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Armstrong v. Simeoni

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Road Cycling
Published
23 July 2004
Last activity
29 July 2004
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PeterL
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  1. Quoted from the SF Chronicle:

    Armstrong, his rivals thoroughly beaten, was so relaxed he even had time
    during the 103.2-mile stage to tend to a little personal animosity with an
    Italian rider who has taken legal action against him.

    Even though Filippo Simeoni represents no threat to Armstrong's imminent
    Tour victory, the five-time champion appeared determined not to let the
    Italian get ahead.

    Armstrong, in a highly unusually move for a rider who is generally extremely
    careful, at one point surged off with Simeoni in pursuit of Mercado's escape
    group. They caught that group, stayed with them for a few minutes, and then
    suddenly eased up and waited for the trailing pack to catch up.

    "It was bizarre, really strange," Mercado said.

    It was not immediately clear what prompted Armstrong to act as he did. But
    an official from Armstrong's team suggested the champion's motives were
    personal.

    Simeoni, an Italian with the Domina Vacanze squad, has testified against
    controversial sports doctor Michele Ferrari, with whom Armstrong has ties.
    Ferrari faces accusations of providing performance-enhancing substances to
    riders.

    "It surely had something to do with what has happened," said Johan Bruyneel,
    sports manager of Armstrong's team. "Nobody was expecting it, and it wasn't
    planned, either."

    Simeoni told an Italian court in 2002 that Ferrari advised him to take
    performance enhancers.

    Armstrong was cryptic is explaining his motives for chasing Simeoni.

    "I was protecting the interests of the peloton," he said, referring to the
    main pack. "Other riders were very, very thankful."

    Sebastien Joly, a French rider who was in the escape group, said: "I think
    it was a reaction of pride on Armstrong's part."

    The escape riders knew that their chances of winning the stage were nil
    while Armstrong was with them. So they asked Simeoni to leave, Joly
    explained.

    "When he let go, Lance had the kindness to do the same thing," he said.

  2. "PeterL" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
    news:[email hidden]...

    Quoted message said:

    Quoted from the SF Chronicle:

    Quoted message said:

    "I was protecting the interests of the peloton," he said, referring to


    the

    Quoted message said:

    main pack. "Other riders were very, very thankful."

    Lance Armstrong is a funny guy.

    Jiyang Chen

  3. Aren't we all .....
    "Jiyang Chen" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
    news:[email hidden]...

    Quoted message said:


    "PeterL" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
    news:[email hidden]...

    Quoted message said:

    Quoted from the SF Chronicle:

    Quoted message said:

    "I was protecting the interests of the peloton," he said, referring to


    the

    Quoted message said:

    main pack. "Other riders were very, very thankful."

    Lance Armstrong is a funny guy.

    Jiyang Chen

  4. How does that go now?

    "Don't tug on superman's cape."

    PeterL said:

    Quoted from the SF Chronicle:

    Armstrong, his rivals thoroughly beaten, was so relaxed he even had time
    during the 103.2-mile stage to tend to a little personal animosity with an
    Italian rider who has taken legal action against him.

    Even though Filippo Simeoni represents no threat to Armstrong's imminent
    Tour victory, the five-time champion appeared determined not to let the
    Italian get ahead.

    Armstrong, in a highly unusually move for a rider who is generally extremely
    careful, at one point surged off with Simeoni in pursuit of Mercado's escape
    group. They caught that group, stayed with them for a few minutes, and then
    suddenly eased up and waited for the trailing pack to catch up.

    "It was bizarre, really strange," Mercado said.

    It was not immediately clear what prompted Armstrong to act as he did. But
    an official from Armstrong's team suggested the champion's motives were
    personal.

    Simeoni, an Italian with the Domina Vacanze squad, has testified against
    controversial sports doctor Michele Ferrari, with whom Armstrong has ties.
    Ferrari faces accusations of providing performance-enhancing substances to
    riders.

    "It surely had something to do with what has happened," said Johan Bruyneel,
    sports manager of Armstrong's team. "Nobody was expecting it, and it wasn't
    planned, either."

    Simeoni told an Italian court in 2002 that Ferrari advised him to take
    performance enhancers.

    Armstrong was cryptic is explaining his motives for chasing Simeoni.

