General fitness, health and nutrition · Public discussion

Alcohol stoves

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General fitness, health and nutrition
Published
22 March 2004
Last activity
6 April 2004
Original author
Crash Test
Posts
59
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  1. "AndyP" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
    "]news:[email hidden]...

    Quoted message said:

    "Ian Walker" <[email hidden]> wrote

    Quoted message said:

    I find that I can always use my rucksack/coat/whatever
    as a windshield. I've certainly never really needed to
    carry a separate item just for that purpose, which is
    rather contrary to the principles of lightweight hiking!

    Carrying a stove at all is rather contrary to the
    principles of


    lightweight

    Quoted message said:

    hiking.

    Could I just be the first one to say "balderdash!"?
    --
    Mark South Citizen of the World, Denizen of the Net <<Tiens!
    Ce poulet a une grenade!

  2. Ken said:

    Trangia stoves use alcohol. Not the quickest boil, not
    the lightest, not the most fuel efficient, but very
    very rugged and reliable - and works better the windier
    it gets.

    I just also rely on an MSR dragonfly these days which I find
    is probably as reliable as it gets.

  3. Ken said:

    Having been considerably disappointed with about gas
    burners, I'd be interested in other people's experiences
    of multifuel/petrol/kerosene burners; IMHO the biggest
    advantage they impart is for 3+ day trips, where the
    relative inefficiency and unavailability of alcohol for
    fuel can be a logistical problem; but I suspect that they
    too require considerable attention, and degrade
    substantially in the wind.

    I went over to using an MSR Dragonfly after being caught out
    several times in France, not being able to get a canister in
    little villages in the mountains - everyone stocks Camping
    Gaz but there are days when they are awaiting delivery -
    just my luck. With the Dragonfly I can use diesel if I need
    to and you can get that anywhere.

    The main disadvantage of multi fuel stoves is weight but
    they're not really that heavy. Of course the fuel adds to
    the weight but then you'd be carrying fuel anyway. Some
    observations:

    The wind shield supplied with MSR multi fuel stoves are
    pretty effective and you shouldn't have to worry about
    wind too much.

    Priming these stoves is far easier than people think.

    Cleaning the stoves is pretty easy, you just shake out the
    fuel line and soot comes out, again pretty easy.

    These stoves are very stable because they are near the
    ground.

    I have found them to be more reliable than gas particularly
    at altitude (not talking great heights here).

    Finally, the multi fuel stoves are expensive to buy in the
    first place. But fuel capacity, usage and economy can be
    very impressive. And they are far more versatile to cook
    with. I consider mine to have been a very good investment.

  4. "Andy Howell" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
    "]news:[email hidden]...

    Quoted message said:

    On 23/3/04 8:53 am, in article c3otli$2eic$1@uns-
    a.ucl.ac.uk, "Ken"

    Quoted message said:

    Having been considerably disappointed with about gas
    burners, I'd be interested in other people's experiences
    of multifuel/petrol/kerosene burners; IMHO the biggest
    advantage they impart is for 3+ day trips,


    where

    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:

    the relative inefficiency and unavailability of alcohol
    for fuel can be


    a

    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:

    logistical problem; but I suspect that they too require
    considerable attention, and degrade substantially in
    the wind.

    I went over to using an MSR Dragonfly after being caught
    out several times in France, not being able to get a
    canister in little villages in the mountains - everyone
    stocks Camping Gaz but there are days when they are
    awaiting delivery - just my luck. With the Dragonfly I can
    use diesel if


    I

    Quoted message said:

    need to and you can get that anywhere.

    The main disadvantage of multi fuel stoves is weight but
    they're not


    really

    Quoted message said:

    that heavy. Of course the fuel adds to the weight but then
    you'd be carrying fuel anyway. Some observations:

    The wind shield supplied with MSR multi fuel stoves are
    pretty effective


    and

    Quoted message said:

    you shouldn't have to worry about wind too much.

    Priming these stoves is far easier than people think.

    Cleaning the stoves is pretty easy, you just shake out the
    fuel line and soot comes out, again pretty easy.

    These stoves are very stable because they are near
    the ground.

    I have found them to be more reliable than gas
    particularly at altitude


    (not

    Quoted message said:

    talking great heights here).

