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Anqut v06 - Path & Routes

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General fitness, health and nutrition
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2 December 2005
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11 December 2005
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druidh
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  1. I've just loaded in a Route from version 1 and it's now hit me how the
    new version handles paths.

    In effect, paths are now discrete routes. However, routes can be joined
    up to make multi-leg routes.

    The structure of these can be seen in the Data Explorer window as a
    "tree". Select the highest-level of the tree, and the whole route is
    highlighted, and the Route Card/Route profile are for the whole thing.
    Select one of the lower level routes and only the relevant one is
    highlighted - and the Route Card/Route profile show only this leg.

    It's much easier to modify routes now - instead of doing the "Add Node"
    and then dragging it, just click on the line and it'll create a new
    "Waypoint" which can then be dragged.

    Oh for a decent user manual. . . .

    druidh

  2. "druidh" <[email hidden]> schreef in bericht
    news:[email hidden]...

    Quoted message said:

    I've just loaded in a Route from version 1 and it's now hit me how the new
    version handles paths.

    Do you import routes into v06 from v1 or do you export routes from v1 to v06
    ?
    I couldn't find out in the manual or with the dropdown menus.

    --
    Theo
    www.theosphotos.fotopic.net

  3. "theo" <[email hidden]> schreef in bericht
    news:[email hidden]...

    Quoted message said:


    "druidh" <[email hidden]> schreef in bericht
    news:[email hidden]...

    Quoted message said:

    I've just loaded in a Route from version 1 and it's now hit me how the
    new version handles paths.

    Do you import routes into v06 from v1 or do you export routes from v1 to
    v06 ?
    I couldn't find out in the manual or with the dropdown menus.

    Found it. TAW.

    --
    Theo
    www.theosphotos.fotopic.net

  4. theo said:

    "druidh" <[email hidden]> schreef in bericht
    news:[email hidden]...

    Quoted message said:

    I've just loaded in a Route from version 1 and it's now hit me how the new
    version handles paths.

    Do you import routes into v06 from v1 or do you export routes from v1 to v06
    ?
    I couldn't find out in the manual or with the dropdown menus.


    I've only done V1 to v6 so far. It's in the Tools.......Import/Export menu

    druidh

  5. theo said:


    "druidh" <[email hidden]> schreef in bericht

    Quoted message said:

    Do you import routes into v06 from v1 or do you export routes from v1 to
    v06
    ?
    I couldn't find out in the manual or with the dropdown menus.

    The instructions are poor for V6; there is no mention of "importing" in
    them. As yet I have been unable to import an AEF file as the import system
    complains about the file format. Has anyone else managed to import AEF
    files?

    Regards

    Richard Newstead

  6. Richard Newstead said:
    theo said:


    "druidh" <[email hidden]> schreef in bericht

    Quoted message said:

    Do you import routes into v06 from v1 or do you export routes from v1
    to v06
    ?
    I couldn't find out in the manual or with the dropdown menus.

    The instructions are poor for V6; there is no mention of "importing" in
    them. As yet I have been unable to import an AEF file as the import
    system complains about the file format. Has anyone else managed to
    import AEF files?

    Looks like the AEF file format has changed between versions as I can't
    export/import these either way (v1 to v6 or vis versa). This means that
    files exported from GPSU can't be read either.

    Looking at the menu structure, it would appear that one can only Import
    from V1 - not Export.

    There's the specific utility in the menu under
    Tools....Import/Export....Anquet V1 User Data. This (for me) worked fine
    and created a new database with all my V1 routes in it. However, none of
    the Routes are named, so there's definitely a bit of extra work needed
    to do it this way.

    It's also possible to pick up specific routes using the
    Tools....Import/Export....Anquet Route (ARF) options. Bringing them in
    this way will at least make renaming easier.

    druidh

  7. On Sat, 03 Dec 2005 11:02:14 -0000, druidh <[email hidden]>

    Quoted message said:
    Richard Newstead said:
    theo said:


    "druidh" <[email hidden]> schreef in bericht

    Quoted message said:

    Looks like the AEF file format has changed between versions as I can't
    export/import these either way (v1 to v6 or vis versa). This means that
    files exported from GPSU can't be read either.

    Looking at the menu structure, it would appear that one can only Import
    from V1 - not Export.

