BBC breakfast: cycling to school

On Mon, 26 Jun 2006 07:33:49 +0100 someone who may be "wafflycat"
<w*a*ff£y£cat*@£btco*nn£ect.com> wrote this:-

Quoted message said:

Basically good - but then the the usual *overhype* about cycling on roads
being dangerous

It is dangerous, but still less dangerous than cycling on many cycle
"facilities".

Quoted message said:

and the need to get kids on to off-road psychle paths.
Sustrans in abundance... quelle surprise then, that the emphasis in the last
bit was on having the kids on the road for a little time as possible and on
to cycle paths as soon as possible... thus emphasising the 'need' for a a
separate natinal cycle network...

Lord, I *loathe* Sustrans more and more....

There is obviously some campaign, as much the same thing was on the
radio as well. If I hear another idiot, a word I use deliberately,
from Sustrans talking about "traffic free cycle paths" I'm going to
start shouting at the radio. I usually only do that for some party
politicians, but I am now starting to classify Sustrans in the same
group of chancers.

--
David Hansen, Edinburgh
I will *always* explain revoked encryption keys, unless RIP prevents me
http://www.opsi.gov.uk/acts/acts2000/00023--e.htm#54

"David Hansen" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

On Mon, 26 Jun 2006 07:33:49 +0100 someone who may be "wafflycat"
<w*a*ff£y£cat*@£btco*nn£ect.com> wrote this:-

Quoted message said:

Basically good - but then the the usual *overhype* about cycling on roads
being dangerous

It is dangerous, but still less dangerous than cycling on many cycle
"facilities".

Is it?

Is the risk of serious injury or death while cycling on the Queen's highways
greater than that of, say, life in general?

And look at the picture of the psychle farcility Auntie Beeb has chosen to
use on the web page of this story...

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/5115906.stm

A dangerous farcility if ever there was one...

Cheers, helen s

wafflycat wrote on 26/06/2006 12:29 +0100:

Quoted message said:

And look at the picture of the psychle farcility Auntie Beeb has chosen
to use on the web page of this story...

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/5115906.stm

A dangerous farcility if ever there was one...

Bl**dy lycra lout cycling on the pavement!! ;-)

--
Tony

"Anyone who conducts an argument by appealing to authority is not using
his intelligence; he is just using his memory."
- Leonardo da Vinci

wafflycat said the following on 26/06/2006 12:29:

Quoted message said:

And look at the picture of the psychle farcility Auntie Beeb has chosen
to use on the web page of this story...

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/5115906.stm

A dangerous farcility if ever there was one...

I reckon that car driver might just have left his braking a tad late.
The front end seems to be down, and is that smoke from a locked back
wheel? Perhaps he just spotted the camera!

I think the caption must be tongue in cheek :-)

--
Paul Boyd
http://www.paul-boyd.co.uk/

wafflycat wrote on 26/06/2006 07:33 +0100:

Quoted message said:

Article - to be repeated - about encouraging cycling to school. eed for
cycle training to get the skills to cycle on road.

A quick read of the comments on the BBC Breakfast piece this morning
shows just how far we have to go to make any impact.
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/programmes/breakfast/3342693.stm#cycle

Sigh :-(

--
Tony

"Anyone who conducts an argument by appealing to authority is not using
his intelligence; he is just using his memory."
- Leonardo da Vinci

Tony Raven said:

wafflycat wrote on 26/06/2006 07:33 +0100:

Quoted message said:

Article - to be repeated - about encouraging cycling to school. eed for
cycle training to get the skills to cycle on road.

A quick read of the comments on the BBC Breakfast piece this morning
shows just how far we have to go to make any impact.
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/programmes/breakfast/3342693.stm#cycle

My kids school will not allow children to cycle. This is explained as
being due to a lack of storage facilities (though there is plenty of
space to install them, eg a cage like that we have just had installed
at the Uni (clear sides so you can see anyone messing around) or some
lockers. Time to rattle some cages methinks. There is a nice new cycle
route right by the school, the catchment area includes quiet/off road
routes and it would cut down the number of cars considerably.

...d

On 26 Jun,

Paul Boyd said:

Quoted message said:

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/5115906.stm

A dangerous farcility if ever there was one...

I reckon that car driver might just have left his braking a tad late.
The front end seems to be down, and is that smoke from a locked back
wheel? Perhaps he just spotted the camera!

More like falling off a wet speed cushion.