    Finally, the multi fuel stoves are expensive to buy in the
    first place.


    But

    Quoted message said:

    fuel capacity, usage and economy can be very impressive.
    And they are far more versatile to cook with. I consider
    mine to have been a very good investment.

    Thanks - very good observations. I had my eye on the
    Dragonfly for a long time before my missus convinced me to
    go for the gas stove. Drat, and double drat!

  5. "Ken" <[email hidden]> wrote

    Quoted message said:

    Thanks - very good observations. I had my eye on the
    Dragonfly for a long time before my missus convinced me to
    go for the gas stove. Drat, and


    double

    Quoted message said:

    drat!

    A search of the UK legal code fails to reveal any stricture
    against ownership of more than one stove(*). Buy as many as
    you like. Or make them (links given earlier in thread).

    Note that wearing out stoves is not an option, even cheap
    gas stoves last for years and years.

    (*) But I'm sure Gordon Brown will place a tax on additional
    stoves soon after taxing walkers on their mileage.
    --
    Mark South Citizen of the World, Denizen of the Net <<Tiens!
    Ce poulet a une grenade!

  6. "Mark South" <[email hidden]> wrote

    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:

    Carrying a stove at all is rather contrary to the
    principles of


    lightweight

    Quoted message said:

    hiking.

    Quoted message said:

    Could I just be the first one to say "balderdash!"?

    S'true. Dr. Harkel Farkel's legendary bible for lightweight
    ambling and rambling entitled "What the f**k are you
    carrying that for you muppet?" rule number 46 states: Leave
    your stove and pasta at home and live off chocolate. I
    believe similar advice is issued in seminars to anyone
    attending tramp college. You'll never find a tramp carrying
    a stove but they'll all have a Mars bar or two secreted
    about their person for days when they can't be arsed to lift
    a chicken. It's my only ambition in life to become a member
    of The Worshipful Association of Tramps ([censored]) and I'm
    saving up for tramp college at this very moment.

  7. The message <[email hidden]>
    from "Mark South" <[email hidden]> contains these words:

    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:

    Carrying a stove at all is rather contrary to the
    principles of lightweight hiking.

    Quoted message said:

    Could I just be the first one to say "balderdash!"?

    You can but you are wrong. Hiking carries no connotations of
    overnighting, rather the reverse in fact. And even
    backpacking can be accomplished without the luxury of hot
    food and drink if minimizing weight is the highest priority.

    --
    Roger

  8. Quoted message said:

    arsed to lift a chicken. It's my only ambition in life
    to become a member of The Worshipful Association of
    Tramps ([censored]) and I'm saving up for tramp college at
    this very moment.


    Well I hope Tramp College know the new SQA guidelines on
    computing projects. I dont want you sending in any "How many
    Munroes R there in Livingston" messages.

    Richard Webb

  9. Ken said:

    Thanks - very good observations. I had my eye on the
    Dragonfly for a long time before my missus convinced me to
    go for the gas stove. Drat, and double drat!

    This definitely fits into the definition of expensive kit
    that you acquire over years and lasts for years ...

  10. Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:

    Carrying a stove at all is rather contrary to the
    principles of lightweight hiking.

    Quoted message said:

    Could I just be the first one to say "balderdash!"?

    S'true.

    Yeah, I'm with Andy on this - by the time you've packed
    stove, pans, fuel and food you are looking at a minimum of a
    kilo with the very lightest kit and quite possibly twice
    that. If supplies are available every day then I leave the
    stove behind every time.

    --
    Boo

  11. "RJ Webb" <[email hidden]> wrote

    Quoted message said:

    Well I hope Tramp College know the new SQA guidelines on
    computing projects. I dont want you sending in any "How
    many Munroes R there in Livingston" messages.

    I don't think posting messages to newsgroups is on the
    syllabus. Communication between tramps is still based more
    on things like leaving a bent hazel twig by a farm gate to
    convey the message "Farmer goes to pub till chucking out
    time every Friday, dogs friendly, 4 star barn accommodation
    and wife's a bit of a goer".

  12. "AndyP" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
    "]news:[email hidden]...

