almost hit--damn drivers

My pulse went way up with fear-feelings just reading this. We really are
invisible, aren't we? And that's frightening.

Deep breath, indeed.

--M. Powell

"Deb" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

On a rec ride, probably at 25 of 40 that day, I'm on a straightaway

My pulse went way up with fear-feelings just reading this. We really are
invisible, aren't we? And that's frightening.

Deep breath, indeed.

--M. Powell

"Deb" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

On a rec ride, probably at 25 of 40 that day, I'm on a straightaway

Quoted message said:

Menace. She's a menace on the road, and NOT accepting any
responsibility for her errors. Do drivers have to actually kill
someone before they are taken off the road?????

not even then.

--
Knight-Toolworks & Custom Planes
Custom made wooden planes at reasonable prices
See http://www.knight-toolworks.com For prices and ordering instructions.

Deb wrote:
:: On a rec ride, probably at 25 of 40 that day, I'm on a straightaway
:: and a driver came to a stop sign on a road on the right which "T'd"
:: into the larger road that I was riding on. Mind you...there are LOTS
:: of bikers on this road ALL the time...so most cars know that.
::
:: I know that I am invisible on a bike...so i am very careful. I
:: continued straight, but just had a sense about this car...I kind of
:: slowed, and looked her in the eye...she looked back, I'm certain of
:: it (I run, too, and this is a method I use when running, and I'm not
:: dead yet). I was in the middle of the intersection and after SLOWING
:: at the stop sign, she ACCELERATED straight at me.
::
:: I hit the brakes, and swerved OUT of her way. She barely missed me
:: and kept going.
::
:: She got caught at the red light up the road. I pulled up beside her,
:: motioned for her to roll her window down, which she did, and politely
:: asked her what happened. She said...oh, I didn't see you, and turned
:: away. I was appalled. I continued the conversation, explaining that
:: I was right in front of her and she looked right at me. She told me
:: that I should be careful. AAAAAARGH. I told her that SHE should be
:: careful, and that she has the power to kill ME. NOT the other way
:: around.
::
:: Menace. She's a menace on the road, and NOT accepting any
:: responsibility for her errors. Do drivers have to actually kill
:: someone before they are taken off the road?????

Er, had she killed you she'd be still be driving, most likely (remember,
you're just playing around on a toy while she is doing important whatnots in
her car). She just would have said she didn't see you. As long as she's not
on drugs or drinking, or has a long record of killing people with her car,
she'd probably just get a traffic citation.

I had this happen to me too, though. You're looking someone right in the eye
and you assume they are paying attention. What you need to realize is that
there can be a disconnect in a person's head, and what you see is just a
blank stare. Try waving or shooting them the bird to get a response.
Either a friendly or a mean approach/response is better than being mowed
down (I'd choose the friendly approach 99% of the time).

"Deb" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

On a rec ride, probably at 25 of 40 that day, I'm on a straightaway
and a driver came to a stop sign on a road on the right which "T'd"
into the larger road that I was riding on. Mind you...there are LOTS
of bikers on this road ALL the time...so most cars know that.

I know that I am invisible on a bike...so i am very careful. I
continued straight, but just had a sense about this car...I kind of
slowed, and looked her in the eye...she looked back, I'm certain of it
(I run, too, and this is a method I use when running, and I'm not dead
yet). I was in the middle of the intersection and after SLOWING at the
stop sign, she ACCELERATED straight at me.

I hit the brakes, and swerved OUT of her way. She barely missed me and
kept going.

She got caught at the red light up the road. I pulled up beside her,
motioned for her to roll her window down, which she did, and politely
asked her what happened. She said...oh, I didn't see you, and turned
away. I was appalled. I continued the conversation, explaining that I
was right in front of her and she looked right at me. She told me
that I should be careful. AAAAAARGH. I told her that SHE should be
careful, and that she has the power to kill ME. NOT the other way
around.

Menace. She's a menace on the road, and NOT accepting any
responsibility for her errors. Do drivers have to actually kill
someone before they are taken off the road?????

