Campy Ergo Record vs. Chorus Question

I've got Record shifters on one bike, Chorus on two others. My observation
would be that they both start out somewhat stiff and soften as the springs
wear. The springs are replaceable, and replacing them restores the original
stiffness (and quickness) of the shifts. If your father likes Ultegra, why
not acknowledge that?

On 7/11/07 7:31 AM, in article
[email hidden], "D'ohBoy"

Quoted message said:

With my pre-2007 shifters, my Record ergos have a significantly softer
click than my Chorus.

Is that still true for the 2007? I am building a bike for my father
who had Ultegra for years and would probably be more amenable to the
softer clicks like I get from my Record shifters but if the Chorus now
have the same feel as the Record, then there's no need to spend the
extra cash.

TIA

D'ohBoy

Sons and daughters, don't let your father get stuck with Shimano! Get
'em the good stuff.

A couple I ride with went from Treks with Shimano to Italian bikes
(Pinarello for her, Colnago for him) with Campagnolo earlier this year.
They both like the "Italian junk", as he calls it.

I've been converted since 1995. I have to stop and think about how to
shift Shimano equipped bikes when I try to help someone who is in the
wrong gear.

Allan Leedy said:

I've got Record shifters on one bike, Chorus on two others. My observation
would be that they both start out somewhat stiff and soften as the springs
wear. The springs are replaceable, and replacing them restores the original
stiffness (and quickness) of the shifts. If your father likes Ultegra, why
not acknowledge that?

On 7/11/07 7:31 AM, in article
[email hidden], "D'ohBoy"

Quoted message said:

With my pre-2007 shifters, my Record ergos have a significantly softer
click than my Chorus.

Is that still true for the 2007? I am building a bike for my father
who had Ultegra for years and would probably be more amenable to the
softer clicks like I get from my Record shifters but if the Chorus now
have the same feel as the Record, then there's no need to spend the
extra cash.

TIA

D'ohBoy

Colin Campbell TOP POSTED:

Quoted message said:

Sons and daughters, don't let your father get stuck with Shimano! Get
'em the good stuff.

Go SRAM!!!

--
Tom Sherman - Holstein-Friesland Bovinia
The weather is here, wish you were beautiful

--
Posted via a free Usenet account from http://www.teranews.com

D'ohBoy said:

With my pre-2007 shifters, my Record ergos have a significantly softer
click than my Chorus.

Is that still true for the 2007? I am building a bike for my father
who had Ultegra for years and would probably be more amenable to the
softer clicks like I get from my Record shifters but if the Chorus now
have the same feel as the Record, then there's no need to spend the
extra cash.

TIA

D'ohBoy

Record and Chorus innards are the same(2007 and 2006) except for a
teflon coating on the shift disc for Record and a 'fiber' spring
carrier. All else is the same. In my experience, these 2 shifters feel
the same.

D'ohBoy said:

With my pre-2007 shifters, my Record ergos have a significantly softer
click than my Chorus.

Is that still true for the 2007? I am building a bike for my father
who had Ultegra for years and would probably be more amenable to the
softer clicks like I get from my Record shifters but if the Chorus now
have the same feel as the Record, then there's no need to spend the
extra cash.

TIA

D'ohBoy

Related to another poster, It is 'nice' that Sram is changing their
design already, particularly the FD, but disappointing that they
didn't do this at the first go. Sram works well enough but the FD
action and the foldable big ring(both corrected in 'Red'😉 should have
been corrected with first gen Force and Rival.

OEM is seeing lots of Sram and we have had a Sram group early on onto
a bike but interest has been 'slow' with no new bikes with it from our
shop(no bikes OEM here, thanks).

"Johnny Sunset aka Tom Sherman" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Colin Campbell TOP POSTED:

Quoted message said:

Sons and daughters, don't let your father get stuck with Shimano! Get
'em the good stuff.

Go SRAM!!!

--
Tom Sherman - Holstein-Friesland Bovinia
The weather is here, wish you were beautiful

--
Posted via a free Usenet account from http://www.teranews.com

Went SRAM on a new bike this spring. Been riding STI since the first DuraAce
8 speed. Much to my surprise, I find my STI equipped bikes totally
non-intuitive. Double tap really works and seems natural.
Bill

On Jul 11, 7:51 pm, Allan Leedy <[email hidden]> wrote (in part):

Quoted message said:

If your father likes Ultegra, why
not acknowledge that?

He fell in love with my Campy one day. His Ultegra is crapping out on
him, and he wants something better.

