Are Viking bikes good?

blackhead writtificated

Quoted message said:

I'm thinking of buying either the Viking Vittoria for £359 or the
Claud Butler Melano for £389. But which is the best value for money?

Don't touch the Viking - overpriced [censored]. That it is cheap and /still/
overpriced lets you know how [censored] it is.

The Claud Butler looks like it might be okay, but the 'carbon' forks make
me suspicious.

Go here <www.edinburghbicycle.com> and have a looksie at the Revolution
Continental 08 [1]. It's a good, no nonsense bike with a lifetime warranty
on the frame and EBC has excellent customer service. Space for proper
mudguards if you want 'em too. No carbon forks, but it's alloy ones are
lighter than the heavy lump of poo on the Viking - no carbon fork has ever
listed a hi-ten steel steerer as a selling point.[2]

I'd recommend good 10 minute test ride before you slap hundreds of pounds
down on a bike.

[1] This might take you straight to it:
<www.edinburghbicycle.com/ebwPNLqrymode.a4p?f%5FProductID=9447&f>

[2] Cheap, light, strong. Pick any two. Unless it's hi-ten steel. That's
just cheap. And flexible. And heavy. And utterly out of place on a
'carbon' fork. Which is probably just a normal heavy fork with a carbon
wrap.

blackhead said the following on 28/03/2008 13:13:

Quoted message said:

I'm thinking of buying either the Viking Vittoria for £359 or the
Claud Butler Melano for £389. But which is the best value for money?

<http://corporate.marketworks.com/storefrontprofiles/
DeluxeSFItemDetail.aspx?sid=1&sfid=101713&c=40001226&i=64350776>

Frankly, based purely on the spec I would say the Viking bike is
horrendously overpriced.

Quoted message said:

Model Type :Alloy Road
Frame Construction :6061 Aluminium mainframe with replaceable gear
hanger
Forks :Steel steerer Carbon Blades
Frame Size :56cm (22"😉.
Wheel Size :700 with 23c Kenda Tyres
Gear System : 21 speed Shimano gears STI button shifters. With a
52/42/32 tooth Pro-wheel Chainset combined with a 13/26 cassette.
Shimano Sora front & rear derailleurs.
Wheel Specification :Weinmann XR18 deep section alloy rims & Quando
cassette hubs with quick release levers
Brakes :Shimano STI levers with Tektro R556 Alloy Dual Pivot Side
Brakes.
Handlebar and Stem :11cm Aheadset Stem & 42cm Anatomic drop bars
Additional :Alloy Micro adjust seatpost, Viking Racing saddle , Alloy
Cranks with cartridge bottom bracket system, Integrated Cartridge
aheadset system.
Frame Colour :Gloss Black
Fork Colour :Carbon
Cycle Condition :Brand New sealed in Box. This Bike comes 90% Built,
Fitting of pedals, stem/bars, front wheel, front brake cable & seat.
Gears & brakes also require some adjustment.

--
Paul Boyd
http://www.paul-boyd.co.uk/

blackhead said:

I'm thinking of buying either the Viking Vittoria for £359 or the
Claud Butler Melano for £389. But which is the best value for money?

<http://corporate.marketworks.com/storefrontprofiles/
DeluxeSFItemDetail.aspx?sid=1&sfid=101713&c=40001226&i=64350776>

Quoted message said:

<http://www.bikes2udirect.com/B2090.html?id=hvcgDKy5>

Of those two, Claud Butler every time. I have never heard of Viking.
CB has (or, at least, used to have: I've not heard anything to the
contrary) a good reputation.

Somehow the Viking looks misshapen at the front, too. It's just...
wrong, somehow.

PhilD

--
<><

PhilD said:

I have never heard of Viking.

They are more famous for selling 99 quid bike shaped
objects.

I agree with everyone else that this looks very
overpriced fro what it is.

Arthur

--
Arthur Clune PGP/GPG Key: http://www.clune.org/pubkey.txt
The struggle of people against power is the struggle
of memory against forgetting - Milan Kundera

Mark T said:

blackhead writtificated

Quoted message said:

I'm thinking of buying either the Viking Vittoria for £359 or the
Claud Butler Melano for £389. But which is the best value for money?

Don't touch the Viking - overpriced [censored]. That it is cheap and /still/
overpriced lets you know how [censored] it is.

The Claud Butler looks like it might be okay, but the 'carbon' forks make
me suspicious.

