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Aviemore

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General fitness, health and nutrition
Published
16 September 2004
Last activity
23 September 2004
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Pete
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  1. In message <[email hidden]>, Adrian Tupper
    <[email hidden]> writes

    Quoted message said:

    Chris Townsend <[email hidden]> wrote in
    news:[email hidden]:

    Quoted message said:

    In message <[email hidden]>, AndyP
    <[email hidden]> writes

    Quoted message said:

    "Chris Townsend" <[email hidden]> wrote

    > The solution to the problem would be to have not built the railway
    > in the first place. The best solution now is to remove the railway
    > and restore Cairn Gorm as soon as possible. It is a destructive
    > eyesore that should never have been built.

    I don't think the railway itself stands out as much of an additional
    eyesore to all the ski stuff that was already there. Although I only
    visit once in a while so haven't studied it too closely. There was
    already a building at the top station wasn't there? I think the ski
    fences have a far greater adverse visual impact than the railway.


    The whole ski resort is an eyesore. However the fences can be easily
    removed. The railway involved bulldozing masses of material, laying
    deep concrete foundations and blasting a tunnel. Removing it will be a
    huge task. The railway requires maintenance tracks too.

    The railway catches the light and can be seen from quite a distance
    away. Even worse is the large top station/restaurant/visitor centre,
    which has a shiny roof that draws the eye from many miles away. The
    original Ptarmigan restaurant was much smaller and less obtrusive,

    If I may put a slightly more positive tone on to this, I would say
    that we should be glad that there is very little in the way of obtrusive
    development in the Highlands. Anything hydro-electric is more
    obtrusive I would say but being socially necessary and generally older
    it gets away with it.

    Most of the damage to the Highlands lies in deforestation, over grazing
    and bulldozed roads, which aren't as immediately obvious as railways and
    hydro schemes.

    Quoted message said:


    How many of us have used the various ski centre car parks?

    A problem with providing access is of course that people will use it, in
    part because they want to get beyond developments like car parks. Where
    the concrete ends the wild begins.

    Cairn Gorm is, I think, the only ski centre car park that isn't on or
    near a main road.

    While it's there I'll use it occasionally because I don't want to walk
    up next to or in sight of it or start a walk that then goes through the
    ski resort. Ideally I'd like to see the whole resort dismantled and the
    road end brought down to Glenmore. I'm not expecting that to happen
    though :-)

  2. "AndyP" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
    news:[email hidden]...

    Quoted message said:

    "Chris Townsend" <[email hidden]> wrote

    Quoted message said:

    The solution to the problem would be to have not built the railway in
    the first place. The best solution now is to remove the railway and
    restore Cairn Gorm as soon as possible. It is a destructive eyesore that
    should never have been built.

    I don't think the railway itself stands out as much of an additional


    eyesore

    Quoted message said:

    to all the ski stuff that was already there. Although I only visit once


    in

    Quoted message said:

    a while so haven't studied it too closely. There was already a building


    at

    Quoted message said:

    the top station wasn't there? I think the ski fences have a far greater
    adverse visual impact than the railway.

    No one argued against the building of the railway on the basis that it was
    spoiling a pristine landscape, the corrie was already trashed. The
    objections were to the pointlessness of the whole thing, particularly as the
    skiing no longer seems to be sustainable.

    If, or rather when, the whole thing goes bust there is a condition to be met
    that the landscape is returned to its original state. Pull the ski fences
    down and you'll hardly know they were there a year later. It's going to be
    a good trick to restore the line of the railway though, given the amount of
    high explosive that was used to build it. Of course, since the chairlift
    company will be insolvent, the cost is going to be left with the taxpayer,
    again.

    --
    Duncan Gray

    www.duncolm.co.uk
    also The Mountaineering Council of Scotland
    www.mountaineering-scotland.org.uk

  3. "Birgit Kleymann" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
    news:[email hidden]...

