Bikes made in North America?

"Rob Osborn" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

I have been following the "Why buy it at the LBS?" thread and appreciated
the comment concerning products made in North America. Please tell me what
bikes are actually made in the United States.

Thanks,

Rob
Made in the USA? Don't know. But I have been looking for a Vitus bike
(made in France) for years and I found one last weekend. I plan to
eventually kit it out with Stronglight components, Sachs Ergoshifters,
derailleurs, Mavic wheels and brakes and hubs and a LOOK stem. Oh, and
LOOK pedals. Anyone know of a French-made bar and saddle?

"Dave Mayer" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:ic5Qe.317889$5V4.291790@pd7tw3no...

Quoted message said:

"Rob Osborn" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

I have been following the "Why buy it at the LBS?" thread and appreciated
the comment concerning products made in North America. Please tell me
what bikes are actually made in the United States.

Thanks,

Rob
Made in the USA? Don't know. But I have been looking for a Vitus bike
(made in France) for years and I found one last weekend. I plan to
eventually kit it out with Stronglight components, Sachs Ergoshifters,
derailleurs, Mavic wheels and brakes and hubs and a LOOK stem. Oh, and
LOOK pedals. Anyone know of a French-made bar and saddle?

A handle bar with a holder for a white flag, or without? (bad taste, but
couldn't help myself)

"di" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:nD5Qe.1921$P34.449@okepread07...

Quoted message said:

Anyone know of a French-made bar and saddle?

Quoted message said:

A handle bar with a holder for a white flag, or without? (bad taste,
but couldn't help myself)

You know, humour or not, these jokes about France are getting a little
tedious. For one thing, they represent a profound ignorance of military
history and of history in general. The French army may have been defeated by
the German army in the second world war, but it wasn't for lack of fighting
by the troops on the ground. There was vicious fighting in fact. I can't
think of any instance where the French raised a white flag. Dien Bien Phu?
The French there fought and held out as long as possible with tremendous
skill and valour and against overwhelming odds. They lost Indochina
ultimately (Vietnam), but so did the Americans a generation later armed with
much greater resources. What other battles or military actions do you want
to go back to? The French have never been cowardly enough to bomb civilians
from the safety of high altitude as the Americans did in the second world
war, Vietnam and now Iraq, so I don't think any particular nation is
justified in making jokes about the French.

Pierre

Pete said:

"di" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:nD5Qe.1921$P34.449@okepread07...

Anyone know of a French-made bar and saddle?

Quoted message said:

A handle bar with a holder for a white flag, or without? (bad taste,
but couldn't help myself)

You know, humour or not, these jokes about France are getting a little
tedious. For one thing, they represent a profound ignorance of military
history and of history in general. The French army may have been defeated by
the German army in the second world war, but it wasn't for lack of fighting
by the troops on the ground. There was vicious fighting in fact. I can't
think of any instance where the French raised a white flag. Dien Bien Phu?
The French there fought and held out as long as possible with tremendous
skill and valour and against overwhelming odds. They lost Indochina
ultimately (Vietnam), but so did the Americans a generation later armed with
much greater resources. What other battles or military actions do you want
to go back to? The French have never been cowardly enough to bomb civilians
from the safety of high altitude as the Americans did in the second world
war, Vietnam and now Iraq, so I don't think any particular nation is
justified in making jokes about the French.

Pierre

I admire your efforts Pete, but you're wasting your breath. Of course
every people has had their highs and lows in all fields of human
endeavor, but such nuance is lost on myth-believing non-thinkers such as
"di". Not persuaded by facts, a depressingly large number of "followers"
like our friend here are happy simply adopting the mindless world view
they're fed by the likes of Fox "News", "talk" radio, and the rest of
the right wing corporate media machine, as they obediently march like
lemmings off a cliff. Too bad they're dragging the whole damned society
with them.

Your remark is not only "bad taste" pal, it reveals you to be an
ignorant fool.

Vérité

vérité' 'myth buster said:

Pete said:

"di" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:nD5Qe.1921$P34.449@okepread07... Anyone know of a French-made bar
and saddle?

