Better, lighter wheels

Colin Campbell said:

I'm upgrading (or at least updating) one of my bikes. Currently, it has
a Campagnolo Record Triple 13 x 26 drivetrain, and 32 spoke wheels made
from Campy Record hubs, DT Swiss spokes, and Mavic Open Pro (front) and
Velocity Aerohead (rear) rims. The wheels have been very dependable,
although the original Mavic Open Pro rim, and a replacement, on the rear
both had cracks at the spoke holes.

I'm going to change to a compact drivetrain, and want to reduce weight,
while maintaining reliability. It seems to me the wheels are where I
have the biggest potential for weight savings.

My other bike has Bontrager Race Lite wheels, with 20 spokes front, and
24 spokes rear. While these aren't very expensive wheels, they are
lighter, and they've been dependable for about 11,500 km (7,000+ miles).

Should I just buy some Bontrager wheels? I could get Race Lite or Race
X Lite for not too much money. I've tried Fulcrum Racing I and Mavic
R-Sys wheelsets recently, and they didn't impress for their high prices.

Can I build something similar? If so, who makes the hubs, spokes, and
rims that I would need?

Race X-Lite is pretty good. My experience with them has been that
they're good bang for the buck, and at 1300 grams pretty lightweight
for long climbs if that's what you're looking for.

-B.D
http://cozybeehive.blogspot.com

Colin Campbell said:

I'm upgrading (or at least updating) one of my bikes. Currently, it has
a Campagnolo Record Triple 13 x 26 drivetrain, and 32 spoke wheels made
from Campy Record hubs, DT Swiss spokes, and Mavic Open Pro (front) and
Velocity Aerohead (rear) rims. The wheels have been very dependable,
although the original Mavic Open Pro rim, and a replacement, on the rear
both had cracks at the spoke holes.

I'm going to change to a compact drivetrain, and want to reduce weight,
while maintaining reliability. It seems to me the wheels are where I
have the biggest potential for weight savings.

My other bike has Bontrager Race Lite wheels, with 20 spokes front, and
24 spokes rear. While these aren't very expensive wheels, they are
lighter, and they've been dependable for about 11,500 km (7,000+ miles).

Should I just buy some Bontrager wheels? I could get Race Lite or Race
X Lite for not too much money. I've tried Fulcrum Racing I and Mavic
R-Sys wheelsets recently, and they didn't impress for their high prices.

Can I build something similar? If so, who makes the hubs, spokes, and
rims that I would need?

How would you improve on 32h Campagnolo wheels? Tough. Dump the Mavic
and rebuild with an asymmetric rim maybe if you seek lower weight:
http://www.yellowjersey.org/vel9.jpg

Bontrager introduces new problems you don't have now:
http://www.ocrebels.com/images/GelsonsNBNovember2007/pic02.htm
--
Andrew Muzi
www.yellowjersey.org
Open every day since 1 April, 1971

A Muzi said:

Colin Campbell said:

I'm upgrading (or at least updating) one of my bikes. Currently, it has
a Campagnolo Record Triple 13 x 26 drivetrain, and 32 spoke wheels made
from Campy Record hubs, DT Swiss spokes, and Mavic Open Pro (front) and
Velocity Aerohead (rear) rims. The wheels have been very dependable,
although the original Mavic Open Pro rim, and a replacement, on the rear
both had cracks at the spoke holes.

Quoted message said:

I'm going to change to a compact drivetrain, and want to reduce weight,
while maintaining reliability. It seems to me the wheels are where I
have the biggest potential for weight savings.

Quoted message said:

My other bike has Bontrager Race Lite wheels, with 20 spokes front, and
24 spokes rear. While these aren't very expensive wheels, they are
lighter, and they've been dependable for about 11,500 km (7,000+ miles).

Quoted message said:

Should I just buy some Bontrager wheels? I could get Race Lite or Race
X Lite for not too much money. I've tried Fulcrum Racing I and Mavic
R-Sys wheelsets recently, and they didn't impress for their high prices.

