Biking in Mexico

Mad Dog said:

I'm gonna be spending some time near Veracruz next spring - long enough to
consider taking the bike along. But when I mentioned that, I was told that I'd
not survive riding there for long. Anyone done any road riding in Mexico? Is
it really that bad? I promise not to drink the water. Looks like there are
some really big hills a little west of Veracruz, sure would like to check'em
out.

I hear the pharmacies are great.

Mad Dog said:

I'm gonna be spending some time near Veracruz next spring - long enough to
consider taking the bike along. But when I mentioned that, I was told that I'd
not survive riding there for long. Anyone done any road riding in Mexico? Is
it really that bad? I promise not to drink the water. Looks like there are
some really big hills a little west of Veracruz, sure would like to check'em
out.

I heard Chris Wherry knows some really nice places to ride in May-hee-ko.

Thanks,

Magilla

Mad Dog said:

I'm gonna be spending some time near Veracruz next spring - long enough to
consider taking the bike along. But when I mentioned that, I was told that I'd
not survive riding there for long. Anyone done any road riding in Mexico? Is
it really that bad? I promise not to drink the water. Looks like there are
some really big hills a little west of Veracruz, sure would like to check'em
out.

I never rode a bike there but there are a few things I've noted:

1) The drivers are VERY fast on poor roads and often don't pay a lot of
attention. On the good side is that they aren't very numerous off of
the beaten tracks.

2) The government officials are less than helpful unless you'er waving
large bills under their noses and around a large urban area you had
better keep tight control of your bicycle - one blink and it will be
gone.

3) Local police aren't. Federal police are often overworked, underpaid
and uninterested. Again if you need help remember the power of the US
Treasury Bill.

REI and other vendors sell water filters built into standard bike
bottles. One of those would be handy to take along, with or without
the bike.
Jason

Why carry some sill contraption? Bottled water is sold on every corner at
small markets and convenience stores. Mexico is no longer a primitive
society.

If the original poster will drop me anote I'll share some real and
meaningful information

[email hidden]

In article <[email hidden]>,

Quoted message said:

REI and other vendors sell water filters built into standard bike
bottles. One of those would be handy to take along, with or without
the bike.
Jason

I have travelled on business(not biking) in Mexico, including the
Veracruz area. I have seldom seen any serious road bikers on the roads,
but there are some. Water shouldn't be an issue, because bottled water
is readily available. As I recall, the immediate area around Veracruz
is pretty flat and can get pretty hot in summer months. Your biggest
concern would be the condition of the roads and the macho attitude of
many of the drivers. Drivers do not normally yield to pedestrians, let
alone anyone on a cycle. There are some good roads, but most go
unrepaired and there is no such thing as bike lanes.
It would be an adventure that I wouldn't attempt, and I love to ride
the roads!

In article <[email hidden]>,

teschman said:

there is no such thing as bike lanes.

I hear that it's better that way...

--
tanx,
Howard

Butter is love.

remove YOUR SHOES to reply, ok?

BW said:

Why carry some sill contraption? Bottled water is sold on every corner at
small markets and convenience stores. Mexico is no longer a primitive
society.

Ask Coca-Cola where their bottled water comes from...

BW said:

Why carry some sill contraption? Bottled water is sold on every corner at
small markets and convenience stores. Mexico is no longer a primitive
society.

Because it's often easier to carry an extra bottle with built-in filter
than it is to buy water. I just got back from two weeks in Egypt
(without bike) and after two days, I wished I had brought a filter.
Bottled water was readily available, but it just got to be a pain
buying and carrying it for myself and my wife. I could usually get 1.5
L bottles for about $0.40 US, but that involved haggling over the
price. We had several days where the high temp was 42C (108F), so we
were drinking at least 8 L a day. If we were in a hotel and ran out of
water, I could pay hotel prices or I could go downstairs, go outside,
walk several blocks, haggle for four or five minutes, fill a shopping
bag with water bottles, and walk back. I did not find that easier than
carrying a "silly contraption" the size of a bike bottle and squeezing
tap water through the filter into a spare bottle. Therefore, I will
carry a filter next time I travel. I will also suggest that option to
those who might find it helpful, while recognizing that they might
think it's a silly idea.

