Record)
- Suntour or WTB Grease Guard headsets and bottom bracket
- A frame that has drainage in the bottom bracket and all four stays.

After I get caught in a deluge, I put the bike on the stand and squirt out
the old grease on the BB, hubs and headset with a grease gun. Takes only a
minute. The old grease generally comes out milky grey, indicating that
water and grit has gotten in. I'd hate to think of the damage that this
foul mix would cause if left to sit for a few days. If you know there is
water in your hubs or BB, then you should overhaul them ASAP.

You should lube your chain - yes, obviously.

Bob Palermo said:

So, how careful do I need to be when riding on the rain? How much can you
lean before sliding out? Any other tips for riding on wet roads?

you crash a couple of times, then you learn about how to lean and break.
honest, no better way than experience and everyone slides every once in
a while. keep tire preassure to max and avoid riding on the signs
painted on the road
dan

dan_s said:

you crash a couple of times, then you learn about how to lean and break.

that's to brake...

ahem :?

Bob Palermo said:

Hi,

Today while riding, I got caught in a rainstorm. It was a hard rain, though
not torrential, that lasted about 20 minutes.

Quoted message said:

So, how careful do I need to be when riding on the rain? How much can you
lean before sliding out? Any other tips for riding on wet roads?

Quoted message said:

Also, what else do I need to do? What do I need to dry? Should I lube the
chain? What about the brakes and derailleur? Anything else?

Wet roads have less traction, but most cyclists never approach the
limits of traction anyway. I don't typically slow down at all when
riding in the rain (no hairpin curves around here).

Metal surfaces can be very much more slippery when wet. Some road
marking paints can be slippery, too. RR tracks become really hazardous.

Wet rims may cause several seconds of delay before brakes start being
effective. It's wise to allow for this and/or dry your rims by dragging
brakes if you're in a stop & go environment where fast braking is needed.

Potholes may lurk under any puddle. A way to avoid them is to ride along
the fog line (or median line if the road is empty), you can see the
potholes then.

I just bounce & wipe my bike after riding in the rain. I try to get the
water off the chain, as it will rust pretty fast. If the rain riding was
long, it'll need lube, I'll just add some after wiping.

If you ride in the rain a lot, you'll wear down rims. A partial solution
to this is to use hard brake pads which don't pick up road grit.
KoolStop salmon-colored are the best. If you use soft pads, you should
dig the grit out before it cuts too much metal.

Most water gets into the frame at the top of the seattube, a good reason
to keep that junction well greased. A hole in the BB shell allows
drainage without disassembling anything.

I don't worry about water in the rims. I check pedals, hubs, headsets
and BBs once a year or so for contaminated grease. I clean and lube
seatposts about as often, quill stems about twice a year.

If you ride in the rain a lot, fenders are more comfortable and keep the
maintenance chores down somewhat.

dan_s said:

dan_s said:

you crash a couple of times, then you learn about how to lean and break.

that's to brake...

Brake or break.

Ron

Hi,

The reason I'm somewhat leery about traction was because of a fall I had
last year. I was on my mountain bike going over a wooden bridge that was
wet. The bridge had a 30 degree turn in it. Despite slowing down to about 12
mph, almost immediately after I started the turn, I slid out and took it on
my hip. The bruise was bad but the pulled groin was worse. I was out of
commission for 4 weeks and not fully recovered for another 4 weeks beyond
that. That ride actually turned out to be my last ride of the year, as it
happened in late September and I live in Minnesota and don't ride in the
cold weather. So I had all winter to think about it.

For my first few rides this spring, I was pretty cautious but am getting
more confident as the season progresses. I haven't had to ride on wet roads
this year until yesterday, when I got caught in a storm. I'm happy that I
had enough nerve to continue riding but I felt little confidence on the
road, especially on turning. I figured out the braking pretty easily, after
my first attempt took longer than expected. I realised that braking early
was the way to go. But I was not confident enough to pedal through or lean
even through curves, no less turns.

