BigHa again

Two years in a start up business with two partners taught me a lot about risk and reward and
provided me with an appreciation for those who can visualize a product or service, put their idea in
to action, bring it to market, and make a profit by being of service to others. That would include
those individuals who make it possible for us to ride more than one type of bicycle.

Skip

"rorschandt" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
"]news:[email hidden]... <snip>

Quoted message said:

As I mentioned above, business is often risky.

"Edward Wong" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
"]news:[email hidden]...

Ed let me add my name to those who say "excellent post"

Skip

skip said:

<[email hidden]> wrote in message "]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Yes, life is hard for the CEOs of large corporations that make over 500 times the average wage
of their hourly workers.

Tom - You are going into re-runs. We know already.

Skip,

Well, I did not bring the subject up about how difficult life is for CEOs. As an extensive Google
Groups search will reveal, I have not started any of these off-topic discussions on a.r.b.r., but
have merely responded to those off topic discussions started by others.

Tom Sherman - Quad Cities USA (Illinois side)

"Edward Wong" skrev

*snip*

Quoted message said:

Mr. Acres I wish you the best of success and should the venture not prosper to your intitial
expectations, it will NOT be because of any reasons anyone expounds in this newsgroup.

You mean saying that we wouldn't touch it with a 7-foot pole because one can get a wide variety of
great recumbent bikes for 3000 dollars and in some cases even have cash left over for accessories?

It seems to me that listening to your potential costumers might be a good idea in any business. But
apparently we are not his potential customers based on John Acres replies here. Who then?

People that are new to recumbents? Maybe it can be done but 3000 is still going to make a lot run
away screaming and get an entrylevel bent at an affordable price.

I will be looking forward to BROLs next issue where we will get John Acres take on this. I will also
look forward to a test of the bike. I still like the electronics part of it a lot.

But saying we can't have an opinion on this unless we start our own recumbent business is quite
frankly just you being as immature as you accuse us of being.

Regards Mikael

Sorry if I misspoke Tom. I didn't do a Google search nor do I wish to one, but it seemed to me that
you had posted this particular snippit about CEO's several times in the recent past. My apologies if
this is first time for that one.

To change the subject and to continue off topic, Fritz the Cat was screaming at me this morning and
I had to make an emergency run to the grocery to get him some of his favorite stuff. In the grocery
parking lot I saw a car with the bumper sticker "God Bless Everybody - No Exceptions". After I
paused to reflect on the larger meaning of the message I started thinking of all the locals I
consider to be super bigots and how much fun it would be to sneak one of these stickers on to the
back bumpers of their cars.

It's been raining for about 70 hours straight - better than snow I guess - anyway that's my excuse
for overposting.

Skip

"Tom Sherman" <[email hidden]> wrote in message "]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

skip said:

<[email hidden]> wrote in message "]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Yes, life is hard for the CEOs of large corporations that make over

500

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

times the average wage of their hourly workers.

Tom - You are going into re-runs. We know already.

Skip,

Well, I did not bring the subject up about how difficult life is for CEOs. As an extensive Google
Groups search will reveal, I have not started any of these off-topic discussions on a.r.b.r., but
have merely responded to those off topic discussions started by others.

Tom Sherman - Quad Cities USA (Illinois side)

Mikael Seierup said:

"Edward Wong" skrev

*snip*

Quoted message said:

Mr. Acres I wish you the best of success and should the venture not prosper to your intitial
expectations, it will NOT be because of any reasons anyone expounds in this newsgroup.

You mean saying that we wouldn't touch it with a 7-foot pole because one can get a wide variety of
great recumbent bikes for 3000 dollars and in some cases even have cash left over for accessories?

It seems to me that listening to your potential costumers might be a good idea in any business.
But apparently we are not his potential customers based on John Acres replies here. Who then?

People that are new to recumbents? Maybe it can be done but 3000 is still going to make a lot run
away screaming and get an entrylevel bent at an affordable price.

I will be looking forward to BROLs next issue where we will get John Acres take on this. I will
also look forward to a test of the bike. I still like the electronics part of it a lot.

But saying we can't have an opinion on this unless we start our own recumbent business is quite
frankly just you being as immature as you accuse us of being.