    Quoted message said:

    a nice daywalk is to go from the Coire Cas parking lot up to Cairn
    Gorm, past the Ptarmigan restaurant/summit station (which is in fact
    quite a bit BELOW the summit of Cairn Gorm). The path starts behind
    the base station of the mountain railroad as seen from the parking
    lot. The first bit of the walk is on vehicle tracks and past skilifts
    and not particularly inspiring, but if you take the railway up to
    Ptarmigan they won't let you off the station - it's operated as a
    'closed system' (see below). Once past Ptarmigan, you head up to the
    summit of Cairn Gorm (great views). From there, you can walk via the
    plateau over to Ben Macdui and back down to Coire Cas via a much nicer
    path (past Lurcher's Crag, great views) that goes more or less above
    Lairig Ghru. The path ends at the Coire Cas parking lot, so this makes
    a nice circular walk.

    Or if you find yourself short of time, simply walking round the clifftops
    over Cairn Lochan, then back through the corries is well worth it.

    --
    Duncan Gray

    www.duncolm.co.uk
    also The Mountaineering Council of Scotland
    www.mountaineering-scotland.org.uk

  4. In message <[email hidden]>, Duncan Gray
    <[email hidden]> writes

    Quoted message said:


    "AndyP" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
    news:[email hidden]...

    Quoted message said:

    "Chris Townsend" <[email hidden]> wrote

    Quoted message said:

    The solution to the problem would be to have not built the railway in
    the first place. The best solution now is to remove the railway and
    restore Cairn Gorm as soon as possible. It is a destructive eyesore that
    should never have been built.

    I don't think the railway itself stands out as much of an additional


    eyesore

    Quoted message said:

    to all the ski stuff that was already there. Although I only visit once


    in

    Quoted message said:

    a while so haven't studied it too closely. There was already a building


    at

    Quoted message said:

    the top station wasn't there? I think the ski fences have a far greater
    adverse visual impact than the railway.

    No one argued against the building of the railway on the basis that it was
    spoiling a pristine landscape, the corrie was already trashed. The
    objections were to the pointlessness of the whole thing, particularly as the
    skiing no longer seems to be sustainable.

    There were also concerns about greater accessibility to fragile terrain,
    hence the closed system. And to the far greater impact a railway would
    have, as compared to ski tows and chair lifts.

    Of course it wasn't really built for skiers, it was built for coach
    parties.

    Quoted message said:


    If, or rather when, the whole thing goes bust

    Given that the owners of the land - Highlands and Islands Enterprise -
    have already slashed the rent paid by the railway company because they
    hadn't made a profit I think everything possible will be done to prevent
    it going bust, including further dollops of public money.

    Quoted message said:

    there is a condition to be met
    that the landscape is returned to its original state. Pull the ski fences
    down and you'll hardly know they were there a year later. It's going to be
    a good trick to restore the line of the railway though, given the amount of
    high explosive that was used to build it.

    Removing all that concrete will be difficult, to say the least. The much
    greater permanence of the railway compared to the ski structures was one
    reason for some of the objections.

    Quoted message said:

    Of course, since the chairlift
    company will be insolvent, the cost is going to be left with the taxpayer,
    again.

    I expect the companies who built the railway - run by people who either
    worked or went on to work for HIE, who handed out the money for the
    construction - will get the job of dismantling it.

    Quoted message said:
  5. "Duncan Gray" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
    news:[email hidden]...

    Quoted message said:


    "AndyP" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
    news:[email hidden]...

    Quoted message said:

    "Chris Townsend" <[email hidden]> wrote

    Quoted message said:

    The solution to the problem would be to have not built the railway in
    the first place. The best solution now is to remove the railway and
    restore Cairn Gorm as soon as possible. It is a destructive eyesore


    that

    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:

    should never have been built.

    I don't think the railway itself stands out as much of an additional


    eyesore

    Quoted message said:

    to all the ski stuff that was already there. Although I only visit once


    in

    Quoted message said:

    a while so haven't studied it too closely. There was already a building


    at

    Quoted message said:

    the top station wasn't there? I think the ski fences have a far greater
    adverse visual impact than the railway.

