Anyone here ever Braze aluminum?

JoanD'arcRoast <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:<[email hidden]>...

Quoted message said:

Product named "Dura-Fix". Zinc-based rods flow at 732 degrees F. Can be
used with propane torch...

Questions:

1.) Do you think this is prudent building practice for a thin-walled
"as-light-as-feasible" [not over-built] aluminum "space" frame?

2.) Would heat treatment still be necessary?

Thanks,
-j

P.S. What was that exhaustive online catalog of Al & Ti wedgie bike
parts? [I lost my links?]

Hi Joan,
Zinc is not nearly strong enough to braze a bicycle frame with. Too
weak and too soft. Weldng or high-tech gluing is the only way to go.
Paul Milner

In article <[email hidden]>, Paul

Milner said:

JoanD'arcRoast <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:<[email hidden]>...

Quoted message said:

Product named "Dura-Fix". Zinc-based rods flow at 732 degrees F. Can be
used with propane torch...

Questions:

1.) Do you think this is prudent building practice for a thin-walled
"as-light-as-feasible" [not over-built] aluminum "space" frame?

2.) Would heat treatment still be necessary?

Thanks,
-j

P.S. What was that exhaustive online catalog of Al & Ti wedgie bike
parts? [I lost my links?]

Hi Joan,
Zinc is not nearly strong enough to braze a bicycle frame with. Too
weak and too soft. Weldng or high-tech gluing is the only way to go.
Paul Milner

Any pointers towards "high-tech" glues for aluminum? I've found a few
references to using epoxies with aluminium. Products such as:
"Metalmend" and "Marinetex" and some veiled references to the
automobile industry...

I was curious if anyone here had any first-hand experience as well.

Thanks,
-j

There is a product called Alumiweld.

I have no experience with it but it sounds like a possibility.

JoanD'arcRoast <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:<[email hidden]>...

Quoted message said:

In article <[email hidden]>, Paul

Milner said:

JoanD'arcRoast <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:<[email hidden]>...

Quoted message said:

Product named "Dura-Fix". Zinc-based rods flow at 732 degrees F. Can be
used with propane torch...

Questions:

1.) Do you think this is prudent building practice for a thin-walled
"as-light-as-feasible" [not over-built] aluminum "space" frame?

2.) Would heat treatment still be necessary?

Thanks,
-j

P.S. What was that exhaustive online catalog of Al & Ti wedgie bike
parts? [I lost my links?]

Hi Joan,
Zinc is not nearly strong enough to braze a bicycle frame with. Too
weak and too soft. Weldng or high-tech gluing is the only way to go.
Paul Milner

Any pointers towards "high-tech" glues for aluminum? I've found a few
references to using epoxies with aluminium. Products such as:
"Metalmend" and "Marinetex" and some veiled references to the
automobile industry...

I was curious if anyone here had any first-hand experience as well.

Thanks,
-j

I would check in the aerospace industry. I don't know which glues they
are.
If , however, you know how to gas weld, lyou have about 80% of the
welding motion down to TIG weld aluminum. Aluminum is not terribly
difficult to learn to weld in this case.
Paul Milner

In article <[email hidden]>, Paul

Milner said:

JoanD'arcRoast <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:<[email hidden]>...

Quoted message said:

In article <[email hidden]>, Paul

Milner said:

JoanD'arcRoast <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:<[email hidden]>...
> Product named "Dura-Fix". Zinc-based rods flow at 732 degrees F. Can be
> used with propane torch...
>
> Questions:
>
> 1.) Do you think this is prudent building practice for a thin-walled
> "as-light-as-feasible" [not over-built] aluminum "space" frame?
>
> 2.) Would heat treatment still be necessary?
>
>
>
> Thanks,
> -j
>
> P.S. What was that exhaustive online catalog of Al & Ti wedgie bike
> parts? [I lost my links?]
Hi Joan,
Zinc is not nearly strong enough to braze a bicycle frame with. Too
weak and too soft. Weldng or high-tech gluing is the only way to go.
Paul Milner

Any pointers towards "high-tech" glues for aluminum? I've found a few
references to using epoxies with aluminium. Products such as:
"Metalmend" and "Marinetex" and some veiled references to the
automobile industry...

I was curious if anyone here had any first-hand experience as well.

Thanks,
-j

I would check in the aerospace industry. I don't know which glues they
are.
If , however, you know how to gas weld, lyou have about 80% of the
welding motion down to TIG weld aluminum. Aluminum is not terribly
difficult to learn to weld in this case.
Paul Milner

Okay, correct me if I'm wrong -- my impression was that if I weld
aluminum, then I must heat treat the frame afterward. If I choose *not*
to heat treat, I must design using heavier, thicker tubes... therefore
obviating aluminum.

Thanks,
-j

True. If you weld AL you SHOULD heat treat it to both relieve the weld
joint stress and bring it back up to strength. You don't have to however
and you don't need to go a LOT thicker either. Unless you're an engineer
and can do the math (or know someone who can) you can use AL that has a
little thicker walls (don't necessarily have to go a lot thicker), and after
welding, shelve it for a few weeks and it will age harden and toughen up on
it's own. It will not, however, go back to it's original strength
properties or relieve the joint stress. It will be stronger than if you
welded it and started using it within a matter of days though.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

> > 1.) Do you think this is prudent building practice for a

thin-walled

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

> > "as-light-as-feasible" [not over-built] aluminum "space" frame?
> >
> > 2.) Would heat treatment still be necessary?
> >
> >
> >
> > Thanks,
> > -j
> >
> > P.S. What was that exhaustive online catalog of Al & Ti wedgie

bike

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

> > parts? [I lost my links?]
> Hi Joan,
> Zinc is not nearly strong enough to braze a bicycle frame with. Too
> weak and too soft. Weldng or high-tech gluing is the only way to go.
> Paul Milner

Any pointers towards "high-tech" glues for aluminum? I've found a few
references to using epoxies with aluminium. Products such as:
"Metalmend" and "Marinetex" and some veiled references to the
automobile industry...