    "I was protecting the interests of the peloton," he said, referring to the
    main pack. "Other riders were very, very thankful."

    Sebastien Joly, a French rider who was in the escape group, said: "I think
    it was a reaction of pride on Armstrong's part."

    The escape riders knew that their chances of winning the stage were nil
    while Armstrong was with them. So they asked Simeoni to leave, Joly
    explained.

    "When he let go, Lance had the kindness to do the same thing," he said.

  5. Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:

    "PeterL" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
    news:[email hidden]...

    Quoted message said:

    Quoted from the SF Chronicle:

    Quoted message said:

    "I was protecting the interests of the peloton," he said, referring to


    the main pack. "Other riders were very, very thankful."

    Uncharacteristically ungentlemanly behavior for normally chivalrous Lance,
    although no one appreciates being sued. But perhaps all the circumstantial
    evidence (not to mention testimony) re doping is starting to gather
    momentum, and LA is getting worried. Why would the riders of the peloton
    be so grateful, after all, unless most had something to lose from doping
    revelations? They can't all care that much about the lawsuit for its own
    sake...

    Admittedly, this is just more pissing in the wind (like most of what
    passes here for insight) -- but eventually the chickens may come home to
    roost... and one of them might just peck LA when it arrives. Ouch!

    -AMG

  6. "Jiyang Chen" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
    news:[email hidden]...

    Quoted message said:


    "PeterL" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
    news:[email hidden]...

    Quoted message said:

    Quoted from the SF Chronicle:

    Quoted message said:

    "I was protecting the interests of the peloton," he said, referring to


    the

    Quoted message said:

    main pack. "Other riders were very, very thankful."

    Revealing words. Simeoni has broken the law of silence and to prevent others
    had to be punished. First by the UCI and now by the boss of the peloton. If
    all the test in the Tour hadn't been positive - so it's proven they are all
    clean - scandalmongers would say it's rather suspicious.

    Benjo Maso

  7. AMG said:

    Uncharacteristically ungentlemanly behavior for normally chivalrous Lance,
    although no one appreciates being sued. But perhaps all the circumstantial
    evidence (not to mention testimony) re doping is starting to gather
    momentum, and LA is getting worried. Why would the riders of the peloton
    be so grateful, after all, unless most had something to lose from doping
    revelations? They can't all care that much about the lawsuit for its own
    sake...

    Admittedly, this is just more pissing in the wind (like most of what
    passes here for insight) -- but eventually the chickens may come home to
    roost... and one of them might just peck LA when it arrives. Ouch!

    First, what other rider has said that he was thankful for what Armstrong
    did? First hand, please.
    Second, I really can't get it in my head that - if your theory
    concerning doping in the field was true - that anybody would think it is
    a good idea to bully/mob a whistleblower in front of so many people.
    You'd expect something like that to happen when that chap is alone in
    the dark - I'm envisioning something like that towel scene in full metal
    jacket in a hotel. I'd be interested to hear the opinion of a guy like
    Jens Voigt on the whole affair.

  8. Hank Sniadoch said:

    Aren't we all .....

    Ya think?

    Quoted message said:

    "Jiyang Chen" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
    news:[email hidden]...

    Quoted message said:


    "PeterL" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
    news:[email hidden]...

    Quoted message said:

    Quoted from the SF Chronicle:

    Quoted message said:

    "I was protecting the interests of the peloton," he said, referring to


    the

    Quoted message said:

    main pack. "Other riders were very, very thankful."

    Lance Armstrong is a funny guy.

    Jiyang Chen

  9. Ernst Noch said:
    AMG said:

    Uncharacteristically ungentlemanly behavior for normally chivalrous
    Lance,
    although no one appreciates being sued. But perhaps all the
    circumstantial
    evidence (not to mention testimony) re doping is starting to gather
    momentum, and LA is getting worried. Why would the riders of the peloton
    be so grateful, after all, unless most had something to lose from doping
    revelations? They can't all care that much about the lawsuit for its own
    sake...

    Admittedly, this is just more pissing in the wind (like most of what
    passes here for insight) -- but eventually the chickens may come home to
    roost... and one of them might just peck LA when it arrives. Ouch!

    First, what other rider has said that he was thankful for what Armstrong
    did? First hand, please.

    We can only hope Jeff & CN can get some candid interviews or, come to
    it, sneak some bugs into riders rooms and get the real lowdown on how
    they felt.