D'ohBoy

Qui si parla Campagnolo said:

D'ohBoy said:

With my pre-2007 shifters, my Record ergos have a significantly softer
click than my Chorus.

Is that still true for the 2007? I am building a bike for my father
who had Ultegra for years and would probably be more amenable to the
softer clicks like I get from my Record shifters but if the Chorus now
have the same feel as the Record, then there's no need to spend the
extra cash.

TIA

D'ohBoy

Just rebuild it and pack a lot of grease in. There may be a little
stickiness on some shifts (the direction that loosens the cable) at
first, but once broken in it's really nice and smooth and quiet. I've
really grown to hate the loud click on stock ungreased Campy shifters.
Just like the loud clicking freewheeling cassettes on urban group
bikerides in traffic.

Quoted message said:

Record and Chorus innards are the same(2007 and 2006) except for a
teflon coating on the shift disc for Record and a 'fiber' spring
carrier. All else is the same. In my experience, these 2 shifters feel
the same.

Those teflon coated and fiber spring parts cost a fortune to replace.
I found that branford didn't even have the significantly cheaper old
versions of those parts available (I think it's solely a weight
"penalty", rather than a "smoothness" of shifting issue), so I rebuilt
very used shifters without replacing anything, even the springs, and
they work just fine with all the old parts. I'm going to rebuild the
other two ergo pairs similarly. Once you've done the job it's a snap,
so if the grease get's all cruddy after a few years it's no big deal
to rebuild when you cable change.

Bill Westphal

Bill Westphal said:

Qui si parla Campagnolo said:

D'ohBoy said:

With my pre-2007 shifters, my Record ergos have a significantly softer
click than my Chorus.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Is that still true for the 2007? I am building a bike for my father
who had Ultegra for years and would probably be more amenable to the
softer clicks like I get from my Record shifters but if the Chorus now
have the same feel as the Record, then there's no need to spend the
extra cash.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

TIA

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

D'ohBoy

Just rebuild it and pack a lot of grease in. There may be a little
stickiness on some shifts (the direction that loosens the cable) at
first, but once broken in it's really nice and smooth and quiet. I've
really grown to hate the loud click on stock ungreased Campy shifters.
Just like the loud clicking freewheeling cassettes on urban group
bikerides in traffic.

Quoted message said:

Record and Chorus innards are the same(2007 and 2006) except for a
teflon coating on the shift disc for Record and a 'fiber' spring
carrier. All else is the same. In my experience, these 2 shifters feel
the same.

Those teflon coated and fiber spring parts cost a fortune to replace.

errrr, the Chorus 10s disc costs the same as the Record one and the
fiber spring carrier is $5 more($15 vs $10)..Hardly a fortune.

Quoted message said:

I found that branford didn't even have the significantly cheaper old
versions of those parts available (I think it's solely a weight
"penalty", rather than a "smoothness" of shifting issue), so I rebuilt
very used shifters without replacing anything, even the springs, and
they work just fine with all the old parts. I'm going to rebuild the
other two ergo pairs similarly. Once you've done the job it's a snap,
so if the grease get's all cruddy after a few years it's no big deal
to rebuild when you cable change.

Bill Westphal

Qui si parla Campagnolo said:

Bill Westphal said:

Qui si parla Campagnolo said:

On Jul 11, 8:31 am, D'ohBoy <[email hidden]> wrote:
> With my pre-2007 shifters, my Record ergos have a significantly softer
> click than my Chorus.

Quoted message said:

> Is that still true for the 2007? I am building a bike for my father
> who had Ultegra for years and would probably be more amenable to the
> softer clicks like I get from my Record shifters but if the Chorus now
> have the same feel as the Record, then there's no need to spend the
> extra cash.

Quoted message said:

> TIA

Quoted message said:

> D'ohBoy

Just rebuild it and pack a lot of grease in. There may be a little
stickiness on some shifts (the direction that loosens the cable) at
first, but once broken in it's really nice and smooth and quiet. I've
really grown to hate the loud click on stock ungreased Campy shifters.
Just like the loud clicking freewheeling cassettes on urban group
bikerides in traffic.

Quoted message said:

Record and Chorus innards are the same(2007 and 2006) except for a
teflon coating on the shift disc for Record and a 'fiber' spring
carrier. All else is the same. In my experience, these 2 shifters feel
the same.

Those teflon coated and fiber spring parts cost a fortune to replace.

errrr, the Chorus 10s disc costs the same as the Record one and the
fiber spring carrier is $5 more($15 vs $10)..Hardly a fortune.

