Cambridge Police crackdown

Ambrose Nankivell wrote on 06/11/2006 14:22 +0100:

Quoted message said:

My intuition says that a keen cyclist has a lower chance than that,
what with them being quite likely to be competent and use
anticipation.

There was a study ICBA to look up that found quite a substantial
increase in safety of regular cyclists over occasional ones, club riders
being the safest.

--
Tony

"Anyone who conducts an argument by appealing to authority is not using
his intelligence; he is just using his memory."
- Leonardo da Vinci

Quoted message said:

There was a study ICBA to look up that found quite a substantial
increase in safety of regular cyclists over occasional ones, club riders
being the safest.

Heh, given some of the riding I've seen from club riders, I'd like to see
the data in a 'per trip' format.

in message <[email hidden]>, Tony Raven

(') said:

Ambrose Nankivell wrote on 06/11/2006 14:22 +0100:

Quoted message said:

My intuition says that a keen cyclist has a lower chance than that,
what with them being quite likely to be competent and use
anticipation.

There was a study ICBA to look up that found quite a substantial
increase in safety of regular cyclists over occasional ones, club riders
being the safest.

Citation?

--
[email hidden] (Simon Brooke) http://www.jasmine.org.uk/~simon/

...but have you *seen* the size of the world wide spider?

Simon Brooke wrote on 06/11/2006 16:14 +0100:

Quoted message said:

in message <[email hidden]>, Tony Raven

(') said:

Ambrose Nankivell wrote on 06/11/2006 14:22 +0100:

Quoted message said:

My intuition says that a keen cyclist has a lower chance than that,
what with them being quite likely to be competent and use
anticipation.

There was a study ICBA to look up that found quite a substantial
increase in safety of regular cyclists over occasional ones, club riders
being the safest.

Citation?

NB: ICBA = I can't be a***d

--
Tony

"Anyone who conducts an argument by appealing to authority is not using
his intelligence; he is just using his memory."
- Leonardo da Vinci

Tony Raven said:

Ambrose Nankivell wrote on 06/11/2006 14:22 +0100:

Quoted message said:

My intuition says that a keen cyclist has a lower chance than that,
what with them being quite likely to be competent and use anticipation.

There was a study ICBA to look up that found quite a substantial
increase in safety of regular cyclists over occasional ones, club riders
being the safest.

Ironically, the exact opposite of the effect on drivers - a study once
mentioned here, which i equally CBA to look up, found that those who drive
more were more likely to have accidents (per mile, of course). I wonder
why?

tom

--
Pave the world

Tony Raven wrote on 06/11/2006 17:24 +0100:

Quoted message said:

Simon Brooke wrote on 06/11/2006 16:14 +0100:

Quoted message said:

in message <[email hidden]>, Tony Raven

(') said:

Ambrose Nankivell wrote on 06/11/2006 14:22 +0100:
> My intuition says that a keen cyclist has a lower chance than that,
> what with them being quite likely to be competent and use
> anticipation.
There was a study ICBA to look up that found quite a substantial
increase in safety of regular cyclists over occasional ones, club riders
being the safest.

Citation?

NB: ICBA = I can't be a***d

I lied ;-) Table 3 of
http://www.johnforester.com/Articles/Social/aaas94.htm

Accidents per million miles

Children 720
College Associated Adults 500
League of American Bicyclists 113
CTC members 66

and

Table 1/Fig 2 of http://www.johnforester.com/NatSafCouncil/NSC.htm
--
Tony

"Anyone who conducts an argument by appealing to authority is not using
his intelligence; he is just using his memory."
- Leonardo da Vinci

in message <[email hidden]>, Tony Raven

(') said:

Simon Brooke wrote on 06/11/2006 16:14 +0100:

Quoted message said:

in message <[email hidden]>, Tony Raven

(') said:

Ambrose Nankivell wrote on 06/11/2006 14:22 +0100:
> My intuition says that a keen cyclist has a lower chance than that,
> what with them being quite likely to be competent and use
> anticipation.
There was a study ICBA to look up that found quite a substantial
increase in safety of regular cyclists over occasional ones, club
riders being the safest.

