Basic saddle question

swampy1970 said:

What happens if your name is **** (d1ck) and you want to post here. Do you get **** as your username?

Most likely a tweak needed in the new censor filter... 🙄

oldbobcat said:

By that guideline, nearly all saddles should be tipped down in front.

Now that you bring it up, I do recall Grant Petersen as the source of the "Brooks tilt" recommendation. I also recall a time, about 35 years ago, when I rode on a Brooks Pro, and I'd set that saddle with a slight upward tilt, too. Of course, that was when I unsuccessfully strove to resolve the various heights of my stem and saddle, just the way Grant Petersen likes it.

Riding with a lower, flatter back has compelled me to lower the front of my saddle a bit, but not to the extent of your advice. The Fizik Arione that I'm still "testing" is just about dead horizontal, and the scoop saddles I've been using (a Turbo, a Concor, and a Fizik Aliante) are set so a level resting on the nose pretty much bisects the cantle.

FYI. The rear of the saddle can be higher than the nose without tipping it downward (see attachment) ... this is true of MANY saddles -- leather AND plastic.

Off-topic, but that's a very cool SS bike. I love the simple frame color with all the black components.....nice and classic!

Your problem may be an overly narrow saddle. A Specialized dealer can measure your sit bones and provide a saddle which is wide enough. I find saddles are made for smaller guys, even on larger frame bikes.

You could roughly measure it yourself. The saddle width is listed on most online catalogs & you can bring your ruler to the store. Many "race" saddles are about 20mm too narrow for me.

A cheap solution if you just want to try it is to get a saddle from walmart. Their MTB saddles are a bit wider than usual. The clamp looks incompatible but the rails are the same as modern road bike saddle rails so remove the clamp and use the clamp in your seatpost.

dhk2 said:

Off-topic, but that's a very cool SS bike. I love the simple frame color with all the black components.....nice and classic!

Thanks.

Of course, pale green for a frame color is probably an acquired taste ... the same could probably be said for orange frames, too!

Whenever a customer was having problems finding a saddle that worked, I looked at bike fit. That's often where the problem lay, rather than with the particular saddle they were using.

If you have tried a number of quality saddles without luck, I'd be looking at getting fitted or doing some experimenting by yourself. Sometimes, its a mater of getting the saddle under your sitbones, where it belongs. Occasionally, a shorter handlebar stem is the answer. Of course, the ideal is a frame built to your size to optimize all these adjustments.

alfeng said:

FYI. The rear of the saddle can be higher than the nose without tipping it downward (see attachment) ... this is true of MANY saddles -- leather AND plastic.

Alfeng, Grant Petersen would say that your stem is too low and too long, and your saddle is too high in the back.

As a stem Nazi and skeptic of most of Mr. Petersen's hobby horses, I say I like your bike and I'm glad you're comfortable on it.

By the way, here's a photo of my fixie, that fits me very nicely. Note how we change things to adapt to our individual sizes, proportions, and physical hang-ups.

I would echo all of the advice on bike fit. Saddles are often too specific of a thing to go about trying random ones, unless your fit has already been dialed in. Even if you do end up randomly finding a saddle that works you won't necessarily know why it does.

Go to your LBS and ask for a fit, also as others have said expect to pay for this service if you didn't purchase your bike there. Or if you don't have an LBS that you like you can find people who specialize solely in bike fit.

You might want to check out Peter White's thoughts on bike fitting in general and saddle tilt/height/fore-aft position in particular:

How to Fit a Bicycle

OldGoat said:

You might want to check out Peter White's thoughts on bike fitting in general and saddle tilt/height/fore-aft position in particular:

The fore-aft saddle positioning section is somewhat concurrent with Hogg's position on this. Their approaches are different, though--White's is more about balance and Hogg's is about avoiding pain in the lower back, wrists, and quads, the proximate cause of which appears to be imbalance.

Lately, when fitting road and fitness bikes I've been asking customers to stand as if they're about to swing at a baseball, bump a volleyball, return a tennis serve, ski a mogul field, whatever is familiar to them. I ask them to notice their body position--knees bent, torso slightly forward but extended, arms and hands forward, weight centered somewhere between the balls and heels of the feet. I ask them if they're supporting their upper body with their arms. (No.) I ask them if they feel as though they're about to fall over. (No.) They are in the "athletic ready" position. This is roughly the way sitting on a bike should feel.

Of course, Alberto Contador's torso is a lot lower than that, but he's still balanced over the balls of his feet.

oldbobcat said:

Alfeng, Grant Petersen would say that your stem is too low and too long, and your saddle is too high in the back.

Oh, woe is me!

oldbobcat said:

As a stem Nazi and skeptic of most of Mr. Petersen's hobby horses, I say I like your bike and I'm glad you're comfortable on it.

Yes, it's too bad I can't conform to someone else's self-declared "conventional wisdom" ...

As I've mentioned in at least one other thread in this Forum, a few years ago I finally eschewed the "conventional wisdom" of K.O.P.S. as being the correct way to be positioned on the bike, too, due to its inefficiency for me ... and, I suspect the what is true for me is probably true for some others, too ...

oldbobcat said:

By the way, here's a photo of my fixie, that fits me very nicely. Note how we change things to adapt to our individual sizes, proportions, and physical hang-ups.

Nicely done.

oldbobcat said:

By the way, here's a photo of my fixie, that fits me very nicely. Note how we change things to adapt to our individual sizes, proportions, and physical hang-ups.

BTW. So, even though your bike reminds me of a Peugeot, I'm sure it isn't ...

What did it begin life as before it was repainted OR the decals were removed?

alfeng said:

BTW. So, even though your bike reminds me of a Peugeot, I'm sure it isn't ...

It's a mid-'60s Frejus track frame with a Kinesis aluminum road fork. It was originally chromed and pitted so badly I needed to do something to keep it from going structural. Sandblasting and pearl gray powercoating was done through JD's Cycle Shack in Northglenn, Colorado.

Everyone who sees the bike says it's one of the nicest powdercoats they've ever seen. You can read the serial number stamped in the seat lug. If you're ever around Denver and you need powdercoating, see JD.