Quoted message said:

I found that branford didn't even have the significantly cheaper old
versions of those parts available (I think it's solely a weight
"penalty", rather than a "smoothness" of shifting issue), so I rebuilt
very used shifters without replacing anything, even the springs, and
they work just fine with all the old parts. I'm going to rebuild the
other two ergo pairs similarly. Once you've done the job it's a snap,
so if the grease get's all cruddy after a few years it's no big deal
to rebuild when you cable change.

Bill Westphal

The "fortune" was coming from memory. I took notes when I did the
shifter job, and attach below. Somewhere in here there is a "fortune"
to be made by Campy/Branford for saving me mere grams. I thought them
too greedy with their "recommendations", so I outsmarted them, and no
one got a nickel:

* branford bike order, spoke with new owner Rod Wagner Mon, 04/23/07
(206)323-1218

campagnolo blue ergo manual 1998-current $4.88
cost to rebuild a lever: $55 for parts, $40-$50 for labor

"We recommend replacing the
- G springs,
- Ergo Index gear,
- Thumb Button spring and
- Ergo Coil
spring when rebuilding a right side lever."

What about left side lever?
Can I use improved record parts for centaur rebuild, such as

"Teflon coated, Ergo Index gear for smoother shifting and a carbon
polymer, G spring carrier for greater durability

"You can upgrade any 1999 to current right hand 10 speed Ergo shifter
to Ultra shifting by simply replacing the above three parts

- ultra 01 index gear
- carbon carrier teflon washer
- carbon G Spring Carrier

Is the ultra 10 just a lightweight 10? difference in price 54 vs 44

Right side:

(from campy ergo lever parts - 1, 2, 3 and 4)
thumb button return spring right EC-RE215 $ 5.88
thumb button return lever right EC-RE204 $24.88
G spring right EC-RE-209 2 @ $ 5.88ea. = $11.76

(from campy ergo lever parts - 5 and 6)
finger shift lever return right EC-RE137 $ 5.88
ultra 10 index gear right EC-RE161 $54.88
-or
10 index gear right EC-RE061 $44.88
carbon G spring carrier right EC-RE065 $15.88
carbon G Spring Carrier
teflon coated bushing EC-RE157 $ 3.88

alloy G Spring Carrier right EC-RE111 $ 9.88

(from campy ergo lever parts - 14, 15, 18 and 19)
coil spring right EC-RE055 $ 9.88

Left side:

(from campy ergo lever parts - 1, 2, 3 and 4)
thumb button return spring left EC-RE216 $ 5.88
thumb button return lever left EC-RE205 $24.88
G spring left EC-RE-210 2 @ $ 5.88ea. = $11.76

(from campy ergo lever parts - 5 and 6)
finger shift lever return left EC-RE138 $5.88
ergo (ultra) index gear left EC-RE314 $39.88
ultra carbon G spring carrier left EC-RE066 $15.88

alloy G Spring Carrier left EC-RE112 $ 9.88

(from campy ergo lever parts - 14, 15, 18 and 19)
coil spring left EC-RE054 $ 9.88

--recommended for replacement by Branford Bike:

* thumb button return spring right EC-RE215 $ 5.88
* thumb button return spring left EC-RE216 $ 5.88
thumb button return lever right EC-RE204 $24.88
thumb button return lever left EC-RE205 $24.88
* G spring right EC-RE-209 2 @ $ 5.88ea. = $11.76
* G spring left EC-RE-210 2 @ $ 5.88ea. = $11.76
finger shift lever return left EC-RE138 $ 5.88
finger shift lever return right EC-RE137 $ 5.88
* ultra 10 index gear EC-RE161 $54.88
* carbon G spring carrier right EC-RE065 $15.88
* carbon G Spring Carrier right
teflon coated bushing EC-RE157 $ 3.88
* ergo (ultra) index gear left EC-RE314 $39.88
* ultra carbon G spring carrier left EC-RE066 $15.88
* coil spring right EC-RE055 $ 9.88
* coil spring left EC-RE054 $ 9.88

5.88+5.88+24.88+24.88+11.76+11.76+5.88+5.88+54.88+15.88+3.88+39.88+15.88+9.88+9.88
=$246.96

remove 2 return levers @ 24.88 * 2 = 49.76
246.96-49.76
=$197.20

only the starred, which meet criteria recommendation:
- G springs,
- Ergo Index gear,
- Thumb Button spring and
- Ergo Coil

