bar-end shifters

Jim said:

Hello there,

I was reading the Trek Web site, and found the 520 comes with bar-end
shifters.
What benefits do the Shimano Dura-Ace bar-end shifters offer, compared
with
modern integrated shifters? Is the 520 the only modern bicycle equipped
with
bar-end shifters?

The Shimano bar-end shifters are much simpler than STI or Campy Ergo,
and therefore more reliable.

The bar-end in friction mode is much better at shifting between large
differences on the front chainrings than either STI or Rabid-Fire
(sic). It will easily handle a 52-42-24 combination in front (or even
54-44-24 on one bike I rode).

The friction mode will still allow for decent shifting if the rear
derailleur gets knocked out of alignment.

All three of the above reasons are beneficial for touring use.

--
Tom Sherman - Fox River Valley

Jim said:

Hello there,

I was reading the Trek Web site, and found the 520 comes with bar-end
shifters.
What benefits do the Shimano Dura-Ace bar-end shifters offer, compared
with
modern integrated shifters?

They last more or less indefinetely whereas STI's die, sometimes fairly
abruptly. Also, the fact that the right has a friction mode and the
left is friction only makes them more reliable in a lot of other ways
that sometimes prove relevant when you're screwed if you can't shift.
And front indexing pretty much always sucks. Shi bar-ends plus the
higher end Shi aero levers (which are the most expensive I think are
made right now except for Campy) are also about the same price as Sora
STI's, which are kinda jank. Bar-ends make a lot of sense for most
bikes and riders.

Is the 520 the only modern bicycle equipped

Quoted message said:

with
bar-end shifters?

It's among the only modern US-distributed touring bikes with them,
which is pretty much ridiculous and backwards. I'm not sure how true
that is elsewhere. I've always assumed the main reason why bar-ends
even exist anymore is that Tri/TT bikes use them on the ends of their
aerobars.

Quoted message said:

Thanks in advance.

-Jim

"Jim" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

What benefits do the Shimano Dura-Ace bar-end shifters offer, compared
with
modern integrated shifters? Is the 520 the only modern bicycle equipped
with
bar-end shifters?

There are still quite a few bar end shifter hold outs. Not that anything is
wrong with Ergo and the Shimano and soon to be SRAM equivilents, but bar end
shifters offer the following:

1. More choice in brake levers and shifters.
2. In a crash bar ends are protected and you are less likely to need to
replace them. Brake levers can be cheap to replace.
3. Actually if money isn't an issue, I think Campy 10 bar ends and their
carbon brake levers weigh less than Chorus Ergo. (Not a good reason to
choose bar ends.)
4. It can be good to lift your hands once in a while from the bar to shift.
You have to move your hands around anyway, so why not do it for a purpose
other than
to give them a break from a tiring placement.
5. Maybe bar ends are probably less likely to get gummed up with mud, and if
they are, or the indexing feature fails for some other reason you can use
them in friction mode.

There are other touring bikes and cross bikes with bar end shifters besides
the Trek 520. Cost can be a consideration when manufacturers spec bikes.
Don't think that for 'cross racing there are any advantages to bar ends, nor
for road racing. Tourists and others who like functional, simple equipment
are more likely to be bar end adherents.

One way to look at this is to ask, "Except for racing, is there a reason to
use integrated levers/shifters?"

Many points of view and it boils down to what you are comfortable with. I
run evrything from from Campy 10 Ergo to Suntour Barcons on my bikes. If I
had to live with only one technology, it would be bar ends.

Gary Jacobson
Rosendale, NY

In article <[email hidden]>, Jim

Quoted message said:

Hello there,

I was reading the Trek Web site, and found the 520 comes with bar-end
shifters.
What benefits do the Shimano Dura-Ace bar-end shifters offer, compared
with
modern integrated shifters? Is the 520 the only modern bicycle equipped
with
bar-end shifters?

Thanks in advance.