You're right about Viking, wrong (in my opinion) about Claud Butler. I've
seen a number of these - they are good value for the price (although in my
opinion if you can afford it you'll get better value by spending a bit
more).

Quoted message said:

Go here <www.edinburghbicycle.com> and have a looksie at the Revolution
Continental 08 [1]. It's a good, no nonsense bike with a lifetime
warranty
on the frame and EBC has excellent customer service.

Agreed.

Quoted message said:

I'd recommend good 10 minute test ride before you slap hundreds of pounds
down on a bike.

Absolutely.

--
[email hidden] (Simon Brooke) http://www.jasmine.org.uk/~simon/
Windows 95:
You, you, you! You make a grown man cry...
M. Jagger/K. Richards

On 28 Mar, 14:10, Mark T
<pleasegivegenerously@warmail*turn_up_the_heat_to_reply*.com.invalid>

Quoted message said:

blackhead writtificated

Quoted message said:

I'm thinking of buying either the Viking Vittoria for £359 or the
Claud Butler Melano for £389. But which is the best value for money?

Don't touch the Viking - overpriced [censored].  That it is cheap and /still/
overpriced lets you know how [censored] it is.

The Claud Butler looks like it might be okay, but the 'carbon' forks make
me suspicious.

Go here <www.edinburghbicycle.com> and have a looksie at the Revolution
Continental 08 [1].  It's a good, no nonsense bike with a lifetime warranty
on the frame and EBC has excellent customer service.

Yes, went in there today and they do come across as a classy setup
with good, helpful staff.

Quoted message said:

Space for proper
mudguards if you want 'em too.  No carbon forks, but it's alloy ones are
lighter than the heavy lump of poo on the Viking - no carbon fork has ever
listed a hi-ten steel steerer as a selling point.[2]

I'd recommend good 10 minute test ride before you slap hundreds of pounds
down on a bike.

[1] This might take you straight to it:
<www.edinburghbicycle.com/ebwPNLqrymode.a4p?f%5FProductID=9447&f>

[2] Cheap, light, strong.  Pick any two.  Unless it's hi-ten steel.  That's
just cheap.  And flexible.  And heavy.  And utterly out of place on a
'carbon' fork.  Which is probably just a normal heavy fork with a carbon
wrap.

Colin MacDonald last week suggested :

"EBC own-brand stuff is generally reasonable value, but you get what
you pay for. The Continental, for example, has pretty low-spec
components but that's why it is £350. If you're happy with that,
Chain Reaction are doing last year's BeOne Briza 2.0 (no, I'm not on
commission) for £250 and it has a more or less identical spec. For
£350 the Storm 3.0 has Sora kit rather than 2200 as well as carbon
forks."

So I'm swayed in two directions by the BeOne Briza 2.0 or the Storm
3.0. Are carbon forks and Sora kit worth an extra £100 over alloy
forks and shimano 2200 for someone that wants an enjoyable 10 mile
bike ride over the weekend and the odd 5 miles during the week?

How much do carbon forks reduce vibration by compared to alloy forks?
Can you really feel the difference or is it just a placebo effect? lol

Thanks for your input, as usual.

Arthur Clune said:

PhilD said:

I have never heard of Viking.

They are more famous for selling 99 quid bike shaped
objects.

I agree with everyone else that this looks very
overpriced fro what it is.

Arthur

lots on ebay, when i was searching for a 2nd bike, allways had to sift
though a ton of them.

roger
--
www.rogermerriman.com

Arthur Clune said:

PhilD said:

I have never heard of Viking.

They are more famous for selling 99 quid bike shaped
objects.

I agree with everyone else that this looks very
overpriced fro what it is.

Arthur

lots on ebay, when i was searching for a 2nd bike, allways had to sift
though a ton of them.

roger
--
www.rogermerriman.com

blackhead said:

How much do carbon forks reduce vibration by compared to alloy forks?

Enough.

Quoted message said:

Can you really feel the difference or is it just a placebo effect? lol

Yes to the difference and no to the placebo, not a laughing matter on a
rough ride.

--
Don Whybrow

Sequi Bonum Non Time

"This seems like a case where we need to shoot the messenger."
(Charlie Kaufman on Cypherpunks list)

(Roger Merriman) said:

Arthur Clune said:

PhilD wrote:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

I have never heard ofViking.

Quoted message said:

They are more famous for selling 99 quid bike shaped
objects.

Quoted message said:

I agree with everyone else that this looks very
overpriced fro what it is.