Regards Mikael

That's the big question: who are Bigha's potential customers? It seems to be the comfort bike
market. People in their 40's and 50's who haven't rode a bike since they were kids. So assuming they
are sufficiently naive to pay twice the market cost for a bike of this type, they are going to get
this bike shipped to them sight unseen, with no chance to test ride and no one to explain to them
how to ride it and just pedal off? That's what they should be able to do on a comfort bike. Will
they be able to do that on a Bigha? Remember the very first time you were on a recumbent? A little
wobbly? Most of us probably fell a time or two. And most of us were probably experienced bike
riders, most had a chance to test ride recumbents before buying. Now take someone who has not rode a
bike of any kind for twenty years. We'll see how good Bigha's return policy is.

Lorenzo L. Love home.thegrid.net~llloveOpen ↗

"A people living under the perpetual menace of war and invasion is very easy to govern. It demands
no social reforms. It does not haggle over expenditures on armaments and military equipment. It pays
without discussion, it ruins itself, and that is an excellent thing for the syndicates of financiers
and manufacturers for whom patriotic terrors are an abundant source of gain." Anatole France

rorschandt said:

"Joshua Goldberg" <[email hidden]> wrote in
:"]news:[email hidden]:

Quoted message said:

Wow...I like this. The episode I was thinking of had the Enterprise almost colliding with a ship
that had been in space 88 years. I love Star Trek, the ONLY thing worth watching since Dr.Who was
pulled. Gawd I need a Life. I ride bents to avoid TV btw.

Red Dwarf is quite hilarious. Unfortunately,my lame-assed PBS station doesn't agree.Smegheads.

rorschandt

We mustn't forget Red Green, the best thing to come out of Canada since Moosehead beer.

--
Larry Varney Cold Spring, KY home.fuse.netlarryvarneyOpen ↗

"Lorenzo L. Love" skrev...

Quoted message said:

home.thegrid.net~llloveOpen ↗

Speaking of Big Ha's I enjoyed the "Pilocene Pussycat Theory" immensely. :-)

It also made perfect sense. I guess I should be worried about that but right now I'll write it off
to lack of sleep, mentally exhausting timecoding of subtitles and a mediocre white wine. Thats my
excuse at least and I'm sticking to it. ;-)

Mikael

Ehm... Pliocene even.

(see lack of sleep, wine etc.)

[email hidden] (Seth Jayson) wrote in message
news:<[email hidden]>...

Quoted message said:

BIG HAHA is more like it.

c'mon folks, who's going to pay 3K for this package of bells and whistles? Not too many people,
that's who. Bike E went bankrupt for exactly that reason.

Seth. BikeE did NOT go bankrupt because no one bought their product. BikeE was the largest
manufacturer of recumbents in the world. I suspect that BikeE failed primarily due to cash flow
problems, and plain bad luck.

The Federal and state goverments take our money through the force of law. Much of it is wasted. 15%
of your income is confiscated, err...I mean collected, for "Social Security". Anyone under thirty
five that thinks that they'll see a dime of that money is more than a prime candidate for a $3,000
entry level recumbent.

Big Ha is funded with private money. If they fail, it's no loss to any one on this board. Big Ha is
presenting the market place with an option. We are free to buy or not as we wish. Some people may
not like the Big Ha bike, but there is absolutely no excuse for hostility. Big Ha can not compell
you to do anything. Personally, I enjoy having choices. Even if I chose something else.

Quoted message said:

But saying we can't have an opinion on this unless we start our own recumbent business is quite
frankly just you being as immature as you accuse us of being.

Regards Mikael

Dear Mikael,

Read my post again. No where did I imply that you can't have your opinion. I was merely stating my
opinion and the way I see things. I didn't mention any names but by replying the way you did, it
shows that a nerve has been struck and thus implicated yourself. Sorry but that's the way it is.

Regards, Edward Wong Orlando, FL

tamasic1 said:

... No, is there a reason you can't read the entire post? Suffer from ADD? It's a comment on those
who are given everything, work at nothing and criticize those who make any attempt.

I certainly fit the first two descriptions - heck, I have never even worked more than 3800 hours in
one year. 😉

Tom Sherman - Quad Cities USA (Illinois side)

tamasic1 said:

No, is there a reason you can't read the entire post? Suffer from ADD? It's a comment on those who
are given everything, work at nothing and criticize those who make any attempt.

