A12 death :( There is something you can do

Note -

Peter Fox has been told, according to the local media reports, not to cycle along the A12, during
the rush hour, by police. If this is true, can anyone tell me what right the police have to stop a
single cyclist from cycling along a public highway??? On the surface of it, it sounds like pure
anti-cyclist prejudice and possibly an illegal act. Has the CTC been informed of this?

I don't know the full details, but from what is being put across in the local media, I am appalled
by the police action.

helen s

~~~~~~~~~~
This is sent from a redundant email Mail sent to it is dumped My correct one can be gleaned from
h$**$*$el$**e$n$**$d$**$o$*$t**$$s$**$im$mo$ns*@a$**o$l.c$$*o$*m*$ by getting rid of the
overdependence on money and fame
~~~~~~~~~~

"wafflyDIRTYcatLITTERhcsBOX" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
"]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Peter Fox has been told, according to the local media reports, not to

cycle

Quoted message said:

along the A12, during the rush hour, by police.

You would have thought that with lower vehicle speeds during rush hour it would actually be safer in
some ways.

Tuesday's ride goes ahead and we will see.

The police have a number of opportunities to put foot (big) in mouth and make themselves look
foolish. I have warned the chief const. by fax that anybody suggesting cycling safely and reasonably
along a dual carriage way is causing an obstruction will be the immediate subject of a formal
complaint.

I also made the point that a bit of delay is nothing when compared to lives. Apparently their
latest statement witters on about all the manpower they are putting into investigating the death of
the TT - Shame

have any cycling officer.)

The HA are still in denial. Just shows what a pathetic bunch of civil servants they are - When
people are incapable of taking responsibility for their actions they shouldn't be trusted with
responsibility.

Ta for all the support, including offers to ride. Let's take it one step at a time - Today the real
work needs to be done by harassing your MP to harass David Jamieson MP (Road safety minister).
(Numbers in phone book.)

--
PETER FOX Not the same since the bridge building business collapsed

Peter Fox <[email hidden]> wrote:

: I also made the point that a bit of delay is nothing when compared to lives. Apparently their
: latest statement witters on about all the manpower they are putting into investigating the death
: of the TT - Shame

: have any cycling officer.)

It's a fair point tho, and maybe worth making, that it's ok to *ride* along the A14 while still
being stupidly dangerous to *race* along it. There's a world of difference.

Arthur

On 14 Jul 2003 21:09:13 GMT someone who may be [email hidden]
(wafflyDIRTYcatLITTERhcsBOX) wrote this:-

Quoted message said:

If this is true, can anyone tell me what right the police have to stop a single cyclist from
cycling along a public highway???

His crime is a serious one, being a cyclist. The police generally go out of their way to pick
on cyclists.

--
David Hansen, Edinburgh | PGP email preferred-key number F566DA0E I will always explain revoked
keys, unless the UK government prevents me using the RIP Act 2000.

On Tue, 15 Jul 2003 01:38:06 +0100 someone who may be Peter Fox <[email hidden]>
wrote this:-

Quoted message said:

Apparently their latest statement witters on about all the manpower they are putting into
investigating the death of the TT - Shame they haven't done anything about _prevention_.

That's because the police would have to do something they are most reluctant to do, investigate a
large government organisation. It's much easier to go for individuals.

--
David Hansen, Edinburgh | PGP email preferred-key number F566DA0E I will always explain revoked
keys, unless the UK government prevents me using the RIP Act 2000.

Peter Fox <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:<[email hidden]>...

Quoted message said:

Tuesday's ride goes ahead and we will see.

<big snip>

Peter, Have you posted your actions on the CTT board and the veloriders board? A lot of regulars on
the boards come from that part of the woods.

www.veloriders.co.uk www.ctt.org.uk

SteveP

Arrested and charged with causing a wilful obstruction without lawful authority or excuse!

Cycling on a dual carriage way is a crime!

The police are going to get some stick for the way they have handled this in more ways than one.

The implication for all are well appreciated and some well known names will be on-side when this
matter comes to a proper court hearing.

In the meantime the Highways agency continue spouting rubbish From the acting chief executive: "...I
can assure you the provision for cyclists for each scheme is assessed on its merits" So what? I
didn't say it wasn't.

Obviously he isn't concerned how the HA could ever propose something as dangerous as a high-speed
merge in the first place.

--
PETER FOX Not the same since the cardboard box company folded

David Hansen said:

His crime is a serious one, being a cyclist. The police generally go out of their way to pick on
cyclists.

Your Plod May Vary. My local beat constable travels almost exclusively by bike (as Alex "Mr Rat"
will bear witness) and the busies in Henley have been tremendously supportive when Captain Clueless
has done his worst to spoil my day.

Guy
===
** WARNING ** This posting may contain traces of irony. chapmancentral.comchapmancentral.comOpen ↗ Advance
notice: ADSL service in process of transfer to a new ISP. Obviously there will be a week of downtime
between the engineer removing the BT service and the same engineer connecting the same equipment on
the same line in the same exchange and billing it to the new ISP.

In article <[email hidden]>, one of infinite monkeys

at the keyboard of Peter Fox said:

Arrested and charged with causing a wilful obstruction without lawful authority or excuse!

Thou shalt not ... erm ... challenge authority! Nice to hear you're getting some publicity, but have
you got any of the meeja on-side, or will you end up as the loony/villain yourself?

Quoted message said:

Obviously he isn't concerned how the HA could ever propose something as dangerous as a high-speed
merge in the first place.

