Bench pressing...

In article <[email hidden]>,

Neil Gendzwill said:

Hobbes said:

For example, for someone of your age and build I would say 20-30 lbs is
decent. 50 is excellent.

50 total weight? Or two 50 lb dumbbells? I guess I'll just have to try
and see just for grins. I don't have too much trouble front squatting a
pair of 75s. But rumour has it the overhead variety is hard 🙂

One hand overhead squat - 50 lb dumbbell in the hand.

For an overhead squat (barbell) - again, it depends. I can do 135 lbs
and I consider that unacceptable. Mainly because I want to do the squat
[censored] and I need to get over 300 lbs.

But for the average person - mebbe 100 lbs is about right. So the two
dumbbells would be decent, since there is less support in the
implement(s).

--
Keith

In article <[email hidden]>,

Neil Gendzwill said:

Hobbes said:

If you can do an overhead squat with decent weight ATTG without your
back rounding you'll have a strong core. Period.

Define "decent", please...

Neil

That depends entirely on the individual I would think. ;-)
--
Om.

"My mother never saw the irony in calling me a son-of-a-[censored]." -Jack Nicholson

OmManiPadmeOmelet said:

Hobbes wrote:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

If he is squatting and deadlifting heavy he is getting a ton of core
work.

Yes, I do deadlift heavy.
It's my best (and favorite) lift.
Every Teusday.

Squats will be done eventually once I can get a handle on the knee
issues. ;-) Right now it's heavy leg presses, hack squats, leg
extensions and ham curls.

You should be doing some light squats every week at least. But this
was discussed to death in another thread before.

OmManiPadmeOmelet said:

My bench press sucks.
It's my weakest lift!

I've started working with a retired power lifter at the gym and he
suggests that the reason for it is not the chest muscles so much as the
peripheral muscles involved with the lift also need to be worked with
other moves.

If my arms and front delts are weak, that is going to severely limit how
much I can move.

I've started doing military presses, and more isolation work on triceps
at his suggestion.

Any other ideas?

You'd be better off doing some board presses or close grip bench instead
of a bunch of tricep isolation exercises.

Do bench and auxiliary bench workouts like these:
http://www.weighttrainersunited.com/rdctemplate.html

OmManiPadmeOmelet said:

Hobbes said:

OmManiPadmeOmelet said:

T wrote:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

>Grease the groove. If you want to bench more, bench more [often].

So I've been told, but for some reason that's not working. :-(

You don't do it. Greasing the groove would be multiple bench workouts
every day, moderate weights. low reps.

Ok, I'd not heard that term before. Sorry!

Quoted message said:

Monday 3 workouts of 5 sets of 2 reps at 85% of 1rm.
Tuesday - 1 workout of 5 sets of 3 reps at 70%
Wednesday - 3 workouts of 5 sets of 3 at 80%
Thursday - 1 workout of 5 sets of 3 reps at 70%
Friday - 2 workouts of 5 sets of 2 reps at 85%
etc.

My understanding is you just do bench once per week.

Yes, I do bench just once per week.
Bench _daily_???

You should at least try twice a week. They don't have to be the
same workout. See my other post in this thread with the workout
template.

On Thu, 01 Sep 2005 11:56:20 -0600, Hobbes <[email hidden]>
wrote in misc.fitness.weights:

Quoted message said:

In article <[email hidden]>,

OmManiPadmeOmelet said:

In article <[email hidden]>, Dally <[email hidden]>

Quoted message said:

OmManiPadmeOmelet wrote:
> My bench press sucks.
> It's my weakest lift!
>
> I've started working with a retired power lifter at the gym and he
> suggests that the reason for it is not the chest muscles so much as the
> peripheral muscles involved with the lift also need to be worked with
> other moves.
>
> If my arms and front delts are weak, that is going to severely limit how
> much I can move.
>
> I've started doing military presses, and more isolation work on triceps
> at his suggestion.
>
> Any other ideas?
>
> TIA!

Pilates. :-)

Seriously, core work. Tighter abs translates into a better bench for me.

Dally

I do abs daily... ;-)

I've looked at Pilates, I just don't have time.

Core is not just abs.

I'd ditch the abs and do overhead squats as a warm-up to my squat
workout. Your core will get plenty of work.

I took a class at intercession - Fitness Foundations for Life - by Bart
Arnold, who has a physiotherapy background and is big on core work. We
had about 25 students and at the end we all had to lead the class
through an abbreviated workout - 15 minutes or so. So we had done weight
training, aerobics, dance, pilates, yoga, boxercise, tai bo, etc through
the course. And most of the young people (I was the only old fogey) led
various classes. Including three Pilates instructors.

It was telling that I could get through any of the workouts (although my
grace in the ballet/modern jazz workout was questionable), but not one
person could get through the 'old school' workout I presented.

My workout was the 5 tibetan rites, followed by hindu squats to a Tabata
interval (which nobody could get through), one-armed power [censored] to
overhead squat to press and then some self controlled PNF stretches for
strengthening.

