Advice on tandem purchasing please

"Simon L" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
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Now I've got a five month old nipper I think it would be nice for us
all to go out cycling and a tandem with child seat seems ideal. Living
in hilly Wales I could do with a decent gear range. Touring potential
would be nice.

Ebay do them for a couple of hundred quid up; do cheap bikes just use
normal bike rims and spokes? The weight of the three of us on two
wheels sounds a bit iffy.

Most of the secondhand ebay ones are listed as having been sat in
garages unused for 10 years or so which makes me wonder whether I want
to splash out larger sums for a bike that might not get much use. Think
I could get a bargain for £400??

Cheers.

From what I have seen something like a Mission tandem would probably be what
you want ... bit like a "stretch mountain bike" - quite tough and available
new with warranty in the sort of price range you state (and seem to be quite
saleable too when you have finsihed with it)

Why not go and rent a tandem first for a few test runs (some renatl places
that sell bikes will off-set renatl charges against a purchase) .... it's a
different sort of ride and your stoker may not take to the idea.

The other thinh to remember with a tandem is that they are a PITA to put
in/on a car ... so plan trips starting from home!

RG

"Simon L" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
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Quoted message said:

Ebay do them for a couple of hundred quid up; do cheap bikes just use
normal bike rims and spokes? The weight of the three of us on two
wheels sounds a bit iffy.

Have you seen the stock answer to "should I buy this cheap bike for x
quid" - it's normally that you've got to pay 200sq+ to get a single bike
which isn't a pile of crud. Now apply that to tandems :-)

OTOH our tandems use normal bike rims and spokes - a good 36 hole 26" wheel
is plenty strong enough for what you want.

Quoted message said:

Most of the secondhand ebay ones are listed as having been sat in
garages unused for 10 years or so which makes me wonder whether I want
to splash out larger sums for a bike that might not get much use. Think
I could get a bargain for £400??

I have done in the past. I got a dawes galaxy twin for that price - one of
the later steel ones, not to be confused with the older super galaxy twins,
which are wobbly creatures.
For 500 quid I got an ally dawes double edge in good nick - that was a very
good buy.

For 525 quid, you can get a new Dawes Discovery - this is a decent bike.

The Tandem Club have for sale adverts. In the past I've made myself
unpopular there by pointing out the ridiculous prices people ask for old
bikes. Tandems have benefited more than single bikes from fat tubes and
modern freehub designs - as such, the modern bikes are rather better than
the old ones, but the prices people ask don't appear to reflect this.

So, what's on ebay at the moment?

'New Konekt Adult Tandem (etc)'. Almost certainly a dreadful bike.

'Tandem Mountain Bike Shiman orbita'. Ditto. If you're just after a pootling
to the pub bike, 150 quid isn't bad. But don't expect it to be good for more
than a couple of miles.

'Tandem Bicycle F.H.Grubb'. An enthusiast's bike. Some people love these
older bikes - not me.

'Pashley Tandem'. Pootling to the pub, yes, but it'll handle like a piece of
spaghetti.

'Dawes Discovery Twin Tandem'. A good bike. I'd maybe go to 300 quid for
that if the components are in reasonable fettle. But consider the price of a
new one...

'Tandem Twenty'. Yes, well.

'Thorn Voyager Enduro'. Another good bike. Maybe go to 450 since it's got a
roof rack included.

'Swallow Toucan'. Quite posh this one, and probably quite quick. Doesn't
suit me though. 800?

'Dawes Two Across'. Good again. 500 seems a bit steep, however if you want
drops it may be worth the extra.

'Globetrotter Tandem'. Doesn't look anything special, but 75 quid for a pub
bike?

'Tandem Cycle - claud butler'. Probably quite light, but you tend to get
that if you make things from string like this one is. I wouldn't bother.

'Galaxy twin 700c Alloy' - Good bike. 700-800? New is 1050 quid, not 1200...

'Dawes Double Edge MTB' - another good bike. New can be 600 quid though, or
800 for the 2005 model, so s/h for 400?

