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Acid following Gallbladder removal

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General fitness, health and nutrition
Published
30 September 2003
Last activity
2 October 2003
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Kathy Burke
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  1. I had my gallbladder removed around 13 years ago. Since then during the night I'm woken up by "acid"
    - or more accurately I become aware of the acid if I wake up - and then it seems to get worst. So
    I've been taking a single Zantac before going to bed each night which keeps the symptoms at bay.
    Taking Zantac long-term to mask these symptoms may not be a good thing. So I'm looking for some
    alternative approaches to try and any opinions on some of these ideas would be appreciated.

    As I understand it the cause of the extra acid may be a constant dripping of bile into my
    digestive system - whereas before it was all nicely stored in my little sac! A question I have
    pondered is, whereas most people are advised NOT to eat before they go to bed, should I consider
    doing the reverse and eat just before going to bed in order to absorb the acids whilst I sleep?
    If so any ideas on what would be the best thing to eat ie should it be easily digestibly foods
    such as carbohydrates - or should it be the reverse ie say "meat" or pulses to take longer to
    use the "juices". Or am I on the completely wrong track? Or should I just shut-up and keep
    taking the antacids?

  2. "Kathy Burke" <leavemealone> wrote in :"]news:[email hidden]:

    Quoted message said:

    I had my gallbladder removed around 13 years ago. Since then during the night I'm woken up by
    "acid" - or more accurately I become aware of the acid if I wake up - and then it seems to get
    worst. So I've been taking a single Zantac before going to bed each night which keeps the symptoms
    at bay. Taking Zantac long-term to mask these symptoms may not be a good thing. So I'm looking for
    some alternative approaches to try and any opinions on some of these ideas would be appreciated.

    I think the first thing you need to do is consult a gastroenterologist and try to find out what's
    really going on, rather than guessing.

    Quoted message said:

    As I understand it the cause of the extra acid may be a constant dripping of bile into my
    digestive system - whereas before it was all nicely stored in my little sac! A question I have
    pondered is,

    That doesn't make any sense physiologically, because bile enters the small intestine well past the
    point where it joins the stomach, and except during vomiting, the contents of the small intestine
    don't flow backwards into the stomach. Acid reflux symptoms are usually due to the contents of the
    stomach (which again doesn't normally contain bile) leaking back up into the lower portion of the
    esophagus.

    Quoted message said:

    whereas most people are advised NOT to eat before they go to bed, should I consider doing the
    reverse and eat just before going to bed in order to absorb the acids whilst I sleep? If so any
    ideas on what would be the best thing to eat ie should it be easily digestibly foods such as
    carbohydrates - or should it be the reverse ie say "meat" or pulses to take longer to use the
    "juices". Or am I on the completely wrong track? Or should I just shut-up and keep taking the
    antacids?

    The reason for not eating before going to bed (it should really be phrased as "not lying down within
    two hours after eating"😉 is that the combination of the pressure in the stomach from it being full
    (or at least non-empty) and the effects of gravity from lying down will increase the pressure on the
    sphincter that normally keeps stomach contents out of the esophagus, and this will allow some
    stomach contents to back up.

    I think you need to do something different, but first you need to find out what's really going on.
    You're probably right that shutting up and just taking the antacids is a band-aid approach. It's
    possible that your symptoms aren't due to acid reflux at all. A gastroenterologist can rule out some
    rather unlikely, but potentially serious, causes of your symptoms.

  3. Many thanks for your advice Eric - very much appreciated.

    As I understand it bile is continuously synthesized by the liver. The purpose of the gallbladder is
    to store this greenish fluid between meals. When you eat, the gallbladder contracts, empting its
    contents into the small intestine, where the bile mixes with the food. If there is no gallbladder,
    then the bile constantly drips into the intestine, even when no food is present. In this
    concentrated form, the bile acids are very irritating to the linings of the intestine. I think that
    this is what is causing the problem.

    I understand that I may need to see a gastroenterologist, but before I do it makes sense to see if I
    can do something simple first.

    Any ideas?

    K

    "Eric Bohlman" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
    "]news:[email hidden]...