Quoted message said:

A handle bar with a holder for a white flag, or without? (bad
taste, but couldn't help myself)

You know, humour or not, these jokes about France are getting a
little tedious. For one thing, they represent a profound ignorance
of military history and of history in general. The French army may
have been defeated by the German army in the second world war, but
it wasn't for lack of fighting by the troops on the ground. There
was vicious fighting in fact. I can't think of any instance where
the French raised a white flag. Dien Bien Phu? The French there
fought and held out as long as possible with tremendous skill and
valour and against overwhelming odds. They lost Indochina ultimately
(Vietnam), but so did the Americans a generation later armed with
much greater resources. What other battles or military actions do
you want to go back to? The French have never been cowardly enough
to bomb civilians from the safety of high altitude as the Americans
did in the second world war, Vietnam and now Iraq, so I don't think
any particular nation is justified in making jokes about the French.
Pierre

I admire your efforts Pete, but you're wasting your breath. Of course
every people has had their highs and lows in all fields of human
endeavor, but such nuance is lost on myth-believing non-thinkers such
as "di". Not persuaded by facts, a depressingly large number of
"followers" like our friend here are happy simply adopting the
mindless world view they're fed by the likes of Fox "News", "talk"
radio, and the rest of the right wing corporate media machine, as
they obediently march like lemmings off a cliff. Too bad they're
dragging the whole damned society with them.

Your remark is not only "bad taste" pal, it reveals you to be an
ignorant fool.

Vérité

http://www.code7r.org/Bintoons/allies2.htm

"Pete" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

"di" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:nD5Qe.1921$P34.449@okepread07...

Quoted message said:

Anyone know of a French-made bar and saddle?

Quoted message said:

A handle bar with a holder for a white flag, or without? (bad taste,
but couldn't help myself)

You know, humour or not, these jokes about France are getting a little
tedious. For one thing, they represent a profound ignorance of military
history and of history in general. The French army may have been defeated
by the German army in the second world war, but it wasn't for lack of
fighting by the troops on the ground. There was vicious fighting in fact.
I can't think of any instance where the French raised a white flag. Dien
Bien Phu? The French there fought and held out as long as possible with
tremendous skill and valour and against overwhelming odds. They lost
Indochina ultimately (Vietnam), but so did the Americans a generation
later armed with much greater resources. What other battles or military
actions do you want to go back to? The French have never been cowardly
enough to bomb civilians from the safety of high altitude as the Americans
did in the second world war, Vietnam and now Iraq, so I don't think any
particular nation is justified in making jokes about the French.

Pierre

Gallic Wars - Lost. In a war whose ending foreshadows the next 2000 years of
French history, France is conquered by of all things, an Italian.

Hundred Years War - Mostly lost, saved at last by female schizophrenic who
inadvertently creates The First Rule of French Warfare; "France's armies are
victorious only when NOT led by a Frenchman."

Italian Wars - Lost. France becomes the first and only country to ever lose
two wars -- when fighting Italians.

Wars of Religion - France goes 0-5-4 against the Huguenots.

Thirty Years War - France is technically not a participant, but manages to
get invaded anyway. Claims a tie on the basis that eventually the other
participants started ignoring her.

War of Devolution - Tied. Frenchmen take to wearing red flower pots as
chapeaux.

The Dutch War - Tied.

War of the Augsburg League / King William's War / French and Indian
War -Lost, but claimed as a tie. Three ties in a row induces deluded
Frogophiles the world over to label the period as the height of French
military power.

War of the Spanish Succession - Lost. The War also gave the French their
first taste of a Marlborough, which they have loved ever since.

American Revolution - In a move that will become quite familiar to future
Americans, France claims a win even though the English colonists saw far
more action. This is later known as "de Gaulle Syndrome", and leads to the
Second Rule of French Warfare; "France only wins when America does most of
the fighting."

French Revolution - Won, primarily due the fact that the opponent was also
French.

The Napoleonic Wars - Lost. Temporary victories (remember the First Rule!)
due to leadership of a Corsican, who ended up being no match for a British
footwear designer.

The Franco-Prussian War - Lost. Germany first plays the role of drunk Frat
boy to France's ugly girl home alone on a Saturday night.

