Beyond tomorrow - roundabout

Euan said:

Anyone actually catch the whole article? Curious.

No, but the Swindon Roundabout in the UK seriously rocks:

swindonweb.comlifemagi0.htmOpen ↗

"Euan" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

There was a bit on Beyond Tomorrow about a roundabout which had been
re-engineered. From the little I saw they basically removed all the
usual lane markings etc, nixed the traffic lights, give way signs, stop
signs etc. The only rule brought in was that cars had to give way to
pedestrians and cyclists at all times.

This roundabout solution was in the Netherlands, where this legal principle
is the default situation in any motorcar/cyclist/ped accidents. It is
presumed that the motorist is at fault unless it is proven otherwise. Makes
it much easier for this traffic solution to work - take away the signs and
motorists are too scared to speed through for fear of law suits.

Quoted message said:

In the four years it's been in operation there hasn't been a single
accident on the roundabout. Sounds a lot like this:

What is second-generation traffic calming?

David Engwicht

The goals of traditional traffic calming and 'second generation traffic
calming' are identical - to create more livable and vibrant
neighborhoods by slowing traffic. However, while traditional traffic
calming concentrated almost exclusively on slowing traffic through
engineering interventions, second generation traffic calming uses a much
wider range of interventions. Designing second generation traffic
calming interventions is grounded in an understanding that traffic
problems emerge from a very complex interplay of mental, psychological,
social, cultural, economic, physical and political realities.

[more]
http://www.lesstraffic.com/Articles/Traffic/SGTC.htm

Anyone actually catch the whole article? Curious.

Yes, saw most of the item. The streetscape certainly looked very clean, with
no signs and few road markings, but plenty of paving treatments. It was
stunning to see some of the pedestrian and cyclist road crossing manouvres,
suddenly crossing in front of cars and the cars had to stop on a dime.

Cheers
Peter

Euan said:

There was a bit on Beyond Tomorrow about a roundabout which had been
re-engineered. From the little I saw they basically removed all the
usual lane markings etc, nixed the traffic lights, give way signs, stop
signs etc. The only rule brought in was that cars had to give way to
pedestrians and cyclists at all times.

In the four years it's been in operation there hasn't been a single
accident on the roundabout. Sounds a lot like this:

What is second-generation traffic calming?

David Engwicht

The goals of traditional traffic calming and 'second generation traffic
calming' are identical - to create more livable and vibrant
neighborhoods by slowing traffic. However, while traditional traffic
calming concentrated almost exclusively on slowing traffic through
engineering interventions, second generation traffic calming uses a much
wider range of interventions. Designing second generation traffic
calming interventions is grounded in an understanding that traffic
problems emerge from a very complex interplay of mental, psychological,
social, cultural, economic, physical and political realities.

[more]
http://www.lesstraffic.com/Articles/Traffic/SGTC.htm

Anyone actually catch the whole article? Curious.
--
Cheers | ~~ __@
Euan | ~~ _-\<,
Melbourne, Australia | ~ (*)/ (*)

I caught it - very interesting, although I get the feeling it's one of those things that would work well in the Netherlands where the culture is already predisposed, than over here...

Basically it removed most signage, introduced a roundabout and mixed pedestrian/car areas which basically forced motorists and others to treat the entire area with caution and use *shock* common courtesy and individual interaction to negotiate the intersection safely. Sounds a bit like a bluff, but it seemed to work! Main features were the roundabout (nothing new there), some raised brick paving areas (I guess to make drivers feel like they were driving in ped. areas), and some funky water fountains that got bigger the heavier the traffic got to drown out the noise!

Mind you, watching it was bizarre. People, cyclists and cars everywhere with scant regard for rules (so it seemed), but working it out anyway...

Until the P-plater in the Conformodore with a backseat full of mates comes along that is...

Euan said:

Anyone actually catch the whole article? Curious.

Website for the show gives a picture here:
http://www.beyondtomorrow.com.au/stories/ep14/nakedstreets.html

Then there's this collection of schemes to reclaim the use of streets for
people. The Dutch solution in Drachten is pictured 2/3 down the page:
http://www.hamilton-baillie.co.uk/gallery.htm
Love the 80th birthday party in Copenhagen.

Cheers
Peter

"cfsmtb" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
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Quoted message said:

No, but the Swindon Roundabout in the UK seriously rocks:

http://www.swindonweb.com/life/lifemagi0.htm

Everyone talks about that Swindon roundabout, but the web page
says that it was first tried in Colchester, Essex. Now I've never
visited Swindon, but I have driven through that Essex roundabout!
I didn't have any problems with it, but I did have my wife in
the passenger seat as navigator, and she worked in Colchester
so regularly got to drive through it. I never tried it on a bike.
The closest I got to a bike in the UK was as a passenger in
a bus when the bus driver tried to push a cyclist off the road...

I wonder how Critical Mass would go when they reached a
roundabout like that :-)

Years back in Adelaide there's a section on Rundle Mall that cars can
legally drive across. It's a cobble paved area, & cars are very courteous
as I remember it.

Would be great if people could reclaim the streets as per the Dutch
solution, but I rather think the Council Legal Dept's would be flapping.

Rob

"Peter Signorini" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
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Quoted message said:

Euan said:

Anyone actually catch the whole article? Curious.

Website for the show gives a picture here:
http://www.beyondtomorrow.com.au/stories/ep14/nakedstreets.html

Then there's this collection of schemes to reclaim the use of streets for
people. The Dutch solution in Drachten is pictured 2/3 down the page:
http://www.hamilton-baillie.co.uk/gallery.htm
Love the 80th birthday party in Copenhagen.

Cheers
Peter

just a small reminder. The Dutch Rock!!! 😄😄

Wouldnt mind one of them climbing wall thingy's either

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

>> "eddiec" == eddiec <[email hidden]> writes:

eddiec> Until the P-plater in the Conformodore with a backseat full
eddiec> of mates comes along that is...

I think that's the whole point, behaviour like that is much less likely
to happen when the motorist is the inferior.

Look at the road infrastructure we have here today, it's all geared
around the motorist. If a pedestrian is in the road then it's their own
fault if they get hit (in the minds of some). Motorists know this, the
road is theirs.

Make it so that the road belongs to the pedestrians and it's up to
motorists to negotiate their way safely and the psychology of driving is
turned on its head.
--
Cheers | ~~ __@
Euan | ~~ _-\<,
Melbourne, Australia | ~ (*)/ (*)