You can belittle me all you like to make yourself feel good or whatever. Have fun. Your post didn't
read to me like that.

"Tom Sherman" <[email hidden]> wrote in message "]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

tamasic1 said:

... No, is there a reason you can't read the entire post? Suffer from ADD? It's a comment on
those who are given everything, work at nothing and criticize those who make any attempt.

I certainly fit the first two descriptions - heck, I have never even worked more than 3800 hours
in one year. 😉

Tom Sherman - Quad Cities USA (Illinois side)

Tom to my way of thinking it isn't so much how many hours you've managed to put in, but more what
were the worthwhile contributions you made during that time.

Skip

"Edward Wong" skrev...

Quoted message said:

Read my post again. No where did I imply that you can't have your opinion. I was merely stating my
opinion and the way I see things. I didn't mention any names but by replying the way you did, it
shows that a nerve has been struck and thus implicated yourself. Sorry but that's the way it is.

I just think the "do it yourself or you're not entitled to an opinion"-argument is a bit
nonproductive no matter where it crops up. Thanks for a good laugh though. 😉

Regards Mikael

skip said:

Tom to my way of thinking it isn't so much how many hours you've managed to put in, but more what
were the worthwhile contributions you made during that time.

Skip,

From the viewpoint of a modern economist, the value of a person's contribution can be measured
solely in terms of financial returns to the employer from an individual's work versus the cost of
the employee to the employer.

When my chargability, total number of chargeable hours, book rate, and write-ups on the projects I
manage is taken into account, I am actually quite a good employee. [1] There are other less tangible
aspects also - in a business whose nature involves constantly changing overall workloads; the
willingness of employees to take on additional workload at the times of higher business volume will
prevent undesirable overstaffing during the times of lower business volume.

[1] You didn't think I was hired for my personality, did you?

Tom Sherman - Quad Cities USA (Illinois side)

"Tom Sherman" <[email hidden]> wrote in message "]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

skip said:

Tom to my way of thinking it isn't so much how many hours you've managed

to

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

put in, but more what were the worthwhile contributions you made during

that

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

time.

Skip,

From the viewpoint of a modern economist, the value of a person's contribution can be measured
solely in terms of financial returns to the employer from an individual's work versus the cost of
the employee to the employer.

When my chargability, total number of chargeable hours, book rate, and write-ups on the projects I
manage is taken into account, I am actually quite a good employee. [1] There are other less
tangible aspects also - in a business whose nature involves constantly changing overall workloads;
the willingness of employees to take on additional workload at the times of higher business volume
will prevent undesirable overstaffing during the times of lower business volume.

[1] You didn't think I was hired for my personality, did you?

I don't care about that stuff. Sorry, but why should I? What I'm trying to get at is this - during
those 3800 hours you spent working as a civil engineer last year you must have done something
productive to contribute to the building of the infrastructure of this country. The projects you
helped build are what I'd rather hear about. In my view your work on those projects is reflective of
your contribution to society and not those overstaffing/understaffing, chargeable vs. total time
type internal company concerns. It's the work you've done to build this country that I appreciate.

skip said:

I don't care about that stuff. Sorry, but why should I? What I'm trying to get at is this - during
those 3800 hours you spent working as a civil engineer last year you must have done something
productive to contribute to the building of the infrastructure of this country. The projects you
helped build are what I'd rather hear about. In my view your work on those projects is reflective
of your contribution to society and not those overstaffing/understaffing, chargeable vs. total
time type internal company concerns. It's the work you've done to build this country that I
appreciate.

Skip,

Quick correction - I did not work 3800 hours last year - the unofficial number is a few hundred
lower, and the official number lower yet. I worked 3800 hours in 1995 when I was working full time
plus at one low paying, dead end job and part time 30 to 35 hours a week at an even lower paying,
more dead end job. On the bright side, I made almost $19,000 US after taxes.

The reason I mentioned the financial aspects instead of the work I do is that financial results are
what our society values.

Think about it - when someone asks, "What is that man worth?" what he or she really wants to know is
how much financial wealth he has.

Tom Sherman - Recumbent Curmudgeon