--
BD
Change lycos to yahoo to reply

Paul Boyd said:

wafflycat said the following on 26/06/2006 12:29:

Quoted message said:

And look at the picture of the psychle farcility Auntie Beeb has
chosen to use on the web page of this story...

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/5115906.stm

A dangerous farcility if ever there was one...

I think I'll write an email.

Quoted message said:

I reckon that car driver might just have left his braking a tad late.
The front end seems to be down, and is that smoke from a locked back
wheel? Perhaps he just spotted the camera!

I think it's exhaust steam, and driving down the edge of a speed bump.

Quoted message said:

I think the caption must be tongue in cheek :-)

One hopes...

"Tony Raven" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

wafflycat wrote on 26/06/2006 07:33 +0100:

Quoted message said:

Article - to be repeated - about encouraging cycling to school. eed for
cycle training to get the skills to cycle on road.

A quick read of the comments on the BBC Breakfast piece this morning shows
just how far we have to go to make any impact.
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/programmes/breakfast/3342693.stm#cycle

Sigh :-(

Apparently, in the 8.30 dispatches on Breakfast - the reading out of emails,
it was read out that a woman in Norfolk has a son who cycles 13-miles each
way to school... according to the newsreaders, said son will be ready for
the Tour de France.

Amusing though it may be, it really shows how little cycling is understood,
as in distance terms, a journey of 13 miles is eminently doable by *anyone*
that is normally healthy... you don't have to be superfit to to a 13-mile
each way journey regularly. 13-miles is, in cycling terms, nada...

Cheers, helen s

wafflycat said:

"Tony Raven" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

wafflycat wrote on 26/06/2006 07:33 +0100:

Quoted message said:

Article - to be repeated - about encouraging cycling to school. eed for
cycle training to get the skills to cycle on road.

A quick read of the comments on the BBC Breakfast piece this morning shows
just how far we have to go to make any impact.
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/programmes/breakfast/3342693.stm#cycle

Sigh :-(

Apparently, in the 8.30 dispatches on Breakfast - the reading out of emails,
it was read out that a woman in Norfolk has a son who cycles 13-miles each
way to school... according to the newsreaders, said son will be ready for
the Tour de France.

Amusing though it may be, it really shows how little cycling is understood,
as in distance terms, a journey of 13 miles is eminently doable by *anyone*
that is normally healthy... you don't have to be superfit to to a 13-mile
each way journey regularly. 13-miles is, in cycling terms, nada...

I was also surprised at the various comments. 2.5 miles? that is about
15 minutes at bimbly pace. It rains? So? don't they have a coat?
Schools are so warm these days and modern fabrics quick drying that by
the end of the first period they will be bone dry.

30lb of books? That is surely ridiculous and outside of H&S allowances
for a child to carry. Someone somewhere is doing something wrong if a
child has to carry that much every day.

Time to email the vulcan, and the greeny/bluey/bikey bloke and suggest
a manifesto commitment that all schools would provide secure cycle
parking for children over 8 and every child should have access to
training under the national standards curriculum.

The costs are minimal, a fixed infrastructure cost that over the
lifetime of the facilites would be about one small textbook per pupil
per year, max.

...d

Tony Raven said:

wafflycat wrote on 26/06/2006 07:33 +0100:

Quoted message said:

Article - to be repeated - about encouraging cycling to school. eed for
cycle training to get the skills to cycle on road.

A quick read of the comments on the BBC Breakfast piece this morning
shows just how far we have to go to make any impact.
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/programmes/breakfast/3342693.stm#cycle

Sigh :-(

--
Tony

"Anyone who conducts an argument by appealing to authority is not using
his intelligence; he is just using his memory."
- Leonardo da Vinci

Just looked through some of these (very, very sad) and came accross yet again the 'my childs bag weighs 30lb's' line. Now in my day we had desks or lockers to keep thigns in admittedly, but a 30lb bag is more than I'd take away for a weekend away walking! Do people actually weight bags, or just guess thiinking 'it's heavy it musy be 30lbs!'.

I stand tobe correctedm, but I doubt many of teh parents of these children could actually carry a bag weighing 30lbs.

Bryan

Tony Raven said:

wafflycat wrote on 26/06/2006 07:33 +0100:

Quoted message said:

Article - to be repeated - about encouraging cycling to school. eed for
cycle training to get the skills to cycle on road.

A quick read of the comments on the BBC Breakfast piece this morning
shows just how far we have to go to make any impact.
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/programmes/breakfast/3342693.stm#cycle

Sigh :-(

After the last funding input two road safety officers requested their local
authority employer support their applications for bursaries so they could be
trained to delicver the National Standards.
The LA refused, saying that by allowing them to be trained it would be
giving approval to the National Standards scheme - and that would never do
as it might increase cycling.

