Are two bicycles necessary?

Quoted message said:

I'm on a budget but want to get back into cycling in a
big way.

I need a bike for long distance touring and commuting.

And also can see myself doing some light off road
cycling such as dirt trail and roads.

Is it impossible to have only one bike do it all above?

Is it necessary to have a touring AND a MT bike with
front shock?

It's not necessary. Many people tour on mountain bikes. There are some
draw backs to touring on a mtb however. First many people have hand pain
issues with flat bar bikes, some people get numb fingers after a time on
flat bar bikes. This can be lessened somewhat by wearing cycling gloves
and adding a set of bar ends to the flat bars.

What kind of touring are you planning? Loaded camping touring? Or lite
motel touring? Or a mix of both?

How often would you ride off road? If you don't ride off road much ( or
not at all) you might prefer a true road touring bike.

How often do you plan of touring? If it's going to be a yearly thing (or
more often) You might consider a recumbent. Lots of people who tour a
lot ride recumbent style bikes on tour.

There are lots of question you need to ask yourself before buying any
gear for a tour.

Ken
--
The bicycle is just as good company as most husbands and, when it gets
old and shabby, a woman can dispose of it and get a new one without
shocking the entire community. ~Ann Strong

Quoted message said:

I'm on a budget but want to get back into cycling in a
big way.

I need a bike for long distance touring and commuting.

And also can see myself doing some light off road
cycling such as dirt trail and roads.

Is it impossible to have only one bike do it all above?

Is it necessary to have a touring AND a MT bike with
front shock?

If you're not insistent upon having the ultimate machine for each
venue, it's easy to blend the worlds. Buy a lightweight MTB with a
front shock that can be either locked or adjusted up very stiff, and
build a spare set of wheels with skinny street slicks on them. That
describes what I did for my all-purpose bike that I take on road trips
when I'm not sure what kind of riding will be possible along the way.
The only down side is the fact that it's hard to put panniers on a
suspension fork...but if your trails are all smooth enough, you can
overcome this as well, by using a non-suspension bike as the starting
point.
--
Typoes are a feature, not a bug.
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Werehatrack said:

Quoted message said:

I'm on a budget but want to get back into cycling in a
big way.

I need a bike for long distance touring and commuting.

And also can see myself doing some light off road
cycling such as dirt trail and roads.

Is it impossible to have only one bike do it all above?

Is it necessary to have a touring AND a MT bike with
front shock?

If you're not insistent upon having the ultimate machine for each
venue, it's easy to blend the worlds. Buy a lightweight MTB with a
front shock that can be either locked or adjusted up very stiff, and
build a spare set of wheels with skinny street slicks on them. That
describes what I did for my all-purpose bike that I take on road trips
when I'm not sure what kind of riding will be possible along the way.
The only down side is the fact that it's hard to put panniers on a
suspension fork...but if your trails are all smooth enough, you can
overcome this as well, by using a non-suspension bike as the starting
point.

It is possible to put panniers on your front suspension fork. The people
at Old Man Mountain racks can help out. I bought a set of pannier racks
from them for my hybrid. And they also have racks for the back of a full
suspension bike as well.

Ken
--
The bicycle is just as good company as most husbands and, when it gets
old and shabby, a woman can dispose of it and get a new one without
shocking the entire community. ~Ann Strong

Quoted message said:

I'm on a budget but want to get back into cycling in a
big way.

I need a bike for long distance touring and commuting.

And also can see myself doing some light off road
cycling such as dirt trail and roads.

Is it impossible to have only one bike do it all above?

Is it necessary to have a touring AND a MT bike with
front shock?

As long as you have reasonably wide tires (i.e. 28-mm or greater) and
are willing to portage the bicycle over rougher areas and not attempt
stunts like "getting big air", most off-road trails can be negotiated
with a road bicycle, including single-track. I would also suggest
conventional wheels with reasonably strong rims and 36 or more spokes,
as one or two broken spokes can temporarily be accommodated, which is
generally not true for low-spoke count "boutique" wheels.

