BY!

All you need to do is start talking bentish and not contribute or read unbentish threads and you'll
see that there's still a base of bent enthusiasts here. It's up to you.

Bent content: My semi-new speedmachine has a new stem and is sitting on my trainer. Now I'm waitng
for a brown truck to deliver a new seat. "Ben Eadie" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:xjsTb.3718$6X2.1043@clgrps13...

Quoted message said:

I am tired of this, came wanting to talk bents, I love bents, not

political

Quoted message said:

discussions, found petty discussions on politics and anything but recumbents.

"Ben Eadie" <[email hidden]> skrev i en meddelelse news:xjsTb.3718$6X2.1043@clgrps13...

Quoted message said:

I am tired of this, came wanting to talk bents, I love bents, not political discussions, found
petty discussions on politics and anything but recumbents.

Yea thanks for contributing to the OT stuff tho. Anyone else want to leave just leave. Don't
post. First we get the Ed-Sherman [censored]. Then 4-5 threads complaining about it. Then the 4-5 Bye
bye-threads.

Learn to use a killfile and this would not be a problem.

Mikael

I AGREE with you Mikael. I really don't enjoy kill-filing anyone and to be
honest perhaps kill-filing someone is not really needed, if you JUST IGNORE
THEIR POSTS! This NG being a public thing; you will get a lot of non-topic
posts; it happens in all (Non-moderated) NG's and even in some moderated
ones, for a short while. Like Mikael, I'll choose to read and subsequently
respond to a post, if it concerns recumbency. Now, having said that, I guess
you could find me GUILTY of even responding to this thread, as it really
doesn't concern recumbency... ;-) LOL But that's the power of choice I have;
instead of departing from what has been and still is, a good communication
medium for recumbents.
EZ Biker :-) Pompano Beach, Fl. (Bacchetta Aero Pilot)

"Mikael Seierup" <[email hidden]> wrote in message -"]news:[email hidden]-
berlin.de...

Quoted message said:

Learn to use a killfile and this would not be a problem.

Mikael

"Mikael Seierup" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:<[email hidden]>...

Quoted message said:

"Ben Eadie" <[email hidden]> skrev i en meddelelse
news:xjsTb.3718$6X2.1043@clgrps13...

Quoted message said:

Learn to use a killfile and this would not be a problem.

Mikael

Is there a killfile on all computers? Old Macintoshes too? Only killfile I ever found was a
combination of the on/off switch, the doorknob, and 3 wheels.

Thanks,

Chris Jordan Santa Cruz, CA.

That brown truck better work overtime! My fairing and '04 Catrike are on the way too. There, more
bent content!

Chris Jordan Santa Cruz, CA.

"harv" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:<[email hidden]>...

Quoted message said:

All you need to do is start talking bentish and not contribute or read unbentish threads and
you'll see that there's still a base of bent enthusiasts here. It's up to you.

Bent content: My semi-new speedmachine has a new stem and is sitting on my trainer. Now I'm waitng
for a brown truck to deliver a new seat. "Ben Eadie" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:xjsTb.3718$6X2.1043@clgrps13...

Quoted message said:

I am tired of this, came wanting to talk bents, I love bents, not

political

Quoted message said:

discussions, found petty discussions on politics and anything but recumbents.

"Christopher Jordan" skrev

Quoted message said:

Is there a killfile on all computers? Old Macintoshes too? Only killfile I ever found was a
combination of the on/off switch, the doorknob, and 3 wheels.

No, but if you have a big problem with OT-threads and I agree it is a problem thats the fast and
effective fix. If you want to stick to Macs or Google or whatever then you must live with the
drawbacks of that choice. That being said you got a pretty neat killfile there. :-)

Mikael

Christopher Jordan said:

That brown truck better work overtime! My fairing and '04 Catrike are on the way too. There, more
bent content!

Bent (literally) and brown truck content combined.
<http://www.campyonly.com/images/joebell/paint_steps/003_3s.jpg>.

Tom Sherman - Quad Cities

Quoted post said:

Originally posted by Ben Eadie
I am tired of this, came wanting to talk bents, I love bents, not political discussions, found petty
discussions on politics and anything but recumbents.