I just looked at it on your webpage. There are a couple of superficially- similar merges on my
regular journey into Plymouth, that I don't consider particularly dangerous. OTTOMH I can think of
one on the way in and two on the way home, all within 40mph limits.

The one on the way in is downhill, which means the speed difference between cyclists and cars is
small. Both the ones on the way home are uphill, but benefit.from a stretch where bikes can merge
but cars can't, which I can occupy until there's a gap in traffic from the left.

All of them doubtless also benefit from the lighter and less stressed traffic of the southwest,
compared to London core commuterland.

--
Axis of Evil: Whose economy needs ever more wars? Arms Exports $bn: USA 14.2, UK 5.1, vs France 1.5,
Germany 0.8 (The Economist, July 2002)

Peter Fox said:

Arrested and charged with causing a wilful obstruction without lawful authority or excuse

I hope you throw the book at them - the book being Cyclecraft, obviously ;-)

Guy
===
** WARNING ** This posting may contain traces of irony. chapmancentral.comchapmancentral.comOpen ↗ [currently
offline awaiting ADSL transfer to new ISP]

On Tue, 15 Jul 2003 19:14:25 +0100 someone who may be "Just zis Guy, you know?"
<[email hidden]> wrote this:-

Quoted message said:

Your Plod May Vary.

Individual officers do indeed vary. However, as a series of organisations the police display an
institutional attitude that is not even handed.

My personal view is that all unknown police officers should be treated with suspicion, unless
vouched for by a respectable member of society.

--
David Hansen, Edinburgh | PGP email preferred-key number F566DA0E I will always explain revoked
keys, unless the UK government prevents me using the RIP Act 2000.

David Hansen said:

My personal view is that all unknown police officers should be treated with suspicion, unless
vouched for by a respectable member of society.

Indeed. Remember the paedophile hunter in Soham whose computer was filled with images of
young children?

Yesterday I saw a police car shooting down my road, lights flashing and sirens blaring. It came to a
road junction on red, where it met an ambulance crossing its path. The police car skidded to a halt,
and only narrowly missed the paramedics.
--
remove remove to reply

David Hansen said:

My personal view is that all unknown police officers should be treated with suspicion, unless
vouched for by a respectable member of society.

My view is that they should be treated as someone who's there to do a job which generally makes my
life better. But I'm middle class.

Guy
===
** WARNING ** This posting may contain traces of irony. chapmancentral.comchapmancentral.comOpen ↗ [currently
offline awaiting ADSL transfer to new ISP]

"Gonzalez" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
"]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Indeed. Remember the paedophile hunter in Soham whose computer was filled with images of young
children?

Yesterday I saw a police car shooting down my road, lights flashing and sirens blaring. It came to
a road junction on red, where it met an ambulance crossing its path. The police car skidded to a
halt, and only narrowly missed the paramedics.
--

Also a number of police officers from Erith are on trial at the moment for threatening to torture
and taunting a guy after they had run him down (and broken his leg) outside his house. All in a
normal day's work for your average copper, but these officers were unlucky because one of the
victim's neighbours heard the noise and recorded it all on CC TV. Funny how this kind of stuff gets
so little air time.

"Just zis Guy, you know?" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:<[email hidden]>...

Quoted message said:

David Hansen said:

My personal view is that all unknown police officers should be treated with suspicion, unless
vouched for by a respectable member of society.

My view is that they should be treated as someone who's there to do a job which generally makes my
life better. But I'm middle class.

...and therefore have never actually met one :-)

James

Frank X <[email hidden]> wrote:

: Also a number of police officers from Erith are on trial at the moment for

This is a little harsh. There's bad eggs in all walks of life. THe police I've had to deal with have
all been very professional and good.

Arthur

"Arthur Clune" <[email hidden]> wrote in message "]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Frank X <[email hidden]> wrote:

: Also a number of police officers from Erith are on trial at the moment

for

Quoted message said:

This is a little harsh. There's bad eggs in all walks of life. THe police I've had to deal with
have all been very professional and good.

No I don't believe it is harsh. I have very little to do with the police but I have seen them commit
crimes on a number of occasions. Police men must see criminal behaviour by their colleagues
regularly, if they say nothing they are corrupt themselves because it is their job to stop crime if
they do report the offence they are blackballed by colleagues and eventually hounded out of the
force. I don't see how decent people can survive within the police.

The police go to great lengths to prevent any independent investigation of their activities,
coverage of offences like the above is minimal and there is always some one ready with the a few bad
apples in every profession argument. The fact that the police are reasonable most of the time and
reasonable to certain groups of people doesn't excuse the times when they are not.

Maybe it is different in rural police forces, which do integrate with the community, but in London
everything I see personally and in the news convinces that police corruption is endemic.

Note I don't consider what they have done to Peter corrupt or criminal just inappropriate.

Arthur Clune said:

Frank X <[email hidden]> wrote:

: Also a number of police officers from Erith are on trial at the moment for

This is a little harsh. There's bad eggs in all walks of life. THe police I've had to deal with
have all been very professional and good.

The police are generally OK if you are perceived as a goodie. The moment they perceive you as a
baddie you're in for a hard time.

A good friend of mine and (believe it or not) an acquaintance of Pa*l Sm*th was given a very hard
time by the Northern Constabulary when suspected of drink driving. They made assumptions they should
never have made and spent an hour taunting him until two more officers turned up to administer the
breath test. The reading was green - not even amber.

Read the third paragraph of this web page and you'll see that he's turning as nutty as Pa*l Sm*th.
He's a mountaineering companion and myself and others are supporting him with his difficulties.

paul.orientfans.co.ukAbout me.htmOpen ↗
--
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