-Jim

Here are a few benefits of bar-end shifters :
a) should they need to be replaced, they're more economical than
brifters[1]
b) Shimano DA/Ultegra rear bar-end shifters offers both index and
friction mode. This is convenient should you bend your rear derailleur
hanger or damage the rear derailleur itself, both circumstances which
can wreak havoc with indexed shifting.
c) I find bar-end shifters are more durable, having a simpler, more
robust mechanism (less parts to break). Not sure if this is
representative of other Shimano brifters, but in heavy rain my (soaked)
Tiagras frequently skip (fail to retract cable) on the down-shift,
while the action of the bar-end shifters' indexed shifting is much more
precise and positive in all conditions.
d) The left bar-end shifter (friction only) allows for very accurate
trimming of the front derailleur.
e) On a more esoteric note, a single sweep of a bar-end shifter can
up-shift multiple gears; Shimanos brifters (my Tiagra/Shimano 600, at
least) can only up-shift one gear at time. I'm uncertain whether this
limitation applies to newer incarnations of Ultegra or DA.

In short, bar-end shifters emphasize durability, versatility (those
with indexed and friction modes) and economy; they're more suited to
the demands of touring or commuting. I'm not sure if the 520 is the
only 'modern'(?) bike equipped with bar-end shifters, but almost any
bike with drop bars is a candidate - and with the addition of Pauls
Thumbies, MTBs too can be so equipped.

Luke

1.
brifter: integrated brake/shifter unit

Jim said:

Hello there,

I was reading the Trek Web site, and found the 520 comes with bar-end
shifters.
What benefits do the Shimano Dura-Ace bar-end shifters offer, compared
with
modern integrated shifters?

In addition to the answers others have given, I'll add:

I can't stand having anything on my bike that I can't take apart and
repair with relative ease. There should be a difference between a bike
and a Swiss watch.

- Frank Krygowski

Quoted message said:

I was reading the Trek Web site, and found the 520 comes with bar-end
shifters. What benefits do the Shimano Dura-Ace bar-end shifters offer,
compared with modern integrated shifters? Is the 520 the only modern
bicycle equipped with bar-end shifters?

I believe it's almost entirely a question of personal preference. I find
bar end shifters the nicest to use, but others will disagree.

Here are some things to consider, but not all may be true:

- if a bar-end shifter needs replacing, the brake lever probably won't need
to be replaced as well, and conversely.
- with integrated shifters, you can shift with your hands on the
hoods/hooks (I don't see this as an advantage; racers may.)
- with bar-ends, you have visual/tactile feedback regarding the gear you're
in (I don't see this as an advantage either).
- some think bar-end shifters are less likely to be fatally damaged during
a long ride/tour.
- some bar-end shifters can be toggled between indexed/friction mode. I
have such a shifter, but it has never gone out of adjustment during a
ride, so I've never used the friction mode.
- some people may find the hoods on sti/ergo more comfortable that regular
brake hoods.
- bar-end shifters are elegant and aesthetically pleasing; sti/ergo are
ugly devil-spawned monstrosities.

--
Benjamin Lewis

Now is the time for all good men to come to.
-- Walt Kelly

"Benjamin Lewis" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

What benefits do bar-end shifters offer,
compared with modern integrated shifters?

Quoted message said:

- with bar-ends, you have visual/tactile feedback regarding the gear
you're
in (I don't see this as an advantage either).

I forgot about this one. I find bar end shifters great at nigth as I can
feel the levers and get a sense where I'm at on the chain rings and cogs.

Gary Jacobson
Rosendale, NY

In article <[email hidden]>,

Jim said:

Hello there,

I was reading the Trek Web site, and found the 520 comes with bar-end
shifters.
What benefits do the Shimano Dura-Ace bar-end shifters offer, compared
with
modern integrated shifters? Is the 520 the only modern bicycle equipped
with
bar-end shifters?

Thanks in advance.

-Jim

I, for one, would hate to see bar-end shifters to go the way of the
dodo. While not quite as slick as brifters (you do have to move your
hand to shift) they do include good things like less cost, more
resistance to damage, an ability to switch to friction shift, and
usefulness for handlebars of other than drop persuasions.

No they're not dead yet, Jim.

--
Ted Bennett

Ted Bennett said:

I, for one, would hate to see bar-end shifters to go the way of the
dodo. While not quite as slick as brifters (you do have to move your
hand to shift)....

I use my thumbs to move the bar-end levers without moving my hands.

--
Tom Sherman - Fox River Valley

Johnny Sunset said:

Ted Bennett said:

I, for one, would hate to see bar-end shifters to go the way of the
dodo. While not quite as slick as brifters (you do have to move your
hand to shift)....

I use my thumbs to move the bar-end levers without moving my hands.

I've used my water bottle to move the bar-end levers on occasion.