World War I - Tied and on the way to losing, France is saved by the United
States. Thousands of French women find out what it's like to not only sleep
with a winner, but one who doesn't call her "Fraulein." Sadly, widespread
use of condoms by American forces forestalls any improvement in the French
bloodline.

World War II - Lost. Conquered French liberated by the United States and
Britain just as they finish learning the Horst Wessel Song.

War in Indochina - Lost. French forces plead sickness, take to bed with the
Dien Bien Flu.

Algerian Rebellion - Lost. Loss marks the first defeat of a western army by
a Non-Turkic Muslim force since the Crusades, and produces the First Rule of
Muslim Warfare; "We can always beat the French." This rule is identical to
the First Rules of the Italians, Russians, Germans, English, Dutch, Spanish,
Vietnamese and Esquimaux.

War Against Greenpeace - Lost. 1985, the Greenpeace ship Rainbow Warrior
prepares to sail for Moruroa Atoll for a major campaign against French
nuclear testing. Agents of the DGSE [secret service] bomb and sink the ship
in Auckland Harbor. I tree-hugger sans tree drowns. Six weeks later agents
Prieur and Mafart plead guilty to charges of manslaughter and willful
damage. They get sentences of 10 years and 7 years. French Prime Minister
Fabius admits to state terrorism on TV.

War on Terrorism - France, keeping in mind its recent history, surrenders to
Germans and Muslims just to be safe. Attempts to surrender to Vietnamese
ambassador fail after he takes refuge in
a McDonald's.

Rob Osborn said:

I have been following the "Why buy it at the LBS?" thread and appreciated
the comment concerning products made in North America. Please tell me what
bikes are actually made in the United States.

These days, bikes like most other products (including automobiles) are
built of bits and pieces sourced from all over the place. It's not
uncommon to have a bike with parts from ten different countries, put
together in a package in an eleventh with final assembly in a twelfth.

A bike in a box is about 90% air, being roughly 4' long, 3' high and
3/4' wide, a container is 8 x 8 x 40, so it holds about 10 bikes wide,
2 high and 10 deep or about 200 bikes, in boxes. Say it costs $10,000
to move that container from China to the USA, or $50 per bike, that's a
lot of shipping cost on say a $100 bike.

Makes more sense to order containers of parts, say brakes, deraileurs,
pedals, chains from Shimano, cables from somewhere else, frames from
another place, rims from somewhere else, tires and tubes from somewhere
else, etc. Build a small assembly plant that does partial assembly
locally, and go for a discount carrier shipment of the final bikes in a box.

This is why, most Asian auto makers now do assembly in North America,
it's cheaper that way.

W

Rob Osborn said:

I have been following the "Why buy it at the LBS?" thread and appreciated
the comment concerning products made in North America. Please tell me what
bikes are actually made in the United States.

Thanks,

Rob

Cannondale bikes have "Handmade in the USA" decals on the frame. How
much of the bike that's true of is a good question...

--

the black rose
Research Associate in the Field of Child Development and Human
Relations
http://community.webshots.com/user/blackrosequilts
2005 BOMs: http://pg.photos.yahoo.com/ph/blackrosequilts/my_photos

-------- __o
----- -\<. -------- __o
--- ( )/ ( ) ---- -\<.
-------------------- ( )/ ( )
-----------------------------------------

di said:

Gallic Wars - Lost. In a war whose ending foreshadows the next 2000
years of French history, France is conquered by of all things, an
Italian.
Hundred Years War - Mostly lost, saved at last by female
schizophrenic who inadvertently creates The First Rule of French
Warfare; "France's armies are victorious only when NOT led by a
Frenchman."
Italian Wars - Lost. France becomes the first and only country to
ever lose two wars -- when fighting Italians.

Wars of Religion - France goes 0-5-4 against the Huguenots.

Thirty Years War - France is technically not a participant, but
manages to get invaded anyway. Claims a tie on the basis that
eventually the other participants started ignoring her.

War of Devolution - Tied. Frenchmen take to wearing red flower pots as
chapeaux.

The Dutch War - Tied.

War of the Augsburg League / King William's War / French and Indian
War -Lost, but claimed as a tie. Three ties in a row induces deluded
Frogophiles the world over to label the period as the height of French
military power.