    "That looked suspicious, us letting Der Boss go away after Filippo and
    we not chase him."

    Quoted message said:

    Second, I really can't get it in my head that - if your theory
    concerning doping in the field was true - that anybody would think it is
    a good idea to bully/mob a whistleblower in front of so many people.
    You'd expect something like that to happen when that chap is alone in
    the dark - I'm envisioning something like that towel scene in full metal
    jacket in a hotel. I'd be interested to hear the opinion of a guy like
    Jens Voigt on the whole affair.

    "Affair? What you say? You mean to say, LANCE escaped?!? We are all so
    tired, we did not notice it! Is good Filippo bring him back!"

  10. "AMG" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
    news:[email hidden]...

    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:

    "PeterL" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
    news:[email hidden]...
    > Quoted from the SF Chronicle:

    > "I was protecting the interests of the peloton," he said, referring


    to

    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:

    the main pack. "Other riders were very, very thankful."

    Uncharacteristically ungentlemanly behavior for normally chivalrous Lance,
    although no one appreciates being sued. But perhaps all the circumstantial
    evidence (not to mention testimony) re doping is starting to gather
    momentum, and LA is getting worried. Why would the riders of the peloton
    be so grateful, after all, unless most had something to lose from doping
    revelations? They can't all care that much about the lawsuit for its own
    sake...

    Alternative explanation: most has something to lose from doping
    **allegations**. Everyone loses when someone claims that the sport is
    dirty.

    Quoted message said:

    Admittedly, this is just more pissing in the wind (like most of what
    passes here for insight) -- but eventually the chickens may come home to
    roost... and one of them might just peck LA when it arrives. Ouch!

    -AMG

  11. benjo maso said:

    "Jiyang Chen" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
    news:[email hidden]...

    Quoted message said:

    "PeterL" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
    news:[email hidden]...

    Quoted message said:

    Quoted from the SF Chronicle:

    Quoted message said:

    "I was protecting the interests of the peloton," he said, referring to

    the

    Quoted message said:

    main pack. "Other riders were very, very thankful."


    Revealing words. Simeoni has broken the law of silence and to prevent others
    had to be punished. First by the UCI and now by the boss of the peloton. If
    all the test in the Tour hadn't been positive - so it's proven they are all
    clean - scandalmongers would say it's rather suspicious.

    Benjo Maso

    The appearance to me is that Lance is the friend to the dopers, and
    whistleblowers will be treated as, well, whistleblowers.
    This will convince no one that Lance is clean. And putting his petty
    antagonisms in the way of other riders on the road is a black mark on
    his usual high ethical standard.

    Steve

    Quoted message said:


  12. I thought there would be support for Armstrong here, but I'm glad some others agree with me on this. It does seem very strange that LA actually came out and said that he did it for the good of the peleton.

    To me that sounds like all the other chumps who ostracize anyone who speaks out against doping. It always seemed to me that any riders who don't strongly denounce doping and crusade to eliminate it are probably doing it.

    Tafi, for instance, refused to protest on behalf of the riders because he's willing to tolerate inconvenieces in order to end doping.

  13. PeterL said:

    "AMG" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
    news:[email hidden]...

    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:

    >"PeterL" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
    >news:[email hidden]...
    >
    >>Quoted from the SF Chronicle:
    >
    >>"I was protecting the interests of the peloton," he said, referring

    to

    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:

    >the main pack. "Other riders were very, very thankful."
    >

    Uncharacteristically ungentlemanly behavior for normally chivalrous Lance,
    although no one appreciates being sued. But perhaps all the circumstantial
    evidence (not to mention testimony) re doping is starting to gather
    momentum, and LA is getting worried. Why would the riders of the peloton
    be so grateful, after all, unless most had something to lose from doping
    revelations? They can't all care that much about the lawsuit for its own
    sake...

    Alternative explanation: most has something to lose from doping
    **allegations**. Everyone loses when someone claims that the sport is
    dirty.

    PARIS AFP- The entire Tour de France peloton, excepting the members of a
    6 man break away and Filippo Simeoni, were placed under formal
    investigation after race leader Lance Armstrong chased down Simeoni as
    he joined the 6 man break. After Armstrong threatened the break if
    Simeoni did not return to the peloton, break members washed their hands
    of Simeoni and left him to the custody of Armstrong. Jean-Marie LeBlanc
    said he had no choice in the matter and suspended all but the seven
    riders for the remainder of the race.

