BHIT MPs

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I love the way the UK considers it pays high tax- still not done the thinking required to
actually bridge the gap into wanting to create a better society for all.

Of course Mr Marx proposed another way but that didn't work too well either.

Both systems had the same fundamental flaw - us.[1]

[1] Well, maybe not /us/ as all cyclists are decent, honest and upsitting[2] people :-)

[2] Apart from recumbent riders.

"Tony Raven" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
"]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Willowbeauty said:

I love the way the UK considers it pays high tax- still not done the thinking required to
actually bridge the gap into wanting to create a

better

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society for all.

Of course Mr Marx proposed another way but that didn't work too well

either.

Honk?

cheers, clive

"Mark Thompson" <[email hidden] (change warm for hot)>
wrote in message "]news:[email hidden]...

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the rich will get richer but surely more concerning is that the poor

will get

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poorer.

I've never really bothered how rich the rich are - better things to get

envious

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about IMHO. The poor are getting richer though, unless you're talking

about

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this slightly misleading 'relative' thing.

Ah.. you're probably right, they can all go to University now and earn a fortune when they come out
so there won't be any poor people in the future (!) Of course in a service economy (the UK) this
might present a few challenges to say the least!

"Tony Raven" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
"]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Willowbeauty said:

I love the way the UK considers it pays high tax- still not done the thinking required to
actually bridge the gap into wanting to create a

better

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society for all.

Of course Mr Marx proposed another way but that didn't work too well

either.

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Tony

I notice that Cuba's healthcare system seems to working fairly effectively. I also notice that most
of Scandinavia actually ensure their population are putting money aside for the old-age. The UK has
so much to learn, but will it?

"Mark Thompson" <[email hidden] (change warm for hot)>
wrote in message "]news:[email hidden]...

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Fair enough. I don't like the 'privatise everything, pay really low tax

and

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wonder why everything falls apart' method.

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Excellent. I don't like the 'nationalise everything, pay really high tax

and

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still wonder why everything falls apart method'. Maybe we can find a

third way

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somehow. D'oh.

You must have been really [censored] of with Major, then, and his "we've privatised everything and
pretended the income is revenue but now we've run out of things to sell and we'll have to put taxes
back up to cover the costs of Maggie's holy war against manufacturing industry" method ;-)

--
Guy
===

WARNING: may contain traces of irony. Contents may settle after posting.
chapmancentral.co.ukchapmancentral.co.ukOpen ↗

Willowbeauty said:

I notice that Cuba's healthcare system seems to working fairly effectively. I also notice that
most of Scandinavia actually ensure their population are putting money aside for the old-age. The
UK has so much to learn, but will it?

Since Cuba achieves that on a per capita annual health spend one tenth that of the UK perhaps we
should be looking at NHS costs rather than more taxes then ;-)

But I agree on the pensions side. Gordon's raid on the pension funds to fund his programmes didn't
do a lot to encourage or assist people saving for their old age.

Tony

"Tony Raven" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
"]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

I notice that Cuba's healthcare system seems to working fairly

effectively.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

I also notice that most of Scandinavia actually ensure their population

are

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putting money aside for the old-age. The UK has so much to learn, but

will

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it?

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Since Cuba achieves that on a per capita annual health spend one tenth

that of

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the UK perhaps we should be looking at NHS costs rather than more taxes

then

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;-)

It must be profoundly embarrasing for the Septics, whose healthcare system is the most expensive per
capita in the world and you can still die while waiting for your HMO to approve treatment. If you
have a HMO (which, if you are chronically ill, you won't).

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But I agree on the pensions side. Gordon's raid on the pension funds to

fund

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his programmes didn't do a lot to encourage or assist people saving for

their

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old age.

Clearly learned at the knee of the late unlamented Cap'n Bob.

--
Guy
===

WARNING: may contain traces of irony. Contents may settle after posting.
chapmancentral.co.ukchapmancentral.co.ukOpen ↗

In article <[email hidden]>,

Tony Raven said:

But I agree on the pensions side. Gordon's raid on the pension funds to fund his programmes didn't
do a lot to encourage or assist people saving for their old age.

That just brought forward an inevitable pensions crash.

Without it, the crash would have been put off, and would have been many times bigger when it came.
I've been certain since the 1980s that my generation won't enjoy the same level of provision as
todays pensioners - precisely because we have an unsustainable system based largely on a pyramid
investment.

Right now, the next problem is probably property-price inflation. We got that when Gordon paid off
the national debt and pushed interest rates right down. Now he's running up a big debt again ...

--
Nick Kew

Colin Blackburn said:

If you don't know who your MP is then go to upmystreet.comupmystreet.comOpen ↗

Another good site is publicwhip.org.ukpublicwhip.org.ukOpen ↗ -- type in your postcode and find out your MP's
voting record.

--
Gareth Rees

"Gareth Rees" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
"]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Another good site is publicwhip.org.ukpublicwhip.org.ukOpen ↗ -- type in your postcode and find out your MP's
voting record.

See, you spoiled it by telling us what it does. Much better to let us speculate on the precise
nature of the public whipping on offer...

--
Guy
===

WARNING: may contain traces of irony. Contents may settle after posting.
chapmancentral.demon.co.ukchapmancentral.demon.co.ukOpen ↗

Quoted message said:

"James Hodson" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
"]news:[email hidden]...

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On Tue, 27 Jan 2004 23:49:47 -0000, "Willowbeauty"

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I don't like the "the state knows best" attitude of the LibDems and Labour.

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Fair enough.

Not really. The tories were never too slow in telling people what to do.

Dangerous dogs and "rythmic music" come to mind.