Ok, deep breath!
Just needed to vent

It's worse than just us being invisible. We're HATED by many drivers. All
that disc jockey garbage from last year was evidence of that. I live an
hour away from Athens, GA where there's a thing called the Winter Bike
League that attracts a hundred or more riders each Saturday through the
winter. I have a veterinarian from Athens who came to the house to check my
horses. As we were talking, I mentioned that I'm into cycling and I asked
her if she saw a lot of cyclists in the Athens area. She said, "yes, we see
them every Saturday. They're a real nuisance. We hate them. We call them
$%#(!!." (I can't recall what she said she called them, but it wasn't
anything good.) I couldn't believe this fatass lady was saying this to one
of her customers who had just finished telling her he was an avid cyclist.

This, of course, is a lady who probably weighs 250 lbs and drives a Cadillac
Escalade. The WBL is a nuisance to her because it passes by her house one
morning per week? And it's not like a century ride where riders are strung
out along the road for hours. It's one pack of riders riding 2 abreast that
passes and it's done. But that's enough to make them a hated nuisance.

I think the real root of things is that 99% of drivers just can't relate to
anyone who is conscious of fitness. They see us and they feel guilt. They
know they should be riding a bike or doing something to keep fit, too. But
they're too weak-willed to do it. It's easier to just despise those of us
who aren't so weak-willed.

But I don't worry so much about those drivers who despise us. They fear the
consequences if they take any action against us. (Most don't realize that
there rarely are any.) I fear the ones who are oblivious already and who
are now oblivious while talking with someone on a cell phone. I got my body
parts rearranged by one of them 2 years ago.

Bob C.

Quoted message said:

Do drivers have to actually kill

someone before they are taken off the road?????

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

sadly enough, even drivers who kill are not taken off the road, nor are they
fined, or cited or anything.
http://tinyurl.com/42xks

josie was hit from behind and since there were no witnesses, there were zero
charges filed. a common refrain i've heard is: "the guilt of hitting and
killing a cyclist is the worst possible punishment". [censored]. take the
license away and punish the offender.

--

jmed

1 Dec 2004 07:59:50 -0800,
<[email hidden]>,

(Deb) said:

Menace. She's a menace on the road, and NOT accepting any
responsibility for her errors. Do drivers have to actually kill
someone before they are taken off the road?????

No. They get their licenses back pretty quick if they're even pulled
in the first place.

As regards the driver's attitude, get used to it.
They're mostly just scum.
--
zk

"Roger Zoul" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Deb wrote:
:: On a rec ride, probably at 25 of 40 that day, I'm on a straightaway
:: and a driver came to a stop sign on a road on the right which "T'd"
:: into the larger road that I was riding on. Mind you...there are LOTS
:: of bikers on this road ALL the time...so most cars know that.
::
:: I know that I am invisible on a bike...so i am very careful. I
:: continued straight, but just had a sense about this car...I kind of
:: slowed, and looked her in the eye...she looked back, I'm certain of
:: it (I run, too, and this is a method I use when running, and I'm not
:: dead yet). I was in the middle of the intersection and after SLOWING
:: at the stop sign, she ACCELERATED straight at me.
::
:: I hit the brakes, and swerved OUT of her way. She barely missed me
:: and kept going.
::
:: She got caught at the red light up the road. I pulled up beside her,
:: motioned for her to roll her window down, which she did, and politely
:: asked her what happened. She said...oh, I didn't see you, and turned
:: away. I was appalled. I continued the conversation, explaining that
:: I was right in front of her and she looked right at me. She told me
:: that I should be careful. AAAAAARGH. I told her that SHE should be
:: careful, and that she has the power to kill ME. NOT the other way
:: around.
::
:: Menace. She's a menace on the road, and NOT accepting any
:: responsibility for her errors. Do drivers have to actually kill
:: someone before they are taken off the road?????

Er, had she killed you she'd be still be driving, most likely (remember,
you're just playing around on a toy while she is doing important whatnots
in
her car). She just would have said she didn't see you. As long as she's
not
on drugs or drinking, or has a long record of killing people with her car,
she'd probably just get a traffic citation.

I had this happen to me too, though. You're looking someone right in the
eye
and you assume they are paying attention. What you need to realize is that
there can be a disconnect in a person's head, and what you see is just a
blank stare. Try waving or shooting them the bird to get a response.
Either a friendly or a mean approach/response is better than being mowed
down (I'd choose the friendly approach 99% of the time).