Citation?

NB: ICBA = I can't be a***d

I know. Now get your [censored] into gear.

--
[email hidden] (Simon Brooke) http://www.jasmine.org.uk/~simon/

;; making jokes about dyslexia isn't big, it isn't clever and
;; it isn't furry.

in message <[email hidden]>, Tony Raven

(') said:

Tony Raven wrote on 06/11/2006 17:24 +0100:

Quoted message said:

Simon Brooke wrote on 06/11/2006 16:14 +0100:

Quoted message said:

in message <[email hidden]>, Tony Raven
([email hidden]'😉 wrote:

> Ambrose Nankivell wrote on 06/11/2006 14:22 +0100:
>> My intuition says that a keen cyclist has a lower chance than that,
>> what with them being quite likely to be competent and use
>> anticipation.
> There was a study ICBA to look up that found quite a substantial
> increase in safety of regular cyclists over occasional ones, club
> riders being the safest.

Citation?

NB: ICBA = I can't be a***d

I lied ;-) Table 3 of
http://www.johnforester.com/Articles/Social/aaas94.htm

Thank you kindly sir.

--
[email hidden] (Simon Brooke) http://www.jasmine.org.uk/~simon/
;; Skill without imagination is craftsmanship and gives us
;; many useful objects such as wickerwork picnic baskets.
;; Imagination without skill gives us modern art.
;; Tom Stoppard, Artist Descending A Staircase

Tony Raven said:

I lied ;-) Table 3 of
http://www.johnforester.com/Articles/Social/aaas94.htm

Accidents per million miles

Children 720
College Associated Adults 500
League of American Bicyclists 113
CTC members 66

I knew there was a good reason for joining.

Quoted message said:

and

Table 1/Fig 2 of http://www.johnforester.com/NatSafCouncil/NSC.htm

--
Don Whybrow

Sequi Bonum Non Time

If you find yourself in a hole, the first thing to do is stop diggin'.

"David Hansen" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

On Sat, 4 Nov 2006 22:52:57 -0000 someone who may be "Adam Lea"
<[email hidden]> wrote this:-

Quoted message said:

If you cycle within the law, you won't get fined.

Really?

Does your touching belief apply to Telford?

OK in general if you cycle within the law you wont get fined. That was an
absurd exception to a normally correct general rule.

By the way I haven't heard much about that incident recently. Did the
cyclist in question manage to successfully appeal?

On Mon, 6 Nov 2006 23:08:58 -0000 someone who may be "Adam Lea"
<[email hidden]> wrote this:-

Quoted message said:

By the way I haven't heard much about that incident recently. Did the
cyclist in question manage to successfully appeal?

I imagine an appeal is a long way away, but the last I heard he was
appealing.

The police have continued to smugly assert that they were only doing
their job.

--
David Hansen, Edinburgh
I will *always* explain revoked encryption keys, unless RIP prevents me
http://www.opsi.gov.uk/acts/acts2000/00023--e.htm#54

John Clayton top-posted:

Quoted message said:

Never mind the fancy debate, this is absolute and utter b*ll*cks.
For instance this debate would not occur in Denmark or Holland - or any
other civilised nation.
Trouble is here we are subject to the (all bow down NOW) motoring press/
pressure.
How sodding petty to start on a few harmless, inoffensive benign cyclists.
Our planet might perish tomorrow but "hey kids" lets hand out some FPN's.
Job done - what a load of [censored].

Plonker.

Actually, this article isn't news anyway. It has happened in Cambridge
a week or two after the clocks go back every year for at least 20
years. I think it is an entirely reasonable way to get the message
across that bicycles need lights when ridden between sunset and
sunrise. In current society, the trend seems to be to get away with
what you can, so the threat of a small fine will probably have the
desired effect on rather more that the small number of people that
actually get caught.