    Quoted message said:

    "RJ Webb" <[email hidden]> wrote

    Quoted message said:

    Well I hope Tramp College know the new SQA guidelines on
    computing projects. I dont want you sending in any "How
    many Munroes R there in Livingston" messages.

    I don't think posting messages to newsgroups is on the
    syllabus. Communication between tramps is still based more
    on things like leaving a bent hazel twig by a farm gate to
    convey the message "Farmer goes to pub till chucking out
    time every Friday, dogs friendly, 4 star barn
    accommodation and wife's a bit of a goer".

    Gosh you have thoughts like that this early in the morning!

    ---
    Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. Checked by AVG anti-
    virus system (grisoft.comgrisoft.com). Version: 6.0.634 /
    Virus Database: 406 - Release Date: 18/03/2004

  13. AC said:


    Gosh you have thoughts like that this early in the
    morning!

    Disturbing !!!

  14. [email hidden] (Crash Test) wrote in message news:<[email hidden]>...

    Quoted message said:

    Hey all,

    I was wondering if anyone had had much experience with
    alcohol stoves?

    I have to confess to always having always used a gas stove
    in the field before now, but curiousity had been sparked
    and the US style pepsi can stove
    (pcthiker.compepsistove.shtml)

    I have a gas stove which I don't use these days since I
    found alcohol
    - Hic!! I toyed with the idea of making a lightweight tin
    can stove, but I am a clumsy fool and the possibility
    of falling and crushing the stove whilst in my pack
    became a worry.

    I bought a Trangia, just to try out an alcohol stove and the
    solid construction, whilst a little heavier is very robust
    to say the least. Others have mentioned that it is reliable,
    especially in wind, and I use it in the tent vestibule in
    foul weather. The fuel weight is a little more than others,
    but for a 2 - 3 day trip its not a great problem. (I also
    get the additional psychological benefit of my load getting
    measurably lighter with each meal). 🙂

    All in all I'm glad I got the Trangia and IMHO the
    robustness is more important than saving a few grams and/or
    quid by making a Pepsi stove.

    I am looking to extending the length of my trips and I had
    been wondering about an MSR Dragonfly and the postings here
    have confirmed it as a good choice.

    Quoted message said:

    Frankly, I should have gotten a blue peter badge!

    Make one yourself - it's cheaper & up to 0.37 grams lighter
    if you use a titanium pin!

    Steve

  15. "AndyP" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
    "]news:[email hidden]...

    Quoted message said:

    "RJ Webb" <[email hidden]> wrote

    Quoted message said:

    Well I hope Tramp College know the new SQA guidelines on
    computing projects. I dont want you sending in any "How
    many Munroes R there in Livingston" messages.

    I don't think posting messages to newsgroups is on the
    syllabus. Communication between tramps is still based more
    on things like leaving a bent hazel twig by a farm gate to
    convey the message "Farmer goes to pub till chucking out
    time every Friday, dogs friendly, 4 star barn
    accommodation and wife's a bit of a goer".


    LOL. So *thats* what a bent hazel twig means!

    KRO

  16. "Roger" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
    "]news:[email hidden]...

    Quoted message said:

    The message <[email hidden]> from "Mark
    South" <[email hidden]> contains these words:

    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:

    Carrying a stove at all is rather contrary to the
    principles of lightweight hiking.

    Quoted message said:

    Could I just be the first one to say "balderdash!"?

    You can but you are wrong.

    You forgot to add "IMHO".

    Quoted message said:

    Hiking carries no connotations of overnighting, rather the
    reverse in fact. And even backpacking can be accomplished
    without the luxury of hot food and drink if minimizing
    weight is the highest priority.

    If minimising weight is the highest priority, then stay on
    the nudist beach and don't walk further than 100m from the
    beach bar.

    If your principles don't survive the test of reductio ad
    absurdum they are useless.
    --
    Mark South Citizen of the World, Denizen of the Net <<Tiens!
    Ce poulet a une grenade!

  17. "Boo" <boo@spam_me_no_spam.net> wrote in message
    "]news:[email hidden]...

    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:

    >Carrying a stove at all is rather contrary to the
    >principles of lightweight hiking.

    Quoted message said:

    Could I just be the first one to say "balderdash!"?

