Aternative/noseless saddles?

Darrell Criswell said:

What are the disadvantages to saddles without a nose?

Nothing there to support you if you slip/sit forwards; less there to "find" when you go to sit down;
nothing there to press against to control the bike when standing and leaning; wider rear of saddle
may obstruct legs.

A noseless saddle could only possibly work on the most upright of bicycles if at all.

~PB

Darrell, in th eworld of tandems there is a difference for the stoker with a no nose seat.

I rode a tandem as a captain for a lady that was on a tandem with a soft ride stoker beam. When her
husband rode with his saddle that only had a pad for each cheek, she stated that she felt like the
bike was doind a lot of side to side motion. When I rode it with my saddle, she said that the bike
felt like it was going straight down the road or trail.

Since I rode the tandem with her on the beam they have changed to a saddle for him with a cutout in
the middle of the nose designed for men. She has stated that the bike rides straight now instead of
her feeling like she was riding on the tail of a big dog as it wagged it's tail.

In addition, before they changed the captains seat the bolt at the front end of the softride beam
broke several times. Since the change it has not broken and they are just using the standard bolt
supplied from softride to keep the beam in place.

It would seem that the nose of the saddle helps to keep the bike from waving side to side as the
riders legs keep the saddle from moving side to side under the riders butt. It would really help
when the rider stands up and keeps their legs on either side of the seats nose.

Hoefully this is some information that you can use. Your mileage may vary as in everything
else though.

Al Butler ka0ies

Quoted message said:

Does anyone have any experience with alternative saddles which do not have a nose like the
Hobson saddle?

First off let me say that I'm a die-hard Brooks fan and won't ride any other saddle. If you haven't
tried a Brooks you can't definitively say that a standard cycling saddle won't work for you.

On the noseless saddle thing; the easy seat has been around for a long time:
beachcomber.comeasyseat.htmlOpen ↗

I also have vague recollections of a home made sling seat that was comprised of a pair of drop
handlebars flipped up so the drops were on top and mounted where the seat would be. Lawn chair
webbing or something similar stretched across the drops formed the seat. This was pre-internet so
I'm assuming that I saw it in one cycling rag or another. The guy who built it swore it was the
greatest thing since friction shifters on the down tube... Anyone else remember this?

On Fri, 19 Dec 2003 03:05:41 GMT, Darrell Criswell

may have said:

Does anyone have any experience with alternative saddles which do not have a nose like the
Hobson saddle?

It seems most discomfort comes from the pressure the saddle exerts in the perineal region. I do not
have any pain from regular saddles I am seeking something more comfortable and that does not exert
pressure in the perineal area.

What are the disadvantages to saddles without a nose?

In my case, sitting down becomes a much less certain process, such as after rising to cross a bump,
among others. Also, it's much more difficult to effectively control the bike when standing; I was
surprised by how much I use my legs against the nose of the saddle as a way of staying centered,
staying on the pedals, and keeping the bike on track with me *over* it. There may be a good use for
noseless saddles, but I have concluded that for me, a conventional bike isn't one of them.

--
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Yes, I have a killfile. If I don't respond to something,
it's also possible that I'm busy.
Words processed in a facility that contains nuts.

RE/

Quoted message said:

Does anyone have any experience with alternative saddles which do not have a nose like the
Hobson saddle?

I've tried three or four of them.

Worthless IMHO.

Major loss of control, since you can steady the frame against a thigh.

My bet would be that you have a saddle angle issue. Try a micro-adjustable (the kind with two bolts
- continuously adjustable) post. I find a quarter turn makes a diff and a full turn of an adjusting
screw can cross the line from comfort to major discomfort.
--
PeteCresswell

"Robert Canon" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:<[email hidden]>... <snip>

Quoted message said:

I also have vague recollections of a home made sling seat that was comprised of a pair of drop
handlebars flipped up so the drops were on top and mounted where the seat would be. Lawn chair
webbing or something similar stretched across the drops formed the seat. This was pre-internet so
I'm assuming that I saw it in one cycling rag or another. The guy who built it swore it was the
greatest thing since friction shifters on the down tube... Anyone else remember this?