    No one argued against the building of the railway on the basis that it was
    spoiling a pristine landscape, the corrie was already trashed. The
    objections were to the pointlessness of the whole thing, particularly as


    the

    Quoted message said:

    skiing no longer seems to be sustainable.

    If, or rather when, the whole thing goes bust there is a condition to be


    met

    Quoted message said:

    that the landscape is returned to its original state. Pull the ski fences
    down and you'll hardly know they were there a year later. It's going to


    be

    Quoted message said:

    a good trick to restore the line of the railway though, given the amount


    of

    Quoted message said:

    high explosive that was used to build it. Of course, since the chairlift
    company will be insolvent, the cost is going to be left with the taxpayer,
    again.

    --
    Duncan Gray

    www.duncolm.co.uk
    also The Mountaineering Council of Scotland
    www.mountaineering-scotland.org.uk


    The problem is that many DID (and still do) argue against the development on
    the grounds of landscape value. I still can't help feeling that there's too
    much attention paid to the few square kilometres surrounding the railway
    when there's so much more available elsewhere. If ski developments were
    eating up all of Scotlands wild places, I'd understand more. As it is, even
    the development of MTB tracks at Glen Shee and the White Corries are hardly
    going to be major intrusions. Compare this to the number of potential wind
    farms and we're shooting at the wrong target. . .

    druidh

    druidh

  6. In message <[email hidden]>, druidh
    <[email hidden]> writes

    Quoted message said:


    "Duncan Gray" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
    news:[email hidden]...

    Quoted message said:


    "AndyP" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
    news:[email hidden]...

    Quoted message said:

    "Chris Townsend" <[email hidden]> wrote

    > The solution to the problem would be to have not built the railway in
    > the first place. The best solution now is to remove the railway and
    > restore Cairn Gorm as soon as possible. It is a destructive eyesore


    that

    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:

    > should never have been built.

    I don't think the railway itself stands out as much of an additional


    eyesore

    Quoted message said:

    to all the ski stuff that was already there. Although I only visit once


    in

    Quoted message said:

    a while so haven't studied it too closely. There was already a building


    at

    Quoted message said:

    the top station wasn't there? I think the ski fences have a far greater
    adverse visual impact than the railway.

    No one argued against the building of the railway on the basis that it was
    spoiling a pristine landscape, the corrie was already trashed. The
    objections were to the pointlessness of the whole thing, particularly as


    the

    Quoted message said:

    skiing no longer seems to be sustainable.

    If, or rather when, the whole thing goes bust there is a condition to be


    met

    Quoted message said:

    that the landscape is returned to its original state. Pull the ski fences
    down and you'll hardly know they were there a year later. It's going to


    be

    Quoted message said:

    a good trick to restore the line of the railway though, given the amount


    of

    Quoted message said:

    high explosive that was used to build it. Of course, since the chairlift
    company will be insolvent, the cost is going to be left with the taxpayer,
    again.

    --
    Duncan Gray

    www.duncolm.co.uk
    also The Mountaineering Council of Scotland
    www.mountaineering-scotland.org.uk


    The problem is that many DID (and still do) argue against the development on
    the grounds of landscape value. I still can't help feeling that there's too
    much attention paid to the few square kilometres surrounding the railway
    when there's so much more available elsewhere. If ski developments were
    eating up all of Scotlands wild places, I'd understand more. As it is, even
    the development of MTB tracks at Glen Shee and the White Corries are hardly
    going to be major intrusions. Compare this to the number of potential wind
    farms and we're shooting at the wrong target. . .


    It's certainly not worth spending much time on the funicular now. It is
    a highly symbolic development though and what happens in the long run is
    important. If more public money is requested to keep it solvent it will
    be time to raise the debate again. What happens also has importance for
    the Cairngorms National Park and how that develops.

    Wind farms are of far greater importance at present in the Highlands as
    a whole. The line of huge pylons required to bring wind power from Lewis
    across the Highlands and then south will be horrendous.

    Bulldozed roads are another big concern. New high level ones are still
    appearing in places.


  7. Quoted message said:

    Bulldozed roads are another big concern. New high level ones are still
    appearing in places.