There are dozens of threads about bents.

watsonglenn said:

Ben Eadie said:

I am tired of this, came wanting to talk bents, I love bents, not political discussions, found
petty discussions on politics and anything but recumbents.

Quoted message said:

There are dozens of threads about bents.

There are more threads complaining about off-topic political threads than there are off-topic
political threads.

Tom Sherman - Quad Cities

watsonglenn said:

Ben Eadie said:

I am tired of this, came wanting to talk bents, I love bents, not political discussions, found
petty discussions on politics and anything but recumbents.

There are dozens of threads about bents.

--

Instead of complaining about all the OT threads::: Learn to use the kill filter and the message
total will go from 50 to 10 or 12 every time you sign on just by killing 2 senders on this group.
You will never know what you're missing but you can be sure it's trash. I usually monitor a group
for a week then kill file the ones that send more than 20 messages a week. Been doing that since the
Bulletin Board days and can pretty well stay on topic of news groups intent. Every news group on the
web has a couple S+++ disturbers. We called that type person the 1% in the Marine Corps. They are
argumentive by nature and all the sane attempts to change them just adds fuel to their posting. When
I first joined this group Ed gave me what I considered decent advice. Since then however I have seen
nothing worth reading in his posts. A week ago I quit seeing any messages from him or Tom and the
subject lines I get now are mostly recumbent related. It's great not having to go through 50 posts
just to see one that helps. Just my 2 cents

I just returned after 6 weeks of ignoring this Newsgroup because it was less friendly and less of
the warm & fuzzy community that it was evolving into....prior to being hijacked by certain members
looking to provoke arguments over Iraq and actions of their President. It went from a fairly
pleasant stroll from post to post into something akin to the gauntlet of doom. People posting
legitimate cycling questions & getting their chosen grammar reviewed and then being called an
ass*ole for making the grammatical error.

In the days leading up to the invasion of Iraq this Newsgroup got downright nasty and that was
understandable. Cabin fever with the bent in the garage and not on the road is also going to
generate some hostile posts and replies. But it has been like 8 months of flat out yelling at one
another around here and it is way too much.

I am not a big fan of censorship and A.R.B.R. cannot be Moderated and so the entire group is stuck
with those who have a problem staying on topic and those who seem hell bent on pissing people off
(because they can).

Some people choose to make bent cycling a lifestyle, they are in constant need of support and
reinforcement, but to have one group they can turn to riddled with all this never ending OT [censored]
is not helping them. There are lots of Newsgroups that would love to be entertained by our members
who choose to [censored] about everything around them...but they stay here on ARBR and bring down the
whole group.

I am a relative newcomer here, around 4 years of daily reading and according to Google I tied Tom
Sherman for several months in a row on the # of messages I posted. Under the user name of salmagundi
alone I hit over 2,000 messages in one year and 500 under Wile E.Coyote, have not checked under
joshua goldberg or evsolutions yet. For a while there I was wondering why people were posting
messages on "MY" newsgroup.

Yes I Ramble on and on...bet ya'll missed that for 6 weeks LOL

I don't have a solution to the OT and anger, not sure there is one.

IF I had the time I'd look at doing a Moderated Version of ARBR as the only way to get this group
back on track...but I lack the time to do it.

I will continue to lurk and sometimes reply to a message, but my days of trying to tie Tom Sherman
or Ed Dolan are behind me...it just ain't fun any longer.

Joshua
*****

"watsonglenn" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
"]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Ben Eadie said:

I am tired of this, came wanting to talk bents, I love bents, not political discussions, found
petty discussions on politics and

anything

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

but recumbents.

There are dozens of threads about bents.

--

"Mikael Seierup" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:<[email hidden]>...

Quoted message said:

"Ben Eadie" <[email hidden]> skrev i en meddelelse
news:xjsTb.3718$6X2.1043@clgrps13...

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

I am tired of this, came wanting to talk bents, I love bents, not political discussions, found
petty discussions on politics and anything but recumbents.