All the new bikes I've mentioned are from JD Cycles in Ilkley - they're a
good real bike shop with nice people, so I'd recommend them. I suspect the
better bikes in the list above will sell for rather too much - new may well
offer a better deal.

cheers,
clive

"Simon L" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Now I've got a five month old nipper I think it would be nice for us
all to go out cycling and a tandem with child seat seems ideal. Living
in hilly Wales I could do with a decent gear range. Touring potential
would be nice.

Ebay do them for a couple of hundred quid up; do cheap bikes just use
normal bike rims and spokes? The weight of the three of us on two
wheels sounds a bit iffy.

Most of the secondhand ebay ones are listed as having been sat in
garages unused for 10 years or so which makes me wonder whether I want
to splash out larger sums for a bike that might not get much use. Think
I could get a bargain for £400??

I live in hilly Wales and have tandem. A Dawes bought new from St john's
Cycles in 1999 for £670. I have dropped the gearing by fitting a 32 tooth
rear cassette so Janet and I can get up most hills (we would walk up the
Devil's Staircase).

I also had to spend £70 on a suspension seatpost because I was very bad at
warning Janet about holes in the road. Prior to buying the Dawes we had a go
on a cheaper (older) tandem - don't buy a cheaper (older) tandem.

If my Dawes were for sale I would expect to get £400 at least. So you may
consider setting your base price at £400 for a fully working tandem with
nothing to spend. Then be prepared to spend a bit more.

John

Simon L said:

Now I've got a five month old nipper I think it would be nice for us
all to go out cycling and a tandem with child seat seems ideal. Living
in hilly Wales I could do with a decent gear range.

And brakes, if you value your life!

BugBear

Simon L said:

Now I've got a five month old nipper I think it would be nice for us
all to go out cycling and a tandem with child seat seems ideal. Living
in hilly Wales I could do with a decent gear range. Touring potential
would be nice.

I've got a Dawes Discovery Twin. Seems a good starting point quility
wise to me. As in having proper tandem 48 spoke wheels. Suspension
seatpost for stoker etc.
Sizing wise I have the 51/41 cm. I got the adjustable stem swapped
by the dealer for a longer one and with that change it fits me (6ft3 16
stone) and at the time of purchase my 11 year old daughter or my wife
as stoker.
I read a lot of the tandem club threads before buying the bike and
a regular point made was that to avoid problems with anything other
than very light use at leat 40 spoke wheels were recommended.
Thorn cycles use 36 spoke wheels on their Rohloff geared tandems
but as they point out the Rohloff hub alows a rear wheel without any
dishing.
Someone else on this group had a discovery twin as well
and recommended it.
Iain

<[email hidden]> wrote in message
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Quoted message said:

I read a lot of the tandem club threads before buying the bike and
a regular point made was that to avoid problems with anything other
than very light use at leat 40 spoke wheels were recommended.

Whoever said that was talking out of their [censored].

Quoted message said:

Thorn cycles use 36 spoke wheels on their Rohloff geared tandems
but as they point out the Rohloff hub alows a rear wheel without any
dishing.

Actually Thorn use 32 spoke wheels on the Rohloff tandems, because that's
what a Rohloff hub comes with.

With 26" wheels 36 spokes is fine - both our tandems, MTB and road have
them. The wheels are somewhat stronger than the 40H 700c wheels we had on
our old road tandem - that's mainly rim differences.

Then there's them fancy low-spoke count wheels. Santana reckon their 16
spoke wheels are stronger than their 48 spoke ones...

cheers,
clive

I wish I had found this thread a few days ago. Me and my brother are
going to be cycling to the south coast of Spain (from Birmingham) on a
tandem this summer (wild camping, plan is about 80 miles a day for a
month, with rest days) . We're both in very good shape and keen
cyclists, but have never toured this far before, and have only ridden
on a tandem once before.

We're looking to pick up a second hand tandem now, and sell it on once
we get it back. I really don't mind too much about how much the bike
costs, the key is how much it would depreciate, and making sure I don't
lose too much when I sell it on at the end of the summer.

So I guess I'm looking for two pieces of advice.

1) How much difference will spending extra make? Looking on ebay, I've
seen an Dawes Super Galaxy tandem for about £300
(http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=7223333500), but
I've also found a much newer Dawes Galaxy I've been offered for £750
(http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=7219979473).
Would we really notice the difference between these two bikes?
Spending the extra £450 opens me up to losing much more money if I
can't sell it on for a similar price, so I don't want the extra risk
unless it's worth it.