The only times that I find front suspension on an ATB to be of
significant benefit are over sections where there are a LOT of roots or
wash-boarding, or when failing to miss cobble size rocks.

Wide knobby tires are helpful in loose gravel and mud, but not
essential. Mud is best avoided for environmental reasons, and because
it fouls the braking surface on rim braked bicycles. Clean sand is the
one area where wide tires and lower pressures are a near requirement,
but this is not too commonly encountered in many geographic regions.

The bonus of having a road bike that can accommodate moderate off-road
use is that it will be more stable to ride on the road, suffer from
fewer pinch flats, have better weight distribution (longer chain
stays), and clearances to accommodate fenders and some wheel
mis-alignment. The loss in speed compared to a dedicated racing bike is
small enough it will take a stopwatch to measure.

An option that will cost a couple of hundred dollars is to have two
wheel sets; one with a relatively narrow (e.g. 25-mm) tires for paved
road use and one with relatively wide (e.g. 32-mm) tires for mixed and
off-road use.

The opinions of a well known poster who frequently rides on unpaved
roads and trails on a drop-bar road bike:
<http://yarchive.net/bike/mountain_bike.html>.

--
Tom Sherman - Post Free or Die!

Ken C. M. said:

...
How often do you plan of touring? If it's going to be a yearly thing (or
more often) You might consider a r[*]c[*]mb[*]nt. Lots of people who tour a
lot ride r[*]c[*]mb[*]nt style bikes on tour....

You are not supposed to advocate r*c*mb*nt bicycles on rec.bicycles.*!

Having said that, if I had the time to tour, I would seriously consider
a r*c*mb*nt tadpole trike (suspended for light touring, unsuspended for
self-contained). While likely a little slower, removing the issue of
balance and needing to pay so much attention to road hazards, while
sitting in a moderately reclined position, allows one to pay much more
attention to one's surroundings (in my experience).

--
Tom Sherman - Post Free or Die!

Johnny Sunset aka Tom Sherman said:

Ken C. M. said:

...
How often do you plan of touring? If it's going to be a yearly thing (or
more often) You might consider a r[*]c[*]mb[*]nt. Lots of people who tour a
lot ride r[*]c[*]mb[*]nt style bikes on tour....

You are not supposed to advocate r*c*mb*nt bicycles on rec.bicycles.*!

Silly Ken!

Quoted message said:

Having said that, if I had the time to tour, I would seriously consider
a r*c*mb*nt tadpole trike (suspended for light touring, unsuspended for
self-contained). While likely a little slower, removing the issue of
balance and needing to pay so much attention to road hazards, while
sitting in a moderately reclined position, allows one to pay much more
attention to one's surroundings (in my experience).

Yes I would agree with you on the tadpole suggestion. If and when I get
to tour often, more than once a year I think I will probably set myself
up with a trike with a trailer.

Ken
--
The bicycle is just as good company as most husbands and, when it gets
old and shabby, a woman can dispose of it and get a new one without
shocking the entire community. ~Ann Strong

Quoted message said:

I'm on a budget but want to get back into cycling in a
big way.

I need a bike for long distance touring and commuting.

And also can see myself doing some light off road
cycling such as dirt trail and roads.

Is it impossible to have only one bike do it all above?

Is it necessary to have a touring AND a MT bike with
front shock?

No. If I were you, I'd buy an aluminum MTB with a rigid fork & put
slicks on it. If you decided you wanted drops or even aero bars they're
easy enough to add. You should be able to outfit a perfect bike for
under $400.

Peter Cole said:

I'd buy an aluminum MTB with a rigid fork & put
slicks on it. If you decided you wanted drops or even aero bars they're
easy enough to add. You should be able to outfit a perfect bike for
under $400.

Or buy a cross bike so you have good geometry and tire clearance. Rack
and fender it for light duty travel. Add a B.O.B. trailer for utility
hauling and touring.