Yea thanks for contributing to the OT stuff tho. Anyone else want to leave just leave. Don't post.
First we get the Ed-Sherman [censored]. Then 4-5 threads complaining about it. Then the 4-5 Bye bye-
threads.

And then you get my criticism of all of the above, including my bidding good riddance to all those
who want to leave.

Yea, and then wait a few weeks and the whole cycle repeats itself yet once again almost identically.
It is nothing but deja vu - like that movie about the reoccurring Groundhog Day! I think we should
rename this newsgroup to something like "Whether to OT or not to OT - that is the question!". We
would have many thousands flocking to this new site as they would all have something to contribute -
even if it is like you say above, just [censored]. By the way I have read most of Mikael since I have been
here and he contributes more than his share of [censored] to this newsgroup. It is mostly on-topic [censored],
but still [censored] nonetheless.

Ed Dolan - Minnesota

Tom Sherman <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:<[email hidden]>...

Quoted message said:

watsonglenn said:

Ben Eadie said:

I am tired of this, came wanting to talk bents, I love bents, not political discussions,
found petty discussions on politics and anything but recumbents.

Quoted message said:

There are dozens of threads about bents.

There are more threads complaining about off-topic political threads than there are off-topic
political threads.

Tom Sherman - Quad Cities

Laughing out loud and almost rolling on the floor! OK, so you are a very witty person after all.
What you say above is perfect in substance AND form - very rare here on ARBR. It is even worthy of
Oscar Wilde, one of the supreme wits of all time.

Tom, the thought has occurred to me that all the kill filers sooner or later see our posts because
others will be quoting our messages and THEY will not have been kill filed by the kill filers. It is
a very sweet revenge on them I think. God, do I ever hate ostriches (only the human kind - the real
birds are probably quite wonderful).

Ed Dolan - Minnesota

gcdoss <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:<[email hidden]>... [...]

Quoted message said:

Instead of complaining about all the OT threads::: Learn to use the kill filter and the message
total will go from 50 to 10 or 12 every time you sign on just by killing 2 senders on this group.
You will never know what you're missing but you can be sure it's trash. I usually monitor a group
for a week then kill file the ones that send more than 20 messages a week. Been doing that since
the Bulletin Board days and can pretty well stay on topic of news groups intent. Every news group
on the web has a couple S+++ disturbers. We called that type person the 1% in the Marine Corps.
They are argumentive by nature and all the sane attempts to change them just adds fuel to their
posting. When I first joined this group Ed gave me what I considered decent advice. Since then
however I have seen nothing worth reading in his posts. A week ago I quit seeing any messages from
him or Tom and the subject lines I get now are mostly recumbent related. It's great not having to
go through 50 posts just to see one that helps. Just my 2 cents

gcdoss should take out a subscription to Recumbent Cyclist News if he wants some solid information
about recumbents. Instead, he wastes his time on this newsgroup sifting for pearls of wisdom about
recumbents, most likely asking lots of stupid questions into the bargain and driving the rest of us
to distraction.

The problem that gcdoss has, along with some others on this newsgroup, is that he is just barely
literate and cannot separate the wheat from the chaff (the on topic from the off topic) even though
Google makes this a no brainer with its subject headings as I am sure do most newsreaders. But
idiots always like to communicate with other idiots anyway, so I am delighted that he has kill filed
me and that I therefore do have to put up with his befuddlement at my messages. Life is good once
you are rid of morons and idiots.

Ed Dolan - Minnesota

"EVSolutions" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:<[email hidden]>...

Quoted message said:

I just returned after 6 weeks of ignoring this Newsgroup because it was less friendly and less of
the warm & fuzzy community that it was evolving into....prior to being hijacked by certain members
looking to provoke arguments over Iraq and actions of their President. It went from a fairly
pleasant stroll from post to post into something akin to the gauntlet of doom. People posting
legitimate cycling questions & getting their chosen grammar reviewed and then being called an
ass*ole for making the grammatical error.