    S'true.

    Yeah, I'm with Andy on this - by the time you've packed
    stove, pans, fuel and food you are looking at a minimum of
    a kilo with the very lightest kit and quite possibly twice
    that. If supplies are available every day then I leave the
    stove behind every time.

    FACT: it may be a very good idea to leave the stove behind.

    FACT: it may be a very good idea to take a stove.

    FACT: it may not be necessary to eat for 48 hrs.

    FACT: the _principle_ (there's only one) of lightweight
    hiking is not to take anything that isn't necessary. If you
    are going to need to melt snow to drink, then you need a
    stove. If you are a diabetic you will need to eat at
    shortish intervals. So even going ultralightweight for a
    single day on the hill will involve food.

    Principles that mislead are not useful principles.

    Do you guys get it yet?
    --
    Mark South Citizen of the World, Denizen of the Net <<Tiens!
    Ce poulet a une grenade!

  18. The message <[email hidden]>
    from "Mark South" <[email hidden]> contains these words:

    snip

    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:

    > Carrying a stove at all is rather contrary to the
    > principles of lightweight hiking.

    Quoted message said:

    Could I just be the first one to say "balderdash!"?

    You can but you are wrong.

    Quoted message said:

    You forgot to add "IMHO".

    No I did not.

    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:

    Hiking carries no connotations of overnighting, rather
    the reverse in fact. And even backpacking can be
    accomplished without the luxury of hot food and drink if
    minimizing weight is the highest priority.

    Quoted message said:

    If minimising weight is the highest priority, then stay on
    the nudist beach and don't walk further than 100m from the
    beach bar.

    Tell that to the nutter who has just walked the length
    of Great Britain dressed in no more than footware and
    a rucksack.

    Quoted message said:

    If your principles don't survive the test of reductio ad
    absurdum they are useless.

    You should try applying that to your own absurd stance.

    --
    Roger

  19. "KRO" <[email hidden]> wrote

    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:

    I don't think posting messages to newsgroups is on the
    syllabus. Communication between tramps is still based
    more on things like leaving


    a

    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:

    bent hazel twig by a farm gate to convey the message
    "Farmer goes to pub till chucking out time every Friday,
    dogs friendly, 4 star barn accommodation and wife's a
    bit of a goer".

    Quoted message said:

    LOL. So *thats* what a bent hazel twig means!

    Well only if its the top three inches bent to an angle of 45
    degrees. If it was the top two inches bent at 60 degrees
    it'd mean "Don't bother with the barrelled cider in the
    barn, tastes like rat's [censored]". That's why every tramp
    carries a protractor and why they insist on GCSE geometry to
    get into tramp college. It's also why you see squirrels
    laughing madly and falling out of hazel trees whilst a
    scruffy old bloke comes legging it out of a farmyard with a
    border collie hanging off his trouser leg and a red faced
    farmer's wife in hot pursuit.

  20. "Roger" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
    "]news:[email hidden]...

    Quoted message said:

    The message <[email hidden]> from "Mark
    South" <[email hidden]> contains these words:

    snip

    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:

    > > Carrying a stove at all is rather contrary to the
    > > principles of lightweight hiking.

    > Could I just be the first one to say "balderdash!"?

    You can but you are wrong.

    Quoted message said:

    You forgot to add "IMHO".

    No I did not.

    You did, it wasn't in the post you made.

    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:

    Hiking carries no connotations of overnighting, rather
    the reverse in fact. And even backpacking can be
    accomplished without the luxury of hot food and drink
    if minimizing weight is the highest priority.

    Quoted message said:

    If minimising weight is the highest priority, then stay
    on the nudist


    beach

    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:

    and don't walk further than 100m from the beach bar.

    Tell that to the nutter who has just walked the length of
    Great Britain dressed in no more than footware and a
    rucksack.

    If he were really dedicated about travelling light he could
    have ditched the footwear and the sac.

    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:

    If your principles don't survive the test of reductio ad
    absurdum they


    are

    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:

    useless.

    You should try applying that to your own absurd stance.

    Translation: nyah nyah nyah.
    --
    Mark South Citizen of the World, Denizen of the Net <<Tiens!
    Ce poulet a une grenade!

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