I was curious if anyone here had any first-hand experience as well.

Thanks,
-j

I would check in the aerospace industry. I don't know which glues they
are.
If , however, you know how to gas weld, lyou have about 80% of the
welding motion down to TIG weld aluminum. Aluminum is not terribly
difficult to learn to weld in this case.
Paul Milner

Okay, correct me if I'm wrong -- my impression was that if I weld
aluminum, then I must heat treat the frame afterward. If I choose *not*
to heat treat, I must design using heavier, thicker tubes... therefore
obviating aluminum.

"Sticker Jim" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:<[email hidden]>...

Quoted message said:

True. If you weld AL you SHOULD heat treat it to both relieve the weld
joint stress and bring it back up to strength. You don't have to however
and you don't need to go a LOT thicker either. Unless you're an engineer
and can do the math (or know someone who can) you can use AL that has a
little thicker walls (don't necessarily have to go a lot thicker), and after
welding, shelve it for a few weeks and it will age harden and toughen up on
it's own. It will not, however, go back to it's original strength
properties or relieve the joint stress. It will be stronger than if you
welded it and started using it within a matter of days though.

If I recall correctly, It is not necessary to heat treat 7000 series
Aluminum. I might be wrong, however.
Paul Milner

"Paul Milner" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

"Sticker Jim" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:<[email hidden]>...

Quoted message said:

True. If you weld AL you SHOULD heat treat it to both relieve the weld
joint stress and bring it back up to strength. You don't have to however
and you don't need to go a LOT thicker either. Unless you're an engineer
and can do the math (or know someone who can) you can use AL that has a
little thicker walls (don't necessarily have to go a lot thicker), and
after
welding, shelve it for a few weeks and it will age harden and toughen up
on
it's own. It will not, however, go back to it's original strength
properties or relieve the joint stress. It will be stronger than if you
welded it and started using it within a matter of days though.

If I recall correctly, It is not necessary to heat treat 7000 series
Aluminum. I might be wrong, however.
Paul Milner

I recall brazing some aluminum once... It wasn't a pretty sight... :-))

On Mon, 11 Oct 2004 03:39:49 GMT "Frank Olson"
used 25 lines of text to write in newsgroup:
alt.rec.bicycles.recumbent

Quoted message said:

I recall brazing some aluminum once... It wasn't a pretty sight... :-))

A Cessna fuselage doesn't count Frank. :-)

-Graham

Remove the 'snails' from my email

"G. Morgan" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

On Mon, 11 Oct 2004 03:39:49 GMT "Frank Olson"
used 25 lines of text to write in newsgroup:
alt.rec.bicycles.recumbent

Quoted message said:

I recall brazing some aluminum once... It wasn't a pretty sight... :-))

A Cessna fuselage doesn't count Frank. :-)

Why not?? :-))

My instructor for aircraft structures was from England. He pronounced the
word "al-you-min-ium". The first day of class there was some confusion as
to what he was talking about...

On Mon, 11 Oct 2004 20:46:04 GMT, "Frank Olson"
<[email hidden]> wrote in message
<giCad.713763$gE.298588@pd7tw3no>:

Quoted message said:

My instructor for aircraft structures was from England. He pronounced the
word "al-you-min-ium". The first day of class there was some confusion as
to what he was talking about...

According to IUPAC, he was right :-)

Guy
--
May contain traces of irony. Contents liable to settle after posting.
http://www.chapmancentral.co.uk

88% of helmet statistics are made up, 65% of them at Washington University

On Mon, 11 Oct 2004 20:46:04 GMT "Frank Olson"
used 20 lines of text to write in newsgroup:
alt.rec.bicycles.recumbent

Quoted message said:

Why not?? :-))

I assumed you did it at 80 MPH, grinding down the runway. :-)

-Graham

Remove the 'snails' from my email

"G. Morgan" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

On Mon, 11 Oct 2004 20:46:04 GMT "Frank Olson"
used 20 lines of text to write in newsgroup:
alt.rec.bicycles.recumbent

Quoted message said:

Why not?? :-))

I assumed you did it at 80 MPH, grinding down the runway. :-)

Not quite. It was a good deal more hazardous than that. I "heroically"
volunteered to climb out one of the over wing emergency exit windows in the
737 while it was upside down to braze the red navigation light back on. The
wind was something fierce and I had to do it left handed as I was holding on
for dear life with my right. I had to work the lighter for the torch with
my teeth, and (not surprising) it kept blowing out on me. :-))

I also know of this really nice nearly new bridge that you can buy cheap.
I'll need your Master Card number and the ID on the back to reserve it for
you. Since my email's kinda slow today you can post it here in the group.
I'm sure you can trust all the guys here.

--
Frank Olson
http://www.yoursecuritysource.com
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