Roger,

Trust me ... from many years of experience out on Upstate roads. Keep that
finger reeled in as best you can. Rednecks REALLY overreact to that. I'm
afraid that, for me, it's as instinctive as pulling my hand away from
something very hot. I get buzzed and out pops the finger. How'd that
happen? I was gonna control that, but there it is again. It was really
embarassing the day I was riding with a pastor friend of mine who's getting
into the sport and a car buzzed us. Ooops ... sorry pastor. I forgot
myself.

Anyway, my experience is that the finger usually makes any situation worse.

A little story. I used to do lots of weight training. I'm a mesomorph, so
a little went a long way in bulking me up. It wasn't good for my cycling,
but I did it anyway. One day this little pickup buzzed me. I flipped him
off. He slammed on the brakes and threw the vehicle into reverse. His
tires were squeeling as he peeled towards me. He was determined to run me
down. I had to dive off the road and went head first into a ditch. As the
truck came to a stop, I got up and grabbed my frame pump. The driver was
coming around the back of the truck and had an empty bottle in his hand and
was weilding it like he was gonna hit me. I had my frame pump in hand and
was weilding it like I was gonna hit him.

This guy had long, greasy black hair, a sleeveless T-shirt with a rebel
flag, jeans with a big black belt and a wallet on a chain and square-toed
Harley boots. He was a tough cookie. I'm only about 5'7. But as I said,
I'm fit and I was REALLY fit then. I came out of that ditch with my eyes on
fire. I was ready to kill. This guy comes around the back of his truck,
gets a good look at me, drops the bottle, gets back in the truck and he's
off. At that point I nearly did a Kevin Costner like in Dances with Wolves
.... about three steps backward, then pass out.

Anyway, the guy was like 5'2! HA! I lucked out on that one. Got his tag
and reported it. Nothing ever came of it.

Bob

On Wed, 1 Dec 2004 11:11:17 -0700, "Jason Medeiros"
<[email hidden]> wrote in message
<[email hidden]>:

Quoted message said:

a common refrain i've heard is: "the guilt of hitting and
killing a cyclist is the worst possible punishment"

Perhaps they'd like to swap places and see if they still think that?

Guy
--
May contain traces of irony. Contents liable to settle after posting.
http://www.chapmancentral.co.uk