My preface to the workout was that the old school people don't worry
about isolation, core workouts, etc. They move - with power and
endurance. They work the body as a whole unit. They work from the ground
up, but they don't bother with a fancy term like closed kinetic chain.
And they work efficiently - they don't waste time with piddly-ass
[censored]. They don't worry about the 'box', power centers, TVA
recruitment, etc. They learn to move and get the body doing naturally
what it should.

If you can do an overhead squat with decent weight ATTG without your
back rounding you'll have a strong core. Period.

<standing O>

OmManiPadmeOmelet said:

I can bench about 1/2 of what I can deadlift.

That sounds about right unless your deadlift really sucks
as well.

--
Helgi Briem hbriem AT simnet DOT is

OmManiPadmeOmelet said:

Quoted message said:

My understanding is you just do bench once per week.

Yes, I do bench just once per week.
Bench _daily_???

Well, I don't bench daily, but I was benching 2 times
a week, 3 sets or so and my bench was completely
stagnant for about a year. I upped the workouts
to 3 and the sets to 5-10 and my bench shot up by over
60% in a few months.

--
Helgi Briem hbriem AT simnet DOT is

Quoted message said:

I can bench about 1/2 of what I can deadlift.
And it ain't because I'm a slacker. I really try.

I can't bench half my deadlift, not even close.

Quoted message said:

Feet flat on the floor, shoulder blades together pushing the chest out,
and I SQUEEZE the chest muscles on the lift, trying to use them as much
as possible.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Grease the groove. If you want to bench more, bench more.

Quoted message said:

So I've been told, but for some reason that's not working. :-(

In a workout, do 8 triples with 55-65% 1RM, OR 6 triples with 70-75% 1RM, OR 5
triples with 80-85% 1RM. Do it 2-3 times a week.

OmManiPadmeOmelet said:

Hobbes said:

T said:

OmManiPadmeOmelet wrote:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

>My bench press sucks.
>It's my weakest lift!

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

>I've started doing military presses, and more isolation work on triceps
>at his suggestion.
>
>Any other ideas?

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Grease the groove. If you want to bench more, bench more [often].

Funny thing is that most big benchers suck at the military press. And I
don't see isolation work helping.

Well, yeah, I can only military press approx. 1/2 what I can bench, but
I've not done them for years. Just started doing them this week at
Jack's suggestion.

I'm told that working my triceps a bit harder can help also?
Is that incorrect?

No, that's true! You don't seem to get the point. Do compound
exercises for triceps instead of isolation ones.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Grease the groove. If you want to bench more, bench more.

Quoted message said:

You don't do it. Greasing the groove would be multiple bench workouts
every day, moderate weights. low reps.

One guy I know leaves 315 on the bar, does 4-8 triples every morning, retests
his max every few months. He likes plates a lot, so he's left 315 on the bar
for a loong time, from when his max was 370. It'll be there until his max hits
475, then he'll jump to 405 on the bar. A beginner could probably use a much
lighter weight, say 65%, do 6-10 triples every morning, and make great progress,
enough progress to have to retest every month or two.

Quoted message said:

Furthermore, during the bench you try and squeeze the back together and
spread the bar. Don't tense the chest - try and pull the bar apart as
you lower it. Like there was a sleeve in the middle. ANother way of
thinking of it is trying to bend the bar into an inverted 'U' shape.
This will tense the chest - and the shoulders and the arms and the back.

In article <[email hidden]>,

Jeff Finlayson said:

OmManiPadmeOmelet said:

Hobbes wrote:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

If he is squatting and deadlifting heavy he is getting a ton of core
work.

Yes, I do deadlift heavy.
It's my best (and favorite) lift.
Every Teusday.

Squats will be done eventually once I can get a handle on the knee
issues. ;-) Right now it's heavy leg presses, hack squats, leg
extensions and ham curls.

You should be doing some light squats every week at least. But this
was discussed to death in another thread before.

Kieth advised me to do body weight squats...
Sorry, I did not mention those as they are not done at the gym.
I've been doing them at work and at home. :-)
--
Om.

"My mother never saw the irony in calling me a son-of-a-[censored]." -Jack Nicholson

In article <[email hidden]>,

Jeff Finlayson said:

OmManiPadmeOmelet said:

My bench press sucks.
It's my weakest lift!

I've started working with a retired power lifter at the gym and he
suggests that the reason for it is not the chest muscles so much as the
peripheral muscles involved with the lift also need to be worked with
other moves.

If my arms and front delts are weak, that is going to severely limit how
much I can move.

I've started doing military presses, and more isolation work on triceps
at his suggestion.

Any other ideas?

You'd be better off doing some board presses or close grip bench instead
of a bunch of tricep isolation exercises.

Do bench and auxiliary bench workouts like these:
http://www.weighttrainersunited.com/rdctemplate.html

Tried some closer grip BP's today.

Had to decrease the weight, but that's ok. ;-)

Next week, I'll BP daily per Keith's and others advice.

Thanks dude's!
I'll report back in a month with my progress.
--
Om.