Quoted message said:

Arthur

lots on ebay, when i was searching for a 2nd bike, allways had to sift
though a ton of them.

roger
--www.rogermerriman.com

No relation, then, to the well-respected Viking machines of the 60's?

blackhead said:

Colin MacDonald last week suggested :

"EBC own-brand stuff is generally reasonable value, but you get what
you pay for. The Continental, for example, has pretty low-spec
components but that's why it is £350. If you're happy with that,
Chain Reaction are doing last year's BeOne Briza 2.0 (no, I'm not on
commission) for £250 and it has a more or less identical spec. For
£350 the Storm 3.0 has Sora kit rather than 2200 as well as carbon
forks."

So I'm swayed in two directions by the BeOne Briza 2.0 or the Storm
3.0. Are carbon forks and Sora kit worth an extra £100 over alloy
forks and shimano 2200 for someone that wants an enjoyable 10 mile
bike ride over the weekend and the odd 5 miles during the week?

How much do carbon forks reduce vibration by compared to alloy forks?

Very significantly. The hierarchy for forks is

* Carbon: least vibration but need to be replaced after a crash
* Steel: middling vibration and don't need to be replaced unless visibly
damaged
* Alloy: very harsh and need to be replaced after a crash

Quoted message said:

Can you really feel the difference or is it just a placebo effect? lol

You can really feel the difference - and after a hundred miles it can be the
difference between having palsy in both hands and not having palsy in both
hands. If you're going to go with alloy forks you either need to get 'grab
on' type foam handlebar covering or not ride long distances.

However, having said that, if you're planning on riding not more than ten
miles a weekend it probably isn't worth the extra.

--
[email hidden] (Simon Brooke) http://www.jasmine.org.uk/~simon/

:: Wisdom is better than weapons of war ::
:: Ecclesiastes 9:18 ::

Walney said:

(Roger Merriman) said:

Arthur Clune said:

PhilD wrote:

Quoted message said:

> I have never heard ofViking.

Quoted message said:

They are more famous for selling 99 quid bike shaped
objects.

Quoted message said:

I agree with everyone else that this looks very
overpriced fro what it is.

Quoted message said:

Arthur

lots on ebay, when i was searching for a 2nd bike, allways had to sift
though a ton of them.

roger
--www.rogermerriman.com

No relation, then, to the well-respected Viking machines of the 60's?

very much dought it.

roger
--
www.rogermerriman.com

Simon Brooke said:

blackhead said:

Colin MacDonald last week suggested :

"EBC own-brand stuff is generally reasonable value, but you get what
you pay for. The Continental, for example, has pretty low-spec
components but that's why it is £350. If you're happy with that,
Chain Reaction are doing last year's BeOne Briza 2.0 (no, I'm not on
commission) for £250 and it has a more or less identical spec. For
£350 the Storm 3.0 has Sora kit rather than 2200 as well as carbon
forks."

So I'm swayed in two directions by the BeOne Briza 2.0 or the Storm
3.0. Are carbon forks and Sora kit worth an extra £100 over alloy
forks and shimano 2200 for someone that wants an enjoyable 10 mile
bike ride over the weekend and the odd 5 miles during the week?

How much do carbon forks reduce vibration by compared to alloy forks?

Very significantly. The hierarchy for forks is

* Carbon: least vibration but need to be replaced after a crash
* Steel: middling vibration and don't need to be replaced unless visibly
damaged
* Alloy: very harsh and need to be replaced after a crash

[censored] forks would be like steel i guess? i was quite suprised as to how
smooth the old steel road bike, that i've recently added to my fleet,
even with 20mm tires.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Can you really feel the difference or is it just a placebo effect? lol

You can really feel the difference - and after a hundred miles it can be the
difference between having palsy in both hands and not having palsy in both
hands. If you're going to go with alloy forks you either need to get 'grab
on' type foam handlebar covering or not ride long distances.

However, having said that, if you're planning on riding not more than ten
miles a weekend it probably isn't worth the extra.

how good is so called gel tape for drops? the old bike's tape is fairly
shafted, while it is fairly comftable to ride, i'd like a bit more
comfort on my hands, as the postion is fairly head down so more weight
is taken on my hands. i have gloves etc.

roger
--
www.rogermerriman.com

Roger Merriman said:

Simon Brooke said:

blackhead said:

Colin MacDonald last week suggested :

"EBC own-brand stuff is generally reasonable value, but you get what
you pay for. The Continental, for example, has pretty low-spec
components but that's why it is £350. If you're happy with that,
Chain Reaction are doing last year's BeOne Briza 2.0 (no, I'm not on
commission) for £250 and it has a more or less identical spec. For
£350 the Storm 3.0 has Sora kit rather than 2200 as well as carbon
forks."

