Basso may ride the Giro

bobke said:

Basso earlier this week said the tour route is clearly BAD for him. And great for Ullrich, which is obviously true.

Now he is out saying he may ride the Giro, which he would certainly win, barring freak illness. Many mountain-top finishes, hard climbs.

Or is this simply mind games between CSC and T-Mobile.

In any event CSC training camp is this week so lets hope Basso doesnt drown or get stuck in a blizzard or something else Riis-esque.

I haven't read this. Where did you read it??? I don't think Basso would be a slam dunk in the Giro BUT he would clearly be the best rider going in. That's a lot of climbing for a guy who blew up once last year during the Giro. His TT skills are now good enough to take time on most of the field in the Giro and we know he can climb. In this route, Cunego or Simoni could blast him off the planet on one climb if he falters. Gotta admit it would be fun to watch and riding the Giro clearly didn't hurt his tour form this year. Just the opposite. Ullrich is likely to ride too. The Giro might end up being the GT of the year yet again.

Anyway, I have only read that he will definitely not ride. Where did you read that he might?

barnstorm said:

I haven't read this. Where did you read it??? I don't think Basso would be a slam dunk in the Giro BUT he would clearly be the best rider going in. That's a lot of climbing for a guy who blew up once last year during the Giro. His TT skills are now good enough to take time on most of the field in the Giro and we know he can climb. In this route, Cunego or Simoni could blast him off the planet on one climb if he falters. Gotta admit it would be fun to watch and riding the Giro clearly didn't hurt his tour form this year. Just the opposite. Ullrich is likely to ride too. The Giro might end up being the GT of the year yet again.

Anyway, I have only read that he will definitely not ride. Where did you read that he might?

velonews.com9223.0.htmlOpen ↗

Lw

lwedge said:

velonews.com9223.0.htmlOpen ↗

Lw

thanks lwedge, I am a cyclingnews guy. I don't check Velonews that much. Well, that is exciting. If it wasn't for his one bad day, Basso was a likely winner this year. Seeing him battle out with Simoni, Cunego, Rujano, and Salvodelli will be great. Throw Ullrich in the mix and it will be a race to watch.

barnstorm said:

thanks lwedge, I am a cyclingnews guy. I don't check Velonews that much. Well, that is exciting. If it wasn't for his one bad day, Basso was a likely winner this year. Seeing him battle out with Simoni, Cunego, Rujano, and Salvodelli will be great. Throw Ullrich in the mix and it will be a race to watch.

Ullrich will do nothing, its a training race, like Lemond used to do, like Floyd will do.
Basso will decide to win the Giro if he does it, and he COULD do the double.
And do it clean not like Pantani!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Well, if Basso decides to ride Giro he'll be clear favorite. Route suits him very well and as Italian he'll be motivated to win his national tour, not only to ride it as Tour preparation. Also he is complaining about Tour route, I don't know why, he is clear favorite there too. It is true that Tour route gives chance to Ullrich but Basso is rising star and Ullrich's best years are behind him. That brings me to the eventual Basso - Ullrich Giro clash, Ullrich will ride it as Tour preparation, there is no doubt, but Basso's presence will challenge him for sure and right there is the point - mind war and psychological advance that one of them can get. I think Basso can benefit more from that, he'll be in better shape so he will put the pressure on Ullrich, how will Ullrich deal with that is big question, we all know his self-confidence is his biggest problem after all this "Armstrong years". So, it will be great if Basso decides to ride Giro, great for the race and viewers as well for the Tour - heating up the atmosphere. And at the end, maybe they'll try to avoid pre-Tour duel, so one of them will, maybe, pull out of Giro.

hombredesubaru said:

Ullrich will do nothing, its a training race, like Lemond used to do, like Floyd will do.
Basso will decide to win the Giro if he does it, and he COULD do the double.
And do it clean not like Pantani!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Mentioning a rider from CSC and the description "clean" in the same paragraph. Interesting!

subaru. I agree with you. Ullrich will not race the Giro, but his presence will be interesting to watch. My guess is he will go for a top 5 or even a win in one of the TTs and it will be interesting to see how he deals with those ridiculous Giro climbs. But, not racing for GC at all.

I don't think he will drop, or Basso for that matter based on competition with the other.. just if they have health problems that would jeopardize their TDF.

Patch, that's quite a stab at CSC. That's one team that hasn't had anyone busted. What, specific to them, makes you say that???

Andrija said:

Well, if Basso decides to ride Giro he'll be clear favorite. Route suits him very well and as Italian he'll be motivated to win his national tour, not only to ride it as Tour preparation.

I guess the route was made for Basso (TTT!)

barnstorm said:

Patch, that's quite a stab at CSC. That's one team that hasn't had anyone busted. What, specific to them, makes you say that???

Being negative by testing has nothing to do with being drug free in professional sports! Getting busted means you stuffed up. Good teams like CSC or DSC will not have people getting busted as they are organised enough to avoid detection.

Why do I mention CSC? For a start - does it not make you suspicious that riders eg Julich improve so much after joining? However, for me it was from talking to people racing in Europe about the famous pharmacist that they have employed who has worked on their very successful cocktail.

patch70 said:

Being negative by testing has nothing to do with being drug free in professional sports! Getting busted means you stuffed up. Good teams like CSC or DSC will not have people getting busted as they are organised enough to avoid detection.

Why do I mention CSC? For a start - does it not make you suspicious that riders eg Julich improve so much after joining? However, for me it was from talking to people racing in Europe about the famous pharmacist that they have employed who has worked on their very successful cocktail.