    They are cropping up all the time..

    New additions seen recently...

    South Ridge of Carn a'Gheoidh, Glen Shee, Perthshire. Continuation
    for 3 miles of the access path to the Gulabin ski hut. Invercauld
    Estate.

    Gana Hill, Lowthers, Dumfriesshire. Road has appeared over the
    summit. Buccleuch Estate.

    Richard Webb

  8. "Duncan Gray" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
    news:[email hidden]...

    Quoted message said:


    "Birgit Kleymann" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
    news:[email hidden]...

    Quoted message said:

    a nice daywalk is to go from the Coire Cas parking lot up to Cairn
    Gorm, past the Ptarmigan restaurant/summit station (which is in fact
    quite a bit BELOW the summit of Cairn Gorm). The path starts behind
    the base station of the mountain railroad as seen from the parking
    lot. The first bit of the walk is on vehicle tracks and past skilifts
    and not particularly inspiring, but if you take the railway up to
    Ptarmigan they won't let you off the station - it's operated as a
    'closed system' (see below). Once past Ptarmigan, you head up to the
    summit of Cairn Gorm (great views). From there, you can walk via the
    plateau over to Ben Macdui and back down to Coire Cas via a much nicer
    path (past Lurcher's Crag, great views) that goes more or less above
    Lairig Ghru. The path ends at the Coire Cas parking lot, so this makes
    a nice circular walk.

    Or if you find yourself short of time, simply walking round the clifftops
    over Cairn Lochan, then back through the corries is well worth it.

    --
    Duncan Gray

    www.duncolm.co.uk
    also The Mountaineering Council of Scotland
    www.mountaineering-scotland.org.uk

    Thanks

    I've had some great suggestions that should keep us busy for a few days

    Pete

  9. In message <[email hidden]>, RJ Webb
    <[email hidden]> writes

    Quoted message said:


    Quoted message said:

    Bulldozed roads are another big concern. New high level ones are still
    appearing in places.

    They are cropping up all the time..

    New additions seen recently...

    South Ridge of Carn a'Gheoidh, Glen Shee, Perthshire.

    This is a particularly awful one. I saw it last May. When the NTS has
    removed a high level road on Beinn a'Bhuiridh not far away it seems
    crazy to allow a new one to be built here.

    Quoted message said:

    Continuation
    for 3 miles of the access path to the Gulabin ski hut. Invercauld
    Estate.

    Gana Hill, Lowthers, Dumfriesshire. Road has appeared over the
    summit. Buccleuch Estate.

  10. In article <[email hidden]>, Chris Townsend
    <URL:[email hidden]> wrote:
    [snip]

    Quoted message said:

    A problem with providing access is of course that people will use it, in
    part because they want to get beyond developments like car parks. Where
    the concrete ends the wild begins.

    Cairn Gorm is, I think, the only ski centre car park that isn't on or
    near a main road.

    While it's there I'll use it occasionally because I don't want to walk
    up next to or in sight of it or start a walk that then goes through the
    ski resort. Ideally I'd like to see the whole resort dismantled and the
    road end brought down to Glenmore. I'm not expecting that to happen
    though :-)

    I recall that one of the compromise solutions offered by the Cairngorms
    Campaign (which I have been a long term supporter of)

    http://www.cairngorms.demon.co.uk/

    was a Gondola system running from about the location of Glenmore Lodge
    and a removal of the car parks and road access to the mountain.

    But I agree with Chris Townsend that although the eyesore value of the
    funicular and the previous chairlift may be subjectively similar,
    objectively the amount of destruction caused to the environment by the
    funicular is considerably greater. Thousands of tons of the mountain
    have been removed to make way for the railway, and it is unlikely that
    it could ever be restored.

    As for allowing tourists out onto the plateau, the problem is that in
    order to make the funicular financially viable on paper (if it ever was
    possible!) required a projected large increase in the numbers of
    visitors to the summit. Such numbers if allowed to roam freely would
    completely destroy the fragile ecosystem.