    Quoted message said:

    "Kathy Burke" <leavemealone> wrote in :"]news:[email hidden]:

    Quoted message said:

    I had my gallbladder removed around 13 years ago. Since then during the night I'm woken up by
    "acid" - or more accurately I become aware of the acid if I wake up - and then it seems to get
    worst. So I've been taking a single Zantac before going to bed each night which keeps the
    symptoms at bay. Taking Zantac long-term to mask these symptoms may not be a good thing. So I'm
    looking for some alternative approaches to try and any opinions on some of these ideas would be
    appreciated.

    I think the first thing you need to do is consult a gastroenterologist and try to find out what's
    really going on, rather than guessing.

    Quoted message said:

    As I understand it the cause of the extra acid may be a constant dripping of bile into my
    digestive system - whereas before it was all nicely stored in my little sac! A question I have
    pondered is,

    That doesn't make any sense physiologically, because bile enters the small intestine well past the
    point where it joins the stomach, and except


    during

    Quoted message said:

    vomiting, the contents of the small intestine don't flow backwards into


    the

    Quoted message said:

    stomach. Acid reflux symptoms are usually due to the contents of the stomach (which again doesn't
    normally contain bile) leaking back up into the lower portion of the esophagus.

    Quoted message said:

    whereas most people are advised NOT to eat before they go to bed, should I consider doing the
    reverse and eat just before going to bed in order to absorb the acids whilst I sleep? If so any
    ideas on what would be the best thing to eat ie should it be easily digestibly foods such as
    carbohydrates - or should it be the reverse ie say "meat" or pulses to take longer to use the
    "juices". Or am I on the completely wrong track? Or should I just shut-up and keep taking the
    antacids?

    The reason for not eating before going to bed (it should really be phrased as "not lying down
    within two hours after eating"😉 is that the combination of the pressure in the stomach from it
    being full (or at least non-empty) and the effects of gravity from lying down will increase the
    pressure on the sphincter that normally keeps stomach contents out of the esophagus, and this will
    allow some stomach contents to back up.

    I think you need to do something different, but first you need to find out what's really going on.
    You're probably right that shutting up and just taking the antacids is a band-aid approach. It's
    possible that your symptoms aren't due to acid reflux at all. A gastroenterologist can rule out
    some rather unlikely, but potentially serious, causes of your


    symptoms.

  4. "Eric Bohlman" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
    "]news:[email hidden]...

    Quoted message said:

    "Kathy Burke" <leavemealone> wrote in :"]news:[email hidden]:

    Quoted message said:

    I had my gallbladder removed around 13 years ago. Since then during the night I'm woken up by
    "acid" - or more accurately I become aware of the acid if I wake up - and then it seems to get
    worst. So I've been taking a single Zantac before going to bed each night which keeps the
    symptoms at bay. Taking Zantac long-term to mask these symptoms may not be a good thing. So I'm
    looking for some alternative approaches to try and any opinions on some of these ideas would be
    appreciated.

    I think the first thing you need to do is consult a gastroenterologist and try to find out what's
    really going on, rather than guessing.

    Excellent advice.

    Quoted message said:


    Quoted message said:

    As I understand it the cause of the extra acid may be a constant dripping of bile into my
    digestive system - whereas before it was all nicely stored in my little sac! A question I have
    pondered is,

    That doesn't make any sense physiologically, because bile enters the small intestine well past the
    point where it joins the stomach, and except


    during

    Quoted message said:

    vomiting, the contents of the small intestine don't flow backwards into


    the

    Quoted message said:

    stomach. Acid reflux symptoms are usually due to the contents of the stomach (which again doesn't
    normally contain bile) leaking back up into the lower portion of the esophagus.

    There is such a thing as bile reflux as it is in the medical books though the first poster proposed
    mechanism doesn't make any sense to me.

    Quoted message said:


    Quoted message said:

    whereas most people are advised NOT to eat before they go to bed, should I consider doing the
    reverse and eat just before going to bed in order to absorb the acids whilst I sleep? If so any
    ideas on what would be the best thing to eat ie should it be easily digestibly foods such as
    carbohydrates - or should it be the reverse ie say "meat" or pulses to take longer to use the
    "juices". Or am I on the completely wrong track? Or should I just shut-up and keep taking the
    antacids?

    The reason for not eating before going to bed (it should really be phrased as "not lying down
    within two hours after eating"😉 is that the combination of the pressure in the stomach from it
    being full (or at least non-empty) and the effects of gravity from lying down will increase the
    pressure on the sphincter that normally keeps stomach contents out of the esophagus, and this will
    allow some stomach contents to back up.