Jason

Mad Dog said:

I'm gonna be spending some time near Veracruz next spring - long enough to
consider taking the bike along. But when I mentioned that, I was told that I'd
not survive riding there for long. Anyone done any road riding in Mexico? Is
it really that bad? I promise not to drink the water. Looks like there are
some really big hills a little west of Veracruz, sure would like to check'em
out.

Veracruz proper is probably one of the least suitable places for
recreational riding in the entire Republic, but that said;

A. The drivers in Mexico are much more accustomed to seeing livestock
and pedestrians alongside the roads and the country itself only started
developing its own equivalent of our Interstate Highway System since
1990 so most motorists had to learn to deal with this environment from
Day One. The roads themselves tend to be narrow and shoulderless. It
was my experience that entering populated areas with heavy traffic
there was a dirt path in the same right of way that was off the road a
bit, so you had the choice to get off if you really wanted to. This
would in turn get you into a place with side streets. Fewer people
drive as a percentage of the population and those that do are more
attentive and competent for some of the following reasons.

B. Gasoline cost $3/Gallon in Mexico when we were paying $1.15= much
less frivolous personal motor vehicle traffic in general.

C. If you get into an accident and stick around and are uninsured you
go straight into the slammerito. For a long long time before you even
get to appear before a judge. While this certainly contributes to hit
and run incidents it also contributes to a more cautious overall
approach to road usage by private individuals even if they do have
insurance.

D. They have very serious speed bumps down there. On just about
everything that's paved as you enter a settled area. Known locally as
topes these things can rip the undercarriage right off a car and they
had them long before we ever had them up here.

E. In my own experience riding there, which approaches 10,000 miles
overall, it's the professional drivers, particularly the busses that
can scare the hell out of you. They will give you space if they have it
do give, but they don't always have it to give. Anybody who ever toured
in Mexico witnessed virtual drag races through the middle of nowhere
between competing bus companies, passing each other on blind curves and
all the horror stories that you have probably heard of by now.
Fortunately these vehicles are usually unmuffled and you could hear
them coming from a long ways off. If I knew for certain when the bus
was leaving someplace I always waited for it to get up the road ahead
of me. If you encounter busses more than once an hour you are probably
on the wrong road.

F. The same people who tell you you won't come back alive would also
repeat the cliche that gringos shouldn't drive anywhere at night in
Mexico. Well I sure as hell rode a bike at night down there. Almost
exclusively on the full moon portion of one trip. And I probably would
again if I ever had to get through the state of Veracruz except in the
dead of winter.

G. Your biggest risk will be theft-related and I always felt that it
took people about 20 minutes to decide that you might be worth stealing
from, so I was always moving on within that interval unless I felt very
secure about a place.

The Veracruz-Mexico City corridor has a huge problem with literal (and
professional as well,) highway robbery. Tony Soprano-style as it were,
a truckload at a time. In the late 1990s this phenomenon was
approaching double-digit percentages of the Gross National product.
Since you seem to be interested in the roads towards Orizaba you may
want to avoid that aforementioned corridor altogether. Wherever they
put a (pre-divided highway or "libre"😉 older road through the mountains
down there it will almost always resemble Independence Pass in many
respects and in the humid tropics 10 or 20 miles of 12-16% grade hits
you in a way that you really can't appreciate until you tried it. Going
from Mazatlan to Durango or from the coast to Oaxaca the numbers that I
just quoted would represent a significant understatement.