"W K" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
"]news:[email hidden]...

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"James Hodson" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
"]news:[email hidden]...

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On Tue, 27 Jan 2004 23:49:47 -0000, "Willowbeauty"

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

I don't like the "the state knows best" attitude of the LibDems and Labour.

Quoted message said:

Fair enough.

Not really. The tories were never too slow in telling people what to do.

Dangerous dogs and "rythmic music" come to mind.

I'll let you know when you are in charge of my opinion forming, til then, perhaps you'd butt out? I
stated fair enough as I am quite happy to accept and listen to other peoples views- I am sure you
are equally tolerant, you just don't show it particularly well.

"Willowbeauty" <[email hidden]> wrote in
message "]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

"W K" <[email hidden]> wrote in message "]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

"James Hodson" <[email hidden]> wrote in

message

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Quoted message said:

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"]news:[email hidden]...
> On Tue, 27 Jan 2004 23:49:47 -0000, "Willowbeauty"

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> I don't like the "the state knows best" attitude of the LibDems and Labour.

Quoted message said:

Fair enough.

Not really. The tories were never too slow in telling people what to do.

Dangerous dogs and "rythmic music" come to mind.

I'll let you know when you are in charge of my opinion forming, til then, perhaps you'd butt out?

WTF? Feel free to talk [censored], my point was that much as people attribute the above to L+L thats a
cunning piece of [censored].

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I stated fair enough as I am quite happy to accept and listen to other peoples views- I am sure
you are equally tolerant, you just don't show it particularly well.

I'm not tolerant of views founded on [censored].

"W K" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
"]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

"Willowbeauty" <[email hidden]> wrote

in

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message "]news:[email hidden]...

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"W K" <[email hidden]> wrote in message "]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

> "James Hodson" <[email hidden]> wrote in

message

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> "]news:[email hidden]...
> > On Tue, 27 Jan 2004 23:49:47 -0000, "Willowbeauty"

> > I don't like the "the state knows best" attitude of the LibDems

and

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> > Labour.

> Fair enough.

Not really. The tories were never too slow in telling people what to do.

Dangerous dogs and "rythmic music" come to mind.

I'll let you know when you are in charge of my opinion forming, til

then,

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perhaps you'd butt out?

WTF? Feel free to talk [censored], my point was that much as people attribute

the

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above to L+L thats a cunning piece of [censored].

Your justification? Any idiot can throw stones

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I stated fair enough as I am quite happy to accept and listen to other peoples views- I am sure
you are equally tolerant,

you

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just don't show it particularly well.

I'm not tolerant of views founded on [censored].

I over-estimated you then- I think you've made yourself clear, go pick an argument with someone 'on
your level'

"Willowbeauty" <[email hidden]> wrote in
message "]news:[email hidden]...

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"W K" <[email hidden]> wrote in message "]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

"Willowbeauty" <[email hidden]> wrote

in

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message "]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

"W K" <[email hidden]> wrote in message "]news:[email hidden]...
>
> > "James Hodson" <[email hidden]> wrote in

message

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> > "]news:[email hidden]...
> > > On Tue, 27 Jan 2004 23:49:47 -0000, "Willowbeauty"
>
> > > I don't like the "the state knows best" attitude of the LibDems

and

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> > > Labour.
>
> > Fair enough.
>
> Not really. The tories were never too slow in telling people what to do.
>
> Dangerous dogs and "rythmic music" come to mind.

I'll let you know when you are in charge of my opinion forming, til

then,

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perhaps you'd butt out?

WTF? Feel free to talk [censored], my point was that much as people attribute

the

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above to L+L thats a cunning piece of [censored].

Your justification? Any idiot can throw stones

I gave my justification early on. I would like you to think about it. There has been a gradual
increase in health+safety interference over the last 50 years. (quite rightly so sometimes (exhibit
A : Fred Dibnah's garden)). There will have been a lot of such legislation brought in by tories, and
obviously the whole thing rolls on today under labour.

To make out that it is something entirely Lib+Lab is at the least exaggeration, at the most plain,
risible [censored]. Dangerous dogs and "rythmic music" were things that the Tories introduced Nanny-
state legislation for. Not to mention the general judgmental tone of "back to basic" - they are as
good as anyone at poking the government's nose into other people's business. As much as the Tories
do go on about "small government" etc. this seems mainly to apply to their friends in small
businesses.

So, there are my stones. The tories are nowhere near as liberterian as they like to portray
themselves. Liberals and Labour are not as controlling as those fun press stories would like us
to believe.

"W K" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
"]news:[email hidden]...

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"Willowbeauty" <[email hidden]> wrote

in

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Your justification? Any idiot can throw stones

I gave my justification early on. I would like you to think about it. There has been a gradual
increase in health+safety interference over the last 50 years. (quite rightly so sometimes
(exhibit A : Fred Dibnah's garden)). There

will

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have been a lot of such legislation brought in by tories, and obviously

the

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whole thing rolls on today under labour.

To make out that it is something entirely Lib+Lab is at the least exaggeration, at the most plain,
risible [censored]. Dangerous dogs and "rythmic music" were things that the Tories introduced Nanny-
state legislation for. Not to mention the general judgmental tone of "back to basic" - they are

as

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good as anyone at poking the government's nose into other people's

business.

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As much as the Tories do go on about "small government" etc. this seems mainly to apply to their
friends in small businesses.

So, there are my stones. The tories are nowhere near as liberterian as they like to portray
themselves. Liberals and Labour are not as controlling as those fun press stories

would

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like us to believe.

Yes all seems logical and fair enough- lucky we get the government we deserve isn't it!