    The person need to raise the head of their bed. Indeed, raising the head of the bed beyond the
    standard suggest works much better in preventing reflux. The reflux sufferer should sleep on their
    left side to the extent possible as this also help prevent reflux.

    Quoted message said:


    I think you need to do something different, but first you need to find out what's really going on.
    You're probably right that shutting up and just taking the antacids is a band-aid approach.

    H-2 blocker don't suppress stomach acid enough to fully prevent acid reflux. Proton pump inhibitors
    are much more effective to the point a suffer can dare to sleep in a normal bed with a noctural
    relux acid burn. Long term use of PPI or H-2 blockers impair vitamin B-12 and folic acid status.
    Further long term adverse effects in PPI cause so Docs to suggest to patient that they only take
    PPIs on a as needed basis. And then when needing them the patient takes them for a number of weeks
    to get the reflux problem in remission. In bad case, some take PPIs for the day and then take a H-2
    blocker to reduce late night acid break thru which happens in at least some taking PPI's.

    Quoted message said:

    It's possible that your symptoms aren't due to acid reflux at all. A gastroenterologist can rule
    out some rather unlikely, but potentially serious, causes of your


    symptoms.

    Excellent point.

    It is bedtime.............. .................W.A. Noyes

  5. Once upon a time, our fellow William A. Noyes rambled on about "Re: Acid following Gallbladder
    removal." Our champion De-Medicalizing in sci.med.nutrition retorts, thusly ...

    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:

    stomach. Acid reflux symptoms are usually due to the contents of the stomach (which again doesn't
    normally contain bile) leaking back up into the lower portion of the esophagus.

    Quoted message said:

    There is such a thing as bile reflux as it is in the medical books though the first poster proposed
    mechanism doesn't make any sense to me.

    Ha, ... Hah, Ha!

    Acid reflux = Obesity, if not morbid Obesity.

    Just my opinion. But, I am *right* as usual!

  6. Forgive me asking this - but there is no "reflux" ie feeding back that I'm aware of.

    K

    "William A. Noyes" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
    "]news:[email hidden]...

    Quoted message said:


    "Eric Bohlman" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
    "]news:[email hidden]...

    Quoted message said:

    "Kathy Burke" <leavemealone> wrote in :"]news:[email hidden]:

    Quoted message said:

    I had my gallbladder removed around 13 years ago. Since then during the night I'm woken up by
    "acid" - or more accurately I become aware of the acid if I wake up - and then it seems to get
    worst. So I've been taking a single Zantac before going to bed each night which keeps the
    symptoms at bay. Taking Zantac long-term to mask these symptoms may not be a good thing. So
    I'm looking for some alternative approaches to try and any opinions on some of these ideas
    would be appreciated.

    I think the first thing you need to do is consult a gastroenterologist


    and

    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:

    try to find out what's really going on, rather than guessing.

    Excellent advice.

    Quoted message said:


    Quoted message said:

    As I understand it the cause of the extra acid may be a constant dripping of bile into my
    digestive system - whereas before it was all nicely stored in my little sac! A question I have
    pondered is,

    That doesn't make any sense physiologically, because bile enters the


    small

    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:

    intestine well past the point where it joins the stomach, and except


    during

    Quoted message said:

    vomiting, the contents of the small intestine don't flow backwards into


    the

    Quoted message said:

    stomach. Acid reflux symptoms are usually due to the contents of the stomach (which again
    doesn't normally contain bile) leaking back up into the lower portion of the esophagus.

    There is such a thing as bile reflux as it is in the medical books though the first poster
    proposed mechanism doesn't make any sense to me.

    Quoted message said:


    Quoted message said:

    whereas most people are advised NOT to eat before they go to bed, should I consider doing the
    reverse and eat just before going to bed in order to absorb the acids whilst I sleep? If so
    any ideas on what would be the best thing to eat ie should it be easily digestibly foods such
    as carbohydrates - or should it be the reverse ie say "meat" or pulses to take longer to use
    the "juices". Or am I on the completely wrong track? Or should I just shut-up and keep taking
    the antacids?