So I'm swayed in two directions by the BeOne Briza 2.0 or the Storm
3.0. Are carbon forks and Sora kit worth an extra £100 over alloy
forks and shimano 2200 for someone that wants an enjoyable 10 mile
bike ride over the weekend and the odd 5 miles during the week?

How much do carbon forks reduce vibration by compared to alloy forks?

Very significantly. The hierarchy for forks is

* Carbon: least vibration but need to be replaced after a crash
* Steel: middling vibration and don't need to be replaced unless visibly
damaged
* Alloy: very harsh and need to be replaced after a crash

[censored] forks would be like steel i guess? i was quite suprised as to how
smooth the old steel road bike, that i've recently added to my fleet,
even with 20mm tires.

I've never ridden a Ti bike, so I wouldn't know. But yes, good steel forks
are remarkably good, and a whole lot better than aluminium.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

You can really feel the difference - and after a hundred miles it can be
the difference between having palsy in both hands and not having palsy in
both hands. If you're going to go with alloy forks you either need to get
'grab on' type foam handlebar covering or not ride long distances.

However, having said that, if you're planning on riding not more than ten
miles a weekend it probably isn't worth the extra.

how good is so called gel tape for drops? the old bike's tape is fairly
shafted, while it is fairly comftable to ride, i'd like a bit more
comfort on my hands, as the postion is fairly head down so more weight
is taken on my hands. i have gloves etc.

In the days I rode steel bikes I mostly used 'grab on' brand foam covers

http://www.bonthronebikes.co.uk/140-412069?sid=3462add83fc68d91

These are effectively like sections of foam pipe lagging, which you slide up
the bars rather than wrap on. The 'grab on' brand are quite high density
foam and really work for reducing vibration - some of the cheaper
imitations are of lower density foam that doesn't work so well. They're
awkward to get on - you need shaving foam (or similar) and patience.

I personally haven't found gel tape works well for me. Some people use a
double wrapping of ordinary cork bar tape, and find that works well. With
carbon forks however, there simply isn't a problem, and that's the solution
I prefer these days.

--
[email hidden] (Simon Brooke) http://www.jasmine.org.uk/~simon/

X-no-archive: No, I'm not *that* naive.

Simon Brooke said:

Roger Merriman said:

how good is so called gel tape for drops? the old bike's tape is
fairly shafted, while it is fairly comftable to ride, i'd like a bit
more comfort on my hands, as the postion is fairly head down so more
weight is taken on my hands. i have gloves etc.

In the days I rode steel bikes I mostly used 'grab on' brand foam
covers

http://www.bonthronebikes.co.uk/140-412069?sid=3462add83fc68d91

These are effectively like sections of foam pipe lagging, which you
slide up the bars rather than wrap on. The 'grab on' brand are quite
high density foam and really work for reducing vibration - some of
the cheaper imitations are of lower density foam that doesn't work so
well. They're awkward to get on - you need shaving foam (or similar)
and patience.

One only needs water to get Grab-on's on and off handlebars (the real
branded high-density ones). Every other lubricant I've tried is no better
than tap water ( I have tried soapy water, washing up liquid (neat and
diluted), WD-40).

To remove, poke a small item under the grab-on to allow the water to get
between the foam and the bars, gentle rotation will work the water in
slowly, and suddenly all will be loose and slidy.

My older tourer has 531 forks and Grab-on bar covering.

Quoted message said:

I personally haven't found gel tape works well for me. Some people
use a double wrapping of ordinary cork bar tape, and find that works
well. With carbon forks however, there simply isn't a problem, and
that's the solution I prefer these days.

My posh bike has carbon forks and Maras foam strips underneath cork bar
tape. The carbon forks are the biggest contribution to improved comfort.