    Mike <URL:http://www.path.cam.ac.uk/~mrc7/>
    --
    o/ \\ // |\ ,_ o Mike Clark
    <\__,\\ // __o | \ / /\, "A mountain climbing, cycling, skiing,
    "> || _`\<,_ |__\ \> | immunology lecturer, antibody engineer and
    ` || (_)/ (_) | \corn computer user"

  11. In article <[email hidden]>, Duncan Gray

    URL: said:


    "AndyP" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
    news:[email hidden]...

    Quoted message said:

    "Chris Townsend" <[email hidden]> wrote

    Quoted message said:

    The solution to the problem would be to have not built the railway
    in the first place. The best solution now is to remove the railway
    and restore Cairn Gorm as soon as possible. It is a destructive
    eyesore that should never have been built.

    I don't think the railway itself stands out as much of an additional
    eyesore to all the ski stuff that was already there. Although I
    only visit once in a while so haven't studied it too closely. There
    was already a building at the top station wasn't there? I think the
    ski fences have a far greater adverse visual impact than the
    railway.

    No one argued against the building of the railway on the basis that it
    was spoiling a pristine landscape, the corrie was already trashed.

    That is not quite correct. One of the major arguments against
    the railway concerned visitor pressure on the Cairgorm plateau,
    particularly during the summer months.

    Quoted message said:

    The objections were to the pointlessness of the whole thing,
    particularly as the skiing no longer seems to be sustainable.

    That is also a substantial argument of course.

    Quoted message said:


    If, or rather when, the whole thing goes bust there is a condition to
    be met that the landscape is returned to its original state. Pull the
    ski fences down and you'll hardly know they were there a year later.
    It's going to be a good trick to restore the line of the railway
    though, given the amount of high explosive that was used to build it.
    Of course, since the chairlift company will be insolvent, the cost is
    going to be left with the taxpayer, again.

    The substantial part of the cost has always been born by the taxpayers
    in some indirect form. A major part of the funds is from an EU subsidy.

    Mike <URL:http://www.path.cam.ac.uk/~mrc7/>
    --
    o/ \\ // |\ ,_ o Mike Clark
    <\__,\\ // __o | \ / /\, "A mountain climbing, cycling, skiing,
    "> || _`\<,_ |__\ \> | immunology lecturer, antibody engineer and
    ` || (_)/ (_) | \corn computer user"

  12. Chris Townsend <[email hidden]> wrote in
    news:[email hidden]:

    Quoted message said:

    Most of the damage to the Highlands lies in deforestation, over


    grazing

    Quoted message said:

    and bulldozed roads, which aren't as immediately obvious as railways


    and

    Quoted message said:

    hydro schemes.

    Yes, indeed. I shan't dispute that.

    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:


    How many of us have used the various ski centre car parks?

    A problem with providing access is of course that people will use it,


    in

    Quoted message said:

    part because they want to get beyond developments like car parks.


    Where

    Quoted message said:

    the concrete ends the wild begins.

    Cairn Gorm is, I think, the only ski centre car park that isn't on or
    near a main road.

    Aonach Mor is another, although it doesn't get you the height you may
    be after.

    Quoted message said:


    While it's there I'll use it occasionally because I don't want to walk
    up next to or in sight of it or start a walk that then goes through


    the

    Quoted message said:

    ski resort. Ideally I'd like to see the whole resort dismantled and


    the

    Quoted message said:

    road end brought down to Glenmore. I'm not expecting that to happen
    though :-)

    Not a chance. Unless, of course, the ski centre becomes economically
    unviable. Which is not as unlikely as it may seem.

    --
    Adrian

  13. In message <[email hidden]>, Adrian Tupper
    <[email hidden]> writes

    Quoted message said:

    Chris Townsend <[email hidden]> wrote in
    news:[email hidden]:

    Quoted message said:


    Cairn Gorm is, I think, the only ski centre car park that isn't on or
    near a main road.

    Aonach Mor is another, although it doesn't get you the height you may
    be after.