Jim Langley does: jimlangley.netfaq.htmlOpen ↗ More on the history of bike seats:
jimlangley.netbicycleseats.htmlOpen ↗

Jeff

Robert Canon said:

I also have vague recollections of a home made sling seat that was

comprised

Quoted message said:

of a pair of drop handlebars flipped up so the drops were on top and mounted where the seat
would be. Lawn chair webbing or something similar stretched across the drops formed the seat.
This was pre-internet so I'm assuming that I saw it in one cycling rag or another. The guy who
built it swore it was the greatest thing since friction shifters on the down tube... Anyone else
remember this?

Yep. That was the invention of Captain Dan Henry, who also built the first recumbent I'd ever heard
of. He was also the guy who invented the idea of road markings for organized century rides. Some
people still call them Dan Henry arrows.

Very interesting guy!

His saddle _may_ have been better than the noseless, two-pad models, since the bars supporting the
sling were at the outsides of your butt. That could allow some side-to-side connection to the bike,
for better control and body english. I don't know for sure - I never tried one.

The two-pad noseless saddle I briefly tried was dismal. Very unsteady feeling, and not particularly
comfortable on my butt, either.

--
Frank Krygowski [To reply, omit what's between "at" and "cc"]

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Does anyone have any experience with alternative saddles which do not have a nose like the
Hobson saddle?

Robert Canon said:

First off let me say that I'm a die-hard Brooks fan and won't ride any other saddle. If you
haven't tried a Brooks you can't definitively say that a standard cycling saddle won't work
for you.

On the noseless saddle thing; the easy seat has been around for a long time:
beachcomber.comeasyseat.htmlOpen ↗

I also have vague recollections of a home made sling seat that was comprised of a pair of drop
handlebars flipped up so the drops were on top and mounted where the seat would be. Lawn chair
webbing or something similar stretched across the drops formed the seat. This was pre-internet so
I'm assuming that I saw it in one cycling rag or another. The guy who built it swore it was the
greatest thing since friction shifters on the down tube... Anyone else remember this?

Yes, you refer to Capt. Dan Henry with the handlebar and lawnchair webbing seat.

Noseless saddles ( and cutout saddles,etc) are duly noted in Sharp's book of a hundred plus
years ago.

We sell such a thing. I am amazed that even with a liberal return policy we get few back. I found it
just annoying.
--
Andrew Muzi www.yellowjersey.org Open every day since 1 April, 1971

Quoted message said:

Yes, you refer to Capt. Dan Henry with the handlebar and lawnchair webbing seat.

Noseless saddles ( and cutout saddles,etc) are duly noted in Sharp's book of a hundred plus
years ago.

We sell such a thing. I am amazed that even with a liberal return policy we get few back. I found
it just annoying.

Are they called "hygiene saddles" in English, too? I actually got to try one of these out on my
touring bike. It wasn't too bad at all. I guess that unless I'm trying to render my netherregions
useless, I sit on nothing more than what one of these saddles provide.

I agree with Pete. A micro adjustable seat post will help you balance your upper body weight against
the saddle and steady your arm force against the handle bars.

You see, the saddle should sort of throw you forward _a little_ onto the handlebars. That is, its
nose should be down a bit. But that throwing force must be consistent with what your arms and hand
like. Padded gloves can make a big difference in perineal comfort by allowing you to lean forward.

You must be aware of your pelvic bones and conciously reposition them so they contact the "give".
Then you adjust handlebars, stem, seat post, and saddle position (both fore-aft and tilt) so this
repositioning becomes least frequent.

The "cubit test" is a good check:

Rest your elbow against the saddle nose. Your fingertips should just brush the handlbar.

This varies somewhat with the length of your saddle nose.