In the days leading up to the invasion of Iraq this Newsgroup got downright nasty and that was
understandable. Cabin fever with the bent in the garage and not on the road is also going to
generate some hostile posts and replies. But it has been like 8 months of flat out yelling at one
another around here and it is way too much.

I am not a big fan of censorship and A.R.B.R. cannot be Moderated and so the entire group is stuck
with those who have a problem staying on topic and those who seem hell bent on pissing people off
(because they can).

Some people choose to make bent cycling a lifestyle, they are in constant need of support and
reinforcement, but to have one group they can turn to riddled with all this never ending OT [censored]
is not helping them. There are lots of Newsgroups that would love to be entertained by our members
who choose to [censored] about everything around them...but they stay here on ARBR and bring down the
whole group.

I am a relative newcomer here, around 4 years of daily reading and according to Google I tied Tom
Sherman for several months in a row on the # of messages I posted. Under the user name of
salmagundi alone I hit over 2,000 messages in one year and 500 under Wile E.Coyote, have not
checked under joshua goldberg or evsolutions yet. For a while there I was wondering why people
were posting messages on "MY" newsgroup.

Yes I Ramble on and on...bet ya'll missed that for 6 weeks LOL

I don't have a solution to the OT and anger, not sure there is one.

IF I had the time I'd look at doing a Moderated Version of ARBR as the only way to get this group
back on track...but I lack the time to do it.

I will continue to lurk and sometimes reply to a message, but my days of trying to tie Tom Sherman
or Ed Dolan are behind me...it just ain't fun any longer.

Joshua

For the record, Mr. Joshua Goldberg was one of the most contentious souls ever to post to this
newsgroup. He was not bad when he was on topic, but when he was off topic he was a bear. Our
exchanges often degenerated into nothing but name calling contests - and then he got

a scoundrel. I have forgiven him some of his indiscretions, but I have a long memory and I
never forget.

If and when he returns to this newsgroup I will always take his OT posts one by one and give
them the consideration they deserve. But as everyone should know by now, with me it is [censored] for
tat. If one is polite and courteous with me, then I am that way back. If you are the other way,
then I am too.

The really remarkable thing about newsgroups is that no one is ever missed for long. After a few
months it is if you were never here. That should keep all of us very humble indeed.

Ed Dolan - Minnesota

"EVSolutions" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
"]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

pleasant stroll from post to post into something akin to the gauntlet of doom. People posting
legitimate cycling questions & getting their chosen grammar reviewed and then being called an
ass*ole for making the

grammatical

Quoted message said:

error

Howdy Joshua and others!

What you mention above is very true. Whether it is Ed posting with circular rhetoric or Tom
correcting the spelling of a bike manufacturer, this place is not very attractive to the new
recumbent rider. If a person can understand the basic thrust of a message, why post a
grammar/spelling correction to it? That seems rather petty and childish, AND drives off others from
posting. I've a local recumbent rider friend who is dyslexic and his spelling, at times, can be
interesting. He'd never post here looking to get information, as he feels that his notes would be
taken apart. That just rubs me the wrong way. He may be just one example and perhaps the needling
that Tom engages in is not bothersome to others, but it bothers me that out there in the recumbent
world, there is one rider who won't come here because of the sophomoric transgressions of one
particular poster. And with Ed, there is just no telling how many people have been put off by your
incessant, rambling posts. Why do you tilt at THIS windmill, Don Quixote?

This note will change nothing about the way either of you post, I'm sure. A shame.

--
"Sea" ya!
--Lars S. Mulford
"You can find evil anywhere you look.
The question is, why are you looking?"

"EVSolutions" <[email hidden]> wrote

Quoted message said:

I am not a big fan of censorship and A.R.B.R. cannot be Moderated

Actually, an existing newsgroup *can* go from unmoderated to moderated. It isn't very likely, but it
is 'permitted' and reportedly has happened. It's probably more accurate to say ARBR *will not*
become moderated.

Quoted message said:

I don't have a solution to the OT and anger, not sure there is one.

Ignoring off-topic postings may help, but not as much as posting *more messages on-topic*! A first-
time or returning non-regular reader of a newsgroup likely doesn't know that filtering even only a
few posters can greatly change [improve] the character of the newsgroup content. So post more
messages like you want to see [on-topic, hopefully]!