H. The bottom line is that it's all about careful route selection.
There are parts of Mexico that I would favor for a winter training
vacation over just about any place in between Florida and Texas. The
whole country bikes on 26 Inch wheels now and if you were thinking of
taking a Mountain Bike and operating off the beaten path you should
have no problem at all. In fact Veracruz offers some advantages for
taking that approach as opposed to the Pacific side where a lot of
interesting cultivation takes place back in the hinterlands. And some
of the back roads in that eastern part of Mexico have been in place for
four centuries.

I. It's hard to find a really decent map down there and when I look at
the Internet map resources of the places that I went through they are
still lacking.

Thanks a bunch for taking the time to write such an excellent, detailed reply!

In article <[email hidden]>,
[email hidden] says...

Quoted message said:

Mad Dog said:

I'm gonna be spending some time near Veracruz next spring - long enough to
consider taking the bike along. But when I mentioned that, I was told that I'd
not survive riding there for long. Anyone done any road riding in Mexico? Is
it really that bad? I promise not to drink the water. Looks like there are
some really big hills a little west of Veracruz, sure would like to check'em
out.

Veracruz proper is probably one of the least suitable places for
recreational riding in the entire Republic, but that said;

A. The drivers in Mexico are much more accustomed to seeing livestock
and pedestrians alongside the roads and the country itself only started
developing its own equivalent of our Interstate Highway System since
1990 so most motorists had to learn to deal with this environment from
Day One. The roads themselves tend to be narrow and shoulderless. It
was my experience that entering populated areas with heavy traffic
there was a dirt path in the same right of way that was off the road a
bit, so you had the choice to get off if you really wanted to. This
would in turn get you into a place with side streets. Fewer people
drive as a percentage of the population and those that do are more
attentive and competent for some of the following reasons.

B. Gasoline cost $3/Gallon in Mexico when we were paying $1.15= much
less frivolous personal motor vehicle traffic in general.

C. If you get into an accident and stick around and are uninsured you
go straight into the slammerito. For a long long time before you even
get to appear before a judge. While this certainly contributes to hit
and run incidents it also contributes to a more cautious overall
approach to road usage by private individuals even if they do have
insurance.

D. They have very serious speed bumps down there. On just about
everything that's paved as you enter a settled area. Known locally as
topes these things can rip the undercarriage right off a car and they
had them long before we ever had them up here.

E. In my own experience riding there, which approaches 10,000 miles
overall, it's the professional drivers, particularly the busses that
can scare the hell out of you. They will give you space if they have it
do give, but they don't always have it to give. Anybody who ever toured
in Mexico witnessed virtual drag races through the middle of nowhere
between competing bus companies, passing each other on blind curves and
all the horror stories that you have probably heard of by now.
Fortunately these vehicles are usually unmuffled and you could hear
them coming from a long ways off. If I knew for certain when the bus
was leaving someplace I always waited for it to get up the road ahead
of me. If you encounter busses more than once an hour you are probably
on the wrong road.

F. The same people who tell you you won't come back alive would also
repeat the cliche that gringos shouldn't drive anywhere at night in
Mexico. Well I sure as hell rode a bike at night down there. Almost
exclusively on the full moon portion of one trip. And I probably would
again if I ever had to get through the state of Veracruz except in the
dead of winter.

G. Your biggest risk will be theft-related and I always felt that it
took people about 20 minutes to decide that you might be worth stealing
from, so I was always moving on within that interval unless I felt very
secure about a place.

The Veracruz-Mexico City corridor has a huge problem with literal (and
professional as well,) highway robbery. Tony Soprano-style as it were,
a truckload at a time. In the late 1990s this phenomenon was
approaching double-digit percentages of the Gross National product.
Since you seem to be interested in the roads towards Orizaba you may
want to avoid that aforementioned corridor altogether. Wherever they
put a (pre-divided highway or "libre"😉 older road through the mountains
down there it will almost always resemble Independence Pass in many
respects and in the humid tropics 10 or 20 miles of 12-16% grade hits
you in a way that you really can't appreciate until you tried it. Going
from Mazatlan to Durango or from the coast to Oaxaca the numbers that I
just quoted would represent a significant understatement.