"My mother never saw the irony in calling me a son-of-a-[censored]." -Jack Nicholson

In article <[email hidden]>,

Helgi Briem said:

OmManiPadmeOmelet said:

I can bench about 1/2 of what I can deadlift.

That sounds about right unless your deadlift really sucks
as well.

Considering I've only been (seriously) back at the gym for 11 weeks
after a very long layoff, my DL is not bad. :-) I get good feedback from
the other lifters that watch me, especially the PL's since they know
that's what I'm after in the long term.

I had a screwed up work schedule for a long while. No routine.
I finally volunteered to pull the Mon. thru Fri. night shift if they'd
take me off weekends and quit varying my hours so I could have some
frickin' routine in my life!

It's impossible to get enough sleep and develop any kind of routine with
2 twelve hour night shifts per month on weekends, and getting rotating
shifts (either midnights or swing shifts) during the damn week and no
regular days off. You basically have no life. At all.

This was what I really needed to start getting serious about lifting
again, so now all is ok and progressing. :-) I work Mon. thru Fri. 22:30
to 07:00 and get to the gym by 07:30 on my way home from work Teus.
morning thru Fri. morning. The gym opens late on Saturdays so I work out
4 days on and 3 days off. The 3 days off I just do cardio.

And no I'm not going to tell you how much weight I lift. Not yet.
It's embarassing...... :-P
--
Om.

"My mother never saw the irony in calling me a son-of-a-[censored]." -Jack Nicholson

In article <[email hidden]>,

Helgi Briem said:

OmManiPadmeOmelet said:

Quoted message said:

My understanding is you just do bench once per week.

Yes, I do bench just once per week.
Bench _daily_???

Well, I don't bench daily, but I was benching 2 times
a week, 3 sets or so and my bench was completely
stagnant for about a year. I upped the workouts
to 3 and the sets to 5-10 and my bench shot up by over
60% in a few months.

--
Helgi Briem hbriem AT simnet DOT is

Cool. :-)
Most of the PL's at my gym also use beef as their major source of
protein. They say they make better strength gains with it. Top sirloin
was on sale about 2 weeks ago for $2.99 so I stocked up on it.

I think part of the problem is is that I'm still trying to lose weight
while making strength gains! It's probably just going to be more a
matter of patience.
--
Om.

"My mother never saw the irony in calling me a son-of-a-[censored]." -Jack Nicholson

In article <[email hidden]>,

Jeff Finlayson said:

OmManiPadmeOmelet said:

Hobbes said:

T wrote:
>OmManiPadmeOmelet wrote:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

>>My bench press sucks.
>>It's my weakest lift!

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

>>I've started doing military presses, and more isolation work on triceps
>>at his suggestion.
>>
>>Any other ideas?

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

>Grease the groove. If you want to bench more, bench more [often].

Funny thing is that most big benchers suck at the military press. And I
don't see isolation work helping.

Well, yeah, I can only military press approx. 1/2 what I can bench, but
I've not done them for years. Just started doing them this week at
Jack's suggestion.

I'm told that working my triceps a bit harder can help also?
Is that incorrect?

No, that's true! You don't seem to get the point. Do compound
exercises for triceps instead of isolation ones.

I'm seeing that.
Hence a close grip bench press, and military press.
It makes sense so I DO get the point.

Thanks for stressing it tho'.
--
Om.

"My mother never saw the irony in calling me a son-of-a-[censored]." -Jack Nicholson

OmManiPadmeOmelet said:

Jeff Finlayson said:

OmManiPadmeOmelet wrote:

....

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Well, yeah, I can only military press approx. 1/2 what I can bench, but
I've not done them for years. Just started doing them this week at
Jack's suggestion.

I'm told that working my triceps a bit harder can help also?
Is that incorrect?

No, that's true! You don't seem to get the point. Do compound
exercises for triceps instead of isolation ones.

I'm seeing that.
Hence a close grip bench press, and military press.
It makes sense so I DO get the point.

Thanks for stressing it tho'.

OK. Good deal. Keep at it OM..

OmManiPadmeOmelet said:

Okay, I set my grip at shoulder width at present.

Take notice of how you naturally fall into your strongest position
for doing push-ups; hand spacing, shoulder positioning, the planes of
movements of the arms, etc, and try to mimic this as much as possible
when you bench. Most nothing we do in terms of work, ahtletics, etc, in
life is done on our backs and many people just don't have a natural feel
for something like benching and they fall prey to using a very
inefficient movement.

In article <[email hidden]>,

(Wizard Whateley) said:

OmManiPadmeOmelet said:

Okay, I set my grip at shoulder width at present.

Take notice of how you naturally fall into your strongest position
for doing push-ups; hand spacing, shoulder positioning, the planes of
movements of the arms, etc, and try to mimic this as much as possible
when you bench. Most nothing we do in terms of work, ahtletics, etc, in
life is done on our backs and many people just don't have a natural feel
for something like benching and they fall prey to using a very
inefficient movement.

I'll check that out, thanks!
--
Om.

"My mother never saw the irony in calling me a son-of-a-[censored]." -Jack Nicholson