Well, you would expect Mr 60% to know the best...

In the recent edition of Cycle Sport : Basso says that he wants to do both the Giro and the TDF in 2006.
He says he feels stronger having completed both in 2005.

Riis states that if he (Riis) says that Basso's not to ride the Giro, then Basso won't ride the Giro.
Riis states that the TDF is the 2006 target for Basso and CSC and he's confident that Basso can win it.

I think Riis's point will prevail - Basso will be told to skip the Giro.

If he's a real champion, he'd try to go for both, I say.
(I like Basso by the way).

Patch you are in error if you think that there are riders today that are cleaner than Marco Pantani. Pantani was leaving riders behind on climbs even as a youth rider. He had no need of performance enhancing drugs. He was taken out on a complete setup, to make a killing on giro betting in 1998. No A and B samples. How can a veteran rider get caught on high hematocrit, when they are team tested daily? Or better yet, if he was is in fact cheating and using epo, shouldn't he cut back and be conservative, with practically a double digit lead in minutes on the gc? check my other posts for a deeper discussion. Pantani admitted afterward to a certain nonchalance that day of testing because he knew his blood was fine from the measurement the night before. Thus the protocols were not closely monitored. He didn't select the preparation vial as is his right, etc. I am not an expert, but it was argued in the tribunal for sporting fraud, that no anti-coagulant was visible in the preparared vial, and thus the high hematocrit is explained by improper execution of the test. This was rebutted by the argument that it is difficult to see the anti-coagulant anyway. Pantani recalls the strangeness of the UCI tester who said to him twice "You see this is your sample, right?"

patch70 said:

Mentioning a rider from CSC and the description "clean" in the same paragraph. Interesting!

pardon me patch , i see it was hombre who wrote the comment not you.

patch70 said:

Being negative by testing has nothing to do with being drug free in professional sports! Getting busted means you stuffed up. Good teams like CSC or DSC will not have people getting busted as they are organised enough to avoid detection.

Why do I mention CSC? For a start - does it not make you suspicious that riders eg Julich improve so much after joining? However, for me it was from talking to people racing in Europe about the famous pharmacist that they have employed who has worked on their very successful cocktail.

Patch, I agree that not getting busted is no indication of being clean in pro sports, any pro sport. I do agree that CSC has been incredible at revitalizing careers, starting with Julich and that has made me suspicious as I have stated in other posts. I hadn't heard about the phantom pharmacist the the special secret cocktail. Anyone ever notice that every team has some phantom pharmacist or doctor of some sort with a sordid reputation who lingers in the shadows of team operations? I would love to see a clean sport someday

limerickman said:

In the recent edition of Cycle Sport : Basso says that he wants to do both the Giro and the TDF in 2006.
He says he feels stronger having completed both in 2005.

Riis states that if he (Riis) says that Basso's not to ride the Giro, then Basso won't ride the Giro.
Riis states that the TDF is the 2006 target for Basso and CSC and he's confident that Basso can win it.

I think Riis's point will prevail - Basso will be told to skip the Giro.

If he's a real champion, he'd try to go for both, I say.
(I like Basso by the way).

We will know next week after their meetings in Denmark.

Lw

lwedge said:

We will know next week after their meetings in Denmark.

Lw

I think Basso is wrong to ride both.
Why did he get dropped on Courchevel by Lance and Rasmussen?
Lance did not drop him in 2004 once.
Because he rode the Giro. He said so. (I think at least)
The rest of the race he dropped Rasmussen and Mancebo on the climbs who were the only ones to stay with Lance on Courchevel (Valverde DNF'd after the Courchevel stage), the day the race was finalized (after the initial death blow was dealt in the prologue)
The Giro put a lot in to draw him back.
Say NO Bjarne!!!

hombredesubaru said:

I think Basso is wrong to ride both.
Why did he get dropped on Courchevel by Lance and Rasmussen?
Lance did not drop him in 2004 once.
Because he rode the Giro. He said so. (I think at least)
The rest of the race he dropped Rasmussen and Mancebo on the climbs who were the only ones to stay with Lance on Courchevel (Valverde DNF'd after the Courchevel stage), the day the race was finalized (after the initial death blow was dealt in the prologue)
The Giro put a lot in to draw him back.
Say NO Bjarne!!!

From what I read it looks like Basso wants to ride and Riis my not let him, not the other way around. I am not sure the Giro is why Basso was dropped on Courchevel. He said he would be ok in the Alps then strong in the Pyrenees, and it happened just like that. Not sure what the Giro had to do with it.

barnstorm said:

From what I read it looks like Basso wants to ride and Riis my not let him, not the other way around. I am not sure the Giro is why Basso was dropped on Courchevel. He said he would be ok in the Alps then strong in the Pyrenees, and it happened just like that. Not sure what the Giro had to do with it.

The fact that he was overtrained after a grand tour in Italy, got sick to boot, then had to rest and recover and peak again within all of two months. Not possible to hit your highest level TWICE in that short time--ask Lance and by the way Riis who did very much the same training progran that Armstrong did before winning the 96 Tour, thats what it has to do with the Giro.

bobke said:

The fact that he was overtrained after a grand tour in Italy, got sick to boot, then had to rest and recover and peak again within all of two months. Not possible to hit your highest level TWICE in that short time--ask Lance and by the way Riis who did very much the same training progran that Armstrong did before winning the 96 Tour, thats what it has to do with the Giro.

...and while your at it, ask Lance about the EPO. (you can ask Riis that to)