    There's the specific utility in the menu under
    Tools....Import/Export....Anquet V1 User Data. This (for me) worked fine
    and created a new database with all my V1 routes in it. However, none of
    the Routes are named, so there's definitely a bit of extra work needed
    to do it this way.

    It also looses all the icon data from V1 which, if like me you have used
    Icons to mean different things, is all lost. I hate the way it turns every
    mouse click on a route into a waypoint - not what I want as the icons
    obscure the map and the track. Have I really paid good money for this
    "upgrade"? Perhaps Memorymap could cash in here but offering all Anquet
    users a 50% discount to upgrade to Memorymap?

    Fortunately V06 does not interfere with the old version so I'll use that
    until V06 gets fixed.

    Regards

    Richard

  8. Richard Newstead said:

    On Sat, 03 Dec 2005 11:02:14 -0000, druidh <[email hidden]>

    Quoted message said:
    Richard Newstead said:

    On Fri, 02 Dec 2005 20:40:17 -0000, theo <[email hidden]> wrote:

    >
    > "druidh" <[email hidden]> schreef in bericht

    Quoted message said:

    Looks like the AEF file format has changed between versions as I
    can't export/import these either way (v1 to v6 or vis versa). This
    means that files exported from GPSU can't be read either.

    Looking at the menu structure, it would appear that one can only
    Import from V1 - not Export.

    There's the specific utility in the menu under
    Tools....Import/Export....Anquet V1 User Data. This (for me) worked
    fine and created a new database with all my V1 routes in it. However,
    none of the Routes are named, so there's definitely a bit of extra
    work needed to do it this way.

    It also looses all the icon data from V1 which, if like me you have
    used Icons to mean different things, is all lost.

    Yep - me too. More manual editing I'm afraid.

    I hate the way it

    Quoted message said:

    turns every mouse click on a route into a waypoint - not what I want as
    the icons obscure the map and the track. Have I really paid good money
    for this "upgrade"? Perhaps Memorymap could cash in here but offering
    all Anquet users a 50% discount to upgrade to Memorymap?

    Unless I'm missing something here, I think you'll find that MM also
    plots a Waypoint at every mouse click. I presume you're referring to the
    Anquet V1 "nodes". These are converted to Waypoints in the GPS anyway
    - and are represented as Waypoints in any file exchanged between Anquet
    and MM too. So Memory Map won't help you out in this regard.

    As for Waypoints obscuring the track, it's easy enough to switch off the
    text or make it more transparent.

    My main bugbear at the moment is trying to make a route between existing
    waypoints. If you trid this using V1, it would pop up a message about
    merging waypoints when you were close enough to the end point. This
    doesn't happen with V6 and you end up with one Waypoint on top of
    another. Must find out how to get round this. . . .

    It's true that this is probably the best time if you were looking to
    "jump ship" as V06 is actually a whole new program rather than an
    upgrade of the old one and it therefore means learning it all over
    again. I can appreciate some of the "why's" - the new file structure,
    the test boxes, consistency with GPS etc, shame it's gonna take a while
    to figure it all out.

    druidh

  9. "druidh" <[email hidden]> schreef in bericht
    news:[email hidden]...

    Quoted message said:

    Unless I'm missing something here, I think you'll find that MM also plots
    a Waypoint at every mouse click. I presume you're referring to the Anquet
    V1 "nodes". These are converted to Waypoints in the GPS anyway

    I didn't know nodes turned into waypoints. Because of this I'll have to
    create an *only major waypoints route* (for gps use) of every *detailed
    route* (for precise distance, etc.). I've got a Geko 201 since two weeks and
    today I've become a *node-remover*.

    --
    Theo
    www.theosphotos.fotopic.net

  10. theo said:

    "druidh" <[email hidden]> schreef in bericht
    news:[email hidden]...

    Quoted message said:

    Unless I'm missing something here, I think you'll find that MM also plots
    a Waypoint at every mouse click. I presume you're referring to the Anquet
    V1 "nodes". These are converted to Waypoints in the GPS anyway

    I didn't know nodes turned into waypoints. Because of this I'll have to
    create an *only major waypoints route* (for gps use) of every *detailed
    route* (for precise distance, etc.). I've got a Geko 201 since two weeks and
    today I've become a *node-remover*.