  14. "jws" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
    news:[email hidden]...

    Quoted message said:


    I thought there would be support for Armstrong here, but I'm glad some
    others agree with me on this. It does seem very strange that LA
    actually came out and said that he did it for the good of the peleton.

    To me that sounds like all the other chumps who ostracize anyone who
    speaks out against doping. It always seemed to me that any riders who
    don't strongly denounce doping and crusade to eliminate it are probably
    doing it.

    It's not speaking out against doping. It's alleging that doping occurs.

    Quoted message said:

    Tafi, for instance, refused to protest on behalf of the riders
    because he's willing to tolerate inconvenieces in order to end doping.

    --
    jws

  15. Ernst Noch said:

    Second, I really can't get it in my head that - if your theory
    concerning doping in the field was true - that anybody would think it is
    a good idea to bully/mob a whistleblower in front of so many people.

    If someone was suing me and they were in the wrong, I would do my best
    to have some sort of revenge on them. I think that's understandable.

    JT

  16. Hank Sniadoch said:

    Aren't we all .....
    "Jiyang Chen" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
    news:[email hidden]...

    Quoted message said:


    "PeterL" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
    news:[email hidden]...

    Quoted message said:

    Quoted from the SF Chronicle:

    Quoted message said:

    "I was protecting the interests of the peloton," he said, referring to


    the

    Quoted message said:

    main pack. "Other riders were very, very thankful."

    Lance Armstrong is a funny guy.

    Yes, Funny Peculiar, Not Funny Ha-Ha

  17. On Fri, 23 Jul 2004 14:56:33 -0700, "PeterL" <[email hidden]>

    Quoted message said:


    Alternative explanation: most has something to lose from doping
    **allegations**. Everyone loses when someone claims that the sport is
    dirty.

    If it is dirty, then in the long run it helps to make such claims.

    JT

  18. "John Forrest Tomlinson" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
    news:[email hidden]...

    Quoted message said:

    On Fri, 23 Jul 2004 14:56:33 -0700, "PeterL" <[email hidden]>

    Quoted message said:


    Alternative explanation: most has something to lose from doping
    **allegations**. Everyone loses when someone claims that the sport is
    dirty.

    If it is dirty, then in the long run it helps to make such claims.

    And if it's not, then in the long and short run it hurts the sport.

    Quoted message said:

    JT

  19. "Ernst Noch" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
    news:[email hidden]...

    Quoted message said:


    I really can't get it in my head that - if your theory
    concerning doping in the field was true - that anybody would think it is
    a good idea to bully/mob a whistleblower in front of so many people.

    Well, it is certainly a good thing that you read Simeoni's comments before
    you posted something really dumb.

    Here's a clue, Armstrong and the peloton aren't some German fans spitting at
    Armstrong or screaming curses at Voigt for going his job. Armstrong used the
    full weight of his reputation to embarass both Simeoni and Domina-Vacanze.
    Mission accomplished.

    What would lead you to make stupid, poorly veiled, remarks as if anyone
    would want to beat the guy up like some mafioso? Would you think that what
    happened today was more than sufficient to impact Simeoni's career?

  20. In the end, it doesnt mean anything one way or the other, with regards
    to doping issues. BUT, it certainly makes me raise an eyebrow. Very weird.

    AMG said:
    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:

    "PeterL" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
    news:[email hidden]...

    >Quoted from the SF Chronicle:

    >"I was protecting the interests of the peloton," he said, referring to

    the main pack. "Other riders were very, very thankful."

    Uncharacteristically ungentlemanly behavior for normally chivalrous Lance,
    although no one appreciates being sued. But perhaps all the circumstantial
    evidence (not to mention testimony) re doping is starting to gather
    momentum, and LA is getting worried. Why would the riders of the peloton
    be so grateful, after all, unless most had something to lose from doping
    revelations? They can't all care that much about the lawsuit for its own
    sake...

    Admittedly, this is just more pissing in the wind (like most of what
    passes here for insight) -- but eventually the chickens may come home to
    roost... and one of them might just peck LA when it arrives. Ouch!

    -AMG

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