An Army of One

What was his 1500 free qualifying time? When are the US Olympic trials being held?

P.S.Is Larry going to show consistency over time and nations and comment that this shows a lack of
depth in US swimming? (c.f. his comments about Thorpe and Australian swimming) ;-)

"4precious" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
"]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

usa swimming has released Olympic Qualifier list.

Phelps qualifies for the Olympics Trials in the following events, with some rankings also listed
when he was one or two. Is this a U.S. record?

Eric

100m Freestyle 200m Freestyle (1) 400m Freestyle (1) 1500m Freestyle 100m Backstroke 200m
Backstroke (2) 200m Breastroke 100m Butterly (2) 200m Butterly (1) 200 I.M. (1) 400 I.m. (1)

It's an apples/oranges situation. Qualifying standards for Olympic Trials change per quadrennium.
For example, in Y2K Olympic Trial cuts were the same as US National cuts (substantially easier than
the Y2004 standards). So there were, I'm guessing, at least some swimmers who had 10 or more
qualifying events (including a kid who trained in the same pool where ekurth currently is striving
to rule the pool).

I love arguing swim team supremecy with Colin the same way I love arguing Michigan/Ohio State
football. But he makes a fatal blunder by bringing up the issue of depth, at least without
qualification. Take any year and look at the top 10 world depth chart and find a single year where
the USA doesn't come out on top. Perhaps, though, Colin refers to an unfortunate claim I may have
once made that, absent Ian, the Aussies would be hard pressed to claim to be in the running for the
world's best team title. OK, so that was uncalled for. But I think that now Colin suggests that the
same thing might be said about the US team, absent Michael, or, previously, the US women's team,
absent Natalie.

Moving beyond all of the above, I think ekurth is now suggesting that Phelps may be the greatest all
around swimmer in history. Time will tell, but who now would bet his/her own money against it?

With regard to the 1500, somehow I think that Michael would have no great difficulty achieving the
Olympic Trials standard in that event, as well. Make it a priority for him, and I think he'd be
competitive at the world level.

Looking at it another way, let's imagine a dual meet between Michael and any other swimmer in the
world, in which each swims all the Olympic events. Ian would take a strong second, but who else
would be even close?

Larry Weisenthal

Certitude is poison; curiosity is life

So what you're saying is that the world lacks depth? ;-)

"Larry Weisenthal" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
"]news:[email hidden]... <snip>

Quoted message said:

Looking at it another way, let's imagine a dual meet between Michael and

any

Quoted message said:

other swimmer in the world, in which each swims all the Olympic events.

Ian

Quoted message said:

would take a strong second, but who else would be even close?

Larry Weisenthal

Certitude is poison; curiosity is life

"Colin Priest" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:<[email hidden]>...

Quoted message said:

So what you're saying is that the world lacks depth? ;-)

"Larry Weisenthal" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
"]news:[email hidden]... <snip>

Quoted message said:

Looking at it another way, let's imagine a dual meet between Michael and

any

Quoted message said:

other swimmer in the world, in which each swims all the Olympic events.

Ian

Quoted message said:

would take a strong second, but who else would be even close?

Larry Weisenthal

Certitude is poison; curiosity is life

I seem to have lost the thread of this post on my computer, since I only show the one entry above.
Which is odd, since I started the post!

But anyways, after looking at the data of Phelps, I did have one idea. Maybe someone has already
mentioned it in the section which I can't see.

So here's the idea that may confront Phelps and his coach:

Instead of trying only to enter events in which he can get first, maybe he should try and enter all
the events that he thinks he can medal in.

Every truly great swimmer that comes along (Thorpe and Phelps on the men's side) knows that the big
fish out there is Mark Spitz and his 7 gold medals (4 individual)

But with regard to Phelps, maybe that's the wrong paradigm. Based on his U.S. rankings, it looks to
me like Phelps could possibly earn Olympic medals in 4 of the 5 disciplines: Fly, Free, Back, I.M.
Now I assume that has never been done. And earning medals of any color in so many strokes would make
him a legend. So maybe he's tired from all the quals and the finals in 400m free, that he gets
"only" bronze in 200 I.M., even though when rested he's a lock for the gold.

So then I thought, play it safe in Athens, maybe do something wild in 2008. So in Athens he does
100/200 Fly, 200,400 I.M. In Beijing he tries to get as many medals as possible. So maybe my idea is
four years early.

Eric

On Sun, 31 Aug 2003 19:29:48 +0000, Larry Weisenthal wrote:

<snip>

Quoted message said:

Looking at it another way, let's imagine a dual meet between Michael and any other swimmer in the
world, in which each swims all the Olympic events. Ian would take a strong second, but who else
would be even close?

Weell... I think he's retired, and it'd have to be scm, but maybe Jani?

Quoted message said:

Larry Weisenthal

Certitude is poison; curiosity is life

--Mike

Quoted message said:

(including a kid who trained in the same pool where ekurth currently is striving to rule
the pool).

I'm working hard at arching my lower back using the muscles just above my rear. And I relish the
kickboard sets, once again working on lower back arch and looking foward. I'm convinced it has
helped. But trust me, I will never rule that pool. When it comes to swimming, I'm not a "has been",
I'm a "never was". Age group/High School/College Swimmers are a different animal. (I was in the
Marching Band!)

Eric

[email hidden] (4precious) wrote in message
news:<[email hidden]>...