<[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

I'm on a budget but want to get back into cycling in a
big way.

I need a bike for long distance touring and commuting.

And also can see myself doing some light off road
cycling such as dirt trail and roads.

Is it impossible to have only one bike do it all above?

Is it necessary to have a touring AND a MT bike with
front shock?

If I was touring I would want a road bike but having said that my new GT
Avalanche has front suspension that you can turn on and off.
While at the bike store I also saw a Devinci MTB that they gave a set of
road bike wheels with so you would have 2 bikes in one. Maybe that is what
you want. Do not ask me about the clearance issue. I did not look close
enough.
Either way the idea is the same.
I have 1.25" tires on the GT and it feels like a road bike but has the
hardiness to be a utility bike for my errands.
So you could just swap tires or you could swap wheels if you want.

me said:

I'm on a budget but want to get back into cycling in a
big way.

I need a bike for long distance touring and commuting.

And also can see myself doing some light off road
cycling such as dirt trail and roads.

Is it impossible to have only one bike do it all above?

Anything that could handle all of that would be a compromise. I would say
that, if all you want "offroad" is to ride on bike-path type trails and
dirt roads, then your touring bike would be fine for that. If you want to
do something you would not want to chance on the touring bike, then you do
need a mountain bike for that.

But, on the other hand, I would not agree with the idea of using a
mountain bike for touring. Yes, it has been done, but you are making it
harder on you than you need to. The flat bars are not as comfortable over
a long distance as drop bars (really), and the extra weight, especially
from a suspension fork, would be unwelcome. The tires of a mountain bike
would really slow you down, as well, so you would need at least an extra
set of wheels/tires for the touring.

Commuting -- depends. Short commute? Then any bike will do. Long one?
Then the touring bike would be far better than the mountain bike. I have
two commuters, even with a short commute; a single-speed road bike, and a
rigid mountain bike with studded tires for snow and ice.

I would say that you will find more benefits from getting two bikes than
from making one serve all purposes.

--

David L. Johnson

__o | You will say Christ saith this and the apostles say this; but
_`\(,_ | what canst thou say? -- George Fox.
(_)/ (_) |

Ken C. M. said:

How often do you plan of touring? If it's going to be a yearly thing (or
more often) You might consider a recumbent. Lots of people who tour a
lot ride recumbent style bikes on tour.

I see myself making maybe two actual long distance bike
tours a year. But maybe several smaller ones on
weekends only.

My main riding would be daily commuting.

I have , however, thought abt getting a MT bike for
daily commuting......and a bent for those tours. I've
never owned a bent before and am concerned I may not
put many miles on it given the cost of one.

I've also thought abt a touring bike for
everything.....upright touring bike that is.

And the other combination I've thought abt is a Bike
Friday for touring.....and MT bike for putzing around
town on.

"Johnny Sunset aka Tom Sherman"

Quoted message said:

I would seriously consider
a r*c*mb*nt tadpole trike (suspended for light touring, unsuspended for
self-contained).

Did you mean the reveres? Suspended for full load
tour....

Peter Cole said:

No. If I were you, I'd buy an aluminum MTB with a rigid fork & put
slicks on it.

Would that bike be efficient on say a 50 mile road tho?

Or will a lot of my cycling energy be lost in the MT
bike frame geometry and such?

I'm VERY out of shape...... so I'm thinking a road or
touring bike for anything more than 15 miles or so.
Not true?

I agree with Will on this. Get a cross bike. They are rigid enough
(compared to a standard road bike) to handle the bumps and dips on a
trail and they also have easy spinning tires for easy street rolling.
I have seen guys touring on MTN bikes and I think its a bit silly. I
find that really all you need is a nice strong set of wheels to handle
the load and any unseen bumps in the road and you will be fine. I have
done several self supported long distance tours on both road and 'cross
bikes and I typically prefer the 'cross bike. The most recent
excursion being SF to Phoenix...plenty of mountainous dirt trails on
that route! I had no problems using a rigid 'cross bike.