As far as maintenence goes. I hand dried the outside of the bike. It wasn't
dirty at all. I spun the water out of the rims and drained the tiny bit left
out of the holes in the rims. I drained the water that was in the frame, out
of the holes at the end of the chain stays. About 2 ounces of water was in
there, which I assume was from the bottom bracket. I picked up the bike and
turned it upside down and listened for any water in the seat tube. I heard
none. I used some solvent to clean the chain and then re-lubed it. I'll
probably also re-lube the brakes and derailleurs before I ride/

Thanks for the advice.

Bob Palermo

"Peter Cole" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Bob Palermo said:

Hi,

Today while riding, I got caught in a rainstorm. It was a hard rain,
though not torrential, that lasted about 20 minutes.

Quoted message said:

So, how careful do I need to be when riding on the rain? How much can you
lean before sliding out? Any other tips for riding on wet roads?

Quoted message said:

Also, what else do I need to do? What do I need to dry? Should I lube the
chain? What about the brakes and derailleur? Anything else?

Wet roads have less traction, but most cyclists never approach the limits
of traction anyway. I don't typically slow down at all when riding in the
rain (no hairpin curves around here).

Metal surfaces can be very much more slippery when wet. Some road marking
paints can be slippery, too. RR tracks become really hazardous.

Wet rims may cause several seconds of delay before brakes start being
effective. It's wise to allow for this and/or dry your rims by dragging
brakes if you're in a stop & go environment where fast braking is needed.

Potholes may lurk under any puddle. A way to avoid them is to ride along
the fog line (or median line if the road is empty), you can see the
potholes then.

I just bounce & wipe my bike after riding in the rain. I try to get the
water off the chain, as it will rust pretty fast. If the rain riding was
long, it'll need lube, I'll just add some after wiping.

If you ride in the rain a lot, you'll wear down rims. A partial solution
to this is to use hard brake pads which don't pick up road grit. KoolStop
salmon-colored are the best. If you use soft pads, you should dig the grit
out before it cuts too much metal.

Most water gets into the frame at the top of the seattube, a good reason
to keep that junction well greased. A hole in the BB shell allows drainage
without disassembling anything.

I don't worry about water in the rims. I check pedals, hubs, headsets and
BBs once a year or so for contaminated grease. I clean and lube seatposts
about as often, quill stems about twice a year.

If you ride in the rain a lot, fenders are more comfortable and keep the
maintenance chores down somewhat.

FYI -- lugged mountain bike tires have terrible traction on slick
surfaces like a wet wooden bridge. In fact, wet wooden bridges are
like ice and the only thing you can do is keep a straight line to the
extent possible, go slowly and use your back brake. If you lock up the
front even a little, you are history -- unless you have exceptional
skills recovering from a front wheel slip out. Try fat slicks and rear
braking. I think you are anguishing too much about riding in the rain,
especially for someone who lives in Minn. and sees ice and sub-zero
temperatures in the winter. -- Jay Beattie.

Bob Palermo said:

Hi,

The reason I'm somewhat leery about traction was because of a fall I had
last year. I was on my mountain bike going over a wooden bridge that was
wet. The bridge had a 30 degree turn in it. Despite slowing down to about 12
mph, almost immediately after I started the turn, I slid out and took it on
my hip. The bruise was bad but the pulled groin was worse. I was out of
commission for 4 weeks and not fully recovered for another 4 weeks beyond
that. That ride actually turned out to be my last ride of the year, as it
happened in late September and I live in Minnesota and don't ride in the
cold weather. So I had all winter to think about it.

I busted up a few things on a mountain bike and slick pavement too (cold
mix asphalt). It was a front brake deal as well, a stupid mistake on my
part. I went down faster than I could realize it was happening. I was
running semi slick street tires and don't recall that I was going very
fast at all.

Have since switched 100% to road bikes. Wet slick surfaces I notice on
the road bike are bricks and the supposedly "nonskid" surfaces that my
town is starting to put down on the handicap curb ramps when they redo
the curbing. That brown concrete-like ramp material is like ice on my
22s when it is dry.