    No need (I think), unless your routes are particularly long and or/
    tortuous. I just upload the whole lot into my GPS. With Anquet V1,
    there's the option to reduce the number of waypoints, which I sometimes
    use to ensure my route stays less than 126 (i.e. a single route).

    V06 has the "reduce data" option to do the same thing.

    I've also figured out the "new route to existing waypoint" issue in V06
    that had me flumoxed. It's as simple as using the Data Explorer window.
    This is proving to be a very powerful route planning system as one can
    re-order, copy and delete waypoints from here and see the results in the
    map window. This makes inserting a waypoint an an exact co-ordinate
    almost as easy as V1.

    As I've already said - "where's the user manual???"

    druidh

  11. theo said:

    I didn't know nodes turned into waypoints. Because of this I'll have
    to create an *only major waypoints route* (for gps use) of every
    *detailed route* (for precise distance, etc.). I've got a Geko 201
    since two weeks and today I've become a *node-remover*.

    I don't understand how nodes, waypoints, paths and routes work in the new
    version, but I've never liked the way Anquet handled GPS stuff.

    The original software was designed with no GPS support at all, it was added
    as an afterthought, and as such, it was never designed as a true GPS
    application like OziExplorer, which is far more powerful in that respect,
    and which works in the same way that GPS units themselves are designed to
    work, whereas Anquet has different ideas about what paths, routes and
    waypoints mean, and so has to convert them for GPS use.

    Anyway, I bought the original Anquet and I didn't buy it for GPS use, I do
    all that in Ozi. I find the old paths/routes system works fine for route
    planning. Good for measuring distances and ascent, good for 3D
    visualisation of an area (especially with the new Photo Maps) and good for
    map printouts.

    As far as GPS routes are concerned, I've never liked to have loads of
    waypoints in a route, just a few key waypoints usually work fine, you don't
    need to trace every twist and turn in order to produce a route that is easy
    to follow. Of course, Anquet encourages you to trace every twist and turn,
    which is great for measuring the distance and producing a route profile, but
    not ideal for uploading to a GPS since there are too many waypoints.

    But here's the point I'm coming to. I don't know if all the latest Garmin
    models work in the same way, but in my 60CS, each route can hold up to 250
    waypoints. However, they can only hold up to 50 *normal* waypoints (user
    created with icons and names). This is something that isn't explained
    properly in the manual, and it's a while since I looked into this, but IIRC
    it seems that there are two kinds of route waypoints, one is the normal
    kind, another is a sort of "invisible" waypoint, i.e. they don't appear as
    waypoints in your GPS, but they do help to trace lots of twists and turns in
    your routes (but without eating up all your waypoint memory).

    These are ideal for creating detailed routes without using any normal
    waypoints at all (which effectively increases the capacity of the GPS),
    however the only software I know of that can create them is MapSource, which
    is what you get when you buy map data for a map GPS. Unfortunately, since
    MapSource only shows road data, I can only create these kinds of routes on
    roads. Handy for following a detailed road route (if necessary) but there's
    no way of creating an offroad route.

    I've tried creating such routes, uploading them to the GPS, then downloading
    them into different software like Ozi and Anquet, but the "invisible"
    waypoints are converted back into normal waypoints. I've asked some
    questions in a 60CS forum but never received any satisfactory answers.
    These special waypoints seem to be a bit of a mystery.

    The new Anquet couldn't possibly have support for these kinds of waypoints,
    could it? You did mention "major" waypoints above. No idea what that means
    in the Anquet context.

    Paul

  12. "druidh" <[email hidden]> schreef in bericht
    news:[email hidden]...

    Quoted message said:
    theo said:

    "druidh" <[email hidden]> schreef in bericht
    news:[email hidden]...

    Quoted message said:

    Unless I'm missing something here, I think you'll find that MM also plots
    a Waypoint at every mouse click. I presume you're referring to the Anquet
    V1 "nodes". These are converted to Waypoints in the GPS anyway

    I didn't know nodes turned into waypoints. Because of this I'll have to
    create an *only major waypoints route* (for gps use) of every *detailed
    route* (for precise distance, etc.). I've got a Geko 201 since two weeks
    and today I've become a *node-remover*.


    No need (I think), unless your routes are particularly long and or/
    tortuous. I just upload the whole lot into my GPS. With Anquet V1, there's
    the option to reduce the number of waypoints, which I sometimes use to
    ensure my route stays less than 126 (i.e. a single route).