    The reason for not eating before going to bed (it should really be


    phrased

    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:

    as "not lying down within two hours after eating"😉 is that the


    combination

    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:

    of the pressure in the stomach from it being full (or at least


    non-empty)

    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:

    and the effects of gravity from lying down will increase the pressure on the sphincter that
    normally keeps stomach contents out of the esophagus, and this will allow some stomach contents
    to back up.

    The person need to raise the head of their bed. Indeed, raising the head of the bed beyond the
    standard suggest works much better in preventing reflux. The reflux sufferer should sleep on their
    left side to the extent possible as this also help prevent reflux.

    Quoted message said:


    I think you need to do something different, but first you need to find


    out

    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:

    what's really going on. You're probably right that shutting up and just taking the antacids is a
    band-aid approach.

    H-2 blocker don't suppress stomach acid enough to fully prevent acid reflux. Proton pump
    inhibitors are much more effective to the point a suffer can dare to sleep in a normal bed with a
    noctural relux acid burn. Long term use of PPI or H-2 blockers impair vitamin B-12 and folic acid
    status. Further long term adverse effects in PPI cause so Docs to suggest to patient that they
    only take PPIs on a as needed basis. And then when needing them the patient takes them for a
    number of weeks to get the reflux problem in remission. In bad case, some take PPIs for the day
    and then take a H-2 blocker to reduce late night acid break thru which happens in at least some
    taking PPI's.

    Quoted message said:

    It's possible that your symptoms aren't due to acid reflux at all. A gastroenterologist can


    rule

    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:

    out some rather unlikely, but potentially serious, causes of your


    symptoms.

    Excellent point.

    It is bedtime.............. .................W.A. Noyes

    Quoted message said:
  7. "John 'the Man'" <DeMan[104]@hotmail.com> wrote in message
    "]news:[email hidden]...

    Quoted message said:

    Acid reflux = Obesity, if not morbid Obesity.

    Just my opinion. But, I am *right* as usual!

    Not this time. I've seen persons who were rail thin with truly nasty acid reflux. You would have
    been closer had you wrote Acid reflux = Middle Age but even that isn't 100%

    Not an opinion, just my observation.... ..............................William A. Noyes

  8. "Kathy Burke" <leavemealone> wrote in :"]news:[email hidden]:

    Quoted message said:

    Forgive me asking this - but there is no "reflux" ie feeding back that I'm aware of.

    Gastroesophageal reflux seldom makes it very far up the esophagus and back into the mouth; it's
    usually only an inch or two of the lower esophagus that's affected.

  9. Once upon a time, our fellow William A. Noyes rambled on about "Re: Acid following Gallbladder
    removal." Our champion De-Medicalizing in sci.med.nutrition retorts, thusly ...

    Quoted message said:

    Not an opinion, just my observation.... ..............................William A. Noyes

    In evidence-based medicine the evidentiary value of observations are ranked lower than flawed
    published research.

    Just thought that you might want to know. 🙂

  10. "John 'the Man'" <DeMan[104]@hotmail.com> wrote in message
    "]news:[email hidden]...

    Quoted message said:

    Once upon a time, our fellow William A. Noyes rambled on about "Re: Acid following Gallbladder
    removal." Our champion De-Medicalizing in sci.med.nutrition retorts, thusly ...

    Quoted message said:

    Not an opinion, just my observation.... ..............................William A. Noyes

    In evidence-based medicine the evidentiary value of observations are ranked lower than flawed
    published research.

    Just thought that you might want to know. 🙂

    You've certainly put your finger on a problem. I already knew.

  11. Once upon a time, our fellow William A. Noyes rambled on about "Re: Acid following Gallbladder
    removal." Our champion De-Medicalizing in sci.med.nutrition retorts, thusly ...

    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:

    In evidence-based medicine the evidentiary value of observations are ranked lower than flawed
    published research.

    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:

    Just thought that you might want to know. 🙂

    Quoted message said:

    You've certainly put your finger on a problem. I already knew.

    Disagree with the one way of Medical Scientism and you are labeled anti-intellectual,
    anti-scientific, and a believer in magic and new age mysticism by *YOUR* science buddies, ...
    *not* mine.

    Accept your position and you automatically make the practice of alternative medicine more
    acceptable. We can not have that, can we?

    Ha, ... Hah, Ha!

    Just thought that you might want to know. 🙂

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