Quoted message said:

Can I build something similar? If so, who makes the hubs, spokes, and
rims that I would need?

How would you improve on 32h Campagnolo wheels? Tough. Dump the Mavic
and rebuild with an asymmetric rim maybe if you seek lower weight:http://www.yellowjersey.org/vel9.jpg

Bontrager introduces new problems you don't have now:http://www.ocrebels.com/images/GelsonsNBNovember2007/pic02.htm
--
Andrew Muziwww.yellowjersey.org
Open every day since 1 April, 1971- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

How did the damage shown in the photo occur? If I'm right a piece of
the hub place cracked and is missing, yes?

-B.D
http://cozybeehive.blogspot.com

On Nov 23, 6:00 pm, bicycle_disciple <[email hidden]>

Quoted message said:

A Muzi said:

Colin Campbell said:

I'm upgrading (or at least updating) one of my bikes. Currently, it has
a Campagnolo Record Triple 13 x 26 drivetrain, and 32 spoke wheels made
from Campy Record hubs, DT Swiss spokes, and Mavic Open Pro (front) and
Velocity Aerohead (rear) rims. The wheels have been very dependable,
although the original Mavic Open Pro rim, and a replacement, on the rear
both had cracks at the spoke holes.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

I'm going to change to a compact drivetrain, and want to reduce weight,
while maintaining reliability. It seems to me the wheels are where I
have the biggest potential for weight savings.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

My other bike has Bontrager Race Lite wheels, with 20 spokes front, and
24 spokes rear. While these aren't very expensive wheels, they are
lighter, and they've been dependable for about 11,500 km (7,000+ miles).

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Should I just buy some Bontrager wheels? I could get Race Lite or Race
X Lite for not too much money. I've tried Fulcrum Racing I and Mavic
R-Sys wheelsets recently, and they didn't impress for their high prices.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Can I build something similar? If so, who makes the hubs, spokes, and
rims that I would need?

Quoted message said:

How would you improve on 32h Campagnolo wheels? Tough. Dump the Mavic
and rebuild with an asymmetric rim maybe if you seek lower weight:http://www.yellowjersey.org/vel9.jpg

Quoted message said:

Bontrager introduces new problems you don't have now:http://www.ocrebels.com/images/GelsonsNBNovember2007/pic02.htm
--
Andrew Muziwww.yellowjersey.org
Open every day since 1 April, 1971- Hide quoted text -

Quoted message said:

- Show quoted text -

How did the damage shown in the photo occur? If I'm right a piece of
the hub place cracked and is missing, yes?

-B.Dhttp://cozybeehive.blogspot.com- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

I meant "flange", not place.

On Nov 23, 10:31 am, bicycle_disciple <[email hidden]>

Quoted message said:

Race X-Lite is pretty good. My experience with them has been that
they're good bang for the buck, and at 1300 grams pretty lightweight
for long climbs if that's what you're looking for.

Not bad wheels but they weigh over 1500g... where are you getting
1300g?

Tune hubs, CX-Rays or Lasers, Aerohead rims or something similar will
get you the same weight as R-Sys (high 1300g) for a little over half
the money. All good parts, and easily and cheaply replaceable.

A Muzi said:

Quoted message said:

I'm going to change to a compact drivetrain, and want to reduce weight,
while maintaining reliability. It seems to me the wheels are where I
have the biggest potential for weight savings.

Quoted message said:

My other bike has Bontrager Race Lite wheels, with 20 spokes front, and
24 spokes rear. While these aren't very expensive wheels, they are
lighter, and they've been dependable for about 11,500 km (7,000+ miles).

Quoted message said:

How would you improve on 32h Campagnolo wheels? Tough. Dump the Mavic
and rebuild with an asymmetric rim maybe if you seek lower weight:http://www.yellowjersey.org/vel9.jpg

Quoted message said:

Bontrager introduces new problems you don't have now:http://www.ocrebels.com/images/GelsonsNBNovember2007/pic02.htm

Comes Winter, and we gather around a warm fire and the parts
catalogs...