    It's a 4 days summits walk around Glen Nevis. Aprox 70km with 6700 m of
    ascend. By looking at the map I try to visualise possible difficulties
    during bad visibility. Is this the right spur to follow, do I need extra
    waypoints to tell me that ? If there's a clear path (like the tourist track
    to the Halfway Lochan) you obviously don't need them but on a snowtopped
    Aonach Mor and Beag the might come in handy.
    I've got a cable to download routes to my gps and will check different forms
    of this route, both from V1 and V06, the next days to watch what it will do
    to waypoints, et. .

    Quoted message said:


    V06 has the "reduce data" option to do the same thing.

    Haven't tried it yet but the *manual* says it can remove 20% of the
    waypoints three times, starting with the WP's with the smallest change of
    direction.

    Quoted message said:


    I've also figured out the "new route to existing waypoint" issue in V06
    that had me flumoxed. It's as simple as using the Data Explorer window.
    This is proving to be a very powerful route planning system as one can
    re-order, copy and delete waypoints from here and see the results in the
    map window. This makes inserting a waypoint an an exact co-ordinate almost
    as easy as V1.

    As I've already said - "where's the user manual???"

    It's a *rough guide*.

    --
    Theo
    www.theosphotos.fotopic.net

  13. Paul Saunders said:

    I don't understand how nodes, waypoints, paths and routes work in the new
    version, but I've never liked the way Anquet handled GPS stuff.

    The original software was designed with no GPS support at all, it was added
    as an afterthought, and as such, it was never designed as a true GPS
    application like OziExplorer, which is far more powerful in that respect,
    and which works in the same way that GPS units themselves are designed to
    work, whereas Anquet has different ideas about what paths, routes and
    waypoints mean, and so has to convert them for GPS use.


    No paths now - only Waypoints and Routes. However, the old path element
    remains in the way that multiple routes can be appended to create bigger
    routes.

    Quoted message said:

    Anyway, I bought the original Anquet and I didn't buy it for GPS use, I do
    all that in Ozi. I find the old paths/routes system works fine for route
    planning. Good for measuring distances and ascent, good for 3D
    visualisation of an area (especially with the new Photo Maps) and good for
    map printouts.

    As far as GPS routes are concerned, I've never liked to have loads of
    waypoints in a route, just a few key waypoints usually work fine, you don't
    need to trace every twist and turn in order to produce a route that is easy
    to follow. Of course, Anquet encourages you to trace every twist and turn,
    which is great for measuring the distance and producing a route profile, but
    not ideal for uploading to a GPS since there are too many waypoints.


    I guess it depends how accurate you want to be. For a "normal" walk, I
    find I seldom need to have more than the 125 Waypoints which a Geko
    route allows.

    Quoted message said:

    But here's the point I'm coming to. I don't know if all the latest Garmin
    models work in the same way, but in my 60CS, each route can hold up to 250
    waypoints. However, they can only hold up to 50 *normal* waypoints (user
    created with icons and names). This is something that isn't explained
    properly in the manual, and it's a while since I looked into this, but IIRC
    it seems that there are two kinds of route waypoints, one is the normal
    kind, another is a sort of "invisible" waypoint, i.e. they don't appear as
    waypoints in your GPS, but they do help to trace lots of twists and turns in
    your routes (but without eating up all your waypoint memory).

    These are ideal for creating detailed routes without using any normal
    waypoints at all (which effectively increases the capacity of the GPS),
    however the only software I know of that can create them is MapSource, which
    is what you get when you buy map data for a map GPS. Unfortunately, since
    MapSource only shows road data, I can only create these kinds of routes on
    roads. Handy for following a detailed road route (if necessary) but there's
    no way of creating an offroad route.

    I've tried creating such routes, uploading them to the GPS, then downloading
    them into different software like Ozi and Anquet, but the "invisible"
    waypoints are converted back into normal waypoints. I've asked some
    questions in a 60CS forum but never received any satisfactory answers.
    These special waypoints seem to be a bit of a mystery.

    The new Anquet couldn't possibly have support for these kinds of waypoints,
    could it? You did mention "major" waypoints above. No idea what that means
    in the Anquet context.


    Not as far as I can see. There doesn't seem to be any way of defining
    Waypoints as "visible" or "invisible".