5.88+5.88+11.76+11.76+54.88+15.88+3.88+39.88+15.88+9.88+9.88
= 185.44

ordering only replacement parts recommended for right shifter

* thumb button return spring right EC-RE215 $ 5.88
* G spring right EC-RE-209 2 @ $ 5.88ea. = $11.76
* ultra 10 index gear EC-RE161 $54.88
* carbon G spring carrier right EC-RE065 $15.88
* carbon G Spring Carrier right
teflon coated bushing EC-RE157 $ 3.88
* coil spring right EC-RE055 $ 9.88

5.88+11.76+54.88+15.88+3.88+9.88
= $102.16

for left shifter, only get these:

* thumb button return spring left EC-RE216 $ 5.88
* G spring left EC-RE-210 2 @ $ 5.88ea. = $11.76
* coil spring left EC-RE054 $ 9.88
(leave out the very expensive Ergo Index gear)
5.88+11.76+9.88
= $27.52

total:
102.16 + 27.52
= $129.68

How much for replacement ergolevers?

2007 QS Chorus Ergo ebay: $224.95 buy-it-now

lickbike: Centaur 2006 10sp $189.88 + shipping = $197
Universal:
Centaur Ergo: $161 backordered
Chorus: $253 backordered (photo of silver 9s), higher price than 10s record
Record $243 in stock

think about order from Licktons:

Bill Westphal said:

Qui si parla Campagnolo said:

Bill Westphal said:

Qui si parla Campagnolo <[email hidden]> writes:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

> On Jul 11, 8:31 am, D'ohBoy <[email hidden]> wrote:
>> With my pre-2007 shifters, my Record ergos have a significantly softer
>> click than my Chorus.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

>> Is that still true for the 2007? I am building a bike for my father
>> who had Ultegra for years and would probably be more amenable to the
>> softer clicks like I get from my Record shifters but if the Chorus now
>> have the same feel as the Record, then there's no need to spend the
>> extra cash.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

>> TIA

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

>> D'ohBoy

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Just rebuild it and pack a lot of grease in. There may be a little
stickiness on some shifts (the direction that loosens the cable) at
first, but once broken in it's really nice and smooth and quiet. I've
really grown to hate the loud click on stock ungreased Campy shifters.
Just like the loud clicking freewheeling cassettes on urban group
bikerides in traffic.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

> Record and Chorus innards are the same(2007 and 2006) except for a
> teflon coating on the shift disc for Record and a 'fiber' spring
> carrier. All else is the same. In my experience, these 2 shifters feel
> the same.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Those teflon coated and fiber spring parts cost a fortune to replace.

Quoted message said:

errrr, the Chorus 10s disc costs the same as the Record one and the
fiber spring carrier is $5 more($15 vs $10)..Hardly a fortune.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

I found that branford didn't even have the significantly cheaper old
versions of those parts available (I think it's solely a weight
"penalty", rather than a "smoothness" of shifting issue), so I rebuilt
very used shifters without replacing anything, even the springs, and
they work just fine with all the old parts. I'm going to rebuild the
other two ergo pairs similarly. Once you've done the job it's a snap,
so if the grease get's all cruddy after a few years it's no big deal
to rebuild when you cable change.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Bill Westphal

The "fortune" was coming from memory. I took notes when I did the
shifter job, and attach below. Somewhere in here there is a "fortune"
to be made by Campy/Branford for saving me mere grams. I thought them
too greedy with their "recommendations", so I outsmarted them, and no
one got a nickel:

* branford bike order, spoke with new owner Rod Wagner Mon, 04/23/07
(206)323-1218

campagnolo blue ergo manual 1998-current $4.88
cost to rebuild a lever: $55 for parts, $40-$50 for labor

"We recommend replacing the
- G springs,
- Ergo Index gear,
- Thumb Button spring and
- Ergo Coil
spring when rebuilding a right side lever."

That's the problem. All you need is the shift springs. AND maybe the
spring carrier if it's broken. Never have replaced a shift disc, never
seen one wear out, in 17 years of OVH-ing these levers. The other
springs don't wear out, certainly not the coil spring.

Quoted message said:

What about left side lever?
Can I use improved record parts for centaur rebuild, such as

"Teflon coated, Ergo Index gear for smoother shifting and a carbon
polymer, G spring carrier for greater durability

"You can upgrade any 1999 to current right hand 10 speed Ergo shifter
to Ultra shifting by simply replacing the above three parts

- ultra 01 index gear
- carbon carrier teflon washer
- carbon G Spring Carrier

To upgrade you need the shift disc and front toothed bushing..NOT the
spring carrier at all.

Quoted message said:

Is the ultra 10 just a lightweight 10? difference in price 54 vs 44

think about order from Licktons:

Or anybody else that actually OVHes these things, not just MO to get
your $