Also...to adress the front fork issue. You really dont gain much from
having a front fork in touring and light offroad use. Unless your fork
is quality and tuned properly..you probably wont be getting much
benefit from it aside from a front end that goes up and down.

David L. Johnson said:

I would say that you will find more benefits from getting two bikes than
from making one serve all purposes.

OK

Kind of my gut feeling as well..... but just needed you
guys opinions.

Maybe I will buy two used bikes.... touring and used MT
bike.

I'm leery of spending any big bucks till I find out
what my riding style is.

Plus.....I have a ton of equip that is yet to be
bought....camping gear, rain gear and shells,
shoes...you name it

Quoted message said:

Ken C. M. said:

How often do you plan of touring? If it's going to be a yearly thing (or
more often) You might consider a recumbent. Lots of people who tour a
lot ride recumbent style bikes on tour.

I see myself making maybe two actual long distance bike
tours a year. But maybe several smaller ones on
weekends only.

My main riding would be daily commuting.

Given these two statements, I might be inclined to say that you might be
better off with either two bikes, which would cost greater than $1000
for the bikes alone with no extras. Or just one bike that would be good
for both touring and commuting. That being said any bike (steel or
aluminum) that makes a good touring bike will also serve you well as a
commuter.

Ken

--
The bicycle is just as good company as most husbands and, when it gets
old and shabby, a woman can dispose of it and get a new one without
shocking the entire community. ~Ann Strong

Quoted message said:

"Johnny Sunset aka Tom Sherman"

Quoted message said:

I would seriously consider
a r*c*mb*nt tadpole trike (suspended for light touring, unsuspended for
self-contained).

Did you mean the reveres? Suspended for full load tour....

Unsuspended trikes tend to ride rather roughly, especially since one
tends to hit potholes with the rear wheel after straddling them with
the front wheels. However, a heavy touring load will tend to smooth out
the ride on an unsuspended trike.

Trikes are subject to significantly higher torsional loads than
bicycles. Putting a heavy load on a suspended trike will likely result
in rapid wear of suspension pivots and spring/shock mounting points.

--
Tom Sherman - Post Free or Die!

Quoted message said:

David L. Johnson said:

I would say that you will find more benefits from getting two bikes than
from making one serve all purposes.

OK

Kind of my gut feeling as well.....

Like I said before... give cross-bikes a good look. Why?

They typically have great tire and fender clearance. What this means
is you can run everything from slicks to studs. And with fenders you
can stay dry. Yes... you can get two sets of wheels. But you can also
learn to quickly change tires. The reality is that you change tires for
a particular project, like an extended tour, or with the seasons. For
my money, the second set of wheels would include a hub generator, for
winter commuting.

They typically have cantilever brake bosses. So you can run canti's or
V-brakes.

The bottom brackets are lower. Better balance, less wobble under load.

The head tube is a bit more relaxed. Loaded handling is better. And you
can take your hands off the bars once in a while to sit upright without
putting the bike in a ditch.

They can use mountain bike drive trains, so you can get excellent
low-to-high gear leverages. Which also means you can spec rock solid
groups like Shimano XT.

Whatever you do... the real trick is getting the correct top tube match
for your torso. Too short and your butt will suffer, too long and it's
your neck...

<[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

I'm on a budget but want to get back into cycling in a
big way.

I need a bike for long distance touring and commuting.

And also can see myself doing some light off road
cycling such as dirt trail and roads.

Is it impossible to have only one bike do it all above?

Is it necessary to have a touring AND a MT bike with
front shock?

I would look into getting a cyclecross bike with braze on mount points for
racks.
You can change the tires out for light trail riding and use street tires for
touring.
A steel framed touring bike would work too. Usually you can mount 700c35
cyclecross tires no problem.
You do not need suspension for light trail riding.