    Quoted message said:

    Paul

  14. Paul Saunders said:

    I don't understand how nodes, waypoints, paths and routes work in the new
    version, but I've never liked the way Anquet handled GPS stuff.

    The original software was designed with no GPS support at all, it was added
    as an afterthought, and as such, it was never designed as a true GPS
    application like OziExplorer, which is far more powerful in that respect,
    and which works in the same way that GPS units themselves are designed to
    work, whereas Anquet has different ideas about what paths, routes and
    waypoints mean, and so has to convert them for GPS use.


    No paths now - only Waypoints and Routes. However, the old path element
    remains in the way that multiple routes can be appended to create bigger
    routes.

    Quoted message said:

    Anyway, I bought the original Anquet and I didn't buy it for GPS use, I do
    all that in Ozi. I find the old paths/routes system works fine for route
    planning. Good for measuring distances and ascent, good for 3D
    visualisation of an area (especially with the new Photo Maps) and good for
    map printouts.

    As far as GPS routes are concerned, I've never liked to have loads of
    waypoints in a route, just a few key waypoints usually work fine, you don't
    need to trace every twist and turn in order to produce a route that is easy
    to follow. Of course, Anquet encourages you to trace every twist and turn,
    which is great for measuring the distance and producing a route profile, but
    not ideal for uploading to a GPS since there are too many waypoints.


    I guess it depends how accurate you want to be. For a "normal" walk, I
    find I seldom need to have more than the 125 Waypoints which a Geko
    route allows.

    Quoted message said:

    But here's the point I'm coming to. I don't know if all the latest Garmin
    models work in the same way, but in my 60CS, each route can hold up to 250
    waypoints. However, they can only hold up to 50 *normal* waypoints (user
    created with icons and names). This is something that isn't explained
    properly in the manual, and it's a while since I looked into this, but IIRC
    it seems that there are two kinds of route waypoints, one is the normal
    kind, another is a sort of "invisible" waypoint, i.e. they don't appear as
    waypoints in your GPS, but they do help to trace lots of twists and turns in
    your routes (but without eating up all your waypoint memory).

    These are ideal for creating detailed routes without using any normal
    waypoints at all (which effectively increases the capacity of the GPS),
    however the only software I know of that can create them is MapSource, which
    is what you get when you buy map data for a map GPS. Unfortunately, since
    MapSource only shows road data, I can only create these kinds of routes on
    roads. Handy for following a detailed road route (if necessary) but there's
    no way of creating an offroad route.

    I've tried creating such routes, uploading them to the GPS, then downloading
    them into different software like Ozi and Anquet, but the "invisible"
    waypoints are converted back into normal waypoints. I've asked some
    questions in a 60CS forum but never received any satisfactory answers.
    These special waypoints seem to be a bit of a mystery.

    The new Anquet couldn't possibly have support for these kinds of waypoints,
    could it? You did mention "major" waypoints above. No idea what that means
    in the Anquet context.


    Not as far as I can see. There doesn't seem to be any way of defining
    Waypoints as "visible" or "invisible".

    Quoted message said:

    Paul

  15. Paul Saunders said:

    As far as GPS routes are concerned, I've never liked to have loads of
    waypoints in a route, just a few key waypoints usually work fine, you
    don't
    need to trace every twist and turn in order to produce a route that is
    easy
    to follow.

    Therein lies the problem. I dont use GPS for navigation and usually need
    just two clear waypoints for a typical day out. The first is where to park
    and the second is usually a summit. In the old version this was fine but
    the new one adds waypoint symbols at every click so I have hundreds of
    symbols on a twisty route. If I turn them off (reduce their size) they all
    go so I cant see the two key points any more.

    I wonder if Anquet did any Beta testing with real users before releasing
    this software [Warning Stereotype Incoming] Maybe the average computer
    programmer relaxes with a PS2 and only needs to navigate between the TV
    and the fridge so perhaps they left them to test the software?

    Regards

    Richard

  16. "Richard Newstead" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
    news:[email hidden]...
    ..

    Quoted message said:


    Therein lies the problem. I dont use GPS for navigation and usually need
    just two clear waypoints for a typical day out. The first is where to park
    and the second is usually a summit. In the old version this was fine but
    the new one adds waypoint symbols at every click so I have hundreds of
    symbols on a twisty route. If I turn them off (reduce their size) they all
    go so I cant see the two key points any more.