Quoted message said:

IF I had the time I'd look at doing a Moderated Version of ARBR as the only way to get this group
back on track... but I lack the time to do it.

You may have missed the short-lived discussion of creating a new newsgroup:
rec.bicycles.recumbent.moderated. It would, as you say, require a big investment in time and energy.

Even if successful, a moderated recumbent newsgroup wouldn't be on the same "track" as what we might
idealistically (unrealistically) remember as ARBR from years' past. We had off-topic posts then, but
it seems to me, nowhere near the current level of persistently and intentionally offensive, abusive,
and sometimes vulgar posts.

They say, "You are what you eat."

Well, the newsgroup is what we post...

Jon Meinecke

PHEW! Not my Speed! Came yesterday, but for a moment; I had to glsnce over to the cardboard box!

Chris J.

Quoted message said:

Bent (literally) and brown truck content combined.
<http://www.campyonly.com/images/joebell/paint_steps/003_3s.jpg>.

Tom Sherman - Quad Cities

"Lars S. Mulford" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:<[email hidden]>...

Quoted message said:

"EVSolutions" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
"]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

pleasant stroll from post to post into something akin to the gauntlet of doom. People posting
legitimate cycling questions & getting their chosen grammar reviewed and then being called an
ass*ole for making the

grammatical

Quoted message said:

error

Howdy Joshua and others!

What you mention above is very true. Whether it is Ed posting with circular rhetoric or Tom
correcting the spelling of a bike manufacturer, this place is not very attractive to the new
recumbent rider.

Circular rhetoric? Yes, I think you are right. I always like to drive a point home before I leave a
subject because I never trust the intelligence of a reader to get my thought otherwise. By the way,
repetition (circular rhetoric) is the basis for all learning. Once over lightly never works for
anyone really.

If a person can

Quoted message said:

understand the basic thrust of a message, why post a grammar/spelling correction to it? That seems
rather petty and childish, AND drives off others from posting.

I never do that sort of thing and have severely criticized others in the past for doing it. However,
when others are being petty themselves, then I relish taking apart their posts and subjecting them
to their own medicine.

I've a local recumbent rider friend who is dyslexic

Quoted message said:

and his spelling, at times, can be interesting. He'd never post here looking to get information,
as he feels that his notes would be taken apart. That just rubs me the wrong way. He may be just
one example and perhaps the needling that Tom engages in is not bothersome to others, but it
bothers me that out there in the recumbent world, there is one rider who won't come here because
of the sophomoric transgressions of one particular poster.

Tom mostly does this sort of thing for humor. And then some of us act very indignant about it - and
that is just humor too. Anyone who comes to this newsgroup without a sense of humor is going to be
drawn and quartered. Trust me on this.

And

Quoted message said:

with Ed, there is just no telling how many people have been put off by your incessant, rambling
posts. Why do you tilt at THIS windmill, Don Quixote?

It is really only unintelligent people who are put off by a bit of rambling. If you will notice, I
never ramble too much. Most of the posts here could use a bit of rambling. It would make them more
interesting and enjoyable. To stay on topic and stick to the subject too severely is extremely
boring - and it is a sort of rudeness in itself. Mr. Sherman does this sort of posting better than
anyone I know (even when he is off topic, he is on topic for the off topic and he never rambles). I
am just the opposite. But even so, I am always just trying to say something that I think might
lighten someone's day and increase their humanity.

Quoted message said:

This note will change nothing about the way either of you post, I'm sure. A shame.

Yes, you are right about your message not changing anything, but it is not a shame, far from it.
Please note, Lars, that your posts do not get many responses because they are so dull. I could teach
you a few things about how to liven up your posts. But we are mostly all old men here and set in our
ways. You cannot teach an old dog new tricks. The main adventure left in our lives is to die.

(There, Lars, did not those last three sentences in the above paragraph lighten your day and
increase your humanity? Or was that too much "rambling" to suit you?)

Ed Dolan - Minnesota