    Aonach More is much closer to a main road than Cairn Gorm. It's a long
    way from Coire Cas to Aviemore and the A9 :-)

    Quoted message said:


    Quoted message said:


    While it's there I'll use it occasionally because I don't want to walk
    up next to or in sight of it or start a walk that then goes through


    the

    Quoted message said:

    ski resort. Ideally I'd like to see the whole resort dismantled and


    the

    Quoted message said:

    road end brought down to Glenmore. I'm not expecting that to happen
    though :-)

    Not a chance. Unless, of course, the ski centre becomes economically
    unviable. Which is not as unlikely as it may seem.


    It's not been economically viable for years, which is one reason the
    railway was built, to try and drum up summer business.

    --
    Chris Townsend
    Mountain & Wilderness Writer & Photographer
    Auchnarrow, Grantown-on-Spey, Moray, PH26 3PL, Scotland, UK
    http://www.auchnarrow.demon.co.uk

  14. In message <[email hidden]>, Adrian Tupper
    <[email hidden]> writes

    Quoted message said:

    Chris Townsend <[email hidden]> wrote in
    news:[email hidden]:

    Quoted message said:

    Most of the damage to the Highlands lies in deforestation, over


    grazing

    Quoted message said:

    and bulldozed roads, which aren't as immediately obvious as railways


    and

    Quoted message said:

    hydro schemes.

    Yes, indeed. I shan't dispute that.

    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:


    How many of us have used the various ski centre car parks?

    A problem with providing access is of course that people will use it,


    in

    Quoted message said:

    part because they want to get beyond developments like car parks.


    Where

    Quoted message said:

    the concrete ends the wild begins.

    Cairn Gorm is, I think, the only ski centre car park that isn't on or
    near a main road.

    Aonach Mor is another, although it doesn't get you the height you may
    be after.

    Cairn Gorm is much further from a main road than Aonach Mor. It's a long
    way from Coire Cas to Aviemore :-)

    Quoted message said:


    Quoted message said:


    While it's there I'll use it occasionally because I don't want to walk
    up next to or in sight of it or start a walk that then goes through


    the

    Quoted message said:

    ski resort. Ideally I'd like to see the whole resort dismantled and


    the

    Quoted message said:

    road end brought down to Glenmore. I'm not expecting that to happen
    though :-)

    Not a chance. Unless, of course, the ski centre becomes economically
    unviable. Which is not as unlikely as it may seem.


    The ski centre hasn't been economically viable for many years, which is
    one reason the funicular was built - to attract summer visitors.
    Financially it doesn't seem to be working - surprise, surprise. The only
    independent study done before the funicular was built said it wasn't
    financially viable. The financial study done by Highlands and Island
    Enterprise has never been published "for confidential reasons".

    The private sector certainly didn't believe it was viable. There's not a
    penny of private money invested in it. The whole £17 million came from
    the public purse.

  15. Chris Townsend <[email hidden]> wrote in news:q
    [email hidden]:

    Quoted message said:

    In message <[email hidden]>, Adrian Tupper
    <[email hidden]> writes

    Quoted message said:

    Chris Townsend <[email hidden]> wrote in
    news:[email hidden]:

    Quoted message said:

    Most of the damage to the Highlands lies in deforestation, over


    grazing

    Quoted message said:

    and bulldozed roads, which aren't as immediately obvious as railways


    and

    Quoted message said:

    hydro schemes.

    Yes, indeed. I shan't dispute that.

    Quoted message said:

    >
    >How many of us have used the various ski centre car parks?

    A problem with providing access is of course that people will use


    it,

    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:

    in

    Quoted message said:

    part because they want to get beyond developments like car parks.


    Where

    Quoted message said:

    the concrete ends the wild begins.

    Cairn Gorm is, I think, the only ski centre car park that isn't on


    or

    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:

    near a main road.

    Aonach Mor is another, although it doesn't get you the height you may
    be after.