88% of helmet statistics are made up, 65% of them at Washington University

psycholist wrote:
:: "Roger Zoul" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
:: news:[email hidden]...
::: Deb wrote:
::::: On a rec ride, probably at 25 of 40 that day, I'm on a
::::: straightaway and a driver came to a stop sign on a road on the
::::: right which "T'd" into the larger road that I was riding on.
::::: Mind you...there are LOTS of bikers on this road ALL the
::::: time...so most cars know that.
:::::
::::: I know that I am invisible on a bike...so i am very careful. I
::::: continued straight, but just had a sense about this car...I kind
::::: of slowed, and looked her in the eye...she looked back, I'm
::::: certain of it (I run, too, and this is a method I use when
::::: running, and I'm not dead yet). I was in the middle of the
::::: intersection and after SLOWING at the stop sign, she ACCELERATED
::::: straight at me.
:::::
::::: I hit the brakes, and swerved OUT of her way. She barely missed me
::::: and kept going.
:::::
::::: She got caught at the red light up the road. I pulled up beside
::::: her, motioned for her to roll her window down, which she did, and
::::: politely asked her what happened. She said...oh, I didn't see
::::: you, and turned away. I was appalled. I continued the
::::: conversation, explaining that I was right in front of her and she
::::: looked right at me. She told me that I should be careful.
::::: AAAAAARGH. I told her that SHE should be careful, and that she
::::: has the power to kill ME. NOT the other way around.
:::::
::::: Menace. She's a menace on the road, and NOT accepting any
::::: responsibility for her errors. Do drivers have to actually kill
::::: someone before they are taken off the road?????
:::
::: Er, had she killed you she'd be still be driving, most likely
::: (remember, you're just playing around on a toy while she is doing
::: important whatnots in
::: her car). She just would have said she didn't see you. As long as
::: she's not
::: on drugs or drinking, or has a long record of killing people with
::: her car, she'd probably just get a traffic citation.
:::
::: I had this happen to me too, though. You're looking someone right
::: in the eye
::: and you assume they are paying attention. What you need to realize
::: is that there can be a disconnect in a person's head, and what you
::: see is just a blank stare. Try waving or shooting them the bird to
::: get a response. Either a friendly or a mean approach/response is
::: better than being mowed down (I'd choose the friendly approach 99%
::: of the time).
:::
::
:: Roger,
::
:: Trust me ... from many years of experience out on Upstate roads.
:: Keep that finger reeled in as best you can. Rednecks REALLY
:: overreact to that. I'm afraid that, for me, it's as instinctive as
:: pulling my hand away from something very hot. I get buzzed and out
:: pops the finger. How'd that happen? I was gonna control that, but
:: there it is again. It was really embarassing the day I was riding
:: with a pastor friend of mine who's getting into the sport and a car
:: buzzed us. Ooops ... sorry pastor. I forgot myself.
::
:: Anyway, my experience is that the finger usually makes any situation
:: worse.
::
:: A little story. I used to do lots of weight training. I'm a
:: mesomorph, so a little went a long way in bulking me up. It wasn't
:: good for my cycling, but I did it anyway. One day this little
:: pickup buzzed me. I flipped him off. He slammed on the brakes and
:: threw the vehicle into reverse. His tires were squeeling as he
:: peeled towards me. He was determined to run me down. I had to dive
:: off the road and went head first into a ditch. As the truck came to
:: a stop, I got up and grabbed my frame pump. The driver was coming
:: around the back of the truck and had an empty bottle in his hand and
:: was weilding it like he was gonna hit me. I had my frame pump in
:: hand and was weilding it like I was gonna hit him.
::
:: This guy had long, greasy black hair, a sleeveless T-shirt with a
:: rebel flag, jeans with a big black belt and a wallet on a chain and
:: square-toed Harley boots. He was a tough cookie. I'm only about
:: 5'7. But as I said, I'm fit and I was REALLY fit then. I came out
:: of that ditch with my eyes on fire. I was ready to kill. This guy
:: comes around the back of his truck, gets a good look at me, drops
:: the bottle, gets back in the truck and he's off. At that point I
:: nearly did a Kevin Costner like in Dances with Wolves ... about
:: three steps backward, then pass out.
::
:: Anyway, the guy was like 5'2! HA! I lucked out on that one. Got
:: his tag and reported it. Nothing ever came of it.
::
:: Bob

Boy - you tell good stories, Bob. But I'll tell you a secret -- I've never
actually given anyone the finger. When I lived in L.A. I had a friend who
did it all the time while driving in freeway traffic, so I have these images
of him flipping people off. But I've never been able to do it myself. I've
only been flipped off once myself that I can remember. Oh, I do flip folks
off in my head, though. All the time, in fact 🙂

In article <[email hidden]>,
Deb <[email hidden]> wrote:

She might have been drunk. As a responsible citizen you should have
tried *DUI.

Quoted message said:

Menace. She's a menace on the road, and NOT accepting any
responsibility for her errors. Do drivers have to actually kill
someone before they are taken off the road?????

No. Sometimes one death isn't enough.

Quoted message said:

Ok, deep breath!
Just needed to vent

--
<a href="http://www.poohsticks.org/drew/">Home Page</a>
9/11 was a premptive attack

Quoted message said:

Boy - you tell good stories, Bob. But I'll tell you a secret -- I've
never
actually given anyone the finger. When I lived in L.A. I had a friend who
did it all the time while driving in freeway traffic, so I have these
images
of him flipping people off. But I've never been able to do it myself.
I've
only been flipped off once myself that I can remember. Oh, I do flip
folks
off in my head, though. All the time, in fact 🙂

Roger,

I commend you on your self-control.

Bob

"psycholist" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:<[email hidden]>...

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

I think the real root of things is that 99% of drivers just can't

relate to

Quoted message said:

anyone who is conscious of fitness. They see us and they feel guilt. >
Bob C.

That's pretty judgmental. Having cycled on busy roads for over 40
years I think that the % of drivers who are really a threat is is
quite small--probably under 1%. Of course, those are the ones you
remember and when it goes bad it goes very bad very quickly.

At least where I live the vast majority of drivers are very careful
around cyclists. But since the average driving speed on most of the
major streets is ~50 mph whenever someone gets hit the result is
disastrous. but it is still a small %.