Compact drivetrain = using unfamiliar gears. Individual "taste" on the
compact-- or indeed, the new/old standard 39t inner ring, which
replaced the old/old standard 42t inner ring, which replaced... If
it works for you, it works.

(Postition statement dept.): Parts that don't break are better than
parts that do even if the non-breakers weigh more.

If you haven't already done so, suggest you look up actual weights
(Weight Weenies, other), get real measured weights for the parts in
question, and see what's what, for real.

FWIW, and following rbt advice given by A. Muzi and P. Chisholm, my
36h 3x, Velocity Aerohead f, A-head OC rear rims, db DT spokes, brass
nipples, local handbuilts on Campy hubs, have been reliable under my
200+ (++++ at one point) bulk, while my skinny buddy is somehow well
pleased with his Neuvation wheels (cheap! great warranty service!),
said satisfaction including apparently the two rears that broke hub
flanges under his 155 lbs, one at the beginning of a long-anticipated
local charity ride/race. Expert rider, easy on gear, too.

What about the potential for personal injury when this (expletive
deleted) happens? Titanium pins, or... ?

Hey, I saw an ebay ad for some used farbon handlebars the other day.
At least 20g advertised lighter than my Deda 215's that survived
hitting the Explored unscathed, and only chipped through the clear
coat at the stem clamp...

Time for another log, and let's see where that draft is coming from,
please...

http://weightweenies.starbike.com/

http://www.damonrinard.com/weights.htm

http://www.thebikestand.com/weights.html

http://felixwong.com/gallery/gallery.php?Category=19

(Endless Summer not all that much different from long, cold winters?):

http://www.velo-retro.com/spivey1.html

--D-y

"Ryan Cousineau" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:rcousine->
http://www.hpamotorsports.com/projects_finished_Jettagon.htm

Quoted message said:

400 hp VW Jetta wagon. When the groceries absolutely, positively have to
be moved a quarter-mile in less than 14 seconds.

Kewl. Or a juiced-up Honda Civic. Video:

http://videos.streetfire.net/video/f884c76a-c03b-4f59-9e51-44398685e32b.htm

In my part of the world you see the remnants of Civics in the local papers
every month. After their vehicles were sheared in two after slamming
sideways into a light standard. Or after frontal impacts where whats left
of the car and passengers could be fit into a doghouse.

In article <NFX1j.38261$fD.35615@pd7urf3no>,

Dave Mayer said:

"Ryan Cousineau" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:rcousine->
http://www.hpamotorsports.com/projects_finished_Jettagon.htm

Quoted message said:

400 hp VW Jetta wagon. When the groceries absolutely, positively have to
be moved a quarter-mile in less than 14 seconds.

Kewl. Or a juiced-up Honda Civic. Video:

http://videos.streetfire.net/video/f884c76a-c03b-4f59-9e51-44398685e32b.htm

In my part of the world you see the remnants of Civics in the local papers
every month. After their vehicles were sheared in two after slamming
sideways into a light standard. Or after frontal impacts where whats left
of the car and passengers could be fit into a doghouse.

Well, you see, these modifications made the Civic in the video much
safer than those other Civics.

But technically, that wasn't a station wagon,

--
Ryan Cousineau [email hidden] http://www.wiredcola.com/
"My scenarios may give the impression I could be an excellent crook.
Not true - I am a talented lawyer." - Sandy in rec.bicycles.racing

Colin Campbell said:

I'm upgrading (or at least updating) one of my bikes. Currently, it has
a Campagnolo Record Triple 13 x 26 drivetrain, and 32 spoke wheels made
from Campy Record hubs, DT Swiss spokes, and Mavic Open Pro (front) and
Velocity Aerohead (rear) rims. The wheels have been very dependable,
although the original Mavic Open Pro rim, and a replacement, on the rear
both had cracks at the spoke holes.