- Nigel

--
Nigel Cliffe,
Webmaster at http://www.2mm.org.uk/

Simon Brooke said:

Roger Merriman said:

Simon Brooke said:

blackhead wrote:

> Colin MacDonald last week suggested :
>
> "EBC own-brand stuff is generally reasonable value, but you get what
> you pay for. The Continental, for example, has pretty low-spec
> components but that's why it is £350. If you're happy with that,
> Chain Reaction are doing last year's BeOne Briza 2.0 (no, I'm not on
> commission) for £250 and it has a more or less identical spec. For
> £350 the Storm 3.0 has Sora kit rather than 2200 as well as carbon
> forks."
>
> So I'm swayed in two directions by the BeOne Briza 2.0 or the Storm
> 3.0. Are carbon forks and Sora kit worth an extra £100 over alloy
> forks and shimano 2200 for someone that wants an enjoyable 10 mile
> bike ride over the weekend and the odd 5 miles during the week?
>
> How much do carbon forks reduce vibration by compared to alloy forks?

Very significantly. The hierarchy for forks is

* Carbon: least vibration but need to be replaced after a crash
* Steel: middling vibration and don't need to be replaced unless visibly
damaged
* Alloy: very harsh and need to be replaced after a crash

[censored] forks would be like steel i guess? i was quite suprised as to how
smooth the old steel road bike, that i've recently added to my fleet,
even with 20mm tires.

I've never ridden a Ti bike, so I wouldn't know. But yes, good steel forks
are remarkably good, and a whole lot better than aluminium.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

You can really feel the difference - and after a hundred miles it can be
the difference between having palsy in both hands and not having palsy in
both hands. If you're going to go with alloy forks you either need to get
'grab on' type foam handlebar covering or not ride long distances.

However, having said that, if you're planning on riding not more than ten
miles a weekend it probably isn't worth the extra.

how good is so called gel tape for drops? the old bike's tape is fairly
shafted, while it is fairly comftable to ride, i'd like a bit more
comfort on my hands, as the postion is fairly head down so more weight
is taken on my hands. i have gloves etc.

In the days I rode steel bikes I mostly used 'grab on' brand foam covers

http://www.bonthronebikes.co.uk/140-412069?sid=3462add83fc68d91

These are effectively like sections of foam pipe lagging, which you slide up
the bars rather than wrap on. The 'grab on' brand are quite high density
foam and really work for reducing vibration - some of the cheaper
imitations are of lower density foam that doesn't work so well. They're
awkward to get on - you need shaving foam (or similar) and patience.

I personally haven't found gel tape works well for me. Some people use a
double wrapping of ordinary cork bar tape, and find that works well. With
carbon forks however, there simply isn't a problem, and that's the solution
I prefer these days.

okay sounds intresting, it's not vibration but pressure as the drops
cause a higher loading on my hands than most of my other bikes.

think i'll roll up to the shop around the courner and see if they have
any i can look at.

roger
--
www.rogermerriman.com

O

Quoted message said:

Don't touch the Viking - overpriced [censored]. That it is cheap and /still/
overpriced lets you know how [censored] it is.

I don't suppose you will now, but if you did get a viking I would
expect it to work ok. £360 does not seem much money and that and the
steel fork version for the money seem comparable to the opposition to
me.The trek Madone is probably a better bike, but we are looking here
at things that 10 years would have seemed okish and would have cost a
lot more then. We have a viking of the sort that you can get now for
about £260 from Parkers.I got it for very little from a serious racer
who had trained probably 20 000miles on it and I put some wheels on it
from the garage of many bits and it seems to be enjoyed by my son, who
is more used to riding a students bike.
If I had got it new for £260 I would be satisfied and look forward to
getting new , good tyres and saddle.Mudguards are desirable, though,
and maybe lower gears or a triple chainset unless you live in a flat
area.
TerryJ

TerryJ said:

O

Quoted message said:

Don't touch the Viking - overpriced [censored]. That it is cheap and /still/
overpriced lets you know how [censored] it is.

I don't suppose you will now, but if you did get a viking I would
expect it to work ok. £360 does not seem much money and that and the
steel fork version for the money seem comparable to the opposition to
me.The trek Madone is probably a better bike, but we are looking here
at things that 10 years would have seemed okish and would have cost a
lot more then. We have a viking of the sort that you can get now for
about £260 from Parkers.I got it for very little from a serious racer
who had trained probably 20 000miles on it and I put some wheels on it
from the garage of many bits and it seems to be enjoyed by my son, who
is more used to riding a students bike.
If I had got it new for £260 I would be satisfied and look forward to
getting new , good tyres and saddle.Mudguards are desirable, though,
and maybe lower gears or a triple chainset unless you live in a flat
area.
TerryJ

PS the steel forks on it are amazingly robust and therefore heavy. At
least the carbon ones would be lighter.
TJ