Deb said:

Menace. She's a menace on the road, and NOT accepting any
responsibility for her errors. Do drivers have to actually kill
someone before they are taken off the road?????

Call the cops. You had the right of way and she has broken the law.

--Blair
"Hit her with your water bottle.
It won't leave any bruises.
At least, none she'll want to
explain."

"gds" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

"psycholist" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:<[email hidden]>...

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

I think the real root of things is that 99% of drivers just can't

relate to

Quoted message said:

anyone who is conscious of fitness. They see us and they feel guilt. >
Bob C.

That's pretty judgmental. Having cycled on busy roads for over 40
years I think that the % of drivers who are really a threat is is
quite small--probably under 1%. Of course, those are the ones you
remember and when it goes bad it goes very bad very quickly.

At least where I live the vast majority of drivers are very careful
around cyclists. But since the average driving speed on most of the
major streets is ~50 mph whenever someone gets hit the result is
disastrous. but it is still a small %.

It may be judgemental. It's also experiencial.

Bob C.

Deb said:

...and looked her in the eye...she looked back, I'm

certain of it

Quoted message said:

(I run, too, and this is a method I use when running, and

I'm not dead

Quoted message said:

yet). I was in the middle of the intersection and after

SLOWING at the

Quoted message said:

stop sign, she ACCELERATED straight at me.

Congratulations on your narrow escape.
The "look them in the eye" method is quite fallible.
For one thing, how do you know, when they look you in the
eye, that THEY don't think "I'm looking her in the eye. She
will stop for me."
For another, you can't really tell if they are focusing on
you.

--
Mike Kruger
Who got left hooked last year by a driver who was looking
straight at him the entire way, and then drove off without
so much as slowing down. (Luckily I avoided him by endo'ing
and only my back wheel swung around and hit his car; I only
had 5 stitches in my chin and a wrecked back wheel.)

Wed, 1 Dec 2004 21:05:09 -0600,
<1101956724.H5KjhlENYJdQD95gQFvAVw@teranews>, "Mike Kruger"

Quoted message said:

Deb said:

...and looked her in the eye...she looked back, I'm certain of it
(I run, too, and this is a method I use when running, and I'm not dead
yet). I was in the middle of the intersection and after SLOWING at the
stop sign, she ACCELERATED straight at me.

Congratulations on your narrow escape.

Seconded.

Quoted message said:

The "look them in the eye" method is quite fallible.
For one thing, how do you know, when they look you in the
eye, that THEY don't think "I'm looking her in the eye. She
will stop for me."

Too often that's an open invitation for cagers to try intimidation.

I'm starting to consciously avoid eye-contact in several situations
where I'd before thought it important. The situation Deb describes is
one of those. I'm watching for other telltale signs but not
acknowledging their presence. I started doing this whenever I saw
people wearing those assinine dark tinted face shields.
I'm still experimenting with the tactic but one place it seems to work
is at stop signs. They'll take the right of way more quickly if you're
not looking.

Negotiating in close with eye contact and head nods works well between
experienced drivers and cyclists of similar cultural backgrounds.

Quoted message said:

For another, you can't really tell if they are focusing on
you.

In many light conditions you can't tell if there even is a driver.
--
zk

"psycholist" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:<[email hidden]>...

Quoted message said:

"gds" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

"psycholist" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:<[email hidden]>...

Quoted message said:

> I think the real root of things is that 99% of drivers just can't

relate to

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

anyone who is conscious of fitness. They see us and they feel guilt. >
Bob C.

That's pretty judgmental. Having cycled on busy roads for over 40
years I think that the % of drivers who are really a threat is is
quite small--probably under 1%. Of course, those are the ones you
remember and when it goes bad it goes very bad very quickly.

At least where I live the vast majority of drivers are very careful
around cyclists. But since the average driving speed on most of the
major streets is ~50 mph whenever someone gets hit the result is
disastrous. but it is still a small %.

It may be judgemental. It's also experiencial.

Bob C.

That's ok. I'm all for empirical evidence. So you really have some of
that evidence that 99% of all drivers are a threat and that they are
so because they are essentially jealous of your fitness. You must live
in an area in which I've never visited.