War of the Spanish Succession - Lost. The War also gave the French
their first taste of a Marlborough, which they have loved ever since.

American Revolution - In a move that will become quite familiar to
future Americans, France claims a win even though the English
colonists saw far more action. This is later known as "de Gaulle
Syndrome", and leads to the Second Rule of French Warfare; "France
only wins when America does most of the fighting."

French Revolution - Won, primarily due the fact that the opponent was
also French.

The Napoleonic Wars - Lost. Temporary victories (remember the First
Rule!) due to leadership of a Corsican, who ended up being no match
for a British footwear designer.

The Franco-Prussian War - Lost. Germany first plays the role of drunk
Frat boy to France's ugly girl home alone on a Saturday night.

World War I - Tied and on the way to losing, France is saved by the
United States. Thousands of French women find out what it's like to
not only sleep with a winner, but one who doesn't call her
"Fraulein." Sadly, widespread use of condoms by American forces
forestalls any improvement in the French bloodline.

World War II - Lost. Conquered French liberated by the United States
and Britain just as they finish learning the Horst Wessel Song.

War in Indochina - Lost. French forces plead sickness, take to bed
with the Dien Bien Flu.

Algerian Rebellion - Lost. Loss marks the first defeat of a western
army by a Non-Turkic Muslim force since the Crusades, and produces
the First Rule of Muslim Warfare; "We can always beat the French."
This rule is identical to the First Rules of the Italians, Russians,
Germans, English, Dutch, Spanish, Vietnamese and Esquimaux.

War Against Greenpeace - Lost. 1985, the Greenpeace ship Rainbow
Warrior prepares to sail for Moruroa Atoll for a major campaign
against French nuclear testing. Agents of the DGSE [secret service]
bomb and sink the ship in Auckland Harbor. I tree-hugger sans tree
drowns. Six weeks later agents Prieur and Mafart plead guilty to
charges of manslaughter and willful damage. They get sentences of 10
years and 7 years. French Prime Minister Fabius admits to state
terrorism on TV.
War on Terrorism - France, keeping in mind its recent history,
surrenders to Germans and Muslims just to be safe. Attempts to
surrender to Vietnamese ambassador fail after he takes refuge in
a McDonald's.

OK, I give!

Again.

<eg>

Dave Mayer said:

"Rob Osborn" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

I have been following the "Why buy it at the LBS?" thread and appreciated
the comment concerning products made in North America. Please tell me what
bikes are actually made in the United States.

Thanks,

Rob
Made in the USA? Don't know. But I have been looking for a Vitus bike
(made in France) for years and I found one last weekend. I plan to
eventually kit it out with Stronglight components, Sachs Ergoshifters,
derailleurs, Mavic wheels and brakes and hubs and a LOOK stem. Oh, and
LOOK pedals. Anyone know of a French-made bar and saddle?

I have seen a handlebar labeled "Pivo" with made in France written on
it. They were on a Peugeot. The same bike had a saddle on it that
said made in France as well. Neither the saddle nor the handlebars
were very impressive, but then again none of the other parts on this
particular Peugeot (a carbolite 103 frame) were very impressive either,
even though most of them were made in France (maillard hubs, huret
derailleurs and shifters, unknown french crank).

Later,
Mark Muller

In article <ic5Qe.317889$5V4.291790@pd7tw3no>,

Dave Mayer said:

"Rob Osborn" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

I have been following the "Why buy it at the LBS?" thread and appreciated
the comment concerning products made in North America. Please tell me what
bikes are actually made in the United States.

Thanks,

Rob
Made in the USA? Don't know. But I have been looking for a Vitus bike
(made in France) for years and I found one last weekend. I plan to
eventually kit it out with Stronglight components, Sachs Ergoshifters,
derailleurs, Mavic wheels and brakes and hubs and a LOOK stem. Oh, and
LOOK pedals. Anyone know of a French-made bar and saddle?

Ideale saddle co., of course! Do you need one, Dave?

http://www.classicrendezvous.com/France/Ideale_main.htm

--
Ryan Cousineau [email hidden] http://www.wiredcola.com/
"I don't want kids who are thinking about going into mathematics
to think that they have to take drugs to succeed." -Paul Erdos

"Rob Osborn" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

I have been following the "Why buy it at the LBS?" thread and appreciated
the comment concerning products made in North America. Please tell me what
bikes are actually made in the United States.