I had wrist and palm aches and perineal pain until I got padded gloves, soft rubber grips, and
adjusted my saddle. I'm still adjusting it and am trying a new stem soon.

You really have to _learn_ to sit on that "give" point on the saddle. When you're on it, you can't
help but have a comfortable behind. Stay on it, and adjust everything else to keep you on it with
least effort.

It's like proper posture, you have to force yourself or at least remind yourself to sit on the
proper point. Once there, you grow into it. Like sitting up straight while typing. And how many of
us do that?

My senior project at ODU: Google Groups, then "dgoncz" and some of: ultracapacitor bicycle
fluorescent flywheel inverter Equipped with BoBike Mini removable child seat, too!

I have had the Hobson seat for several months now.

I used to suffer from numbness and some discomfort both during and after riding.

Having given this some thought and doing some reading on the internet it struck me that on a conventional saddle you appear to be putting a lot of weight on an area of the body which was probably not best designed to take that type of weight for long periods (my basic observations only I am no doctor)

Anyway after some research I decided to order the Hobson seat.

At first I was far from impressed as it felt strange and I did not see an immediate improvement in comfort.

However after a few weeks I went on a 25 mile 2 hour ride which had in the past caused me some discomfort and realised that I no longer felt this discomfort.

I now find a conventional saddle quite uncomfortable and and am ordering another for my second bike.

I accept it may not be for everyone and I do feel a little bit of control is lost compared with a conventional saddle but once I got used to this I find the Hobson so much more comfortable.

RE/

Quoted message said:

At first I was far from impressed as it felt strange and I did not see an immediate improvement
in comfort.

However after a few weeks I went on a 25 mile 2 hour ride which had in the past caused me some
discomfort and realised that I no longer felt this discomfort.

Don't the bottoms of your thighs hit on the front parts of the seat?

The one that's hanging on my garage wall doesn't articulate enough to prevent that.
--
PeteCresswell

Quoted post said:

Originally posted by x
RE/

Quoted message said:

At first I was far from impressed as it felt strange and I did not see an immediate improvement
in comfort.

However after a few weeks I went on a 25 mile 2 hour ride which had in the past caused me some
discomfort and realised that I no longer felt this discomfort.

Don't the bottoms of your thighs hit on the front parts of the seat?

The one that's hanging on my garage wall doesn't articulate enough to prevent that.
--
PeteCresswell

HI Pete

wow reading my post makes me sound like I am on the Hobson payroll which I can assure you I'm not infact I have to pay $20 to have the seat imported as I am in the uk.

Anyway the point you raise all I can say is that for the first 100 miles or so the seat did feel very strange and I do remember my thighs feeling like they were more in contact with the saddle than on my old saddle plus I did have to spend ages getting the angle and the gap right (I ride with the gap close to the minimum)

I also felt like I was using slightly different muscles as my position was different but after a while it started to feel normal.

I feel a lot of people give up with it because it does feel so strange to start with but FOR ME it has definitely been worth staying with but as I said before it may not be for everyone.

I would point out that before I was finding a traditional saddle was causing me quite a lot of discomfort so maybe I have already done some damage in that area previously (I used to go on 100 mile plus day rides)

The main thing I like about it is I feel like my weight is going on your "sit" bones rather than the part in the middle which I find more sensitive.

Tim

RE/

Quoted message said:

The main thing I like about it is I feel like my weight is going on your "sit" bones rather than
the part in the middle which I find more sensitive.

Speaking as a self-described "statistical outlier" pelvic-bone-wise, I can commiserate.

Mine (measured via the famous "sit-on-styrofoam-then-measure-the-dents" test are about 5" center-to-
center. On the Brooks B-17's that I'm currently using, that puts the centers right out at the edge
of the saddle so the outside rear portions of the bones are pressing against the outer rivits on the
back of the saddle and the forward parts of the bones are sort of hanging off the edge.

Ever measured the distance between yours?

--
PeteCresswell