--
Benjamin Lewis

Now is the time for all good men to come to.
-- Walt Kelly

Jim said:

Is the 520 the only modern bicycle equipped with bar-end shifters?

Greenspeed trikes are not exactly bicycles, but they come with bar-end
shifters.

www.greenspeed.com.au

Benjamin Lewis <[email hidden]> wrote in
news:[email hidden]:

Quoted message said:

Johnny Sunset said:

Ted Bennett said:

I, for one, would hate to see bar-end shifters to go the way of the
dodo. While not quite as slick as brifters (you do have to move your
hand to shift)....

I use my thumbs to move the bar-end levers without moving my hands.

I've used my water bottle to move the bar-end levers on occasion.

I've used my knee to shift my bar-ends a few times. Only once or twice was
it on purpose. That said, it was not while actually riding, it was walking
it over a curb.

I have friction bar-ends (Rivendell's excellent ones based on Superbe Pro
DTs) on one bike and Ergos on another, and I like both just fine. I say
that as someone who hates DT shifters. I'm surprised how much I still like
the friction ones after getting indexing on all my other bikes.

Jim said:

Hello there,

I was reading the Trek Web site, and found the 520 comes with bar-end
shifters.
What benefits do the Shimano Dura-Ace bar-end shifters offer, compared
with
modern integrated shifters?

among all the other excellent reasons:
you can shift gears without dropping your sandwich
you can shift with frozen fingers
Ergopower in rollercoaster hills gives me RSI
--
---
Marten Gerritsen

INFOapestaartjeM-GINEERINGpuntNL
www.m-gineering.nl

Johnny Sunset said:

Ted Bennett said:

I, for one, would hate to see bar-end shifters to go the way of the
dodo. While not quite as slick as brifters (you do have to move your
hand to shift)....

I use my thumbs to move the bar-end levers without moving my hands.

I have a favourite bit of road that is downhill gravel, finally tar and it instantly turns
and goes uphill. I could never go from brake to downtube in time,
but with bar-ends no problems!

Your hands never actually leave the bars which act as guidance rails.
I often shift with the base of my palm/thumb, means my fingers are still on the drops.
Brifters are faster if you change and change back cos it was a bad idea.

If you are on the drops you have to move your hands as much for brifters as for bar-ends.

The difference between bar-ends and brifters is much less than the difference
between either and downtube shifter.

Andre

I have bar end shifters that are mounted just below the brake hoods
(sticking up)on a customized Paul's Thumbie mount. Shifting from the
hoods or the drops is easy and quick... though not as good as it could
be with a mount designed for this purpose. Before brifters were popular
(1989) I mounted an MTB thumb shifter in the same location and it was
nearly ideal... much shorter throw than the barends. I wish these were
still available.

I think the barends will be with us for a few years at least... they
are used on all those TT and Tri bikes.

Quoted message said:

I use my thumbs to move the bar-end levers without moving my hands.

Good God, how? By delivering a precisely tuned kung fu tap to the bar,
which moves the shifter?

Or did you mean your pinkies?

My bank wouldn't give me a loan when they found out I was using STI.
Also, once I was harassed by a cop and I started to cry when he
mockingly couldn't find the bar-end shifters on my drop bars. It was a
horrible experience, much like being fondled, when I was forced to
point to (and touch and work and lick) my Tiagra brifters.

Aeek said:

If you are on the drops you have to move your hands as much for brifters
as for bar-ends.

That must depend on where you grip the drops. I find I literally don't move
my hand at all. I just extend a finger and push one of the levers. Using
brifters from the drops seems to require the mimimum hand movement possible.

--
Paul Turner

"Jim" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Hello there,

I was reading the Trek Web site, and found the 520 comes with bar-end
shifters.
What benefits do the Shimano Dura-Ace bar-end shifters offer, compared
with
modern integrated shifters? Is the 520 the only modern bicycle equipped
with
bar-end shifters?

Thanks in advance.

-Jim

For a touring bike it makes very little difference what position on your
bike you change gear from as long as the gear selects efficiently . It is
The law of diminishing returns you pay a lot of money for a very little
return . So to answer your question the benefits for touring are nil.
The problem is all your mates could have integrated shifters and they will
tell you how fantastic they are so you may end up wanting to change . The
doubt is already in your mind about not having the integrated shifters.I
personally would prefer the barcons.

PK