There are still framemakers in the US and Canada. The biggest is probably
Cannondale. Trek makes racing frames in Wisconsin. And there are a number of
smaller, specialty framemakers.

Nearly all, if not all, of the rest of the parts on any bike, regardless of
the source of the frame or its expense, will be made overseas. Bars, stems,
drivetrains, wheels, tires, saddles, seatposts, pedals, bottle cages, bar
tape... Japan, Taiwan, China, Italy, France.

It's like trying to find an American-made computer.

RichC

In article <[email hidden]>,

the black rose said:

Rob Osborn said:

I have been following the "Why buy it at the LBS?" thread and appreciated
the comment concerning products made in North America. Please tell me what
bikes are actually made in the United States.

Thanks,

Rob

Cannondale bikes have "Handmade in the USA" decals on the frame. How
much of the bike that's true of is a good question...

The Cannondale aluminum frames really are pretty much completely built
in the USA. They also have their own "Hollowgram" BB/crank setup, which
quite possibly is manufactured here.

King definitely makes all their stuff in their US facility (they're very
proud of it and have pics on their website), so you could get hubs and
headset from them.

I am sympathetic to these nationalistic impulses, if only because it
makes for a neat theme for a bike. But practically speaking, I'm a big
fan of international parts sourcing. Remember that the reason Shimano is
a powerhouse company in bike components has a lot to do with how much
better their (and Suntour's) components were than the stuff coming out
of France (and Italy) in the 1970s.

American frame, seatpost, and stem, Italian shifters, bars, saddle and
rder, Japanese* brakes, cogs, rings, cranks, pedals, and BB, and
Canadian-designed, Taiwan-sourced wheels on my race bike,

*Most of Shimano's production seems to be outsourced to Malaysia and
Taiwan these days.

--
Ryan Cousineau [email hidden] http://www.wiredcola.com/
"I don't want kids who are thinking about going into mathematics
to think that they have to take drugs to succeed." -Paul Erdos

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Made in the USA? Don't know. But I have been looking for a Vitus bike
(made in France) for years and I found one last weekend. I plan to
eventually kit it out with Stronglight components, Sachs Ergoshifters,
derailleurs, Mavic wheels and brakes and hubs and a LOOK stem. Oh, and
LOOK pedals. Anyone know of a French-made bar and saddle?

Ideale saddle co., of course! Do you need one, Dave?

http://www.classicrendezvous.com/France/Ideale_main.htm

--
Ryan Cousineau [email hidden] http://www.wiredcola.com/
"I don't want kids who are thinking about going into mathematics
to think that they have to take drugs to succeed." -Paul Erdos

Thanks for the offer Ryan? Ti rails? I'd like to have a look.

As you know the bike came with a very nice Simplex seatpost. I would balk
at putting on an AVA or Pivo stem. Were you able to establish which was the
notorious model of death?

In the link provided I notice a 50's era Ideale saddle with a cutout/groove
in the middle for "male anatomy pressure relief". So how exactly was
another bike company able to patent this feature 40 years later?

"Pete" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

The French have never been cowardly enough to bomb civilians

Quoted message said:

from the safety of high altitude as the Americans did in the second world
war,

Safety? Cowardly? What an idiot.

Cheto

di said:

A handle bar with a holder for a white flag, or without? (bad taste,
but couldn't help myself)

Translated back to the original:

A han'le bar wif a holder fo' a white flag, o' wifout? (bad taste, but
c'dn't he'p mahse'f)

--
Sock Puppet

----== Posted via Newsfeeds.Com - Unlimited-Uncensored-Secure Usenet News==----
http://www.newsfeeds.com The #1 Newsgroup Service in the World! 120,000+ Newsgroups
----= East and West-Coast Server Farms - Total Privacy via Encryption =----

di said:

Gallic Wars - Lost. In a war whose ending foreshadows the next 2000 years
of
French history, France is conquered by of all things, an Italian.