2) Any good offers that people have found of well priced bikes. Clive,
you very usefully looked through ebay last week rating the tandems.
Here are some of the listings I've seen out there, do you have any
thoughts on these bikes for us (we're both 5'9"/5'10"😉?

Galaxy twin -
http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=7222643430
Thorn Voyager Tandem -
http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=7223731971
Cannondale T1000 (though I expect this will end up going for more than
I am willing to pay) -
http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=7224725788

Thanks,

Rich

<[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

So I guess I'm looking for two pieces of advice.

1) How much difference will spending extra make? Looking on ebay, I've
seen an Dawes Super Galaxy tandem for about £300
(http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=7223333500), but
I've also found a much newer Dawes Galaxy I've been offered for £750
(http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=7219979473).
Would we really notice the difference between these two bikes?
Spending the extra £450 opens me up to losing much more money if I
can't sell it on for a similar price, so I don't want the extra risk
unless it's worth it.

There's a huge difference between these two tandems. The Super galaxy is a
very floppy frame, possibly lighter than the new bike, but try putting the
power in and it'll go all over the place. I think the stoker compartment on
the older bike will be smaller. And the wheels on the new bike will be more
reliable. And spares will be easier to get for the newer one.

So yes, you'll notice the difference.

If the Al galaxy fits and is in very good nick, 750 is probably a fair
price. 1050 new though...

(41cm for a 5'10" rider? It might fit, but that'll be a very long seatpost.
My wife is 5'0.5" and has a 16" frame at the back)

Quoted message said:

2) Any good offers that people have found of well priced bikes. Clive,
you very usefully looked through ebay last week rating the tandems.
Here are some of the listings I've seen out there, do you have any
thoughts on these bikes for us (we're both 5'9"/5'10"😉?

Quoted message said:

Galaxy twin -
http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=7222643430

Good bike (as above) - small at the back though, so really worth trying to
check for fit.

Quoted message said:

Thorn Voyager Tandem -
http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=7223731971

Again, a good bike - I'd pay less than for the galaxy though. Maybe 400?
(need to check new prices). 7sp is getting old, though it will at least have
a shimano cassette tandem hub. Dawes Double Edge is a better equivalent, and
600 quid for a new one is probably worth the extra.

Quoted message said:

Cannondale T1000 (though I expect this will end up going for more than
I am willing to pay) -
http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=7224725788

I like cannondale tandems - we've got two. It's quite big, but if it fits,
it may be the most suitable for you. You need to check measurements - it may
well be too big.
Mounting front rack may be amusing, but it's certainly possible.

Check what rear hub it has, and the frame spacing there. If it's 140mm,
you'll need to be careful with the hub - replacements are hard.

For 140mm, 8 speed, 800 quid is a good price. It could well fetch > 1000.

cheers,
clive

in message <[email hidden]>,

(') said:

2) Any good offers that people have found of well priced bikes. Clive,
you very usefully looked through ebay last week rating the tandems.
Here are some of the listings I've seen out there, do you have any
thoughts on these bikes for us (we're both 5'9"/5'10"😉?

There's a Dawes Double Edge frame on eBay just now which would fit you,
currently at £57. All you need to add are the parts from a reasonable
quality second hand mountain bike (possibly one where someone's bent the
frame), plus a pair of tandem chainsets and an extra seat post saddle
and bars... it could actually be quite economic.
<URL:http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=7222689758>

Quoted message said:

Cannondale T1000 (though I expect this will end up going for more than
I am willing to pay) -
http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=7224725788

Sadly, it's too big for you. I say 'sadly' because that is a really nice
bike.

--
[email hidden] (Simon Brooke) http://www.jasmine.org.uk/~simon/

[ This mind intentionally left blank ]

"Simon Brooke" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

in message <[email hidden]>,

(') said:

2) Any good offers that people have found of well priced bikes. Clive,
you very usefully looked through ebay last week rating the tandems.
Here are some of the listings I've seen out there, do you have any
thoughts on these bikes for us (we're both 5'9"/5'10"😉?