Cambridge is unusual anyway. It has lots of cycles in a small city,
many of them ridden by students who will have rarely used them as real
transport before they left home, so may be less aware of the
requirements.

Actually, I'd rather the Police used a slightly diffent tactic. Stop
the unlit cyclists and offer them 2 options - a £30 fine, or buy and
spend 15 minutes fitting a set of legal lights that they just happen to
have on sale for £25. But of course that's far too sensible so will
never happen.

TL

The Luggage said:

Actually, I'd rather the Police used a slightly diffent tactic. Stop
the unlit cyclists and offer them 2 options - a £30 fine, or buy and
spend 15 minutes fitting a set of legal lights that they just happen to
have on sale for £25. But of course that's far too sensible so will
never happen.

A bit like this?

http://www.camcycle.org.uk/newsletters/64/article16.html

Anthony

The Luggage said:

Actually, I'd rather the Police used a slightly diffent tactic. Stop
the unlit cyclists and offer them 2 options - a £30 fine, or buy and
spend 15 minutes fitting a set of legal lights that they just happen to
have on sale for £25. But of course that's far too sensible so will
never happen.

I would rather that garages would be forced to stock some basic
equipment for cyclists, including some basic lamps in case a cyclists
gets caught short. Ok, I know you can't "force" garages into what to
sell, but it certainly would be useful.

The time my lamp unit fell off the bike in Camden High Street and was
unrepairable and the nearby cycle shops had all shut for the night, I
had little option really but to complete the journey with rear lights
only.

(Either that or we need to call the BA/RBC).

Tony Raven said:

Tony Raven wrote on 06/11/2006 17:24 +0100:

Quoted message said:

Simon Brooke wrote on 06/11/2006 16:14 +0100:

Quoted message said:

in message <[email hidden]>, Tony Raven
([email hidden]'😉 wrote:

> Ambrose Nankivell wrote on 06/11/2006 14:22 +0100:
>> My intuition says that a keen cyclist has a lower chance than
>> that, what with them being quite likely to be competent and use
>> anticipation.
> There was a study ICBA to look up that found quite a substantial
> increase in safety of regular cyclists over occasional ones, club
> riders being the safest.

Citation?

NB: ICBA = I can't be a***d

I lied ;-) Table 3 of
http://www.johnforester.com/Articles/Social/aaas94.htm

That was the table I vaguely had in mind when I thought it would be easier
to claim intuition rather than try and look up a citation. Thanks Tony 😉

A

Tom Anderson said:

Tony Raven said:

Ambrose Nankivell wrote on 06/11/2006 14:22 +0100:

Quoted message said:

My intuition says that a keen cyclist has a lower chance than that,
what with them being quite likely to be competent and use anticipation.

There was a study ICBA to look up that found quite a substantial
increase in safety of regular cyclists over occasional ones, club riders
being the safest.

Ironically, the exact opposite of the effect on drivers - a study once
mentioned here, which i equally CBA to look up, found that those who drive
more were more likely to have accidents (per mile, of course). I wonder
why?

tom

drive long tireing journeys? off the top of my head.

roger

Tom Anderson said:

On Mon, 6 Nov 2006, Tony Raven wrote:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Ambrose Nankivell wrote on 06/11/2006 14:22 +0100:

Quoted message said:

My intuition says that a keen cyclist has a lower chance than that,
what with them being quite likely to be competent and use anticipation.

There was a study ICBA to look up that found quite a substantial
increase in safety of regular cyclists over occasional ones, club riders
being the safest.

Quoted message said:

Ironically, the exact opposite of the effect on drivers - a study once
mentioned here, which i equally CBA to look up, found that those who drive
more were more likely to have accidents (per mile, of course). I wonder
why?

Car driving rots the brain. No idea why, but it's hard to deny the
evidence.

--
Chris Malcolm [email hidden] DoD #205
IPAB, Informatics, JCMB, King's Buildings, Edinburgh, EH9 3JZ, UK
[http://www.dai.ed.ac.uk/homes/cam/]