Hundred Years War - Mostly lost, saved at last by female schizophrenic who

inadvertently creates The First Rule of French Warfare; "France's armies
are
victorious only when NOT led by a Frenchman."

Italian Wars - Lost. France becomes the first and only country to ever
lose
two wars -- when fighting Italians.

Wars of Religion - France goes 0-5-4 against the Huguenots.

Thirty Years War - France is technically not a participant, but manages to

get invaded anyway. Claims a tie on the basis that eventually the other
participants started ignoring her.

War of Devolution - Tied. Frenchmen take to wearing red flower pots as
chapeaux.

The Dutch War - Tied.

War of the Augsburg League / King William's War / French and Indian
War -Lost, but claimed as a tie. Three ties in a row induces deluded
Frogophiles the world over to label the period as the height of French
military power.

War of the Spanish Succession - Lost. The War also gave the French their
first taste of a Marlborough, which they have loved ever since.

American Revolution - In a move that will become quite familiar to future
Americans, France claims a win even though the English colonists saw far
more action. This is later known as "de Gaulle Syndrome", and leads to the

Second Rule of French Warfare; "France only wins when America does most of

the fighting."

French Revolution - Won, primarily due the fact that the opponent was also

French.

The Napoleonic Wars - Lost. Temporary victories (remember the First Rule!)

due to leadership of a Corsican, who ended up being no match for a British

footwear designer.

The Franco-Prussian War - Lost. Germany first plays the role of drunk Frat

boy to France's ugly girl home alone on a Saturday night.

World War I - Tied and on the way to losing, France is saved by the United

States. Thousands of French women find out what it's like to not only
sleep
with a winner, but one who doesn't call her "Fraulein." Sadly, widespread
use of condoms by American forces forestalls any improvement in the French

bloodline.

World War II - Lost. Conquered French liberated by the United States and
Britain just as they finish learning the Horst Wessel Song.

War in Indochina - Lost. French forces plead sickness, take to bed with
the
Dien Bien Flu.

Algerian Rebellion - Lost. Loss marks the first defeat of a western army
by
a Non-Turkic Muslim force since the Crusades, and produces the First Rule
of
Muslim Warfare; "We can always beat the French." This rule is identical to

the First Rules of the Italians, Russians, Germans, English, Dutch,
Spanish,
Vietnamese and Esquimaux.

War Against Greenpeace - Lost. 1985, the Greenpeace ship Rainbow Warrior
prepares to sail for Moruroa Atoll for a major campaign against French
nuclear testing. Agents of the DGSE [secret service] bomb and sink the
ship
in Auckland Harbor. I tree-hugger sans tree drowns. Six weeks later agents

Prieur and Mafart plead guilty to charges of manslaughter and willful
damage. They get sentences of 10 years and 7 years. French Prime Minister

Fabius admits to state terrorism on TV.

War on Terrorism - France, keeping in mind its recent history, surrenders
to
Germans and Muslims just to be safe. Attempts to surrender to Vietnamese
ambassador fail after he takes refuge in
a McDonald's.

Again, I translate back to the original:

Gallic Wars - Lost. In a war whose endigg f'eshadows de next 2000 years of
French hifayree tale, Frass is conkehid by of all diggs, duuhhhh, an
Italian. Hundrid Years War - Most lost, uh, sabid at last by female
schizophrenic who inadbehtent crates De Firss Rule of French Warfare;
"Frass's armies are bictorious on when NOT lid by a Frenchman." Italian Wars
- Lost. Frass becomes the, uh uh uh, first 'n on country t' ebeh lose two
wars -- when fiteigg Italians. Wars of Religion - Frass goes 0-5-4 against
de Huguenots. Dirty Years War - Frass is technical not a parpicitant, uh,
but manages t' get inbadid anyway. Claims a tie on de basdat ebentual de
odeh parpicitants startid ignorigg heh. War of Debolushun - Tied.
DOIHH!Frenchmen take t' webuharigg rid flowebuhr pots as chapeaux. De Dutch
War - Tied. War of de Augsburg League / Kigg William's War / French 'n
Indian War -Lost, uh, but claimid as a tie, GEEEHEEHEEE.Dree ties in a row
induces delubed Frogophiles the, uh, the world obeh t' label de pehiod as de
heite of French milit powebuhr. War of de Spanish Successhun - Lost. De War
also gabe de French deir firss taste of a Marlborough, which dey habe lobid
ebeh siss. Amehican Rebolushun - In a mobe dat will become kite familiar t'
future Amehicans, duuhhhh, Frass claims a winb eben dough de English
colonists saw far more ackion. GEE danks.Dis is lateh known as "de Gaulle
Syndrome", 'n leads t' de Seconb Rule of French Warfare; "Frass on wins when
Amehica does most of the, uh uh uh, fiteigg." French Rebolushun - Won,
primary due the, uh uh uh, fack dat de opponent was also French. De
Napoleonic Wars - Lost. Tempor bictories (remembeh de Firss Rule! Huh huh!)
due t' leadehship of a Corsican, who endid up beigg no match f' a British
footwebuhar designeh. De Franco-Prussian War - Lost. Gehmany firss plays de
role of drunk Frat boy t' Frass's ug girl home alone on a Saturday nite.
World War I - Tiid and on the, uh, the way t' losigg, Frass is sabid by de
Utid States. Dousands of French women find out what it's like t' not on
sleep wid a winneh, but one who doesn't call heh "Fraulein." Sad, widespread
use of conboms by Amehican f'ces f'estalls any iprobemin in de French
bloodline. World War II - Lost. Conkehid French libehatid by de Utid States
'n Britain dgust as dey finish learnigg de Horst Webuhssel Song. War in
Indochina - Lost. French f'ces blead sickness, duuhhhh, take t' bid wid de
Dien Bien Flu. Algehian Rebellion - Lost. Loss marks the, uh uh uh, first
defeat of a webuhstehn army by a Non-Turkic Muslim f'ce siss de Crusades,
duuhhhh, 'n produces de Firss Rule of Muslim Warfare; "Webuh can allays beat
de French." Dis rule is identical t' de Firss Rules of de Italians, duuhhhh,
Russians, duuhhhh, Gehmans, duuhhhh, English, Dutch, Spanish, Bietnamese 'n
Eskimaux. War Against Greenpeace - Lost. DOIHH!1985, de Greenpeace ship
Rainbow Warrior prepares t' sail f' Moruroa Atoll f' a madgor campaign
against French nucular testigg. Agents of de DGSE [secret sehbice] bomb 'n
sink the, ERRRR, ship in Auckland Harbor. I tree-huggeh sans tree drowns.
Six weebuhks lateh agents Prieur 'n Mafart blead guilty t' charges of
manslaughteh 'n willful damage. Dey get sentesss of 10 years 'n 7 years.
French Prime Ministeh Fabius admits t' state tehrorism on TB. War on
Tehrorism - Frass, keepigg in mind its recent hifayree tale, surrendehs t'
Gehmans 'n Muslims dgust t' be safe. Attempts t' surrendeh t' Bietnamese
ambassador fail affeh he takes refuge in a McDonald's. Um uh.

--
Sock Puppet

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vérité 'myth buster'@hotmail.com said:

I admire your efforts Pete, but you're wasting your breath. Of course
every people has had their highs and lows in all fields of human
endeavor, but such nuance is lost on myth-believing non-thinkers such as
"di". Not persuaded by facts, a depressingly large number of "followers"
like our friend here are happy simply adopting the mindless world view
they're fed by the likes of Fox "News", "talk" radio, and the rest of
the right wing corporate media machine, as they obediently march like
lemmings off a cliff. Too bad they're dragging the whole damned society
with them.

Wow, you hit the nail on the head with that statement.

Quoted message said:

Your remark is not only "bad taste" pal, it reveals you to be an
ignorant fool.

I'm sure he's faced lots of flying lead.

Quoted message said:

Vérité

"Rob Osborn" <[email hidden]> wrote in
news:[email hidden]:

Quoted message said:

I have been following the "Why buy it at the LBS?" thread and
appreciated the comment concerning products made in North America.
Please tell me what bikes are actually made in the United States.

Thanks,

Rob

My Vision R-40 recumbent was made in Washington state. My 18+ y.o. Trek
400, I believe, was made in the US.

--ag