There's a Dawes Double Edge frame on eBay just now which would fit you,
currently at £57. All you need to add are the parts from a reasonable
quality second hand mountain bike (possibly one where someone's bent the
frame), plus a pair of tandem chainsets and an extra seat post saddle
and bars... it could actually be quite economic.
<URL:http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=7222689758>

Also needs tandem eccentric, tandem rear wheel (145mm spacing IIRC - try
getting one of those cheaply), tandem strength fork suitable for carrying
panniers (given the target application), stoker stem. That's getting to be
quite a bit of money. When a new one in a more sensible size can be got with
everything fitted for 600 quid, I'd say unless you had the bits lying
around, it's probably not worth it.

And it's still a bit small in the back - rear suitable for up to 5'8", and
that's pushing it.

(still likely to be a bargain upgrade for somebody with a lot of the bits
though).

cheers,
clive

Clive George said:

Also needs tandem eccentric, tandem rear wheel (145mm spacing IIRC - try
getting one of those cheaply), tandem strength fork suitable for
carrying panniers (given the target application), stoker stem. That's
getting to be quite a bit of money. When a new one in a more sensible
size can be got with everything fitted for 600 quid, I'd say unless you
had the bits lying around, it's probably not worth it.

You can do better than that. The KHS tandem which has a Buy It Now
price of £399 on e-bay is actually extremely good value for money. We
have had a couple of those for 12 years now and have toured all over
Europe on them pulling a BOB trailer and gradually upgrading as bits
wore out.
http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/KHS-TANDEMANIA-SPORT-BRAND-NEW-different-sizes_W0QQitemZ7224873320QQcategoryZ56192QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

--
Tony

"The best way I know of to win an argument is to start by being in the
right."
- Lord Hailsham

Tony Raven said:

Clive George said:

Also needs tandem eccentric, tandem rear wheel (145mm spacing IIRC - try
getting one of those cheaply), tandem strength fork suitable for
carrying panniers (given the target application), stoker stem. That's
getting to be quite a bit of money. When a new one in a more sensible
size can be got with everything fitted for 600 quid, I'd say unless you
had the bits lying around, it's probably not worth it.

You can do better than that. The KHS tandem which has a Buy It Now
price of £399 on e-bay is actually extremely good value for money. We
have had a couple of those for 12 years now and have toured all over
Europe on them pulling a BOB trailer and gradually upgrading as bits
wore out.
http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/KHS-TANDEMANIA-SPORT-BRAND-NEW-different-sizes_W0QQitemZ7224873320QQcategoryZ56192QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

That's actually quite tempting for when Igor dies.. (though I'm thure I
have thome thpare parts around for a while yet). A decent drive train
would be nice and I already have a kiddycrank adapter.

...d

"Tony Raven" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
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Quoted message said:

Clive George said:

Also needs tandem eccentric, tandem rear wheel (145mm spacing IIRC - try
getting one of those cheaply), tandem strength fork suitable for carrying
panniers (given the target application), stoker stem. That's getting to
be quite a bit of money. When a new one in a more sensible size can be
got with everything fitted for 600 quid, I'd say unless you had the bits
lying around, it's probably not worth it.

You can do better than that. The KHS tandem which has a Buy It Now price
of £399 on e-bay is actually extremely good value for money. We have had
a couple of those for 12 years now and have toured all over Europe on them
pulling a BOB trailer and gradually upgrading as bits wore out.
http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/KHS-TANDEMANIA-SPORT-BRAND-NEW-different-sizes_W0QQitemZ7224873320QQcategoryZ56192QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

Pretty good. I'd still recommend paying the extra 200 quid for the Dawes
Double Edge - it's a reasonably significant upgrade and hence probably
better value. But if that 200 quid is a sticking point, then the KHS isn't a
bad bike.

(of course what's going to happen is JD Cycles website is out of date and
all these lovely cheap prices I've been pushing don't exist any more :-( )

cheers,
clive

Thanks for all the help and suggestions everyone. I bought a Dawes
Galaxy off eBay from St. John's Cycles in the end. Got it for £600,
so I'm pleased with that. I was thinking about a new Double Edge, but
felt a new bike was going to depreciate more than a second hand one.

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=7222643430