H. The bottom line is that it's all about careful route selection.
There are parts of Mexico that I would favor for a winter training
vacation over just about any place in between Florida and Texas. The
whole country bikes on 26 Inch wheels now and if you were thinking of
taking a Mountain Bike and operating off the beaten path you should
have no problem at all. In fact Veracruz offers some advantages for
taking that approach as opposed to the Pacific side where a lot of
interesting cultivation takes place back in the hinterlands. And some
of the back roads in that eastern part of Mexico have been in place for
four centuries.

I. It's hard to find a really decent map down there and when I look at
the Internet map resources of the places that I went through they are
still lacking.

Quoted message said:

There are parts of Mexico that I would favor for a winter training
vacation over just about any place in between Florida and Texas.

Rasmussen spends his winters training in Mexico (he has a Mexican wife).

--
E. Dronkert

Assuming that you hit the weather right, the Sierra Madre Oriental and
Orizaba side doubtless has some sparsly traveled roads through lush
rugged country that will blow your mind. That's also the major
whitewater kayaking scene down there. The only question is whether
you'll be based far enough out of the city to avoid the nasty places. I
suspect that the nasty places where you are going involve big rivers
with very few bridges.

The other thing that's escaped this thread so far is that there is a
very substantial Boy-racer scene down there, even in the real [censored]
oil towns like Tampico and Villahermosa where you couldn't pay me to
ride. So it's quite possible that you'll hook up with people who are
passionate about their training and know their way around.

I was fortunate enough to do a lot of my traveling when their currency
was collapsing in the 1980s so we had options back then that I know
I'll never see again anywhere. (Like wheeling your bike onto an airport
runway and placing it in the baggage compartment of a 727 yourself and
flying from Mazatlan to Guadalajara for 16 Dollars. The guys that
taught me that stunt flew from Acapulco to Oaxaca for $21 and either
route was at least a day and a half by car and five days by bike back
then. More importantly they took you from the coast to 500-700 feet in
40 Minutes. Of course the same thing has happened to their airlines
that's happened to ours since then so don't count on that action.)

So if it's occurred to you that you might want to put your bike on a
bus once in a while then you're on the right track (there are almost no
trains down there any longer and the one that ran/runs? through
Veracruz goes south along the coast to places that are just as bad, the
one that goes up to Mexico City would be very useful but it's probably
full almost all the time.) Even though taking the bus will often feel
more dangerous than riding your bike down the very same road. On my
last major trip I was three days trying to get onto the train from
Juarez and finally took the bus from there to Durango. The first class
busses actually have seat assignments like airplanes and they leave at
all hours of the night which meant that it was subsidizing hotel costs
for me and more than once it was so empty that my bike rode right there
in the center aisle of the bus itself.

Any major rural center will have a decent and quite secure $25/Night
hotel ($8 in my day) with a gringo-proof restaurant on the premesis and
I never had anyone tell me that I couldn't keep my bike right in the
room.

We've met once and the next time that you're in Boulder I'd be glad to
open up my private Map collection for you. htis2005ATyahooDOTcom

I not 100 Percent sure that I'll be at VeloSwap.

Ewoud Dronkert says...

Quoted message said:

Rasmussen spends his winters training in Mexico (he has a Mexican wife).

Cool! I've got a heavy duty bunjee cord: Make me fly, skinny man!

[email hidden] says...

Quoted message said:

We've met once and the next time that you're in Boulder I'd be glad to
open up my private Map collection for you. htis2005ATyahooDOTcom

There it is - documented proof that someone has met me before and is willing to
meet with me again.

First time for everything.

In article <[email hidden]>, [email hidden] says...

Quoted message said:

I heard Chris Wherry knows some really nice places to ride in May-hee-ko.

IIRC, he was not on a bike. He was surfing and camping in a car. So he may
not know the best places to ride. He can probably give you pointers on where
not to drive to.
--------------
Alex