Quoted message said:

usa swimming has released Olympic Qualifier list.

Phelps qualifies for the Olympics Trials in the following events, with some rankings also listed
when he was one or two. Is this a U.S. record?

Eric

100m Freestyle 200m Freestyle (1) 400m Freestyle (1) 1500m Freestyle 100m Backstroke 200m
Backstroke (2) 200m Breastroke 100m Butterly (2) 200m Butterly (1) 200 I.M. (1) 400 I.m. (1)

Using the US Olympic qualifying times as a measure of Phelps was evidently not the thing to do as
the time standards change quite a bit. But usa-swimming has posted the World rankings based on best
times for 2003. That data should be quite valid. Phelps' World Rankings stack up as follows:

200m Free, 2 400m Free, 3 200m Back, 2 100m Fly, 2 200m Fly, 1 200m I.M., 1 400m I.M., 1

So in theory he could win individual medals in 7 events, 4 out of the 5 disciplines. Of course
actually pulling that off is a completely different matter.

Eric

You should, perhaps, have titled this "A Navy of One," or, alternatively, "A Coast Guard of One."

Surf's up in North Carolina.

[email hidden] (Larry Weisenthal) wrote in message
news:<[email hidden]>...

Quoted message said:

You should, perhaps, have titled this "A Navy of One," or, alternatively, "A Coast Guard of One."

Surf's up in North Carolina.

A good idea, except I don't think that those branches of the military have the same advertising
slogan as the Army.

And I think the current Army recruiting slogan, which you can see during their ads, "An Army of One"
is brilliant. It captures that us against the World mentality which Americans seem to love to
embrace. It traces its roots all the way back to the Pioneers settling a wild land, manifest
destiny, us attacking Iraq even though the whole World said it was a bad idea, etc.

The macho translation of their slogan is: "We don't need the team, I'm a bad enough mother *#!& all
by myself!"

Eric

What also needs to emphasized is that in 200 back, 200 free, 100 fly, there isn't much seperation
(0.1-0.8 sec) between the No.1 (Peirsol, Thorpe, Crocker) and No.2 (Phelps). All three are WR
holders. Phelps also ranks no.10 for 100 free in the world. SO in theory, he would qualify for 4X100
and 4X200 free relays too.

How many events he can actually swim in the Olympics is a diffenrent matter. It probably depends on
how much risk he is going to take.

[email hidden] (4precious) wrote in message
news:<[email hidden]>...

Quoted message said:

[email hidden] (4precious) wrote in message
news:<[email hidden]>...

Quoted message said:

usa swimming has released Olympic Qualifier list.

Phelps qualifies for the Olympics Trials in the following events, with some rankings also listed
when he was one or two. Is this a U.S. record?

Eric

100m Freestyle 200m Freestyle (1) 400m Freestyle (1) 1500m Freestyle 100m Backstroke 200m
Backstroke (2) 200m Breastroke 100m Butterly (2) 200m Butterly (1) 200 I.M. (1) 400 I.m. (1)

Using the US Olympic qualifying times as a measure of Phelps was evidently not the thing to do as
the time standards change quite a bit. But usa-swimming has posted the World rankings based on
best times for 2003. That data should be quite valid. Phelps' World Rankings stack up as follows:

200m Free, 2 400m Free, 3 200m Back, 2 100m Fly, 2 200m Fly, 1 200m I.M., 1 400m I.M., 1

So in theory he could win individual medals in 7 events, 4 out of the 5 disciplines. Of course
actually pulling that off is a completely different matter.

Eric

For the 200m free "there isn't much separation"? Hmm - 1 second isn't much separation? By your
definition no events (except the 1500m) have much separation. Next you'll be saying that there isn't
much separation in the 200IM.

"F.J." <[email hidden]> wrote in message
"]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

What also needs to emphasized is that in 200 back, 200 free, 100 fly, there isn't much seperation
(0.1-0.8 sec) between the No.1 (Peirsol, Thorpe, Crocker) and No.2 (Phelps). All three are WR
holders. Phelps also ranks no.10 for 100 free in the world. SO in theory, he would qualify for
4X100 and 4X200 free relays too.

How many events he can actually swim in the Olympics is a diffenrent matter. It probably depends
on how much risk he is going to take.

[email hidden] (4precious) wrote in message

news:<[email hidden]>...

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

[email hidden] (4precious) wrote in message

news:<[email hidden]>...

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

usa swimming has released Olympic Qualifier list.

Phelps qualifies for the Olympics Trials in the following events, with some rankings also
listed when he was one or two. Is this a U.S. record?

Eric

100m Freestyle 200m Freestyle (1) 400m Freestyle (1) 1500m Freestyle 100m Backstroke 200m
Backstroke (2) 200m Breastroke 100m Butterly (2) 200m Butterly (1) 200 I.M. (1) 400 I.m. (1)

Using the US Olympic qualifying times as a measure of Phelps was evidently not the thing to do
as the time standards change quite a bit. But usa-swimming has posted the World rankings based
on best times for 2003. That data should be quite valid. Phelps' World Rankings stack up as
follows:

200m Free, 2 400m Free, 3 200m Back, 2 100m Fly, 2 200m Fly, 1 200m I.M., 1 400m I.M., 1

So in theory he could win individual medals in 7 events, 4 out of the 5 disciplines. Of course
actually pulling that off is a completely different matter.

Eric