More cyclists = more casualaties = casualty reduction targets not met.
End of story.

The same LA has seen its own very limited cycle training provision halve
over the last 10 or so years.

John B

Quoted message said:

Just looked through some of these (very, very sad) and came accross yet
again the 'my childs bag weighs 30lb's' line. Now in my day we had
desks or lockers to keep thigns in admittedly, but a 30lb bag is more
than I'd take away for a weekend away walking! Do people actually
weight bags, or just guess thiinking 'it's heavy it musy be 30lbs!'.

I stand tobe correctedm, but I doubt many of teh parents of these
children could actually carry a bag weighing 30lbs.

Bryan

I've actually weighed my son's bag that he has bungeed to the rear rack of
his bike. The normal daily weight of bag and contents is over 20lbs. This is
made up of bag, books, files, change of clothes (could be PE kit...)... it
soon mounts up. In many a school kids have nowhere to keep their school
items and they do end up carrying it all around with them, as the desks are
just a flat surface and there aren't enough lockers for every kid to have
one.

On the plus side, this extra weight is good resistance training on the bike
:-)

Cheers, helen s

wafflycat wrote on 26/06/2006 14:07 +0100:

Quoted message said:

I've actually weighed my son's bag that he has bungeed to the rear rack
of his bike. The normal daily weight of bag and contents is over 20lbs.
This is made up of bag, books, files, change of clothes (could be PE
kit...)... it soon mounts up. In many a school kids have nowhere to keep
their school items and they do end up carrying it all around with them,
as the desks are just a flat surface and there aren't enough lockers for
every kid to have one.

Our girls bags are similarly heavy for the same reason plus the need to
bring text books between school and home for homework. They go by train
and foot but it is a big lump to carry.

--
Tony

"Anyone who conducts an argument by appealing to authority is not using
his intelligence; he is just using his memory."
- Leonardo da Vinci

John B wrote on 26/06/2006 14:06 +0100:

Quoted message said:

More cyclists = more casualaties = casualty reduction targets not met.
End of story.

Perhaps point out to them that cycling in London has doubled and
casualties halved over the last few years. Start of Part 2.

--
Tony

"Anyone who conducts an argument by appealing to authority is not using
his intelligence; he is just using his memory."
- Leonardo da Vinci

Tony Raven said:

wafflycat wrote on 26/06/2006 07:33 +0100:

Quoted message said:

Article - to be repeated - about encouraging cycling to school. eed for
cycle training to get the skills to cycle on road.

A quick read of the comments on the BBC Breakfast piece this morning
shows just how far we have to go to make any impact.
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/programmes/breakfast/3342693.stm#cycle

There is only one positive comment amongst that lot. Every other one is
making excuses for their failure to let their child cycle.
No amount of money going into cycle training or cycle promotion is going to
change those hardened ingrained selfish attitudes.
If schools can 'ban' children cycling to school, they can equally 'ban' them
being by delivered by car.

John B

On Mon, 26 Jun 2006 08:22:56 -0300 someone who may be "jtaylor"
<[email hidden]> wrote this:-

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

It is dangerous, but still less dangerous than cycling on many cycle
"facilities".

Is it?

Yes it is.

Quoted message said:

Is the risk of serious injury or death while cycling on the Queen's highways
greater than that of, say, life in general?

Being alive is very dangerous. In fact there is a 100% fatality
rate, no matter what one's views are on afterlife.

Next contestant please.

--
David Hansen, Edinburgh
I will *always* explain revoked encryption keys, unless RIP prevents me
http://www.opsi.gov.uk/acts/acts2000/00023--e.htm#54

On Mon, 26 Jun 2006 14:28:38 +0100 someone who may be John B
<[email hidden]> wrote this:-

Quoted message said:

No amount of money going into cycle training or cycle promotion is going to
change those hardened ingrained selfish attitudes.

The way of dealing with such attitudes is slowly, by example.

Quoted message said:

If schools can 'ban' children cycling to school, they can equally 'ban' them
being by delivered by car.

Nearly all teachers are serial motorists. They would whine loudly at
such an "infringement" of "rights".

--
David Hansen, Edinburgh
I will *always* explain revoked encryption keys, unless RIP prevents me
http://www.opsi.gov.uk/acts/acts2000/00023--e.htm#54