    I wonder if Anquet did any Beta testing with real users before releasing
    this software [Warning Stereotype Incoming] Maybe the average computer
    programmer relaxes with a PS2 and only needs to navigate between the TV
    and the fridge so perhaps they left them to test the software?

    Regards

    Richard

    Can be achieved but is only a work round.Work in database instead of map.
    Open tree view and data explorer..
    Delete all but waypoint 1 and last one.

    A real pain --.- .-. .- .--. upgrade.

    Roger --. ....- --- .-- --.

  17. "Roger leighton" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
    news:[email hidden]...

    Quoted message said:


    "Richard Newstead" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
    news:[email hidden]...
    .

    Quoted message said:


    Therein lies the problem. I dont use GPS for navigation and usually need
    just two clear waypoints for a typical day out. The first is where to
    park and the second is usually a summit. In the old version this was fine
    but the new one adds waypoint symbols at every click so I have hundreds
    of symbols on a twisty route. If I turn them off (reduce their size) they
    all go so I cant see the two key points any more.

    I wonder if Anquet did any Beta testing with real users before releasing
    this software [Warning Stereotype Incoming] Maybe the average computer
    programmer relaxes with a PS2 and only needs to navigate between the TV
    and the fridge so perhaps they left them to test the software?

    Regards

    Richard

    Can be achieved but is only a work round.Work in database instead of map.
    Open tree view and data explorer..
    Delete all but waypoint 1 and last one.

    A real pain --.- .-. .- .--. upgrade.

    Roger --. ....- --- .-- --.

    Just been playing again.
    For those , who like me , just want a few waypoints.
    Don't start a route.
    Right click on salient points on map and add waypoint.Parking and summit for
    you Richard.
    Open database and click on each waypoint you need to change icon for.
    Database - Save As .... name you want

    Roger

  18. "Paul Saunders" <[email hidden]> wrote in
    news:[email hidden]:

    Quoted message said:

    But here's the point I'm coming to. I don't know if all the latest
    Garmin models work in the same way, but in my 60CS, each route can
    hold up to 250 waypoints. However, they can only hold up to 50
    *normal* waypoints (user created with icons and names). This is
    something that isn't explained properly in the manual, and it's a
    while since I looked into this, but IIRC it seems that there are two
    kinds of route waypoints, one is the normal kind, another is a sort of
    "invisible" waypoint, i.e. they don't appear as waypoints in your GPS,
    but they do help to trace lots of twists and turns in your routes (but
    without eating up all your waypoint memory).

    I always upload my intended 'route' to the GPS (Geko 201) as a 'saved
    track', rather than a route. None of the trackpoints become waypoints. This
    way I can have as detailed a track as I like without cluttering it up with
    waypoints. Obviously I want some waypoints, but these are not part of the
    track. I am using tracklogs, so don't know if this is available in Anquet.

    John

  19. Richard Newstead said:
    Paul Saunders said:

    As far as GPS routes are concerned, I've never liked to have loads of
    waypoints in a route, just a few key waypoints usually work fine, you
    don't
    need to trace every twist and turn in order to produce a route that
    is easy
    to follow.

    Therein lies the problem. I dont use GPS for navigation and usually
    need just two clear waypoints for a typical day out. The first is where
    to park and the second is usually a summit. In the old version this was
    fine but the new one adds waypoint symbols at every click so I have
    hundreds of symbols on a twisty route. If I turn them off (reduce their
    size) they all go so I cant see the two key points any more.


    But you can add text anywhere - including a Waypoint - then switch off
    naming and switch on text.

    Quoted message said:


    I wonder if Anquet did any Beta testing with real users before
    releasing this software [Warning Stereotype Incoming] Maybe the average
    computer programmer relaxes with a PS2 and only needs to navigate
    between the TV and the fridge so perhaps they left them to test the
    software?


    They definitely did Beta testing (with real users) for the last big
    change (3d etc). I'd be surprised if they didn't do the same this time.

    druidh

  20. Roger leighton said:

    Just been playing again.

    This, for me, is the major problem. We're gradually finding out all of
    the ways to use the new system instead of being supplied with some sort
    of instruction manual - and the help is very basic.

    druidh

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