I'm going to change to a compact drivetrain, and want to reduce weight,
while maintaining reliability. It seems to me the wheels are where I
have the biggest potential for weight savings.

My other bike has Bontrager Race Lite wheels, with 20 spokes front, and
24 spokes rear. While these aren't very expensive wheels, they are
lighter, and they've been dependable for about 11,500 km (7,000+ miles).

Should I just buy some Bontrager wheels? I could get Race Lite or Race
X Lite for not too much money. I've tried Fulcrum Racing I and Mavic
R-Sys wheelsets recently, and they didn't impress for their high prices.

Can I build something similar? If so, who makes the hubs, spokes, and
rims that I would need?

Rebuild your exising wheelset with new rims. If your a weight weenie
get the latest incarnation of Record hubs or DT240. However your
current +2001 hubs are still very light and should perform as good as
new after a regrease.

I'm curently riding Record 07 hubset with OpenPro Ceramice, 3x cross,
32x DT Revolution (Competition in rear driveside) and brass nipples.

weight: 1603g including rim tape.

price: 3500 dkkr. or half of what a pair of flexy set of Ksyrium SL
costs while weighing only 100g more. As for arodynamics i doubt there
is any difference.

You can shave off 50g by using non ceramice rimms (and a 1/3 of the
prise), 60g by using alu nipples and additional grams by avoiding
competition spokes in the the rear drive side or going with 28 spokes.
Even at sub 1450-1500 g you will get a whelset witch is way stronger,
stiffer vertical and more comfortable than any low spokecount factory
wheelset. As for aro you need to go carbon or into the +2kg realm to
notice the difference.

Btw i abselutely adore those ceramics, braking is abselutley breath
taking with swissstop's green compound in both wet and dry weater. Very
very usefull when desending from Col Mollard or Galibier - and a lot
of fun when going arround corners, cars and stoplights in central
Copenhagen.

I weigh between 90 and 100kg - a well built set of openpro's can take
an awfull lot of beating and still be stiff as hell + reasonable light
when build on DT240, Record or Dureace hubs.

--
Morten Reippuert Knudsen :-) <http://blog.reippuert.dk>

Merlin Works CR-3/2.5 & Campagnolo Chorus 2007.

A Muzi said:

Colin Campbell said:

I'm upgrading (or at least updating) one of my bikes. Currently, it has
a Campagnolo Record Triple 13 x 26 drivetrain, and 32 spoke wheels made
from Campy Record hubs, DT Swiss spokes, and Mavic Open Pro (front) and
Velocity Aerohead (rear) rims. The wheels have been very dependable,
although the original Mavic Open Pro rim, and a replacement, on the rear
both had cracks at the spoke holes.

I'm going to change to a compact drivetrain, and want to reduce weight,
while maintaining reliability. It seems to me the wheels are where I
have the biggest potential for weight savings.

My other bike has Bontrager Race Lite wheels, with 20 spokes front, and
24 spokes rear. While these aren't very expensive wheels, they are
lighter, and they've been dependable for about 11,500 km (7,000+ miles).

Should I just buy some Bontrager wheels? I could get Race Lite or Race
X Lite for not too much money. I've tried Fulcrum Racing I and Mavic
R-Sys wheelsets recently, and they didn't impress for their high prices.

Can I build something similar? If so, who makes the hubs, spokes, and
rims that I would need?

How would you improve on 32h Campagnolo wheels? Tough. Dump the Mavic
and rebuild with an asymmetric rim maybe if you seek lower weight:
http://www.yellowjersey.org/vel9.jpg

mavics are fine, just avoid alu nipples and use thicker spokes in the
rear drive side.

--
Morten Reippuert Knudsen :-) <http://blog.reippuert.dk>

Merlin Works CR-3/2.5 & Campagnolo Chorus 2007.