    Cairn Gorm is much further from a main road than Aonach Mor. It's a


    long

    Quoted message said:

    way from Coire Cas to Aviemore :-)

    Quoted message said:


    Quoted message said:


    While it's there I'll use it occasionally because I don't want to


    walk

    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:

    up next to or in sight of it or start a walk that then goes through


    the

    Quoted message said:

    ski resort. Ideally I'd like to see the whole resort dismantled and


    the

    Quoted message said:

    road end brought down to Glenmore. I'm not expecting that to happen
    though :-)

    Not a chance. Unless, of course, the ski centre becomes economically
    unviable. Which is not as unlikely as it may seem.


    The ski centre hasn't been economically viable for many years, which


    is

    Quoted message said:

    one reason the funicular was built - to attract summer visitors.
    Financially it doesn't seem to be working - surprise, surprise. The


    only

    Quoted message said:

    independent study done before the funicular was built said it wasn't
    financially viable. The financial study done by Highlands and Island
    Enterprise has never been published "for confidential reasons".

    Reminds me of the openness in government report which also remains
    unpublished (officially).

    Quoted message said:


    The private sector certainly didn't believe it was viable. There's not


    a

    Quoted message said:

    penny of private money invested in it. The whole £17 million came from
    the public purse.

    This is not unusual in the Highlands.

    --
    Adrian

  16. In message <[email hidden]>, Adrian Tupper
    <[email hidden]> writes

    Quoted message said:

    Chris Townsend <[email hidden]> wrote in news:q
    [email hidden]:

    Quoted message said:

    In message <[email hidden]>, Adrian Tupper
    <[email hidden]> writes

    Quoted message said:

    Chris Townsend <[email hidden]> wrote in
    news:[email hidden]:

    > Most of the damage to the Highlands lies in deforestation, over
    grazing
    > and bulldozed roads, which aren't as immediately obvious as railways
    and
    > hydro schemes.

    Yes, indeed. I shan't dispute that.

    >>
    >>How many of us have used the various ski centre car parks?
    >
    > A problem with providing access is of course that people will use


    it,

    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:

    in
    > part because they want to get beyond developments like car parks.
    Where
    > the concrete ends the wild begins.
    >
    > Cairn Gorm is, I think, the only ski centre car park that isn't on


    or

    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:

    > near a main road.

    Aonach Mor is another, although it doesn't get you the height you may
    be after.

    Cairn Gorm is much further from a main road than Aonach Mor. It's a


    long

    Quoted message said:

    way from Coire Cas to Aviemore :-)

    Quoted message said:


    >
    > While it's there I'll use it occasionally because I don't want to


    walk

    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:

    > up next to or in sight of it or start a walk that then goes through
    the
    > ski resort. Ideally I'd like to see the whole resort dismantled and
    the
    > road end brought down to Glenmore. I'm not expecting that to happen
    > though :-)

    Not a chance. Unless, of course, the ski centre becomes economically
    unviable. Which is not as unlikely as it may seem.


    The ski centre hasn't been economically viable for many years, which


    is

    Quoted message said:

    one reason the funicular was built - to attract summer visitors.
    Financially it doesn't seem to be working - surprise, surprise. The


    only

    Quoted message said:

    independent study done before the funicular was built said it wasn't
    financially viable. The financial study done by Highlands and Island
    Enterprise has never been published "for confidential reasons".

    Reminds me of the openness in government report which also remains
    unpublished (officially).

    "Open" and "government" don't really go together.

    Quoted message said:


    Quoted message said:


    The private sector certainly didn't believe it was viable. There's not


    a

    Quoted message said:

    penny of private money invested in it. The whole £17 million came from
    the public purse.

    This is not unusual in the Highlands.


    It is for a tourist attraction.

    Highland Council loaned £1 million to the funicular development. A few
    months ago Cairn Gorm Mountain wanted this changed to a grant so it
    didn't appear on their books. However councillors outside Strathspey
    were starting to wonder just what benefit their areas were getting from
    the funicular and queried turning it into a grant. It was referred for
    debate sometime in the future.

    Ski areas like Glen Shee and Glen Coe haven't received public money, and
    both closed down last year. Everything went into the funicular, which
    was touted as being good for tourism throughout the Highlands.
    --
    Chris

    http://www.auchnarrow.demon.co.uk

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